|
Quality of ACC basketball
|
Replies: 18
| visibility 2352
|
Orange Blooded [2536]
TigerPulse: 100%
32
|
Quality of ACC basketball
1
Dec 30, 2024, 9:13 AM
|
|
Starting a separate thread to address some JK arguments that 1)the ACC is still quality and (2)Clemson basketball "beats national powers with regularity now."
I agree with the first. The ACC's decline is overstated. Clemson getting left out of the tourney after finishing third in the ACC the year before last was absolutely ridiculous. I won't hear any arguments to the contrary.
As for the second point - claiming that the hoops team beats national powers with regularity the way the football team did from 2015-2020 - I wouldn't go so far. For one thing, upsets and parity are more the norm in basketball. For another, our recent "run" consists of one year. I get that we beat Kentucky, but so did a meh Ohio State team. So did Oakland in the first round of last year's NCAAT.
Not ready to crown Tiger Basketball as some kind of ACC juggernaut quite yet. Think this year's team will have its hands full in ACC play. They'll do well to finish over .500 and make the NCAAT. I love Schieffelin and Chase Hunter, but the depth and scoring ability aren't what they were last year. Don't kid yourself. The ACC schedule will be brutal like always; finishing over .500 is good; and if we get into the dance, it'll be Brad's first time ever making it two years in a row.
|
|
|
|
 |
Heisman Winner [82275]
TigerPulse: 100%
62
Posts: 37934
Joined: 2003
|
Reality is that the ACC used to be able to hang its hat on being the best
6
6
Dec 30, 2024, 9:24 AM
|
|
basketball conference, even if football was considered inferior. Those days too, sadly, are long gone. The many millions of extra dollars the SEC and BIG schools are getting each and every year are showing up in a big way in ALL sports, not just football. The ACC's showing in the recent ACC / SEC basketball challenge was shockingly sad.
While the ACC may still field some competitive teams by seasons end, the days of Duke, UNC and others being heavy favorites in March Madness are no more. The ACC will be lucky to get ONE national top seed, and they have a lot of work to do to even acomplish that.
Beating the dusty bones of a long dead horse, but we need to get out of this conference, by whatever means necessary. Our economic survival in the sports landscape depends on it.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Game Day Hero [4176]
TigerPulse: 100%
36
|
Re: Reality is that the ACC used to be able to hang its hat on being the best
1
Dec 30, 2024, 9:54 AM
|
|
We will be out of the ACC in 2-3 years with the coming of The Super Conference. Everyone outside of this conference will be basically FCS schools, no matter what they are now.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Commissioner [1277]
TigerPulse: 92%
27
|
This always sounds good until there's a reminder of so many contracts within
2
Dec 30, 2024, 10:56 AM
|
|
conferences setting their financial terms, and the staggered nature of the end of their respective media deals. No one can come up with a way to settle all the claims of breach of contract, which ultimately is keeping us in the ACC (and out of whatever independence or other conference we'd end up in).
It's either private equity billions that'd need to unwind this all, or Saudi oil money. Seriously.
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-Conference [449]
TigerPulse: 54%
17
|
Re: Reality is that the ACC used to be able to hang its hat on being the best
2
Dec 30, 2024, 11:37 AM
[ in reply to Reality is that the ACC used to be able to hang its hat on being the best ] |
|
Where have you gone, Dean Smith, Coach K, Lefty Drisell, Gary Williams, Roy Williams, and other greats in the ACC? There's nothing but "scraps" left in this once great basketball league. No wonder Brownell can win now. He has no one to coach against. Hubert Davis? Are you kidding me? John Scheyer, please.
Old man Leornard Hamilton (76)? At least Larranaga had the fortitude to quit at 75. A very watered down ACC basketball conference now. There has to be a new generation (wave) of very good hoops coaches to come back into the conference again.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [2536]
TigerPulse: 100%
32
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Immortal [68627]
TigerPulse: 100%
60
Posts: 90381
Joined: 2001
|
Inconsistent play has been a trademark of the CBB era at Clemson.***
2
Dec 30, 2024, 9:30 AM
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Tiger Titan [48244]
TigerPulse: 77%
58
Posts: 35749
Joined: 2003
|
Inconsistent play is a hallmark of college basketball.
1
1
Dec 30, 2024, 11:03 AM
|
|
It's going to happen when you play 30+ games a year, multiple games a week, etc. Given the high number of possessions per game compared to something like football, as well as more parity overall, it isn't surprising to see a college basketball team have widely varying performances over time.
This isn't unique to Brownell-coached teams. In fact, if you go back over the last 6-7 years, we have been one of the more consistent ACC programs. Many of our fans don't recognize that, but should.
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-Conference [449]
TigerPulse: 54%
17
|
Re: Inconsistent play is a hallmark of college basketball.
Dec 30, 2024, 11:46 AM
|
|
Does anyone in College Basketball outside of South Carolina know who Brad Brownell is? If you asked any person who knows about College hoops who Brad Brownell is, what would that person say? Probably some anonymous insurance salesman. He is NOT a name in the sort, unless you live in Clemson, SC. He is not a notable coach, nor does anyone know about Clemson basketball, and he's been here for 14 years. Tiger fans need to realize he's a Lemon. He will NEVER go to a Final Four, or win a Natty. He is not at that level as a college coach. Stop praising mediocrity.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Immortal [68627]
TigerPulse: 100%
60
Posts: 90381
Joined: 2001
|
Que the winningest coach in Clemson hoops history narrative!***
Dec 30, 2024, 11:57 AM
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Game Changer [1914]
TigerPulse: 100%
31
|
Re: Inconsistent play is a hallmark of college basketball.
Dec 30, 2024, 7:59 PM
[ in reply to Re: Inconsistent play is a hallmark of college basketball. ] |
|
I would guess that some diehard UNC fans know who he is. That’s not national recognition, but I would bet they are still smarting from the end of their favorite streak to hold over us. Good times!
I’m thankful that our portal players all know him and trusted him enough to come Clemson. Assuming many of them are from out of state. Pretty good bunch this year.
Should we expect a final four? It would be nice, maybe we should go back and get the last guy that took us there. Maybe y’all should call Neff and complain to the right people. Or just keep crying on the Tigernet, that’ll work, proven success there.
Stick around, there’s still time for everything to implode and y’all to get your wish.
In all honesty, Brownell probably should have been run off in his first 7 years, however the admin continued to retain him and the last 7+ have been pretty good outside of a few disappointments. I’ll take a 40% win percentage vs. top 5 teams (since 2017). Sure, I’d like more, but I do think the outlook is pretty good right now.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Solid Orange [1328]
TigerPulse: 100%
28
|
Re: Inconsistent play is a hallmark of college basketball.
Dec 30, 2024, 9:43 PM
[ in reply to Inconsistent play is a hallmark of college basketball. ] |
|
One your most accurate posts. Coach BB and the Tigers are definitely in the top five over the past five years in consistency in the league. He is also second in tenure of all ACC coaches behind Leonard Hamilton ( may be first soon after today's lawsuit of former players v. Hamilton for non payment of NIL dollars )
|
|
|
|
|
|
Tiger Titan [48244]
TigerPulse: 77%
58
Posts: 35749
Joined: 2003
|
We have beaten national powers regularly in basketball recently.
1
1
Dec 30, 2024, 11:01 AM
|
|
I didn't claim that we have beaten top teams in basketball to the same degree that we did in football from 2015-2020.
What I did claim, and what I stand by, is that our basketball team the last few years has been beating more national powers than our football team has. That's not really up for debate.
|
|
|
|
|
|
110%er [3851]
TigerPulse: 94%
35
|
Please list the *national powers* over the last few years
Dec 30, 2024, 12:02 PM
|
|
And quantify why they are national powers.
Thanks
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [2536]
TigerPulse: 100%
32
|
I don't know. Maybe . . .
1
Dec 30, 2024, 5:37 PM
[ in reply to We have beaten national powers regularly in basketball recently. ] |
|
Really depends on how you define "national power." You could say that FSU is a national power based on history if you want. Football team beat them this year. Beat Notre Dame last year. Beat Miami the year before. Are they a national power? How many national powers are there in football?
You might say that beating Arizona in basketball is beating a "national power," but they've won only one national title. Same for Baylor. Is Kentucky a national power right now? Their current head coach hasn't won anything, and they've had trouble even getting past the first round over the last half decade.
All that to say, it might be up for debate.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Hall of Famer [8400]
TigerPulse: 97%
43
|
Its actually not overstated at all. The ACC has one AP ranked team. ONE.
2
Dec 30, 2024, 11:06 AM
|
|
Is it merely a coincidence that the ACC's decline has coincided with Clemson being "good" in basketball?
|
|
|
|
|
|
110%er [3856]
TigerPulse: 100%
35
|
Agreed. Driving a certified pre-owned 2012 Lexus is still driving a Lexus.
2
Dec 30, 2024, 11:11 AM
|
|
The brand is the brand.
So yes, Clemson basketball could go .500 or or .600 in the ACC, then make a decent run in the ACC tourney, and possibly another good run in the dance, and I'd be thrilled, because I know winning the ACC is not on the table for the basketball program the same way it is for the football program.
And a 2012 Lexus is still a real nice car.
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-In [10178]
TigerPulse: 57%
45
Posts: 13334
Joined: 2006
|
Re: Quality of ACC basketball
1
Dec 30, 2024, 11:53 AM
|
|
I totally agree Thornhill. You cannot talk about arriving after 1 season and we have a long way to go to say we are a consistent national power.
|
|
|
|
|
|
110%er [3851]
TigerPulse: 94%
35
|
Judge Keller is full of crap. Water is wet.***
Dec 30, 2024, 12:01 PM
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Replies: 18
| visibility 2352
|
|
|
|
50
