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null [103]
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chill out people....just voicing my opinion..-Fletcher A
Aug 10, 2005, 3:20 PM
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Listen, all I said was that I read in the Greenville news that the coordinators were counting as many as 16 freshmen that could contribute. I believe all the players mentioned were true freshmen. The point I was trying to make is that if you're playing 16 true freshmen then you are losing football games. Obviously there's no way we're going to play 16 true freshmen or anything close to it. I said that I saw a few guys at practice that were physically mature beyond their years. Of course all D-1 football recruits are physically mature beyond their years, but a few of them looked like they were ready for the combine in my opinion.
Show me a national championship team, or a ACC conference championship team that started a lot of true freshmen. I'm sure they're out there, but they are few and far between.
My concern is that we put 5 kids on kickoff coverage and at the #3 spot on the depth chart and lose a redshirt year, (I.E. John Leake). There's just no point in losing a year of eligibility for kickoff coverage. Especially when you have enough other backups that can make tackles and furthermore when you have a kicker that can pound it through the uprights on kickoffs.
If there are some of you that want to start and/or play a bunch of true and redshirt freshmen and talk about how good we'll be in 2 and 3 years then I suggest you move to Columbia, SC where that kind of talk is customary....trust me I know, I grew up in the middle of it. But as for me, that doesn't cut it. I believe we're into the 6th year of a program with talented coaches and players and it's time to win a lot of football games.
As far as coming across the middle. When Reggie Herring was the D-coordinator he believed in tackling the scout team receivers. My sophmore year I caught passes in practice from Charlie coming across the middle and had my clock properly cleaned by Chad Carson, Rodney Feaster and Rodney Thomas..... have you JMac06????? That’s fine if you think we should challenging our upperclassmen and building the confidence of our freshmen, as for me….I just want to win some football games.
-Fletcher Anderson
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null [4779]
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Agree***
Aug 10, 2005, 3:26 PM
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110%er [6376]
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For the most part people understand where you are coming...
Aug 10, 2005, 3:27 PM
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from, but there's always people who aren't going to see eye to eye with you, especially on a message board. I for one, agree that it's not worth burning a redshirt if the player isn't going to have a substantial impact.
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Orange Blooded [3975]
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Re: makes sense...:)***
Aug 10, 2005, 3:27 PM
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Hall of Famer [21888]
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Remember, if you disagree with the masses here...
Aug 10, 2005, 3:28 PM
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you're a coot. Individual opinions are SOOO overrated.
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null [1726]
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Respectfully disagree.....
Aug 10, 2005, 3:30 PM
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You go with the players that give you the best chance to compete and win, regardless of class standing.
Do I agree with Coach Bowden that someone should hit 80-100 snaps to consider burning a redshirt year? Yes...I think they made a mistake with Sergio Gilliam and Travis Pugh, but I think they learned from that mistake.
The point is, our last recruiting class looks (for now at least) like it gave us a significant upgrade in talent. What's wrong with getting some of those players on the field if they can contribute in a meaningful way?
Oh, and IMO you better have your best players on special teams. If you just throw a bunch of warm bodies out there, you might cost yourself a win or two over the course of a season.
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110%er [7650]
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Re: Respectfully agree.....
Aug 10, 2005, 5:28 PM
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very well put and I agree 100 percent...
should ok have red shirted adrain peterson?
no. why b/c he was the best rb they had and gave them the best shot to win.. I know every freshman we are talking about playing might not be the best on the team but if they are the second best then they are going to make a major contribution and will log plenty of snaps to justify burning a red shirt...
heck after the way our receivers played last year I wouldnt be suprised if we started all true freshmen.. especially if they can catch the ball... lol
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null [12]
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Fletcher and orgmule
Aug 10, 2005, 3:31 PM
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Fletcher...Manning here..How are you doing? Hope all is well. Also orgmuleskinner, what's up buddy?
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All-In [30467]
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Well whether people agree or disagree... well said***
Aug 10, 2005, 3:32 PM
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110%er [9105]
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Fletcher for Prez. - oops, he's already done that.... ;-) ***
Aug 10, 2005, 3:36 PM
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Orange Blooded [4359]
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I heard you on the radio with Dan this morning. I agree with
Aug 10, 2005, 3:47 PM
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you. Hopefully Tommy is just hyping it up as motivation for the upperclassmen.
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Varsity [245]
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Play 'em if they can cut it.
Aug 10, 2005, 3:55 PM
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I don't agree with playing freshmen unless their talent just can't be ignored. These are few and far between, IMO. Wasn't the Fridge a freshmen when he manhandled All American Senior Dave Remmington??? Herschel Walker? Pretty rare air. Using a true freshmen, no matter how good/mature, is like playing egg toss. Everybody has a good time at first, then all but one or two players wind up with egg on them in the end.
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Orange Blooded [3975]
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Re: his point wasnt freshman, but number of freshman.***
Aug 10, 2005, 4:08 PM
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All-TigerNet [13105]
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I personally think Bowden's comments are...
Aug 10, 2005, 4:17 PM
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being blown way out of proportion. Coaches want to see fierce competition for positions in the preseason. It makes the starters better players, and contributes toward building roster depth.
As for 16 freshman actually contributing this year, I'll believe it when I see it.
Just like Fletcher, it's my opinion, nothing more.
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null [1726]
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Actually, those weren't even Bowden's comments
Aug 10, 2005, 4:21 PM
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There were the comments of the coordinators, and taken in a very literal sense. Here's the quote.
Asked last week to project the number of freshmen they anticipate using this season, offensive coordinator Rob Spence and defensive coordinator Vic Koenning ran off 11 names at running back, receiver, tight end, linebacker, defensive end and cornerback. That didn't include the five first-year offensive linemen that Spence referred to en masse.
http://www.greenvillenews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20050807/SPORTS0101/50806007/1025/SPORTS0101
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All-TigerNet [13105]
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Bowden or the coordinators, it doesn't matter...
Aug 10, 2005, 4:29 PM
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You've never heard of coaches using this tactic in the preseason? I've seen it done for years.
I'm not saying it's all smoke and mirrors, because there will be some Freshmen that contribute. When it's all said and done, I don't believe the number will be 16.
I was raised in a football family. Sorry, but I don't take much of what they say literally. 
Like I said, it's just an opinion based on my personal experience. I guess we'll find out as the season unfolds. Should be interesting.
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null [1726]
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I think we're on the same page here. I agree with you.***
Aug 10, 2005, 4:33 PM
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Rookie [16]
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Good Call Fletch-I got ya back***
Aug 10, 2005, 3:57 PM
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null [74]
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Agree***
Aug 10, 2005, 4:16 PM
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Commissioner [976]
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Mr F Anderson I think there is a difference between
Aug 10, 2005, 4:22 PM
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depending on true freshmen playing and "depending" on true freshmen. That is the way I read it.
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null [339]
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I think the problem people have
Aug 10, 2005, 4:58 PM
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is that Bowden has been in football a lot longer time than you have and if he feels that freshmen can help at WR then he has a lot more experience to base his decision on.
Your intimation that we are somehow "in trouble" if we do send some freshmen out there is taking a veiled shot at Bowden and his coaches. Whether that was intentional or not only you know but that doesn't really matter. Some people will view it as such and they are perfectly right in doing so. People obviously aren't going to take well to that.
We only need to look at Justin Miller, Charlie Whitehurst, Josh Hyman & Eddie Royal, and Calvin Johnson in the last couple of year to see that it can be done and it doesn't mean that the team in "in trouble" at that position, and they were starters. Bowden isn’t talking about starting 8-10 freshmen, he is talking about 8-10 playing at least 80-100 snaps over the entire season. 8-10 freshmen getting a handful of snaps each game doesn't mean trouble for us and you comment to that effect is going to shake the hornets nest. I think you probably realize that.
I realize that you aware that the Greenville news was not wholly accurate in that report but some of us knew that. That in turn, at least in my case, caused for us to be basing our opinion on two different pieces of information and that was a partial cause of the disagreement.
Please don't take this as a slam against you, it is not. It is just an explanation why some people were not exactly happy with your public comments on the radio.
Most of the rest of the hubbub was over what I believe to be a complete misunderstanding so I wouldn't worry too much about that.
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Orange Blooded [2065]
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First problem is citing the Greenville News
Aug 10, 2005, 4:47 PM
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There is no way on God's green Earth TB will use 16 true freshmen. That should have been a red flag when you read that paper. Bowden was quoted as saying he could see using 9 true freshmen like he did in Roscoe's class.
Second if we were to use 16 freshmen, true or red-shirted, we would not necessarily lose football games, at least in respect to last year's performance. The coaches obviously would have evaluated those guys and they would have proven more capable of adding to the potential victory than the player the beat out on the 2 deep roster.
As for your comment about just winning ball games, let me ask the following question. Do you think Bowden, Spence, Koening, and company want to win ballgames? Of course, and they will, in their view, put the best player on the field. In light of that truth many others and I think your opinion was as worthless as many others we hear spewed on WCCP. Not that you aren't entitled to it, but that it was either misinformed (i.e. Greenville News info), or ill thought out.
I hope this is not offensive to you and Miller, but it is my opinion, which I was not able to voice on WCCP.
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null [103]
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Re: First problem is citing the Greenville News
Aug 10, 2005, 5:16 PM
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you people don't get. It's not the freshmen that I'm concerned about. I'm fully confident that they are a talented group, possibly and probably the best class Bowden has had come in. My concern is that if they're better than the senior, junior, sophomore and redshirt-freshmen, then that makes a big statement about the status of our program. That being, that we're on the right track, but we're way behind schedule (in my opinion). Oklahoma, Southern Cal., LSU, Georgia, etc.. have singed phenominal freshmen classes before but you didn't hear about a bunch of them making a big impact right away.
Furthermore, the examples provided of freshmen that made impact are valid but they have no place in the argument I was trying to make. You've chosen certain individual players that made a difference right away, not half a freshmen class or even a third. I always hope that 3 or 4 true freshmen will contribute, I just hope it's no more than that.
As far as starting 9 freshmen in the 2002 season??...how many games did we win in the regular season???? 6.....I personally am not satisfied with six wins, so they were freshmen cut them some slack...ok granted.. how many of them were drafted after their senior year? I believe two... Airese and Leroy. I don't know about you, but I'd trade Leroy's 25 tackles on special teams to get back those hundred plus he was producing a season the past two years.
As far as winning, yeah of course the coordinators and Bowden wants to win, you completely missed my point if you thought that's what I was trying to say.
For some reason there are people out there that act like if you say something critical of the football program you're automatically a coot or an idiot. If you think that everything is just fine with the state of our program and we're right where we need to be, then you and I can agree to disagree.
I love and appreciate you all.
Go Tigers-Fletcher
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Orange Blooded [2065]
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How many games did we win last year? 6 so it won't hurt
Aug 10, 2005, 5:40 PM
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As for discussing Oklahoma, USC, and LSU with their freshmen classes we have not been on their level in 15 years so there is no need to even compare us with them right now and how we play our freshmen.
Bowden has also said he is not interested in wasting a red shirt on 30 snaps that it would be more like 100-120 plays if they were to committ to blowing the red-shirt.
The reason I choose the freshmen I did is because those are the ones Bowden and company are discussing using. So for you to continue to discuss the idea of using half of that class reiterates my point of being ill informed. Yes, 9 kids would be a load of true freshmen, but if their talent level does displace a Curtis Baham or a Brandon Pilgrim I then cease to care about the talent of Baham or Pilgrim's classes on a whole because we now have an upgrade in talent. At the end of the day that is why they recruit as hard as they do.
I have not missed your point, and I don't think you an idiot. However, I strongly disagree with what I believe is a poorly defended and thought out opnion regarding the status of our talent and play of freshmen. And for the record I am not you people. Just as you are not some idiot or coot.
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All-In [43465]
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Oh, no, no, no, opinions are frowned upon here...
Aug 10, 2005, 6:53 PM
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by many! How dare you think that your point of view should be as important as anyone else's? Silly boy! LOL!
GO TIGERS!!!!!!!
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