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Topic: Since college football players are all about fairness
Replies: 50   Last Post: Aug 5, 2020, 11:53 AM by: tigerrag86
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Since college football players are all about fairness

emoji_events [11]
Posted: Aug 3, 2020, 1:17 PM
 

then it only makes sense that college athletes be required to have the high school GPA and SAT/ACT scores to be academically competitive at that school.

In other words, if you want to play football at school A, then your academic performance in high school must be good enough for acceptance to that school as a non-athlete. This should be enforced for all sports, not just football.

My proposal for enforcing this is to have the average high school GPA and standardized test scores for each team equal the average high school GPA and standardized test score for the university's general student body. The averages from the prior year's incoming freshman class seems like a reasonable place to start.

FYI, for the general student body at Clemson, the average SAT is 1310 on a 1600 scale, and the average GPA is 4.43 on a 4.0 scale.

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Louisville would quickly become the best team in the ACC

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Posted: Aug 3, 2020, 1:19 PM
 

in all sports. Academically speaking that school is worse than UofSuCk.

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Re: Louisville would quickly become the best team in the ACC

[4]
Posted: Aug 3, 2020, 1:22 PM
 

Yeah, UofL should never have been allowed into the conference. They are garbage in pencil-beard form. That said, while hiring hookers, they never faked their classes for 18 years.

I would much rather have both academies.

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I thought about that as well.

[1]
Posted: Aug 3, 2020, 3:08 PM
 

It would probably mean conference re-alignment so that schools are more comparable academically.

We can send Louisville to the SEC and take Vanderbilt off their hands.

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Brad Brownell: all-time winningest coach in Clemson men's basketball history, and only coach to beat North Carolina in Chapel Hill.


Re: Since college football players are all about fairness

[4]
Posted: Aug 3, 2020, 1:20 PM
 

Ya know Judge, this is kinda was conference alignment was for... pre-money-grabbin days.

Afterall, "academics" was why the coots left (when the ACC required their players to be literate) and why WVU was never going to be part of the ACC (we had a tougher time with VaTech... which caused all the Virginia bow-ties to become loose and disheveled. oh my)

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So the average Clemson student is getting an A++?***

[1]
Posted: Aug 3, 2020, 1:26 PM
 



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Clemson


Bunch of LAZY slackers!

[1]
Posted: Aug 3, 2020, 1:30 PM
 

I graduated with a 4.56 from high school. These durn millennials are devaluing my Clemson degree!!!

~JKB

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In high school, yes***

[1]
Posted: Aug 3, 2020, 1:38 PM
 



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Re: So the average Clemson student is getting an A++?***


Posted: Aug 4, 2020, 8:34 AM
 

Never heard of weighted GPAs? Under those calculations, As in Honors classes get a higher weight than As in general education classes, and AP and IB classes get the most. I had a 5.2 GPA or so.

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Lol the 4.43 is NOT on a 4.0 scale

[1]
Posted: Aug 3, 2020, 1:33 PM
 

On a 4.0 scale, a 4.0 is a 100. I can't remember what SC high schools operate on; I think getting all A's in AP and Honors classes gets a 5 point something. It's weird; no clue why they don't use the college system.

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Re: Lol the 4.43 is NOT on a 4.0 scale

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Posted: Aug 3, 2020, 2:45 PM
 

Recently Retired high school teacher here. You certainly can get a 4.43 on a 4 point system, that's the credits for AP classes. And I believe most schools in SC are on that scale.
What's really shocking is that you can't give a student lower than a 50 on a test or final grade even if they don't do more than write their name on the paper. The computer grading system won't accept a lower grade. That would hurt their feelings and discourage them. The public needs to wake up.

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Re: Lol the 4.43 is NOT on a 4.0 scale


Posted: Aug 4, 2020, 3:49 PM
 

When I was in school about 15 years ago it was like this:

Basic Classes: 4.0 for a A
Honors Classes: 4.5 for an A
AP Classes: 5.0 for an A and 4.0 for a B, etc (something like that)

So if you made As in all your basic classes, you could get above 4.0 just by making As in your honors classes and Bs in your AP classes.

Mine was around 4.7 I think

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Run along Stewart, before I get bored of behavin'.


Re: Since college football players are all about fairness

[2]
Posted: Aug 3, 2020, 1:38 PM
 

Man, I was DUMB. Only a 3.5 and 1200....only a 2.85 as an undergrad. 3.7 for my masters and 3.86 for my PhD. I am either fine wine or Clemson made be better.

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how do you get into grad school with


Posted: Aug 3, 2020, 2:06 PM
 

Under a 3.0 gpa to begin with? In grad school a c is an f

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Re: how do you get into grad school with

[3]
Posted: Aug 3, 2020, 2:46 PM
 

A couple of things.

1. My undergrad did a great job at fighting grade inflation in the early 2000. My 2.85 was a "B-" or 82/100 or equivalent to a 3.0 at Clemson. Their "B" scale was: 89.9-87 was 3.3 86.9-84 was a 3.0 and a 83.9-80 was a 2.7. Dropping from a A- to a B+ was worse (0.4 difference) than a B to a B- (only a 0.3 hit). Ironically, when I teach, I don't give minus grades but I also don't round up either. a 79.99999999999 is a C+ but no minus grades if the college (and most have +/-) so it balances out.

2. I was a double major with a dual thesis requirement in under 4 years -. I had the equivalent of 3 minors as well. I am not aware of many folks who took more classes than I did. My average was a 18 or 19 credit hour plus 6+ over the summer. When I only took 4 courses per semester at Clemson, I though was living easy. At one point, I was four different majors.

3. I had just about every non-athletic/non-academic award possible. Two major leadership awards, two major community service awards, worked 20 hours a week on campus and got the outstanding student employee award. Did the student theater (when I dated drama students- yikes) I was also the Art director for the campus magazine (when dating English students). The joke was more of an question, what was I not a part of

4. I had the recommendation from basically any/all faculty member I talked with. I had a reputation for doing exactly enough and most knew my workload.

5. Finally, my GPA is misleading. I have a speech/auditory disability. Basically I have great hearing but I am "color blind to sounds" and struggle greatly with inflections, etc. It is compounded with a general verbal comprehension quirk which may/maynot be link to my hearing issues. It was well documented but I (be prideful) would always fight through it to a point. My undergrad required 12 credits (4 courses) of language proficiency including a fairly harsh conversational requirement. I could basically memorize the 101 and most of the 102 level, but as soon as I got to the conversation and higher proficiency stage, I would fail. I remember getting a 70% on a final written exam and then a 30 on the oral exam. So that semester I had a 2.06 because I had like 3 B-, a C+ a C, and a F in language. Eventually, after failing languages twice, having that "wall" breakdown, I was eventually sent to the disability office for any alternatives. So my sophomore year was basically a 2.0 level as I was pouring my efforts into passing one and neglecting my others to a point. Junior/Senior first semester was all above 3.0 but not enough to pull it up above a 3.0 for my overall degree.

How I got into grad school? IDK. I was told to go away (rather rudely)by VaTech, accepted to Clemson, Tenn, GMU (where I did my post doc), and VCU. VCU and Clemson offered me the most money and what I learned after the fact is that the Prof overseeing that dept admission's process did basically nothing so the normal class-size of 25 for the masters program only had 13 enroll. Strange. Oh, and there is no doubt that I was one of the last kids picked. But going from last to finishing 3rd out of the 13 with the most difficult sub-discipline - well I will take it. I was the 2nd fastest to graduate from the PhD program at the time. What can I say, I am efficient - even my comprehensive comments said I could have done more but my answers were sufficient.

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Re: how do you get into grad school with


Posted: Aug 3, 2020, 6:39 PM
 

I think you should change your user name to just Doc now ??

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Re: how do you get into grad school with

[1]
Posted: Aug 4, 2020, 8:18 AM
 

I could I guess but "Doc" would be my father-in-law.

I married LittleDoc (a fine Clemson girl) - FutureDoc was coined by my father-in-laws pickin' buddies when we were engaged and making the announcement rounds. It stuck.

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Re: how do you get into grad school with


Posted: Aug 4, 2020, 3:50 PM
 

I think it’s time you show Doc senior who’s in charge!

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Re: how do you get into grad school with


Posted: Aug 4, 2020, 4:22 PM
 

He is a nice guy, good dad and all. However, he is a jawja alum so there is no need for me to do anything. His grandkid have seen the tigers win it all twice! And by twice, that is more than he has seen Jawja win!

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that is a lot of words


Posted: Aug 4, 2020, 7:57 AM
 

Is there a cliff notes version available?

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Re: that is a lot of words

[2]
Posted: Aug 4, 2020, 8:27 AM
 

I am smart enough to get an education but not smart enough to know when to quit.

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there are a couple of things you didn't think through


Posted: Aug 3, 2020, 1:54 PM
 

in your proposal:

1. ALL students SAT/ACT scores and GPA's are included in the 'average', so SA's at Clemson are already accounted for. It takes highs and lows to make an average being that all incoming Clemson students are not all making the exact same score and GPA.
2. You are raising the bar for ALL future incoming students unfairly because, again, there are highs and lows that make up the 'average', which means that the 'average' that you propose now becomes the minimum requirement for entrance to Clemson. What are the minimum SAT/ACT and GPA that you propose in fairness to ALL potential students?

Clemson already has minimums, are they not already fair to ALL potential new students? Do you not trust that the University has already given entrance requirements careful scrutiny and are admitting ALL students on their past achievements and are admitting ALL students on their potential to successfully matriculate through Clemson? Do you think Clemson is admitting any or ALL SA's solely on their athletic potential with zero or substandard consideration of their academic potential? What SA in the last 10 years has not met entrance minimums or been confirmed as an academic welfare case and was ultimately admitted entrance? What instance of unfairness in admitting a SA can you share?

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Re: there are a couple of things you didn't think through

[2]
Posted: Aug 3, 2020, 2:02 PM
 

I think the point is that there is a general low perception for SA’s in some programs and leagues making “demands” for what they want further as SA’s. Quid pro Quo in the opposite direction; insisting higher academic standards for SA’s to get what they get now.

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the point is that there is a specific low perception of the


Posted: Aug 4, 2020, 1:42 AM
 

SA at Clemson... if you haven't, read the subsequent response to my first response... LOL

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Nonsense.

[2]
Posted: Aug 3, 2020, 2:16 PM
 

To insinuate SAs are meeting average SATs is bull. There simply are not enough of them.

Plus... plus.. consider there are thousands of students rejected every year. I ask you, in your heart of hearts, do you think those rejected students have higher or lower academic resumes than the typical scholarshiped SA?

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back atcha...


Posted: Aug 4, 2020, 1:27 AM
 

to assume that I insinuated your assumption is the other side of the stinking bull... reading is fundamental but comprehension is key...
but according to your response, should I assume that you are insinuating that Clemson SA's are substandard students who are enrolled only because of academic welfare to exploit their athletic excellence?
thousands of potential students are rejected every year because there are more applications submitted than there are freshman slots to fill. a higher or lower test score or GPA is still subjective as long as the comparative students all meet the minimums, that's why having an application that exhibits a student's potential to be an asset on campus, off campus and as an alumnus are all part of the consideration for acceptance. and I am appalled that you would insinuate that Dabo would lower the academic standard that Clemson has set to win football games with players that don't meet the academic profile of Clemson. Pleae, have that discussion with Dabo and tell him how you really feel... otherwise, please reconsider your assumptive insinuation...

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i didn't insinuate anything


Posted: Aug 4, 2020, 5:35 PM
 

the amount of student athletes is not high enough to affect the average SAT school. There simply are not enough of them at a school the size of Clemson. The bare minimum NCAA allows is like 400 so even if all the incoming student athletes a Clemson got 400's it wouldn't significantly drop the average of 3200+ incoming freshman. Same if they were all had 1600's.

THe student athlete SAT scores probably don't even show up as a blip on the average of massive schools like Ohio State and Florida

Maybe at small schools like Wake Forest or Miami.

i asked you a simple question.. in your heart of hear of hearts what do you think? do you think the typical scholarship athlete meets the same academic resume as the average Student, or even the average rejected student?

i don't have to insinuate that dabo lowers the academic requirement.. The NCAA did. This is known.

if Dabo wants to call me i will tell him exactly how i feel. Send him this post, screen shot it, tweet it.. tell him to Tmail me.

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Clemson admits students on an individual basis


Posted: Aug 5, 2020, 8:47 AM
 

because the application is reviewed for more factors than just SAT/ACT scores and GPA. Clemson is not a bastion for Mensa International candidates, but was built on the ideal that the common man (at the time agriculturalists predominantly) deserved a place of higher learning that the elitist at usuck were being prejudiced towards. And it is still a place for the common man to pursue his goals even if he doesn't score 1300 on the SAT with a 4.43 on a 4.0 scale GPA...

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I thought through it.

[2]
Posted: Aug 3, 2020, 4:10 PM
 

The reality is that there are typically only two sports where student-athletes aren't expected to have competitive grades and test scores for admission, and those sports are football and basketball.

So you have roughly 100 students out of a total population of approximately 20,000 students with sub-par academic performance in high school. That isn't going to impact Clemson's overall averages by any meaningful degree (if they are even counted in those averages at all).

I can't believe that college athletes today feel so entitled. Never before has a college education cost as much as it does today, and they get one for free. Never before have college athletes, especially those who play football, been so well taken care of in terms of training facilities, high level coaching, medical care, nutrition guidance, perks, etc. as they are today. These guys are treated like heroes, with loads of special exceptions made for them, just because they play football. And they feel taken advantage of?!?

I have ZERO sympathy for their plight. If not for football, very few would ever sniff an acceptance to Clemson based on academic merit. And seeing as how Clemson is an academic institution, I don't feel that they should be granted acceptance as a STUDENT-athlete if they aren't smart enough and accomplished enough in the classroom.

Division III has it right. You can be recruited to play sports, but there are no athletic scholarships and you have to qualify based on academics. For division I, I'm okay with athletic scholarships, but at least require the student-athletes to qualify from an academic standpoint. If they can't, they don't have any business going to college - and especially not a very good school like Clemson.

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go back to my response and answer the questions

[1]
Posted: Aug 4, 2020, 1:36 AM
 

your assumptions fly in the face of the achievements that you and others balley-hooed in regards to APR's and graduation rates... so which side of the coin are you on? do you know or even assume that Clemson football players don't qualify academically to be there? who are these players that do not meet Clemson's academic standards? why haven't you taken your info on the 100 students who are enrolled in spite of sub-par high school academic performance to Dabo, Brownell, DRad and Clements and raised holy #### about their admittance to our beloved university and sullying our academic reputation?? do you know or even assume that Clemson is doing things that confer degrees to players for which some or all players did not earn, further sullying every degree conferred to all of us alumni who maintained the academic integrity of our beloved Clemson?
please do tell, and if you have no answers to my questions here and in my previous response, then don't assume that any SA wouldn't sniff admittance...

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Re: go back to my response and answer the questions

[1]
Posted: Aug 4, 2020, 8:58 AM
 

You really should learn to format your posts. Your lack of formatting along with your poor grammar and stream of consciousness style makes it almost impossible to read.

But yes, I agree with him that if football was not a highly prize commodity, some athletes would not sniff a Clemson acceptance (whether rightly or wrongly, we can definitely debate the admissions criterion schools have). Obviously, an SA's numbers are classified, though I knew the grades and SAT scores of some Clemson players, and trust me, they didn't have 4.43s and 1300 SATs (I knew others in class who didn't value their education very highly, though some of the most famous ones actually did). They qualified academically by the NCAA, but not much more.

But we can look at Wonderlics. The average American scores a 20 on the wonderlic. The average college graduate should score closer to a 26 (I'd assume the average Clemson grad should score higher, since it's definitely an above-average university). Random chance should give you a 13. Tee had an 11 (Jeudy had a 9). Tua had a 13. Now, I don't think these scores are indicative of intelligence at all. I see no reason to think the average football player is any less intelligent than the average American, and I believe there are different kinds of intelligence. But we're talking pure admissions here. Do you think someone who scored in the 9th percentile on the wonderlic somehow scored in the 90th percentile on the SAT (because that's where Clemson's average SAT is, its 25th percentile SAT is in the 80th percentile of scores), a harder test?

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This has nothing to do with APRs and graduation rates.

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Posted: Aug 4, 2020, 3:45 PM
 

Clemson's success in that regard speaks for itself. More on that later.

The reality is that most Clemson football players would not be competitive for admission at Clemson as a general applicant. I am sure that some would get into Clemson on their own academic merit, but most would not. This is not unique to Clemson football. It's also true at virtually all power 5 schools.

Clemson has a committee that evaluates the academic qualifications of each athlete offered an athletic scholarship. The committee looks at the student-athlete's high school performance and projects that athlete's ability to graduate from Clemson. The athlete's likely major of choice plays a role, as does the fact that Clemson has a specific protocol in place for assistance (required study halls, tutoring, advising, etc.). If the committee believes the student-athlete will be able to graduate from Clemson, the scholarship offer is approved. If the committee does not believe the student-athlete is capable of graduating from Clemson, the offer isn't approved.

The fact that our student-athletes graduate with regularity is a combination of a few factors:

1. Clemson being selective in its scholarship offers. This is typically more selective than the NCAA minimums, but nowhere close to what is required for acceptance to Clemson as a non-athlete.
2. Clemson having a very strict policy in place for required class attendance, study hall, tutoring, advising, etc.
3. Clemson strongly encouraging many student-athletes to choose specific athlete-friendly majors.
4. The student-athlete going to class and working hard.

In no way am I insinuating that we have a bunch of "dumb jocks" on our football team. I am proud of the care our university takes in making sure we don't just recruit the best players with no regard for their intellect or character. However, there is no denying that the athletes on our football team do not generally have the high school credentials from an academic perspective to be competitive for admission to Clemson.

I don't think accepting these students "sullies" our academic reputation at Clemson, simply because it's common knowledge that football players at any power 5 school don't tend to have the same academic requirements the general student body does. However, when you think about it, it really isn't fair that one group of student-athletes gets preferential treatment in terms of acceptance, tutoring, class schedules, etc. just because they are good at football. That is the epitome of inequality. So if these football players who are protesting want true equality, then they should be prepared to be held to a higher academic standard. After all, this is college we are talking about.

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Clemson's admissions have everything to do with


Posted: Aug 5, 2020, 8:21 AM
 

APR's and graduation rates as a byproduct of not offering the dumb jock or the jock who only wants to be responsible for his/her athletic progress... but, yet again, you didn't answer any of my questions, so, the answers are apparent.
also, Clemson is a builder of leaders, which is just as important for the future of all mankind as the development of the highly intelligent low functioning individuals who create and build the things that make life convenient. Quite often, leaders are not determined by their academic prowess but by their contributions to life in ways that are not seen in academics.
As for you assertion that our players "do not generally have the high school credentials from an academic perspective to be competitive for admission to Clemson" is a stereotype that, whether you intend it or not, is an affront to the young men that you cheer on for your sports viewing pleasure because you do not believe that they deserve admission in the first place. Clemson is a place for the growth and development of ALL who meet the standard for admission and not just a place for the next generation of Mensa International candidates.

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Whoooooaaah, boy. You need to stop talking about all this

[1]
Posted: Aug 3, 2020, 2:03 PM
 

equality nonsense.

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AGREED. equality

[1]
Posted: Aug 3, 2020, 2:10 PM
 


then it only makes sense that college athletes be required to have the high school GPA and SAT/ACT scores to be academically competitive at that school.

In other words, if you want to play football at school A, then your academic performance in high school must be good enough for acceptance to that school as a non-athlete. This should be enforced for all sports, not just football.

My proposal for enforcing this is to have the average high school GPA and standardized test scores for each team equal the average high school GPA and standardized test score for the university's general student body. The averages from the prior year's incoming freshman class seems like a reasonable place to start.

FYI, for the general student body at Clemson, the average SAT is 1310 on a 1600 scale, and the average GPA is 4.43 on a 4.0 scale.



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AGREED. equality

[1]
Posted: Aug 3, 2020, 2:10 PM
 


then it only makes sense that college athletes be required to have the high school GPA and SAT/ACT scores to be academically competitive at that school.

In other words, if you want to play football at school A, then your academic performance in high school must be good enough for acceptance to that school as a non-athlete. This should be enforced for all sports, not just football.

My proposal for enforcing this is to have the average high school GPA and standardized test scores for each team equal the average high school GPA and standardized test score for the university's general student body. The averages from the prior year's incoming freshman class seems like a reasonable place to start.

FYI, for the general student body at Clemson, the average SAT is 1310 on a 1600 scale, and the average GPA is 4.43 on a 4.0 scale.



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When calculating the value of a college education, you point

[2]
Posted: Aug 3, 2020, 2:10 PM
 

out something that is completely overlooked.

Many athletes would not be able to even get in to a good school if it weren't for their sport. At that point, the value of the education becomes PRICELESS.

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Re: When calculating the value of a college education, you point


Posted: Aug 3, 2020, 2:22 PM
 

Remember folks, back in the 1960's and 70's, ACC requirements for athletes was 800 on the SAT test, which was a lot harder than it is now. High school instruction was standard and not as nurturing to the brightest as it is now.

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So Are Implying Guys Like Lamar Jackson Couldn't Get Into

[1]
Posted: Aug 3, 2020, 2:48 PM
 

a College based on their academic merits.........Shocking!

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Re: So Are Implying Guys Like Lamar Jackson Couldn't Get Into


Posted: Aug 3, 2020, 6:42 PM
 

Yea, dis is crazy, dis is crazy...

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my first thought was, why was Gronk ever admitted anywhere??***


Posted: Aug 5, 2020, 8:53 AM
 



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It's how tarholes win basketball nattys: no classes

[2]
Posted: Aug 3, 2020, 6:41 PM
 

required!

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What are you trying to accomplish?


Posted: Aug 3, 2020, 6:56 PM
 

What are you trying to accomplish, other than alienating 99% of the athletes at schools like Clemson who appreciate all that they have received and give all that they can. If I were the parent of a recruit or a recruit I would be disappointed to see a bunch of middle aged fans sitting around attacking 18-21 year old kids.

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Great, so if 99% of Clemson football players appreciate it

[2]
Posted: Aug 3, 2020, 7:37 PM
 

then they should say so. They all have social media accounts. Use that platform to denounce the “demands” made by the PAC-12 players. Use that influence to show the 1% of their teammates who feel exploited that they are ungrateful and misguided.

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Re: Great, so if 99% of Clemson football players appreciate it


Posted: Aug 3, 2020, 7:47 PM
 

They don’t owe us an explanation and are not obligated to explain themselves to us. Also, I am confident that Coach Swinney does not want them being social media warriors.

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Re: What are you trying to accomplish?

[1]
Posted: Aug 4, 2020, 9:00 AM
 

That's not the case. As he pointed out, most athletes at schools do not receive preferential treatment (a swimmer is not enough of a moneymaker). He's focusing only on football and men's basketball.

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I haven't seen anyone account for the time required for

[2]
Posted: Aug 4, 2020, 10:52 AM
 

training, practice, travel, etc. that most other students have as free time...

From what I've seen of Dabo's recent numbers as to scholarship offers, I think the selective nature is a function of addressing this very issue.

Maybe Stanford or Vanderbilt or Northwestern are more selective, but as a whole, I'd stand by Dabo's take.

Now, get your pads on and get out there in that 95 degree heat and get after it for a couple of hours, head over to the weight room for Power Hour, and after you shower and eat, start studying for tomorrow's classes...

What's the saying...? "Apples and oranges."

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Good point, football players spend a ton of time

[1]
Posted: Aug 4, 2020, 3:56 PM
 

with football-related activities. The time they spend practicing, working out, recovering, etc. is significant. It's a grind. I appreciate their sacrifices in that regard.

In exchange, they get a free education at a fine university, complete with preferential choice of class times to accommodate their schedules. They also have dedicated tutors and advisors to help them, and even their own study spaces so they aren't easily distracted. They also receive free housing, free meals, sport-specific nutrition guidance, medical care, sport-specific weight training facilities, and even dedicated counselors and clergy.

Oh, and they also have expert coaching to help them achieve all that they can from an athletic standpoint. Some will progress to the professional level, making an excellent income. Others who aren't good enough to play professionally will have access to a network of coaches to easily transition into coaching. Still others will have access to a close-knit group of alumni who can help them with job and career placement. This is a network that most regular grads don't have access to.

So yes, it is a sacrifice, but it's one that is easily worth six figures if they had to pay for it themselves. That's what the student-athletes protesting these "unfair conditions" seem to be forgetting.

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Re: Good point, football players spend a ton of time


Posted: Aug 4, 2020, 4:53 PM
 

Can we really call something a "sacrifice" that literally every high school player in America would kill for the opportunity to do? They do work hard for their free education, room and board, etc but its not really accurate to call something everybody wants to do a sacrifice is it?

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Numbers are racist


Posted: Aug 5, 2020, 9:32 AM
 

BLM asking for no more SAT/ACT tests and to delete numerical grades/ranks because the system is racist therefore it must not be valid.

With no GPA and National Test scores, the athletes will qualify fine.

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Re: Since college football players are all about fairness


Posted: Aug 5, 2020, 11:53 AM
 

So the athlete must have AT LEAST as good as the average score? Someone doesn't understand where averages come from.

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