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Replies: 61
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Associate AD [1043]
TigerPulse: 83%
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Dabo is the problem Part 2
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Nov 2, 2024, 11:40 PM
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I said it after the Georgia game and I’ll say it again… Dabo is THE problem.
Anyone being honest could see this coming a mile away. This team is pure fools gold. Beating up on scrubs like WF/Stanford/Virginia doesn’t make you a great team.
Louisville gave up 52 to Miami at home… 34 to SMU at home… 27 at BC. Their defense looked all world tonight and it ain’t bc Louisville just got better.
Yall can point to this player or that player or this coach or that coach but the biggest and worst problem is Dabo.
Most of you love Dabo more than you do Clemson and that’s another problem in itself. This game has past him by. The same way it did Joe Paterno… Bobby Bowden… and very recently Nick Saban.
I’m not going to go into the portal and NIL and all that again like in part 1 of this post after the Georgia game.
We just got handled at home under the lights in the Valley by… LOUISVILLE. Think about that. Not Georgia or Bama or Ohio St… LOUISVILLE.
Yall think it’s bad now? Prepare yourself bc it’s about to get worse. SC will beat us. Their DL will dominate and Cade will be under immense pressure all night.
As I said after Georgia… this is a 7/8 win team. Nothing more nothing less. Also… don’t brush off the 4/5 recruits we’ve lost over the last 6ish weeks. That isn’t by accident and it isn’t random or a coincidence.
It’s going to get much worse before it gets better. I respect the h*ll out of Dabo and I’m grateful for all he’s done for us and brought to us but it’s time. His time is over and so is Clemsons until he’s gone.
Every year he’s allowed to stay we’re going to get a little worse and a little worse until theirs no talent left.
One last point… don’t be stunned or shocked this offseason when we lose big time starters to the portal bc it’s coming.
Money talks and BS walks and Dabo will never understand that.
Fire away
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Hall of Famer [8383]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: Dabo is the problem Part 2
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Nov 2, 2024, 11:45 PM
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We should just hire you. Sounds like you have it all figured out. When can you start?
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Associate AD [1043]
TigerPulse: 83%
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Re: Dabo is the problem Part 2
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Nov 2, 2024, 11:53 PM
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Lol… unbelievable… I literally told my wife one of the first responses would be exactly what you just said…
You can tell the people who love Dabo more than they do Clemson by responses just like yours…
Did I hurt your feelings bc I told the truth about the perfect Dabo?
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Hall of Famer [8383]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: Dabo is the problem Part 2
Nov 2, 2024, 11:58 PM
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Well you are wrong then. I criticize Dabos approach plenty. I just know you have no idea how to fix it.
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All-Pro [703]
TigerPulse: 87%
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Re: Dabo is the problem Part 2
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Nov 3, 2024, 12:05 AM
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Dude. You can't kick an extra point down 16....and then get it blocked. Oh wait.
.. It's a mileu of mediocre madness and no on field fire.
Bad night.
The year is not lost but Cade needs to tell them to let him win or lose the game.
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Associate AD [1043]
TigerPulse: 83%
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Re: Dabo is the problem Part 2
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Nov 3, 2024, 12:07 AM
[ in reply to Re: Dabo is the problem Part 2 ] |
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I have just as much of an idea how to fix it as Dabo does and it’s actually extremely simple.
Play the game OFF the field… the way EVERY OTHER COACH IN AMERICA except the military schools are doing.
That’s literally the fix to the biggest problem. People think that 247 ranking before the season that said oh… Clemson is the 5th most talented team in America on paper is accurate.
I laugh every time I see that mentioned or said. This team has so many holes all over the roster.
They’re literally 30-35 guys on this roster on scholarship that have no business being on scholarship at Clemson.
Want to guess what’s caused that? Misses in recruiting… why are we missing in recruiting? Bc Dabo fails to play the game off the field the way everyone else is.
Don’t give me that BS that we don’t have the money to compete bc that is a load of total BS.
You’re telling me Duke had the money to get a high 4 star QB transfer from Texas who’s from California but we don’t have the money to get a handful of starters or depth out of the portal?
You’re telling me GT has the money to get a 5 star QB transfer from Texas AM but we don’t have the money to get a handful of starters or depth?
Some of y’all are reaching and grasping for straws to explain and defend Dabos insane off the field approach. It’s truly sad how some of you will look for any reason to not put blame on Dabo when it all lays at his proud feet.
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Hall of Famer [8383]
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Re: Dabo is the problem Part 2
Nov 3, 2024, 12:12 AM
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I’m not defending his recruiting and portal approach. I think it’s laughable to think kids are supposed to pick us when they can get more money somewhere else. I also know that Dabo has way more info and is way more qualified to run this program than I am. Do I think he needs to change? Yes. Do I think he can run the program better than you can? YES
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Associate AD [1043]
TigerPulse: 83%
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Re: Dabo is the problem Part 2
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Nov 3, 2024, 12:20 AM
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Where did I apply for the job? When did I collect an 11 mill a year check?
Where did I say I should be the coach instead of him? YOU said that.
Don’t get mad when I respond with an appropriate answer.
I know I know… nobody is better than Dabo at this coaching thing.
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Paw Warrior [4845]
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CU Medallion [18140]
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i mean wiht the talent we have
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Nov 2, 2024, 11:53 PM
[ in reply to Re: Dabo is the problem Part 2 ] |
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he prob can coach us to beating bad teams. and cost way less than dabo who gets paid one of the top salaries int he country to get us to poptart bowls
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Starter [252]
TigerPulse: 77%
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Re: Dabo is the problem Part 2
Nov 3, 2024, 12:07 AM
[ in reply to Re: Dabo is the problem Part 2 ] |
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Hold on hold on Dabo might just do such a thing he's done it before!
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Game Changer [1992]
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Agree 100%. I think there will be a mass
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Nov 2, 2024, 11:46 PM
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Exodus of players.
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Ultimate Clemson Legend [100705]
TigerPulse: 100%
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I can concur on a lot of your statements and knew
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Nov 2, 2024, 11:47 PM
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Our 5 wins were over very weak teams..
And yes, right now the Coots will handle us easily in DV unless we can regroup and somehow get better across the board and as a team, including coaches.
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Orange Elite [5247]
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Re: Dabo is the problem Part 2
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Nov 2, 2024, 11:48 PM
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The game passed Saban by Coot ?? Really....
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Associate AD [1043]
TigerPulse: 83%
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Re: Dabo is the problem Part 2
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Nov 2, 2024, 11:56 PM
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Ummm yeah… you do know he retired yes?
You think he walked away from that bc he was tired of coaching football?
No… he walked away bc he knew the way the game is played today off the field has passed him by.
So yes… the game passed Nick Saban by
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Ring of Honor [22706]
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Re: Dabo is the problem Part 2
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Nov 3, 2024, 12:19 AM
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He didn’t leave because the game passed him by. He simply chose not to continue to coach free agents rather than scholarship kids.
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Associate AD [1043]
TigerPulse: 83%
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Re: Dabo is the problem Part 2
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Nov 3, 2024, 12:23 AM
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Soooo… he didn’t want to deal with the off the field part anymore bc the players that have made him a millionaire and the greatest college football coach of all time are starting to get some of the pie?
Sounds to me like… the game passed him by off the field which is exactly what I said.
If you’re not willing to play the game off the field… guess what… you ain’t going to be winning on the field… at least not at a playoff level anyway.
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Ring of Honor [22706]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: Dabo is the problem Part 2
Nov 3, 2024, 12:54 AM
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He was playing the game. Alabama selectively used the portal and paid NIL. I don’t think he liked the tampering and free agency piece and simply retired rather than continue knowing it was only going to get worse over time.
He did not try and portray it any other way.
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Associate AD [1043]
TigerPulse: 83%
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Re: Dabo is the problem Part 2
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Nov 3, 2024, 1:03 AM
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Bro we’re saying the same thing and you’re arguing over semantics.
Saban walked away for the same reason Chip Kelly left a HC job at UCLA to be an OC at Ohio St.
The same reason Kane Wommack left a HC job at South Alabama to be the DC at Alabama.
The point is… the game passed them by off the field or they got tired of the off the field or they didn’t want to deal with the off the field anymore.
Any way we slice it or any way we say it… we’re saying the same thing… they didn’t want to deal with the off the field the way it is now. Which means my phrase of “it passed them by” is correct.
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Game Day Hero [4295]
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Re: Dabo is the problem Part 2
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Nov 2, 2024, 11:59 PM
[ in reply to Re: Dabo is the problem Part 2 ] |
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More or less, Saban did kinda say it has passed him by with NIL and the portal. I think he said it became too much. I don't remember his exact words but I know he talked about it.
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Orange Blooded [2353]
TigerPulse: 98%
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Re: Dabo is the problem Part 2
Nov 2, 2024, 11:49 PM
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I said it after the Georgia game and I’ll say it again… Dabo is THE problem.
Anyone being honest could see this coming a mile away. This team is pure fools gold. Beating up on scrubs like WF/Stanford/Virginia doesn’t make you a great team.
Louisville gave up 52 to Miami at home… 34 to SMU at home… 27 at BC. Their defense looked all world tonight and it ain’t bc Louisville just got better.
Yall can point to this player or that player or this coach or that coach but the biggest and worst problem is Dabo.
Most of you love Dabo more than you do Clemson and that’s another problem in itself. This game has past him by. The same way it did Joe Paterno… Bobby Bowden… and very recently Nick Saban.
I’m not going to go into the portal and NIL and all that again like in part 1 of this post after the Georgia game.
We just got handled at home under the lights in the Valley by… LOUISVILLE. Think about that. Not Georgia or Bama or Ohio St… LOUISVILLE.
Yall think it’s bad now? Prepare yourself bc it’s about to get worse. SC will beat us. Their DL will dominate and Cade will be under immense pressure all night.
As I said after Georgia… this is a 7/8 win team. Nothing more nothing less. Also… don’t brush off the 4/5 recruits we’ve lost over the last 6ish weeks. That isn’t by accident and it isn’t random or a coincidence.
It’s going to get much worse before it gets better. I respect the h*ll out of Dabo and I’m grateful for all he’s done for us and brought to us but it’s time. His time is over and so is Clemsons until he’s gone.
Every year he’s allowed to stay we’re going to get a little worse and a little worse until theirs no talent left.
One last point… don’t be stunned or shocked this offseason when we lose big time starters to the portal bc it’s coming.
Money talks and BS walks and Dabo will never understand that.
Fire away
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Associate AD [1057]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: Dabo is the problem Part 2
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5
Nov 2, 2024, 11:50 PM
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100% percent outcoached from the coin flip.
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All-Pro [703]
TigerPulse: 87%
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Re: Dabo is the problem Part 2
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Nov 3, 2024, 12:05 AM
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This
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National Champion [7823]
TigerPulse: 99%
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Re: Dabo is the problem Part 2
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Nov 2, 2024, 11:51 PM
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You’re probably not wrong.
Dabo’s philosophy, through noble and respectful as it may be, will not lead to us winning championships. Not in this era of college football. In house hires and solely surviving off recruiting/developing won’t cut it.
But he’s earned time to course correct.
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CU Medallion [18140]
TigerPulse: 95%
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i think the issue is he wont course correct
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Nov 2, 2024, 11:55 PM
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there is the problem..he should either embrace what it has become or quit.
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National Champion [7823]
TigerPulse: 99%
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Re: i think the issue is he wont course correct
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Nov 2, 2024, 11:59 PM
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He’s made several tough decisions with his staff. Firing Streeter, Austin, and Hall and replacing them with Riley, Luke, and Rumph were all tough, and great, decisions.
Streeter was an alumni with multiple years on staff. Austin was a former player and GA. Hall was a friend and former teammate.
Dabo’s shown that he will go out and hire better coaches. Now it’s time to start signing impact players from the portal. I still believe that it will happen.
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Ring of Honor [23636]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Joined: 1995
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Associate AD [1043]
TigerPulse: 83%
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Re: Dabo is the problem Part 2
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Nov 3, 2024, 12:00 AM
[ in reply to Re: Dabo is the problem Part 2 ] |
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Leon… since you gave an honest reply… I’m going to ask an honest question and I truly want to know your answer…
No condescension whatsoever… how long does he get bro? I mean we’re going on what 4 years of this now? How much longer does he get in your opinion?
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National Champion [7823]
TigerPulse: 99%
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Re: Dabo is the problem Part 2
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Nov 3, 2024, 12:27 AM
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That’s the toughest question to answer.
Part of me says 2 years (assuming he fires Goodwin when the season ends). The other part says until he retires.
But I don’t believe in fence sitting. So 2 more years.
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Associate AD [1043]
TigerPulse: 83%
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Re: Dabo is the problem Part 2
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Nov 3, 2024, 12:38 AM
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That’s a fair answer. I fully respect your opinion since you were sincere and answered honestly.
I disagree with you fully… but respect that you answered honestly and respectfully.
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Mascot [29]
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National Champion [7823]
TigerPulse: 99%
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Re: Dabo is the problem Part 2
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Nov 3, 2024, 12:32 AM
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I’m concerned with us showing signs of getting better. And even after this embarrassing loss, the 2024 team is better than the 2023 team.
I will say that I would be incredibly disappointed if we don’t utilize the portal this offseason. More so than previous years tbh. RB, TE, DE, LB, and S should all be positions we look at. Possibly even DT depending on who returns. The 2025 class isn’t that good.
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Ring of Honor [22706]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: Dabo is the problem Part 2
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Nov 3, 2024, 12:59 AM
[ in reply to Re: Dabo is the problem Part 2 ] |
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He has earned the time if he actually uses it to course correct. My concern is he won’t really do what is needed or he will still only work within the parameters he believes in.
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Top TigerNet [31771]
TigerPulse: 100%
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The irony of showing up after EVERY Clemson loss...
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Nov 2, 2024, 11:55 PM
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🙄🙄😑😑
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Associate AD [1043]
TigerPulse: 83%
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Re: The irony of showing up after EVERY Clemson loss...
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Nov 2, 2024, 11:59 PM
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Ahhh… another one that loves Dabo more than Clemson
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Top TigerNet [31771]
TigerPulse: 100%
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You don't love Dabo OR Clemson...***
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Nov 3, 2024, 12:01 AM
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All-Conference [429]
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Re: Dabo is the problem Part 2
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Nov 3, 2024, 12:00 AM
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Go write a book.Youre halfway there genius. Dabo won us two natties. He'll make adjustments and we'll win more.
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Ring of Honor [23636]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Really? What makes you think that?
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Nov 3, 2024, 12:01 AM
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I want to hear this one.
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Tiger Titan [50628]
TigerPulse: 77%
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Well, his adjustments the last four years havent worked too well.
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Nov 3, 2024, 12:51 AM
[ in reply to Re: Dabo is the problem Part 2 ] |
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Why should we expect him to figure it out all of a sudden?
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Commissioner [1211]
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Re: Dabo is the problem Part 2
Nov 3, 2024, 1:35 AM
[ in reply to Re: Dabo is the problem Part 2 ] |
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Dabo, OC/DC, staff, and players won those nattys and the last that I checked Dabo and a few or the staff is all that is left of those units and look what we have now... so exactly how much of those nattys does he really get credit for?
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Paw Warrior [4841]
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Re: Dabo is the problem Part 2
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Nov 3, 2024, 12:01 AM
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Please shut the he** up
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Ring of Honor [23636]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Huh?
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Nov 3, 2024, 12:02 AM
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How about adding something tangible or YOU shut up? How about that?
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Associate AD [1043]
TigerPulse: 83%
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Re: Huh?
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Nov 3, 2024, 12:13 AM
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He can’t add anything tangible bro bc those types love Dabo more than they do Clemson.
They’d rather lose with Dabo then win with another coach that’s up to the times off the field.
Tonight is just a microcosm of what’s coming.
Just give it time
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Varsity [132]
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Re: Dabo is the problem Part 2
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Nov 3, 2024, 12:08 AM
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Someone needs his binky.
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TigerNet Champion [120748]
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Oh Boy, doom and Gloom
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Nov 3, 2024, 12:08 AM
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We could have easily won that game, but it was a perfect storm with Woods being out, 3 first downs dropped by receivers, a questionable PA call that led to a TD, 2 blocked field goals, unimaginative play calling, Receivers not getting open on deep routes, Cade had a terrible night, Barrett Carter had a horrific night, Dline got banged up and drug up and down the field, Louisville played mistake-free for the first time all year, etc
I am not sure how that all points directly at Dabo.
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Starter [262]
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Re: Oh Boy, doom and Gloom
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Nov 3, 2024, 12:15 AM
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If if if. If a frog had wings he wouldn't bump his a s s every time he jumped.
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Playmaker [388]
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Re: Oh Boy, doom and Gloom
Nov 3, 2024, 12:32 AM
[ in reply to Oh Boy, doom and Gloom ] |
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It is alot of ifs as is every game,but I truly believe that if moore would of caught that perfect pass from cade on 2/3 yd line the game would of been totally different.next play was the 1st blocked fg and the momentum just continued to carry,and also it was 3 other drops that I remember right off from briningstool and others.and the defense..no words for that pathetic performance and didn't even notice any adjustments after half time
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Tiger Titan [50628]
TigerPulse: 77%
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Dude, we lost by double digits and it wasnt as close as the score indicated.
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Nov 3, 2024, 12:53 AM
[ in reply to Oh Boy, doom and Gloom ] |
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There is certainly plenty of blame to go around, but it starts with Dabo. He had a terrible night too.
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Tiger Titan [50628]
TigerPulse: 77%
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Its telling that the two best teams on our schedule dominated us.
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Nov 3, 2024, 12:23 AM
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I hoped we turned a corner and were truly better, but after tonight I’m not so sure.
Lots of questions and very few answers at this point.
I still think we have major issues in our program. This isn’t merely about a player here or there.
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Associate AD [1043]
TigerPulse: 83%
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Re: Its telling that the two best teams on our schedule dominated us.
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Nov 3, 2024, 12:34 AM
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That’s exactly what I’m saying Judge.
I just saw one guys response that said how does tonight fall on Dabo and that just goes to show how clueless most around here are.
Tonight was just a very small part of the problem but it got exposed big time in front of the whole country.
This is about how Dabo is running this program and the decisions he’s making to do it.
Winning in college football starts OFF the field which is recruiting. Even Saban can’t win without talent. It takes a ton of talent to win big in college football.
If you’re not willing to play the game off the field then you’re going to lose games on the field. Can we still win 7/8 every year and go to a bowl game? Sure that won’t be an issue… at least for awhile anyway.
Are we going to ever truly compete for the national championship again? Not the way we’re doing things off the field and the recruiting is starting to show it. That’s why we’re losing guys left and right and not just scrubs but top 250 players.
We lose a top rated guy and replace him with a 3 star with offers from WF/UCF/NC St and then expect them to hold their own against Georgia or now even Louisville. You can’t do it that way anymore bc guys aren’t hanging around and developing for 2/3/4 years anymore.
Guys want to get paid and when literally every single other coach in America knocking at their door recruiting them is offering up front money and we’re not… you can’t compete with that.
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Top TigerNet [31771]
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Joined: 2015
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Associate AD [1043]
TigerPulse: 83%
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Re: Shouldn't you be somewhere licking brownies boots***
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Nov 3, 2024, 12:49 AM
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I see the children are up late tonight.
Go to bed before you get a spanking little boy.
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Paw Warrior [4845]
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Re: Shouldn't you be somewhere licking brownies boots***
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Nov 3, 2024, 1:05 AM
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You are right Tiger Rag. I hate the way college football is now. The way it should be and the way it is now are 2 different things. We have to adapt whether we like it or not. Dabo has shown that he’s stubborn and can be slow making changes that have to be made to help us compete.
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Varsity [128]
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Re: Dabo is the problem Part 2
Nov 3, 2024, 1:04 AM
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Take it easy on TigerRag, he’s one of those new money clemson fans. Joined Tigernet in 2020. Likely just a newborn in New Jersey when a Tommy was coaching.
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Associate AD [1043]
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Re: Dabo is the problem Part 2
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Nov 3, 2024, 1:15 AM
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Lol new money huh? Did you say that in your Rose voice from Titanic? Haha
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Varsity [128]
TigerPulse: 55%
11
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Re: Dabo is the problem Part 2
Nov 3, 2024, 1:56 AM
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Boom roasted. Now I’m ready to level with you to understand the 5 paragraph Dabo rants, so we can never lose again and win natties every year. Fire Dabo and hire who? Throw NIL money at kids, which ones? How much do we need, how much are you throwing in?
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Associate AD [1043]
TigerPulse: 83%
25
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Re: Dabo is the problem Part 2
Nov 3, 2024, 1:06 AM
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You’re not ready to level. You’re ready to throw a temper tantrum and fuss scream and kick bc somebody dared tell the truth.
Did I accuse you of “new money” or… anything? Nope never said a word to you. But instead of actually debating the topic you felt a need to act like a petulant child which is par for the course for most of you anyways.
Even if I answer your questions your just going to move the goalposts over and over and respond with some smart*ss answer that’s going to get neither of us anywhere.
Also… where is my check for 11 mill a year? I surely haven’t gotten one yet you want me to answer those questions that the guy making 11 mill a year refuses to address.
I’ll make you a deal… cut me a 916,000$ game check for tonight and I’ll answer 1 of those questions for you mmmk?
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Varsity [128]
TigerPulse: 55%
11
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Re: Dabo is the problem Part 2
1
Nov 3, 2024, 1:36 AM
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I’m not accusing you of anything, I’m making a factual statement that you’re clearly a new fan. Your perspective proves it. And again, we welcome you. Run Dabo out of town. Hire your no name new coach. Raise more NIL money from some non de ###### donors, get the best portal players and never lose to the Vandy’s of the world again. Speaking of goalposts, Dabo ironically moved those so far into your delusional stratosphere that you can rant on tigernet about not winning natties every year. Just don’t pretend you have a plan. We all know you don’t. Cheers brother. Enjoy the ride. Or don't, up to you.
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Varsity [128]
TigerPulse: 55%
11
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Re: Dabo is the problem Part 2
1
Nov 3, 2024, 1:14 AM
[ in reply to Re: Dabo is the problem Part 2 ] |
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“Appalachian St next week will be a full 4 quarter fight and it won’t shock me at all if we lose and honestly that may be the best thing that could happen.“
Dabo won 66-20.
In 2024 this is a TNET “hall of fame” post. You’re full of it. Tell me you jumped on the Clemson bandwagon in 2016 without telling me you jumped on it then. Go NIL a 5 star QB through your business, you seem to have it figured out. We lost a game to a good team. It happens. Sounds like you were one of the bottle tossers and in that case, have at it. Fire Dabo, toss bottles on the field, throw money at portal players like fsu. Couldn’t disagree more with every statement you've made.
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Associate AD [1043]
TigerPulse: 83%
25
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Re: Dabo is the problem Part 2
Nov 3, 2024, 1:22 AM
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lol hall of fame bc I missed on a post?
Why don’t you post some of those other threads? Oh that’s right bc it shows I was right on the money but that doesn’t fit the narrative.
You literally just proved my point by moving the goalposts and you don’t even realize you did it.
Bro I don’t care if you agree or disagree with anything I say… it’s my opinion and I’m entitled to it. I know that bothers you which is why you want to question my fandom and that’s fine I don’t need to prove anything to you.
Have I said things that turned out to be wrong? Sure… no different from anyone else including yourself. But don’t cherry pick one post and act like the almighty… post the whole thread where everything I said in part 1 of this thread is darn near on the money.
I fully admit I was wrong about App St… yep we layed it to them and I was as thrilled as anyone to be wrong but I can admit that I’m not perfect. If you had more than a few posts perhaps I could find something you were wrong about. But honestly I don’t even have the time or want to to go through any of it.
It is what it is bro… if you don’t like it… theirs an ignore button… use it.
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All-In [10143]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: Dabo is the problem Part 2
Nov 3, 2024, 1:36 AM
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lol hall of fame bc I missed on a post?
Why don’t you post some of those other threads? Oh that’s right bc it shows I was right on the money but that doesn’t fit the narrative.
You literally just proved my point by moving the goalposts and you don’t even realize you did it.
Bro I don’t care if you agree or disagree with anything I say… it’s my opinion and I’m entitled to it. I know that bothers you which is why you want to question my fandom and that’s fine I don’t need to prove anything to you.
Have I said things that turned out to be wrong? Sure… no different from anyone else including yourself. But don’t cherry pick one post and act like the almighty… post the whole thread where everything I said in part 1 of this thread is darn near on the money.
I fully admit I was wrong about App St… yep we layed it to them and I was as thrilled as anyone to be wrong but I can admit that I’m not perfect. If you had more than a few posts perhaps I could find something you were wrong about. But honestly I don’t even have the time or want to to go through any of it.
It is what it is bro… if you don’t like it… theirs an ignore button… use it.
I think what you should have said is that the app state post was in fact correct. Had we lost that game changes would have been made but somehow beating cupcakes to mush keeps the smooth brain idiots believing we are world beaters.
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Game Day Hero [4516]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: Dabo is the problem Part 2
Nov 3, 2024, 1:46 AM
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Where was 'Dabo is the problem Part 1' ?
Did you provide a link? Was it on a coot board somewhere?
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