Replies: 48
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Top TigerNet [32213]
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Honest question: What game this year was it for you when you got off the Goodwin
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Dec 23, 2024, 1:07 PM
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train ??
For me, it was Louisville with the coot game a very close 2nd. That was the final straw.
If we'd seen some improvement---any improvement--since the Louisville game in rushing defense, I'd have said give him another year. Then Citadel happened.
But the Texas game was just more data confirming that Goodwin isn't the guy.
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Campus Hero [13283]
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Re: Honest question: What game this year was it for you when you got off the Goodwin
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Dec 23, 2024, 1:08 PM
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It was before this season and don't recall which game.
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Clemson Conqueror [11578]
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was never on it....bad DC hire from the get go.***
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Dec 23, 2024, 1:08 PM
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Top TigerNet [32213]
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Re: was never on it....bad DC hire from the get go.***
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Dec 23, 2024, 1:10 PM
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I was never enthusiastic about the hire in the first place but I was willing to take a wait and see attitude.
On the other hand, I was all in on the Matt Luke hire: that was a home run.
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Clemson Conqueror [11578]
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agreed.......Matt Luke was great from the beginning.....
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Dec 23, 2024, 1:19 PM
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but to go from having the best (by most accounts) and highest paid coordinator in the country w/ BV...............you can't just settle for an inside analyst hire w/ no experience.......not when we were "at the level" BV & Dabo had brought us to.
We're better than that.....................same w/ Streeter when he was hired. Bad from the get go.
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Dynasty Maker [3427]
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Hall of Famer [8125]
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Before the start of last season***
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Dec 23, 2024, 1:08 PM
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Clemson Icon [25488]
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For me it was the GA game. They showed early on they couldnt tackle.
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Dec 23, 2024, 1:09 PM
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Also wide open GA WR’s. Third and long plays that they let UGA convert because of sloppy play.
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Top TigerNet [32213]
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Re: For me it was the GA game. They showed early on they couldnt tackle.
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Dec 23, 2024, 1:11 PM
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I honestly blamed the offense (and Dabo in particular) for that game. Just way too conservative in the 2nd half...defense just got worn out they were on the field too long. But I hear ya--Jawja game was a flashing red light.
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Hall of Famer [8968]
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Dynasty Maker [3231]
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Re: This ^^^
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Dec 23, 2024, 1:43 PM
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For sure the tackling was the worst I've seen in 40 years
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Top TigerNet [29012]
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Re: Honest question: What game this year was it for you when you got off the Goodwin
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Dec 23, 2024, 1:12 PM
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Louisville easy....
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Orange Beast [6412]
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Re: Honest question: What game this year was it for you when you got off the Goodwin
Dec 23, 2024, 3:53 PM
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Same for me
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Paw Warrior [5098]
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Re: Honest question: What game this year was it for you when you got off the Goodwin
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Dec 23, 2024, 1:15 PM
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Was never on it from day 1.
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110%er [3605]
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Re: Honest question: What game this year was it for you when you got off the Goodwin
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Dec 23, 2024, 1:16 PM
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I think He has done a fine job
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Top TigerNet [32213]
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Re: Honest question: What game this year was it for you when you got off the Goodwin
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Dec 23, 2024, 1:17 PM
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I can't tell if you're serious or joking.......I have to assume it's the latter.
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Associate AD [1077]
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Re: Honest question: What game this year was it for you when you got off the Goodwin
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Dec 23, 2024, 1:17 PM
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Completely honestly, it was some time between the Stanford and Virginia games. Despite the rather lopsided final scores, both teams moved at ease down the field. Neither of those offensive lines should have been able to establish any success against our DL (on paper), but they bullied us. Not to mention, the backups looked abysmal both times, as well. Just completely unserviceable, like they hadn’t been developed in the slightest. The backups looked hardly FCS caliber in both games, I mean just terrible. They didn’t look great against NC State, either, but it was domination up until that point, so I overlooked it, but against Stanford, and especially Virginia, it was just a horrid combination of a severe lack of intensity, terrible assignment football, and atrocious development of the younger guys. I really started to doubt Wes at that point. The Wake game in between the two I mentioned was an anomaly against an awful team, but of course, my suspicions of Wes were readily amplified against Louisville, Carolina, SMU, Texas, and so on. Dude is out of his depth, it’s embarrassing.
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Game Changer [1798]
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Re: Honest question: What game this year was it for you when you got off the Goodwin
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Dec 23, 2024, 1:21 PM
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When he was hired. Dabo needs to own this and move on.
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Offensive Star [305]
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Re: Honest question: What game this year was it for you when you got off the Goodwin
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Dec 23, 2024, 1:19 PM
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I don't care who the DC is as long as he can get some tackling fundamentals ingrained in our defense. To Wes's credit our guys in a lot of games were in the correct position, just couldn't get the runner down. If you miss the first tackle at least slow the player down enough that the second defender gets him down. I've watched a lot of replays on our games this year where guys ran through 3 or 4 tackles.
BV had actual game experience and tons more coaching experience. He had 124 tackles for K State his senior year so he could teach technique. And then was a grad assistant for them for a few years after. I think we need someone similar for DC. The OC can be mild mannered, but I think the DC should have that fire like BV had.
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Commissioner [1246]
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Re: Honest question: What game this year was it for you when you got off the Goodwin
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Dec 23, 2024, 1:22 PM
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2022 Scar game, DJU led offense broke the illusive 30 point barrier and we still lost. The Duke opener the next season solidified it for me that he was a trash DC
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Varsity [101]
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2nd half Georgia, and I hate to say it
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Dec 23, 2024, 1:22 PM
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The way we completely fell apart and could not stop any wheel concept in the second half vs Georgia and could not adjust gave me the feeling this defense was going to struggle all year. You could instantly tell the LB's had not been coached at all by the pursuit lines and lack of tackling. They were constantly taking terrible angles, over running plays and could not get folks on the ground.
Mike Bobo is not the best OC in the world, but when he figures something out he goes to it until you stop it, and Clemson made no competent adjustments in game to attempt to stop anything they did with the wheel concept. Even worse when they did attempt to make adjustments, they got gashed even worse because the adjustments were telegraphed and expected.
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110%er [3615]
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Wes hasn't taken it out of the box yet
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Dec 23, 2024, 1:37 PM
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Orange Immortal [66411]
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but there's a horse missing.***
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Dec 23, 2024, 1:41 PM
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110%er [3615]
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I forgot that he took out the Sammy Brown figure against South Carolina***
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Dec 23, 2024, 1:49 PM
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Game Day Hero [4464]
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Re: Honest question: What game this year was it for you when you got off the Goodwin
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Dec 23, 2024, 1:52 PM
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I had my reservations last year but was willing to look at the positives and convince myself he just needed time to mold it in his image.
I chalked UGA up to the O giving them no help what so ever. It was a low scoring game more than halfway through the 3rd IIRC
NC State I convinced myself it was backups (which it was) but I knew something wasn't right.
While they didn't score a lot of points, FSU, Wake and Standford all moved the ball a little to smoothly at times and they were severely outgunned by our talent. I think this is when I knew but didn't want to admit it to myself.
Virginia... I sat 10 rows behind the bench and watched him not interact with his players. He played on his stupid iPad like a 13yr old boy ignoring his parents because he had to beat 1 more level. UVA scored way to many easy points. Thats when I knew, knew. Ya know?
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110%er [4082]
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Re: Honest question: What game this year was it for you when you got off the Goodwin
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Dec 23, 2024, 2:01 PM
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My exact thoughts
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Orange Blooded [2367]
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Re: Honest question: What game this year was it for you when you got off the Goodwin
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Dec 23, 2024, 1:57 PM
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Texas. Never adjusted to their run attack. We can't go next level without in game adjustments
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Legend [6710]
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Re: Honest question: What game this year was it for you when you got off the Goodwin
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Dec 23, 2024, 1:57 PM
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Really the die was cast long before this season. His philosophy and scheme is the farthest thing from traditional Clemson defense with pressure and physicality. Three man rush after putting offenses in a hole in early downs. Puts players in position that they are catching blockers and runners instead of initiating the contact. Something has changed with tackling technique as well. Our corners and safeties went from sure tacklers under BV to side bumpers the first year or two under Wes to now they try to catch a guy up high and get taken for a ride. Mickens is the last physical guy we have on the back end. Is this a reaction to injuries trying to protect them or some new analytical crap?
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110%er [4082]
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Re: Honest question: What game this year was it for you when you got off the Goodwin
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Dec 23, 2024, 1:59 PM
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I was skeptical after the UGA game but I like many just shifted the blame to the offense doing nothing. The season went on and offenses continued to rack up yards. I knew it was trouble. Louisville was probably the final straw but the ACC Championship game was when I knew we were gonna be toast against whoever we played in the playoffs. I didn't have much hope of us shutting down Texas but I didn't think they'd do whatever they wanted to us either. Fire Wes Goodwin.
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Game Changer [1791]
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The Citadel game***
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Dec 23, 2024, 2:05 PM
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Hall of Famer [8516]
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Re: Honest question: What game this year was it for you when you got off the Goodwin
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Dec 23, 2024, 2:06 PM
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When 3rd and long became an automatic 1st down.
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Game Day Hero [4595]
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Honestly, its was last season for me***
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Dec 23, 2024, 2:16 PM
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Recruit [64]
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Re: Honest question: What game this year was it for you when you got off the Goodwin
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Dec 23, 2024, 2:16 PM
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The second they hired him
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110%er [3785]
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Re: Honest question: What game this year was it for you when you got off the Goodwin
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Dec 23, 2024, 2:45 PM
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Citadel - hands down inexcusable amount of rush yards allowed. We looked worse on Defense in that game against the run than pre Venables games against Paul Johnson GT Games.
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Top TigerNet [30022]
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Re: Honest question: What game this year was it for you when you got off the Goodwin
Dec 23, 2024, 2:46 PM
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Lewisville
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Letterman [170]
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Re: Honest question: What game this year was it for you when you got off the Goodwin
Dec 23, 2024, 2:49 PM
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Louisville
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Ring of Honor [22418]
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Re: Honest question: What game this year was it for you when you got off the Goodwin
Dec 23, 2024, 2:52 PM
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Like you, I never liked the hired but wanted to see. The Citadel game was the final straw.
Still not sure what Conn does (or doesn’t) do.
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Valley Protector [1427]
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Re: Honest question: What game this year was it for you when you got off the Goodwin
Dec 23, 2024, 2:54 PM
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Was never on it. 2nd half at UGA solidified it
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Paw Master [16312]
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Duke last year***
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Dec 23, 2024, 3:49 PM
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Game Day Hero [4435]
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Lville and, Ben B for Tackling Coach (throw in LB coach also) and
Dec 23, 2024, 4:05 PM
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USCAR ! That was pitiful they could not at least slow down the QB. They made him look like the greatest QB in the Universe.
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Scout Team [86]
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2022 SC followed by 2022 TN bowl**
Dec 23, 2024, 4:06 PM
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nmmmmmmmm
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Associate AD [1084]
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Re: Honest question: What game this year was it for you when you got off the Goodwin
Dec 23, 2024, 4:11 PM
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Granted Louisville , Coots, and Horns were all abysmal, but the two most telling in my opinion were App St. and the Citadel. FCS and non P5 lineman pushing us around and backs who probably ran 4.75 or 4.8 absolutely bludgeoning us
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Valley Protector [1437]
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Re: Honest question: What game this year was it for you when you got off the Goodwin
Dec 23, 2024, 5:18 PM
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I don't think there was a specific game. I didn't like the hire when it was made, but was willing to see what he could do.
First year, I was disappointed we fell from the #2 defense to the #25 defense. But I realized he had 0 experience as a coordinator and so figured he'd learn to be more aggressive and when the blitz and pressure QBs. I also blamed the offense for so many 3 and outs, which does tire out starters. Finally, we went onto sign some decent players on defense, including Peter Woods, TJ Parker, Burley, and Aveion Terrell. So I was disappointed but recognized his book smarts, so thought he'd improve.
2023, we fell further to the #31 defense. I became pretty concerned, but there were flashes still. While the defense got owned by Duke, Kentucky, and FSU, they were solid against Notre Dame, North Carolina, and South Carolina. I noticed a steep drop in our players' fundamentals. Missed tackles and bad angles cost us two games. Our recruiting dropped more, but I recognized Sammy was among the best athletes in the country. So I left the year more concerned, but not calling for his firing.
This year, everything was worse. Before the season, I predicted we'd have 4 losses this year (UGA, Louisville, Pittsburgh, and South Carolina). But I did still expect us to win the ACC (I never guessed SMU would turn out so good, I thought we'd beat Miami or FSU) and I expected our defense to be improved this year, top 15 or so. But I really saw how bad our fundamentals had degraded when we played NC State. I lost all hope in him during that game, because it came right after a bye and the UGA game, where he was utterly unable to adjust at halftime. And then most games after that confirmed that. We didn't play elite NFL caliber QBs this year, and most of them are terrible under pressure, yet he refused to adjust his 3-4 defense, even when it was obvious it was failing. The Louisville game was the straw where I started calling for his firing.
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National Champion [7824]
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Re: Honest question: What game this year was it for you when you got off the Goodwin
Dec 23, 2024, 5:38 PM
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The Virginia game
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Game Changer [1925]
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just like others. Was never on it. If a guy didn't really ever play high level
Jan 2, 2025, 1:20 PM
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football and was never an on the field coach, should never be given this job at Clemson. We had won 2 National Champions in the previous 6 years, been in the playoffs every year, had the highest assistant coach payroll, a head coach that is not leaving, a coach that promotes a great atmosphere for his assistants families. This is not a place you promote inexperienced people and try experiment. Dabo, did this with 6 guys on his staff basically all at the same time(terrible decisions). I partner with a old very large family owned business and they even make their family members leave the company for at least 2 years after they get their degrees and work for someone else and do something different before coming into the family business.
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Game Changer [1973]
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Re: Honest question: What game this year was it for you when you got off the Goodwin
Jan 2, 2025, 1:23 PM
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No first year coach should be cutting their teeth at Clemson regardless of position
We are an elite club and should conduct ourselves accordingly
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Game Changer [1925]
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exactly esp after the last 10 year run before he was hired and what we pay
Jan 2, 2025, 1:35 PM
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facts
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National Champion [7694]
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Re: Honest question: What game this year was it for you when you got off the Goodwin
Jan 2, 2025, 1:34 PM
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Louisville.
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110%er [3737]
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I'd still like to see him succeed at Clemson.
Jan 2, 2025, 1:40 PM
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But I will say I remember watching the following play thinking "If I were Swinney, I'd be shaving about a foot off the DC's tail about now and firing up the Rolodex when I got back to Clemson."
Go to 12:21.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U48jXQAFIDI
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Replies: 48
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