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Is strength and conditioning an issue?
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Replies: 20
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Orange Elite [5595]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Is strength and conditioning an issue?
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Jan 15, 2025, 10:50 AM
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I don’t think it is. Here is why…
A team can look bad in the 4th quarter for a couple of reasons that are not directly tied to strength and conditioning
- failing to employ run stopping scheme at the beginning of a game
-failure to make 2nd half and late game adjustments
I think the issue was correctly diagnosed at DC spot and it’s been fixed.
Under Batson’s leadership, we dominated the 4th quarter for many years.
I don’t care how strong and conditioned you are, if you don’t know how to stop the run from the get-go and if you cannot make mid / late game adjustments to counter unexpected blocking schemes, then your conditioning and strength will only carry you so far
Nothing wears a defense down like an offense that can run the ball.
Batson ain’t the one calling 3 man soft fronts and pulling Sammy Brown out while we are getting the ball run down our throats
Batson wasn’t the one that let South Carolina roll sellers student body right 5 plays in a row
Batson wasn’t the one the spent all the practice time before the UT game on zone defense, only to scrap it and play man all game
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Standout [248]
TigerPulse: 92%
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Re: Is strength and conditioning an issue?
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Jan 15, 2025, 10:53 AM
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It's not, the issue is a talent deficiency. The players of today's team, don't compare to the players of the national championship era teams. It's not even close to being the same level of athlete.
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Campus Hero [13955]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: Is strength and conditioning an issue?
Jan 15, 2025, 10:55 AM
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Exactly. People think because a player is dominated by another player that it's just strength and conditioning. They never think about talent.
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Orange Elite [5595]
TigerPulse: 100%
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I agree with you, but I think thats true for all schools now
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Jan 15, 2025, 11:01 AM
[ in reply to Re: Is strength and conditioning an issue? ] |
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With the portal, talent isn’t been stockpiled like it used to be.
But, my concern is that in the 4th quarter, a less talented but well conditioned team can beat a more talented team with average conditioning.
We lost games in the 4th quarter and almost gave a few games away.
Some of that is also due to the fact that Mafah was hurt and we weren’t able to run the ball ourselves well the last half of the year.
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Letterman [192]
TigerPulse: 99%
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Re: Is strength and conditioning an issue?
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Jan 15, 2025, 11:17 AM
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There was a time where all I wanted, was Joey Batson to be fired. I thought he was old. I thought he did not understand hows to run a modern S&C program at the major college football level. I thought he did not under stand newer techniques and just had them lifting weights. I wanted a young an crazy S&C coach like I had seen on ESPN when they interviewed LSU and Alabama's. I thought all that, in like 2010..... Then we went on a run that was unbelievable. Those players looks faster and stronger than everyone we played. Batson was not the problem, I was wrong. I learned that we don't know anything about S&C at that level, and that Batson is a professional.
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Offensive Star [340]
TigerPulse: 92%
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Re: Is strength and conditioning an issue?
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Jan 15, 2025, 11:25 AM
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We lost games in 4th quarter were based on gap integrity and tackling. Due to past times when we had a better D coordinator there didn't seem to be a problem. Some people will will try to point to lack of talent but we have enough elite talent with good talent to get the job done. I haven't seen a loss where I thought, we were just gassed and that's why the other team scored. I vote no, for now 
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All-In [10178]
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Re: Is strength and conditioning an issue?
Jan 15, 2025, 11:36 AM
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No.
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Game Day Hero [4176]
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Re: Is strength and conditioning an issue?
1
Jan 15, 2025, 11:49 AM
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Was Barton the strength and conditioning during Clemson’s 6 playoff game run?
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CU Guru [1509]
TigerPulse: 95%
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Re: Is strength and conditioning an issue?
Jan 15, 2025, 12:56 PM
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Yes, Batson has been the strength and conditioning coach since 1997.
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Mascot [25]
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Re: Is strength and conditioning an issue?
Jan 15, 2025, 11:48 AM
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I don’t think all of a sudden everyone else’s S&C program just bypassed us by light years to put us in a deficit in the 4th quarter. I think a lot of our issues were scheme related. We were either play calling not to lose(which put us playing super soft and almost giving away the 4th quarter/the game multiple times) or we just flat out didn’t play call what we needed against our opponent. I do miss the hard-hitting teams we had before WG took over, but I think a lot of that was the positioning advantages that came with BV’s get-after-em coaching style. Sure, it came with a bust or a misfit every now and then, but people were SCARED of our defense. Ready to see some more of that.
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Commissioner [1271]
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Re: Is strength and conditioning an issue?
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Jan 15, 2025, 12:03 PM
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I thought S&C was becoming an issue before BV, and it still is now. BV created an intensity and accountability that permeated the entire program, you had clear leaders on the team from the defensive side that kept players accountable on the field and in the weight room. I haven’t seen that since Skalski left. BV propped up Batson IMO, and now injuries are up and we’re getting pushed around when we play elite teams, and not just in the 4Q. Batson’s old, he’s had his time and a great career, but it’s time for him to hang up his hat and make way for a new S&C coach
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CU Guru [1509]
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Re: Is strength and conditioning an issue?
Jan 15, 2025, 12:34 PM
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That's just dumb honestly. The reason is simple. The players were better back then. They simply had more talent. The players we have now are not is talented as the players during the championship runs. It simply delusional to think otherwise.
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All-Conference [401]
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Re: Is strength and conditioning an issue?
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Jan 15, 2025, 12:12 PM
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My major question is why we have had so many injuries the last few seasons. In season injuries can be traced to off season conditioning programs or practice during the season. Either way, the injury issues need to be addressed.
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CU Guru [1509]
TigerPulse: 95%
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Re: Is strength and conditioning an issue?
Jan 15, 2025, 12:38 PM
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Again this is just trying to make this problem be something simple. It's not because of the conditioning. There are a couple of reasons that we have a lot of injuries. One is we're not beating the #### out of teams anymore like we used to, so that means our starters have to play more snaps and more opportunity to get injured. Related to that, when we're beating the #### out of teams, they're not hitting as hard later on in the game. As it stands now, most of these games are close so the opponents are coming at us full speed running downhill, and that's resulting in harder collisions and opportunity for more injuries. Also related to that, The Players we have now are not as talented, and they aren't physically dominating the opponents like we used to, so again our guys are taking harder hits instead of giving out the harder hits, and again they are susceptible to more injuries. All this stuff about blaming it on strength and conditioning is a bunch of nonsense. It's just people trying to make it to be an easy answer that we just fired this one coach and that'll solve all the problems. It's magical thinking.
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Commissioner [1271]
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Re: Is strength and conditioning an issue?
Jan 15, 2025, 3:28 PM
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The star players we had in ‘15-‘20 all left bigger, and stronger than when they entered as a freshman. What’s fallen off since 20 is development more so than talent. Dabo made several personnel mistakes, many of which he has emphatically corrected, but Batson remains one of a handful holding us back IMO
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CU Guru [1527]
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National Champion [7337]
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Re: We're Not Doing Something Right In Strength And Conditioning ---
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Jan 15, 2025, 12:29 PM
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Other elite Running Backs look like Linebackers and can bust a 50 yard run at any given moment.
Defensive Backs at other elite programs are bigger and more muscular..... somewhat NFL ready.
Our squad is more built towards speed and finesse offensively. Our defense is built on speed....but the last couple of years we have struggled with tackling in the secondary.
Our guys look too fresh out of high school compared to other guys in other programs. Technique will get you but so far until talent and brute force that has been trained and conditioned takes over.
What Sellars did to us was embarrassing. What Texas' Running Backs did to us was embarrassing.
Several times this year we just look small out there.
I remember back in the day we were big all over the defense. Big up front.....and if you got by that we had very strong and fast Linebackers....and if you got by that we had Defensive Backs that could really tackle and they looked the part.
Now our Linebackers outside of Sammy Brown have been looking like Defensive Backs. Some of Offensive Linemen look basically like Tigh-Ends. Got to bring some consistent beef up front because thats what elite teams have up front...on both sides of the ball. Thats why its a struggle to get 2 yards when we need it. Thats why we have to resort to screen passes in the flat. Thats why we can't break or miss tackles.
The strength and conditioning regiment has to change to make us consistently stronger on the field to respectfully compete no matter what the talent level is.
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CU Guru [1509]
TigerPulse: 95%
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Re: We're Not Doing Something Right In Strength And Conditioning ---
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Jan 15, 2025, 12:58 PM
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It's not strength and conditioning. Those guys in the old days were bigger cuz they were just flat-out bigger. There's only so much strength and conditioning can do. If you want to have bigger stronger guys, you just have to recruit bigger stronger players. You can't take a bunch of smaller guys and just magically make them that big, I don't care what kind of strength and conditioning program you have.
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All-In [10915]
TigerPulse: 98%
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Re: Is strength and conditioning an issue? - not really
2
Jan 15, 2025, 1:41 PM
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Our defense’s checkered performance were the result of the convergence of several individual deficiencies that added up to create the overall problem.
Lack of quality starter - DE position. We had only one (1) starter at DE that would either start or even play a prominent rotational role on a very good defense. (Peter Woods showed up to fall practice at 315 lb, not the 295 lb that Dabo said at the end of Spring practice where P.Woods was expected to be when fall practice. Thus, P.Woods did not turn out to be DE-#2 to balance out DE-#1 e.g., TJ Parker. Setting the edge against the run while also maintaining a credible pass rush threat was missing from our defense. That was a big deal.
Lack of quality depth at LB. Carter, Woodaz, and Brown were all quality starters by the time of the Pitt game. Our only fast-enough / pass-coverage-capable other LB (Kobe McCloud) got injured early in the season. All three of these LBs played punt coverage ST as well. Of course they got pooped, especially in the 2nd half of games when our offense forgot how to make 3rd down conversions; it’s not like halftime break is enough time to fully recover from the rigors of playing in the 1st half. Then, there’s the injury factor / targeting penalty risk; remember in the Pitt game when Woodaz was out with his leg contusion and Brown was kicked out in the first half due to targeting penalty. All we had at LB was Carter, the nickel back, and Dee Crayton. Crayton is a good player but needs more development time; he was not ready to play a big role at any point this past season, but was forced into doing so against Pitt. Pitt smartly exploited this problem and that led to both of their scores and mad race down the field within the final ~1:15 to make a reasonable distance pass attempt into our end zone as the clock expired.
Gap control problems. I blame this on W.Goodwin.
Disappointing play by our safeties & nickel backs. With the exception of Mickens (who was great), our safeties and nickel backs were mediocre overall. If S&C were the problem, then how was it that Mickens had a true NFL-prospect-ish final year when his previous seasons with us were good, but not great? There were too many missed assignments which contributed to too many 10+ yard runs by opposing ball carriers. Again, with the exception of Mickens, tackling was poor. Our CBs were better tacklers than our safeties, which is disgraceful. I think that our non-Mickens experienced safeties / nickels have a talent problem -&- a not-fully-matured-body deficiencies. Our backup safeties are more talented and physically gifted. I am counting on Hanafin, R.Jones, Billings, and Dixon being ready to take charge of the safety position this year, with K.Barnes lending game knowledge (while avoiding mentorship on tackling) to this new group.
In summary, I do not see that S&C had any role in the failures of our defense in 2024.
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Scout Team [86]
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Re: Is strength and conditioning an issue?
Jan 15, 2025, 7:33 PM
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South Carolina dominated Clemson in the 4th quarter of a “must-win” game so yeah that’s probably an issue
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All-TigerNet [5817]
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Re: Is strength and conditioning an issue?
Jan 16, 2025, 3:42 AM
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Seems as though each row of bleachers in the stadium has been shrinking in Memorial Stadium, that, or the conditioning of those sitting in those rows is getting worse year by year
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Replies: 20
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