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Again, can someone explain to me how UNC is...
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Associate AD [1012]
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Again, can someone explain to me how UNC is...
Nov 30, 2015, 8:08 AM
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Able to be competing for an ACC Championship despite all of the educational fraud and abuse that was proven to go on there for the past two decades? Please don't give me the "Swofford, Tarhole" line. Is it that the investigation still has not concluded?!?!? There has to be some sort of acceptable explanation as to why.
Someone please tell me that the hammer will be coming down but that authorities just haven't concluded with the "process" yet.
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Ultimate Clemson Legend [107505]
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bob and his googler should be along anytime now.***
Nov 30, 2015, 8:12 AM
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TigerNet Elite [74506]
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Re: Again, can someone explain to me how UNC is...
Nov 30, 2015, 8:18 AM
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well a gutless group of conference school presidents letting Swoff do whatever he wants is the start of it. it began while he was AD there and the Presidents turn a blind eye to that and to UNC antics
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Clemson Conqueror [11846]
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Just wait...their Wimmen's basketball team and probably...
Nov 30, 2015, 8:34 AM
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their bass fishing and equestrian team will be hammered...even though they probably don't have either one!
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Clemson Conqueror [11151]
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Still under investigation***
Nov 30, 2015, 8:20 AM
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Trainer [25]
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Re: Again, can someone explain to me how UNC is...
Nov 30, 2015, 8:33 AM
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Fact is that the academic "scandal" has been overhyped from the start by butthurt wuffpeckers and anti-athletics faculty at UNC (Jay Smith, Mary Willingham etc.) feeding misleading information to Dan Kane at the Raleigh N&O. The reality is that there were easy independent study classes in the AFAM department where work was always required to be turned in for good grades, that these classes were available to all students, and that more regular students took advantage of the "paper classes" than athletes. Oh the horror!!!
UNC's academic administration has established the textbook case of how NOT to deal with the NCAA, throwing open the barn doors to investigators at the first whiff of scandal in 2011, and following that up with repeated internal investigations that have finally turned up the terrifying reality described in the paragraph above that student athletes have taken advantage of easy classes at UNC. Now the NCAA is looking for ways to let UNC athletics off the hook since they realize they don't have jurisdiction over academic accreditation (the folks who do have already clucked clucked and put the school on double super secret probation with a wink and a nod), which will of course cause much welcome wailing and gnashing of teeth on packpride and in trailer parks across North Carolina.
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Clemson Icon [26663]
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BS... Systemic institutional academic fraud and cover-up.
Nov 30, 2015, 9:18 AM
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Fact is.....
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CU Guru [1211]
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Recruit [97]
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Orange Blooded [2180]
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As someone that helgs manage SACSCOC accreditation for
Nov 30, 2015, 8:36 AM
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a large community college, the depth of the lying and cheating that went on at UNC is simply staggering. SACSCOC, like the other four accrediting agencies around the country are peer organizations. UNC, like all other colleges that earn accreditation, have to sign a statement of integrity. It is the first thing that the college president and SACSCOC liaison must sign before they submit the re-affirmation or 5th year report. Clearly, no one at UNC has any.
Attached is the letter that the president of SACSCOC, Belle Wheelan, sent to UNC to get them to answer questions as to why they lied to the SACSCOC committee visit on April 2-4,2013. UNC's "failure, prior to the review of the SACSCOC special committee to examine the full impact of...the fraud"... raise questions about UNC's compliance with SACSCOC standards.
SACSCOC requested that UNC respond to the 18 questions in the letter. My favorite is 3.7.4 Academic Freedom... "identify the elements in the institutions definition of academic freedom that excuses faculty from accountability for academic integrity and creates barriers for faculty and staff reporting academic irregularities."
Sadly, UNC will (is) be too big to fail. SACSCOC does not have the brass ones to pull their accreditation there by triggering the unavailability of Title IV funding from UNC students. UNC will "re-mediate" their crimes, keep all their victories and move on as if nothing happened.
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Clemson Icon [26663]
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Yep...+1.***
Nov 30, 2015, 9:20 AM
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National Champion [7274]
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Ultimate Clemson Legend [107505]
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why don't you break it down into minutes?
Nov 30, 2015, 1:54 PM
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over 3,100 and counting, students that is?
personally, i believe 1 is staggering knowing the university and its agents made it happen, but perhaps i value integrity and ethics where none should exist?
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All-In [10756]
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good points sir
Nov 30, 2015, 3:10 PM
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This man you are arguing with is no different than every other alum around the Sandhills of NC area.
Not a single one can verbalize the words--"We cheated "
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National Champion [7274]
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there you go again
Nov 30, 2015, 3:47 PM
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show me where i've ever denied what happened
BTW, are you still making racist jokes?
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Standout [210]
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National Champion [7274]
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what color is the sky on the planet where that makes sense?
Nov 30, 2015, 2:46 PM
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or is germane?
the point, which you missed, is that from one perspective - size - the 'staggering' amount of cheating was a minuscule part of the academics in Chapel Hill
there were serious failures and wrongdoings, no doubt, but to suggest that UNC should lose it's accreditation is just silly
do you think DRad knows the specifics of the PRTM curriculum at C.U.?
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Clemson Icon [27622]
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Re: what color is the sky on the planet where that makes sense?
Nov 30, 2015, 3:41 PM
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If you cheat to keep your athletes eligible to play against teams that do not, then the percentage of those involved is meaningless. Easy majors are found at every university. What we KNOW happened at chapel hill is not commonplace in most colleges. They cheat. Plain and simple
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Standout [338]
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Re: As someone that helgs manage SACSCOC accreditation for
Nov 30, 2015, 2:05 PM
[ in reply to As someone that helgs manage SACSCOC accreditation for ] |
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The answer for quite a while and the one that may still prevail is that while there was academic fraud, the classes were not exclusive to athletes. The NCAA used a fraternity example, saying that there were always easy or easier classes and that groups of students would find out about those classes and if motivated by an easy grade, would sign up for them. They noted that fraternities would let steer their members toward those classes if they were in danger of failing out of school or just to boost the fraternity GPA. They noted that athletes were perhaps the biggest fraternity and it would be natural for them share information about the extraordinarily easy classes with each other.
That sounds a lot like BS to me, but if the NCAA buys that position, then it's not an athletic issue, it's an academic one. BTW, that's also the stance they took with Tennessee when tutors were writing papers for athletes and they even had a professor resign over that one.
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Clemson Icon [27622]
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Re: As someone that helgs manage SACSCOC accreditation for
Nov 30, 2015, 3:45 PM
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Disagree with that. Athletic eligibility to compete on a level playing field must be considered. In doesn't matter to frat boys. It matters to point guards and tail backs
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CU Medallion [19831]
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A simplified explanation: UNCheat's administration
Nov 30, 2015, 8:47 AM
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with Swofford's help has made a case to the NCAA that it is an academic issue not an athletic issue and therefor not in the jurisdiction of the NCAA.
Essentially 25 years of bogus classes were created, Tar Hole athletes were encouraged to take these course, bogus grades issued and above athletes maintained academic eligibility to participate in NCAA sports. Upon discovery of this charade, UNCheat's administration, president, BOT and Swofford's conspired to cover it up and minimize it for 10 years.
The NCAA has said "since a few regular students took theses courses, it is an academic accreditation issue." There nothing the NCAA should act upon ....
- even though the athletes who took and received credit for these fraudulent courses and maintained eligibility...
- even though UnCheats entire administration repeatedly conspired, lied and covered up the bogus classes ...
But heaven forbid, if a recruit has a "D" as a freshman in HS on a core English credit --- then the full wrath of the NCAA enforcement will be directed at the kid and college that accepts him. Go figure ...
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Trainer [25]
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Re: A simplified explanation: UNCheat's administration
Nov 30, 2015, 10:00 AM
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A couple false statements merit correcting here:
> Essentially 25 years of bogus classes were created,
> Tar Hole athletes were encouraged to take these
> course, bogus grades issued and above athletes
> maintained academic eligibility to participate in
> NCAA sports.
18 years, but who's counting? And FTR no students (athletes or not) were given a grade without turning in work (it's called "independent study" everywhere else).
> Upon discovery of this charade,
> UNCheat's administration, president, BOT and
> Swofford's conspired to cover it up and minimize it
> for 10 years.
"Discovery of this charade" didn't happen until 2011 b/c the pencil-neck liberals in South Building didn't have the cojones to provide normal oversight over the AFAM department. The full scope of what went on wasn't understood until UNC's own internal investigation (Wainstein Report) was published last year. Swofford has absolutely nothing to do with it, breathless conspiratorial fantasies notwithstanding.
> The NCAA has said "since a few regular students took
> theses courses, it is an academic accreditation
> issue." There nothing the NCAA should act upon ....
> - even though the athletes who took and received
> credit for these fraudulent courses and maintained
> eligibility...
Actual facts: all AFAM courses in question were available to non-athletes, and more non-athletes benefited from those courses than did athletes.
> - even though UnCheats entire administration
> repeatedly conspired, lied and covered up the bogus
> classes ...
Actually, the booger-eaters in South Building were blissfully unaware of what was going on in AFAM for 18 years, then fell all over themselves to pull down their pants and beg the NCAA to look for ### warts when it became apparent that something was amiss in 2011. They've since done everything they could to investigate themselves in the vain hope that the media would see them as nice guys after all, but have received none of the hoped-for result.
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Clemson Icon [26663]
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Goat dung...***
Nov 30, 2015, 10:05 AM
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Legend [15492]
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Re: A simplified explanation: UNCheat's administration
Nov 30, 2015, 3:06 PM
[ in reply to Re: A simplified explanation: UNCheat's administration ] |
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I think your false statement needs correcting here:
"The full scope of what went on wasn't understood until UNC's own internal investigation (Wainstein Report) was published last year."
In fact after succumbing to massive outside pressure UNC retained Wainstain, a former fed. prosecutor, as an "Independent" investigator. This after UNC's own internal investigation was laughable at best. There was also some question from Orange County District Attorney Jim Woodall as to whether criminal activity was involved.
So, far from the Wainstein Report being "UNC's own internal investigation" it was an attempt by UNC to head off further troubles as it had become impossible to keep the lid on.
From UNC's own website:
Independent counsel to conduct inquiry of information about academic irregularities
For immediate use: Friday, Feb. 21, 2014
University of North Carolina President Tom Ross and UNC-Chapel Hill Chancellor Carol L. Folt have retained an outside attorney to conduct an independent inquiry of academic irregularities at UNC-Chapel Hill, based on new information that may become available.
The University has remained in contact with Orange County District Attorney Jim Woodall throughout his investigation of potential criminal activity connected to course irregularities in UNC-Chapel Hill’s former Department of African and Afro-American Studies. Woodall has indicated that he will cooperate with the inquiry and that he can now share with the independent counsel as much information acquired by his office during the criminal investigation as determined to be appropriate. Woodall relied on the SBI to help determine whether criminal activity had occurred.
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All-TigerNet [11161]
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Bored UNC apologist in 3, 2, 1...***
Nov 30, 2015, 10:01 AM
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Trainer [25]
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Re: Bored UNC apologist in 3, 2, 1...***
Nov 30, 2015, 10:03 AM
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Beat you to it! ;0)
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All-TigerNet [11161]
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Two-chay***
Nov 30, 2015, 10:04 AM
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All-TigerNet [11934]
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JIM LAMPLEY should be doing an exclusive story @ halftime on
Nov 30, 2015, 1:58 PM
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the total NCAA pounding that UNC should receive ... just like he did about Clemson during the Penn State vs Pitt national broadcast the day we ascended to #1 in 1981.
They should drag him out of ESPN "Ocho" boxing purgatory just long enough to make things right at the ACC title game next Saturday.
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Orange Blooded [2783]
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I'm guessing they will investigate until right after...
Nov 30, 2015, 2:15 PM
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basketball season is over. Then we'll all learn the "truth"
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