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Topic: Offensive overhaul(?) or adjustments needed
Replies: 35   Last Post: Jan 12, 2021, 5:36 PM by: bretfsu®
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Replies: 35  

Offensive overhaul(?) or adjustments needed

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Posted: Jan 12, 2021, 9:07 AM
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After watching Sark's masterpiece last night, it really struck me how our offense has become stale and predictable. Right now, Sark > Elliott in the creativity department. I also like the way that Sark goes to his playmakers continuously---he doesn't give depth chart reps to guys who don't belong on the field. NO further comment needed there. He will also run plays until the opposing defense proves they can stop it. Or not. Something we never do.

With DJ's arm talent, it seems to me we really need to take a hard look our offensive philosophy and do an overhaul. The Chad Morris offense has become stale and far too predictable for our opponents.

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May 6, 2020: "I know I went to Clemson and got a degree, prob more than you ever did. And I bet my IQ is higher than yours too !" sociologycoot843


say what u will bama plays smashmouth football at the point

[3]
Posted: Jan 12, 2021, 9:17 AM
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of attack yes the o-line and d-line.

of the 4 teams in the cfp i think clemsons o-line was #4

we need a little beef on the line like the old days!

go tigers

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Re: say what u will bama plays smashmouth football at the point

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Posted: Jan 12, 2021, 9:21 AM
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I've been harping on that all year. Our OL was pretty awful this year. The good news is we have some studs coming in and moving up. Will they be ready? We will see.

I also think you will see an immediate impact from guys like Demonte Capehart and Tre Williams on the D Line. We can move Bresee outside where I think he will be lethal.

I think the future is bright in the trenches. If anything, I am actually more concerned with the defensive backfield and in particular, at safety.

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Re: say what u will bama plays smashmouth football at the point


Posted: Jan 12, 2021, 12:58 PM
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Bresee outside - check. Been harping in that for awhile.

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Championships are still won or lost in the trenches***

[1]
Posted: Jan 12, 2021, 9:23 AM
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Sometimes good things fall apart so better things can fall together.


Re: say what u will bama plays smashmouth football at the point


Posted: Jan 12, 2021, 9:31 AM
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Exactly! This is how we played smash mouth in the trenches a few short years ago:

https://deadspin.com/clemsons-offensive-line-turned-daron-payne-into-a-block-1791038475


Did we start believing we are a finesse team?

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Re: say what u will bama plays smashmouth football at the point

[4]
Posted: Jan 12, 2021, 9:37 AM
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We need some beef on rb's too.

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Re: say what u will bama plays smashmouth football at the point

[1]
Posted: Jan 12, 2021, 11:19 AM
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OL techniques and processes may change, but the bottom line is still the same:

Move your opponent from point A to point B against his will.

Or, put another way,

Do not allow your opponent to go where he wants to go.

(The first is an oversimplification of run blocking. The second is an oversimplification of pass protection.)

If Bama played this season with the FSU OL they would have be 5-5 or maybe 6-4 at best.

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Re: say what u will bama plays smashmouth football at the point


Posted: Jan 12, 2021, 5:36 PM
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OL techniques and processes may change, but the bottom line is still the same:

Move your opponent from point A to point B against his will.

Or, put another way,

Do not allow your opponent to go where he wants to go.

(The first is an oversimplification of run blocking. The second is an oversimplification of pass protection.)

If Bama played this season with the FSU OL they would have be 6-4 or maybe 7-3 at best.

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Re: Offensive overhaul

[3]
Posted: Jan 12, 2021, 9:17 AM
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agree...mostly. But I honestly don't think there is much Chard Morris-style creativity in our offense anymore.

Seeing the way 'bama used D. Smith speed on short passes (faked an end-around and cut back across the grain in the flat for a TD) was impressive. We seem to fallback to the trips L or R or bubble screen rather than do something more creative. The sideline long ball is nice, but exploiting the middle of the field and getting YAC is hurting us. I attribute that somewhat to uneven use of our TE's too. We did it a few games this year and had great results, but we just sort of ignored it in the last few games. Not sure why.

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Re: Offensive overhaul

[2]
Posted: Jan 12, 2021, 11:12 AM
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C Morris was very creative and kept a defense on its heels our present offense has become more predictable Morris used the tight ends in multiple ways blocking and catching He used more eye candy Morris was able to hide an inferior O line more than offense we have now depends on an Ala Georgia OSU type line

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Re: Offensive overhaul

[2]
Posted: Jan 12, 2021, 12:08 PM
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It helps that our tight ends were Dwayne Allen and Jordan Leggett during the time Morris was here.

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Re: Offensive overhaul

[2]
Posted: Jan 12, 2021, 9:21 AM
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1) We need to ride the hot hand. If a guy can beat the defense keep going to him until the defense stops it.
2) We need to use the receivers to run more up the seam (middle of field) versus always running out routes and down the sideline.
3) We use to use a lot of pre-snap motion. The narrative several years ago called it "window dressing" and that teams had to use it because they weren't good enough. We have gone away from the pre-snap concept. Once again, Alabama has learned to adapt and that motion clearly allowed playmakers to be open in space. We need to go back to this.
4) If our line can't blow, then we learn to adapt to set up middle screens, quick hits to guys in motion, roll the pocket, etc.

Bottom line is like you have stated, we have not adapted at all while others are updating their concepts. Time to do some serious self-scouting and soul searching.

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Sark's system is an RPO that runs the football...

[1]
Posted: Jan 12, 2021, 9:22 AM
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which is very similar to what Clemson does.

If defenses are going to let you run the ball, then you continue to run the ball. The moment defenses try to take away the run, the system is built to go to the RPO. Nothing unusual about that.

The difference is, Sark uses more eye candy to set-up mismatches and he tags pass options on to his three base running plays (inside zone, outside zone, and power). He also teaches his receivers to actually block.

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Re: Sark's system is an RPO that runs the football...


Posted: Jan 12, 2021, 9:23 AM
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We don't run the football. Come again?

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an offense "look in the mirror" definitely needs to happen..


Posted: Jan 12, 2021, 9:28 AM
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I wouldn't use the term "overhaul" necessarily, but I get your point.

I think our defense will be fine. BV also should take that OSU game and "tweak" his playcalling strategy. Our safeties are a concern, No offense to them, but we need a big talent upgrade there.

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Re: Offensive overhaul(?) or adjustments needed


Posted: Jan 12, 2021, 9:41 AM
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When Sark was in the NFL and did not have the talent, he sucked! Now he has great talent, he is great? I think it is in between.

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Re: Offensive overhaul(?) or adjustments needed


Posted: Jan 12, 2021, 9:43 AM
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Thanks for your input, Mr. bandwagon fan. Nice 1st post.

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May 6, 2020: "I know I went to Clemson and got a degree, prob more than you ever did. And I bet my IQ is higher than yours too !" sociologycoot843


Re: Offensive overhaul(?) or adjustments needed

[1]
Posted: Jan 12, 2021, 9:49 AM
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Consider the source, RB. Nobody who lives on Hilton Head Island has even the remotest touch with reality.

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Re: Offensive overhaul(?) or adjustments needed


Posted: Jan 12, 2021, 9:57 AM
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I think our play callings been fine for slapping around the ACC but we need to be able to go against tendencies when we play similarly talented teams. I know we used to think we were keeping things vanilla early in the season to surprise the better teams later in the season. Doesn't really seem like that the case any more. Our offensive play calling looked pretty much the same it had all year against OSU. When the other teams just as talented AND knows what you're going to do then its usually going to be a struggle.

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Re: Offensive overhaul(?) or adjustments needed


Posted: Jan 12, 2021, 12:59 PM
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Insert TE calling plays here. I think he adjusts pretty well in game. Eventually taking advantage of what’s there. I do think some of the play calling by Stark was Innovated and he def got all of his guys involved. We were flat out not as good up front this year on OL. Also OSU spent all offseason and half of their season watching Clemson tape. We will be fine. Young team with great class coming in.

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Re: Offensive overhaul(?) or adjustments needed

[4]
Posted: Jan 12, 2021, 10:25 AM
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First of all I am laughing at all of the people in this thread saying we need to change the way we call plays and referencing the Sugar Bowl as if Elliott actually attended the game. Nobody was making those same complaints after the Notre Dame game 2 weeks prior.

I also love all of the Clemson fans jumping on the "why can't we use creative motion" and completely ignoring the fact that we tried the orbit motion and even tried to do the half orbit motion this season.

The reason it didn't stand out the same way is because Amari Rodgers, as much as I love how he plays, is not DeVonta Smith.

Now in saying all of that, I do think there are concepts and tweaks we can make to our scheme that could greatly improve our offense.

In direct response to RB, I think Bama had about 8 different players catch the ball last night. Sark was using his depth as well but this season Bama's depth at the WR position was much better than Clemson's so it looked a little different when their 3rd, 4th, or 5th guy caught the ball.

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Elliott taking an NFL job might not be the worst thing***

[1]
Posted: Jan 12, 2021, 10:26 AM
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I guess you didn’t watch the Ohio State game


Posted: Jan 12, 2021, 10:45 AM
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The offense was stagnant after the first few Elliott scripted drives. Streeter and Dabo failed to make adjustments, after Ohio State adjusted their defense. The absence of Tony Elliott was felt and it wasn’t pretty.

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Clemson couldn't get anything going with the run game...

[1]
Posted: Jan 12, 2021, 11:17 AM
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due to poor OL play and OSU knew it. Clemson was one dimensional so OSU could pin their ears back and come after TL on pretty much every play.

The best OC in the game wouldn't have changed that.




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Hopefully we would bring somebody else in, Streeter isn't


Posted: Jan 12, 2021, 12:33 PM
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the answer

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Re: Offensive overhaul(?) or adjustments needed


Posted: Jan 12, 2021, 10:55 AM
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We give up on the run way to quick and are still meager at times in the intermediate (Renfrow area) passing game. Although I thought D.J. did a better job at finding the underneath guys. If we have one or two bad running plays seems like Elliott just gives up on it.

I still can't understand why they quit running the ball against LSU last year? Would have shortened the game and given us a chance.

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Re: Offensive overhaul(?) or adjustments needed

[2]
Posted: Jan 12, 2021, 10:59 AM
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Good question but no. This time last year, look what TE and CBV thought they had. They also thought they had a full spring and summer programs to further develop the young OL talent. We also had what should have been stud experience DE and we lost both. Pretty much lost our best two/3 WR - so, we were oh so close. Closer than I initially thought. It just didn't work out.

I watched some of the coaches broadcast (I love Clawson). But if you look at the start of the game, OSU had Bama D on their heels like they did us. Saban had the luxury of watching and learning from our game film. By the time CBV adjusted, Skalski got a target and fields made the throws and 28 pts later, we had to scrap our gp kinda.

Anyway, I'll leave the x and o's to you experts like Tiger O et al. However, that 92? From Bama dline that's a stud, what y'all think, imho that's what Bresee will be plus some.

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Re: Offensive overhaul(?) or adjustments needed


Posted: Jan 12, 2021, 11:27 AM
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Morris used much more eye candy when we defeated OSU in orange bowl few years back they did not know where the ball was going Tajh rolled out a lot in that game avoiding pass rush due to our O Line not protecting When we had Sammy Watkins he was like D Smith not big but faster than everyone and very athletic we used him on patters similar to D Smith We may be missing J Scott more than we thought His Dad was very creative when he was an O C

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Re: Offensive overhaul(?) or adjustments needed

[2]
Posted: Jan 12, 2021, 11:40 AM
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Just to be clear, Sammy Watkins weighed 30 more pounds while at Clemson than DeVonta Smith does now.

I'm not so sure that "not big" applied to Sammy.

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Re: Offensive overhaul(?) or adjustments needed


Posted: Jan 12, 2021, 11:30 AM
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Bamas offense last night looked more like ours than ever. I think our offense and more importantly offensive coordinator is just fine. I will say we need better overall depth on offensive line but then moat teams want that.

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Top 10 Offensively; yet you say

[3]
Posted: Jan 12, 2021, 12:54 PM
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Coach Elliott was playing with one hand tied behind his back for this past season in my opinion and should be praised like never before.
Clemson finished top 10 offensively.
Averaged over 40 ppg.
Was right at 500 ypg.

Why He should be praised more than usual is: "accomplishing those things listed above; despite having 4 new OL starters who turned out to be ineffective in large part.

In short, I don't know that an entire offensive overhaul is needed; so much as there needs to be emphasis placed on OL play! It was clear and apparent that was the issue. Also, in the ND game the offense scored 40 pts in Indiana. And lost! To me that was more on the defense. Same case for the OSU game(defense).

Elliott has been the easy scapegoat - but the offense averaged what they have been averaging since this impressive run started.

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Re: Top 10 Offensively; yet you say


Posted: Jan 12, 2021, 1:27 PM
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^^^ this ^^^ - man you x and o guys are good. Thanks 4 teachin this old lady some football.

Do have a question that I posted in another thread and got TD's for. I just said I thought a healthy developed Ross could play our 9, 5, and 2 slots like bama did with Devonte. I mean, Ross has only had 2 years college experience, and only played 1.5 not hurt. I really think Tony would have used him all over the place.

Tbs, God works in mysterious ways. JR may be blessed by his injury on discovery of defect + it gave CP-17 his chance to shine and now will probably get drafted higher than ever b4... Same wit amari.

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Good Lord, we didn't play ANYBODY beside ND***


Posted: Jan 12, 2021, 3:07 PM
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Bucknut O-line and Sermon ran us over

[1]
Posted: Jan 12, 2021, 1:01 PM
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Most of the game. Bama D knocked out Sermon on the 1st series apparently with clean hits.

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Re: Offensive overhaul(?) or adjustments needed

[2]
Posted: Jan 12, 2021, 1:18 PM
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Listen all of you have some valid points; however you go to war with the army you have. Considering all that happened this year making the final four is a major accomplishment. Since the CFP started we are second in most wins (2). Ain't nothing to be sneezed at.

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