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Tiger Titan [51168]
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Who here is concerned that we've lost our last two
Jan 4, 2021, 2:40 PM
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playoff games by a combined score of 91-53?
That's giving up an average of 45.5 points while only scoring an average of 26.5 points, for an average margin of defeat of nearly 20 points.
Do you think this is a concerning trend that represents significant issues, or just a blip on the radar that is no big deal?
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TigerNet Icon [153627]
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Are you concerned?
Jan 4, 2021, 2:44 PM
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If so, then no, I am not.
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Tiger Titan [51168]
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I agree.***
Jan 4, 2021, 2:55 PM
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TigerNet Icon [153627]
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This is the most intelligent football post...
Jan 4, 2021, 2:56 PM
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you’ve ever made.
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Tiger Titan [51168]
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No argument there.***
Jan 4, 2021, 2:58 PM
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Tiger Spirit [9805]
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Re: No argument there.***
Jan 4, 2021, 5:16 PM
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My head is spinning from the love.....
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All-In [10868]
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Re: Who here is concerned that we've lost our last two
Jan 4, 2021, 2:46 PM
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Well bama lost 44-16 two years ago and didn't even make the playoffs last year. I think we'll respond like they did.
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Tiger Spirit [9750]
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Excellent point!!!!!!!***
Jan 4, 2021, 2:49 PM
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Clemson Conqueror [11589]
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i wouldn't say it's "concerning"........however I find it ..
Jan 4, 2021, 2:56 PM
[ in reply to Re: Who here is concerned that we've lost our last two ] |
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EXTREMELY puzzling to figure out how our offense has essentially disappeared in the last 2 playoff games in which they were going up against "so-so defenses". Maybe it's our lack of run blocking oline???
Defense isn't a concern........it's an offensive game now I fully expected Ohio State and LSU to score 35+ on us......the only difference is I expected that our offense could do similar damage to their "mediocre" defenses.
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Tiger Titan [51168]
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Does it change your opinion that Alabama didn't have Tua
Jan 4, 2021, 3:03 PM
[ in reply to Re: Who here is concerned that we've lost our last two ] |
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for the last four games of the year last year?
I don't think it's unreasonable to assume that they wouldn't have lost to Auburn with Tua. Beating Auburn, with their only loss to LSU, would've probably meant another CFP appearance.
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All-In [10868]
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Not if I use the same logic
Jan 4, 2021, 3:45 PM
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To say what if we’d had Ross , Niagara and ladson
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Heisman Winner [81736]
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Re: Not if I use the same logic
Jan 4, 2021, 4:00 PM
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Gotta love autocorrect.
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Orange Beast [6419]
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Re: Who here is concerned that we've lost our last two
Jan 4, 2021, 2:49 PM
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Didn't Bama get waxed by a bunch to LSU last year and didn't
make the CFP? That would make it two wax jobs, one by us and
one by LSU. I don't think Bama has threw in the towel.
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Tiger Titan [51168]
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It's not about throwing in the towel.
Jan 4, 2021, 2:57 PM
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I don't have any doubt that our coaches and players will continue working hard.
I'm simply asking if you are concerned or not about the last two playoff games we've had.
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Paw Warrior [4758]
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Re: It's not about throwing in the towel.
Jan 4, 2021, 6:22 PM
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I am not concerned with us winning the ACC.
I am concerned about rising to the challenge of winning in the CFP.
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Clemson Conqueror [11589]
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Tiger Titan [51168]
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Also, Tua was out the last four games of the season.
Jan 4, 2021, 3:04 PM
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I'm sure that might've had something to do with Alabama losing to Auburn and thus missing out on the playoffs last year.
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Orange Blooded [4510]
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Very concerning indeed
Jan 4, 2021, 2:53 PM
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2 years in a row finishing top 4 in the country, without a national championship... embarrassing. Is this what rock bottom feels like?
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Tiger Titan [51168]
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That was a snarky way of saying
Jan 4, 2021, 2:59 PM
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that you aren't concerned.
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Orange Blooded [4510]
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Re: That was a snarky way of saying
Jan 4, 2021, 3:18 PM
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I am not concerned***
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Dynasty Maker [3162]
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No, the scores do not concern me.
Jan 4, 2021, 3:00 PM
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LSU scored that way on just about everyone they played last season.
Bama scored that way on just about everyone they played this season.
tOSU will score that way on Bama next week and would have scored that way on every team they played this season if they had a full roster AND wanted to show all their cards earlier (or had to). The U/O on the game next week is in the 70s!
Whether or not 49 will be enough beat Bama is a wait and see.
This is football in 2021. The 2018 Tigers were the CFP exception, not the rule (outstanding defense that could win a game).
The NFL is trending in this direction too.
What does concern me is that we (Clemson) went into both the LSU and tOSU game thinking that the play-calling and schemes that got us through the ACC would be enough to slow down an elite offense in the CFP.
It is not.
Saban recognized this in 2016, hence the onside kick to keep the ball out of DW4's hands. He knew his best defense was to keep DW4 off the field. Look at Bama's seemingly willingness to regress defensively this season...they know it won't matter. What matters is their ability to put up points from different places on the field.
Message was edited by: Matthetiger®
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Tiger Titan [51168]
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Fair points. My question, then, is the following:
Jan 4, 2021, 3:14 PM
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Why pay a defensive coordinator $2 million plus if we are just conceding that modern offenses are going to get their points?
Don't get me wrong, I love Venables and think he's the best defensive coordinator in college football. But if we are saying that we can't expect to hold good offenses under 40-50 points, then why bother paying for the top defensive coordinator?
Also, based on your post, we should be livid that we only scored 25 or so points in these two playoff games. This is with a supposedly great play caller in Tony Elliott, possibly the best QB in the history of college football, and the best RB in the history of the ACC. Even with our injuries this year, that seems inexcusable. Heads should roll, right?
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Dynasty Maker [3162]
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Our D Coordinator is the best in football. The market
Jan 4, 2021, 3:42 PM
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determines what the salary is for the best D Coordinator in football, not Clemson University.
We were overmatched in *almost* every playoff game we have played in Bama 3x, LSU x1, and tOSU x2 (using measurable statistics or analytics). It was excellent coaching that bridged the gaps and helped us win the games against Bama (in 2016) and tOSU (in 2019).
It is a team game - right? You have to have an elite QB and RB to win it, but absent the other pieces an elite QB and RB will not carry a team over elite competition.
On Friday (and against LSU), we truly believed we were the better team and that we would find a way to stop them a handful of times and win the game. Unfortunately, for us, it was not reality.
What we needed was for someone to say "we are having difficulty stopping them and the defense looks lost out there - we need to start playing four downs on each series, we need to keep their offense off the field."
It is hard for reality and reason to overcome entrenched beliefs, especially in the middle of a game.
I trust our coaches - who are the best out there - will figure out what went wrong and work towards improving.
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National Champion [7219]
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Re: Who here is concerned that we've lost our last two
Jan 4, 2021, 3:09 PM
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I am more concerned as to how we looked;
Embarrassed, confused( especially on defense) pushed around, lackluster effort for most of the games.
I have said it a couple of times but it bears repeating ;Top to bottom on both sides of the ball, LSU was just the better team.
OSU was not, yet the results were the same.
I don't think it's a concerning trend ,or a blip on the radar ,but it is something that needs to be addressed, and it needs to be addressed now.
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Tiger Titan [51168]
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Thanks for responding.
Jan 4, 2021, 3:15 PM
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Do you think some staff changes should be made? Or is it more of an attitude shift that needs to occur from the staff and players?
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National Champion [7576]
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Re: Who here is concerned that we've lost our last two
Jan 4, 2021, 3:13 PM
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I will only be concerned if Dabo is concerned. If he is, he will have options to bring in some extra help. I could 100% see Tom Herman wanting a spot as a consultant to revive his imagine as an offensive mastermind.
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Tiger Titan [51168]
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I'd take Herman as a consultant in a heartbeat.
Jan 4, 2021, 3:17 PM
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It seems like some fresh ideas on offense could be helpful.
I won't hold my breath waiting on Dabo to express any concern publicly about this. If he's concerned, I think we will see it in the form of coaches being let go.
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Campus Hero [13389]
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Re: Who here is concerned that we've lost our last two
Jan 4, 2021, 3:16 PM
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If our basketball team was in the final every year and lost two years in a row by a big margin would you be concerned?
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Tiger Titan [51168]
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Well, that depends on a few things.
Jan 4, 2021, 3:19 PM
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First, do we have the highest paid basketball staff in the country?
Second, do we have the best basketball facilities in the country?
Third, do we have top 5 basketball recruiting classes every year?
Fourth, do we have among the best basketball fan bases in the country?
Fifth, has our recent basketball history shown us that expecting to compete for a national championship every year is a realistic goal?
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Clemson Icon [25855]
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We consistently finish higher than our recruiting ranks
Jan 4, 2021, 3:26 PM
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Considering that we've been in the running for the national championship for the 6th year in a row, I'm not that worried.
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Athletic Dir [1185]
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Re: Well, that depends on a few things.
Jan 4, 2021, 3:29 PM
[ in reply to Well, that depends on a few things. ] |
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We only, in the previous 3-4 years have secured top 10 classes. Since 2008 I believe we average #14 in recruiting rankings. We have still overachieved. What we stand upon now is the success plateau. It’s volatile and tilts and becomes a slippery slope.
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Orange Blooded [2269]
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Re: Well, that depends on a few things.
Jan 4, 2021, 3:59 PM
[ in reply to Well, that depends on a few things. ] |
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We don’t have top 5 recruiting classes in football, every year. In fact, in the past 12 years, we’ve only finished in the top 5 twice. We are significantly overachieving compared to Oh St and Bama. Bama has finished in the top 5 every year for past 12, and Ohio State 9 out of the past 12. We have an average class ranking of 14th over those 12 years, Bama has an average of 2nd, and Ohio State 6th.
We are just now recruiting at a similar level as Ohio Ohio State and Bama, because of our recent success and championships.
I’m not concerned at all.
Message was edited by: E36Tiger®
Message was edited by: E36Tiger®
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Paw Warrior [4639]
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No.
Jan 4, 2021, 3:20 PM
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Clemson Icon [25855]
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I'm concerned our BBall team will find a way to miss tourney***
Jan 4, 2021, 3:24 PM
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Tiger Titan [51168]
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Re: I'm concerned our BBall team will find a way to miss tourney***
Jan 4, 2021, 3:34 PM
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Clemson Icon [25855]
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Re: I'm concerned our BBall team will find a way to miss tourney***
Jan 4, 2021, 3:37 PM
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Tiger Titan [51168]
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Re: I'm concerned our BBall team will find a way to miss tourney***
Jan 4, 2021, 3:41 PM
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Tiger Cub [12]
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Re: Who here is concerned that we've lost our last two
Jan 4, 2021, 3:43 PM
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The problem is outside Clemson, the ACC doesn’t provide challenging competition. We’re not prepared when we have to play top level teams.
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Tiger Titan [51168]
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How did Ohio State's 6 game season prepare them then?
Jan 4, 2021, 3:45 PM
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Their schedule wasn't nearly as good as ours this year.
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Orange Blooded [2269]
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Re: How did Ohio State's 6 game season prepare them then?
Jan 4, 2021, 4:11 PM
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It didn’t. The poster is full of #### if he thinks otherwise. Ohio State kicked our ### because they have elite talent all over the field on offense. It’s not because we weren’t prepared because of ACC play. They have more talent than Clemson and that’s a fact. Go check the recruiting rankings. Alabama has been like #1 , 9 out of the twelve years since Dabo has taken over. That is why they dominate everyone they play.
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TigerNet Elite [75118]
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Re: Who here is concerned that we've lost our last two
Jan 4, 2021, 3:43 PM
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It takes time to replace a great defensive line and a very good offensive line. This was a rebuilding year, as I've said many times. Just be patient and things will get better. Next year will definitely be better on the defensive line. The offensive line just takes time to develop (especially with a new starting QB and RB). Hopefully Jackson Carman will stay one more year.
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Tiger Titan [51168]
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Hopefully you're right about the offensive line.
Jan 4, 2021, 3:47 PM
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It will stink losing Trevor and ETN, but we know DJ is ready to be our QB and we have enough talent at RB to be successful as long as the line does their job. Plus, it will help to get some injured receivers back even though we will likely be without both Rodgers and Powell.
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Dynasty Maker [3162]
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tOSU benefitted from only playing 6 games, it is exhausting
Jan 4, 2021, 3:53 PM
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playing an 11 game schedule. Mentally and physically.
Crazy enough, I think we will be even better next year. We were young in the trenches this season. DJU is amazing, I love how hard he throws the ball!
Can't wait, but I will have to.
BEAT UGA!
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Asst Coach [840]
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Re: Hopefully you're right about the offensive line.
Jan 4, 2021, 3:56 PM
[ in reply to Hopefully you're right about the offensive line. ] |
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Not concerned to the point that I feel like we're going off the cliff. As you said, a blip or speed bump in the road. If offensive coordinators are figuring Venables out, I'm sure he'll adjust being the perfectionist he is. Looking forward to next year.
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TigerNet Immortal [177351]
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Last year, we ran into a buzz saw. LSU was one and done.
Jan 4, 2021, 3:51 PM
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Clemson is not. We'll be back and we'll win it before LSU or OSU does. We were young on defense and in my opinion, we were more in rebuilding this year. OSU played a great game and were clicking on all cylinders. Olave (sp) had to be practicing with the team and not in CV-19 protocol. We will get there as we continue to mature on defense. Our offense will be fine, so no, I'm not worried.
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Asst Coach [840]
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Re: Last year, we ran into a buzz saw. LSU was one and done.
Jan 4, 2021, 4:00 PM
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Couldn't agree more. All the grief I've been catching these last few days is silenced when I remind them that we are reloading and will be back while others fall by the wayside.
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Valley Legend [12499]
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Re: Last year, we ran into a buzz saw. LSU was one and done.
Jan 4, 2021, 4:21 PM
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We are doing great. 24-3 over the last two years. About 127 other programs would love to have this kind of record. GoooooTigers!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Valley Legend [12499]
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Re: Who here is concerned that we've lost our last two
Jan 4, 2021, 3:58 PM
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Here's what I posted on another thread and it's related to what you are asking about:
"I prefer to think losing all four Power Rangers at once, four out of five offensive linemen at once, losing Isaiah Simmons, Tanner Muse, Kvon Wallace, AJ Terrell, in addition to losing our OC for the game, injuries, Covid, targeting penalties. Let's see, how much more sh__ can we pile on here? I think the cumulative effect of all of this had more to do than the weak ACC. Just my opinion.
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Valley Legend [12499]
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Re: Who here is concerned that we've lost our last two
Jan 4, 2021, 3:59 PM
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"
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Valley Legend [12499]
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Re: Who here is concerned that we've lost our last two
Jan 4, 2021, 4:06 PM
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Oh, and let's not forget Demarcus Bowman leaving. One of the very best recruits for 2020. Poof. Gone.
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CU Medallion [19650]
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It worries me. We got torched by c-dogs, then the same
Jan 4, 2021, 4:12 PM
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against o14o state. There was a significant loss of development time in the spring, so that is a factor. Regardless, we did not seem to improve on the defensive side between the two games. Offensively we had a new line this year, which certainly doesn't help the situation.
That being said, I hope that Dabo takes a hard look at the plan and makes a few adjustments. Have to develop some of the players a groups that we have. Do we have the right position coaches in place to do that? I hope the correct ones are there by Spring practice!
Go Tigers! Spot the dern ball!
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