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Orange Blooded [3820]
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Louisville or Clemson - who's in control?
Oct 23, 2016, 11:16 AM
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"Which is why it's FAR better to have stared down a chip-shot field goal and lived to tell the tale than it is to miss a yard marker and be whining about it two weeks later."
I couldn't disagree more. I beg to differ because we're NOT playing the game of football, people - football's just the facade we create for the simple-minded inbred and most SEC fans. Something with flashy uniforms, lots of action, resounding thuds, tickly pom-poms. But it's not the real game.
No: We're playing at the game of politics.
The game of ESPN and Bob Delaney. The game of the NCAA, and a besmirched but unbowed UNCheat. The game of 20-second highlight reels, advanced stats, what ifs, and "quality losses". The game of football conferences versus basketball conferences. The game of committees and... well, I need say no more.
Committees. The word should strike fear in the hearts of Clemson men as no other. For in 'committees' lies the soul of an evil that Danny Ford fought every down. A vicious and ravenous soul, a soul made of winks and words, a soul made of football-less Heisman-esque feints, a soul made of lies and innuendo, a soul made of what MIGHT could have been, or could be, or IS if I want it to be. Yes; Lies a political soul.
And in the game of politics, control is everything. Everything. People like Obama and the Clintons, et al spend a lifetime obsessing on it, eating it, idolizing it, abusing it. That's because with control you can do anything: abuse the power of your social status to coerce little Jewish girls into fellatio, murder millions in genocidal pogroms, en-trance the millions of gold-helmeted rosaried with stories of how you went undefeated by scoring from the last 2 yards even when you didn't. And so long as you maintain control, well there's nothing anyone else can do about it.
Really; the size of the horror doesn't actually matter - only the control does.
That's why Louisville can get into the playoffs over Clemson even though the Birds lost to the Tigers, H2H. The "horror!" you say?
For in a political world it's not just IF you have won, it is in fact how you expressed your control. How big was the win. How flashy were the stats. How many Heisman poses did you unknowingly hit. How many of the opponent had to be carted off the pitch to the muted yet respectfully soft-gloved hand-clapping of ladies at the opera.
Failure to exhibit control is simple weakness in that world. Questions that need to be asked. Innuendo that needs to be whispered. Blood in the water that needs to be tasted.
So, yes we're 7-0; but in the eyes of the politicos we're also likely 9-3. In other words, a train wreck waiting to happen if we don't start executing better. That's the reality living in their seditious little minds. And so that's our political world. That's the world of projections and pundits... the CFP world.
Danny would say it can also be the football world, and would remind us of 2011. Down by 14 twice to a King with no clothes in a Cam-less Auburn? Can't put away a FSU team with a literally anemic back-up at QB? Survive a fusillade of missed FG's on either side to beat Weak Forest by 3? Fall behind to Fairyland by 18... twice... in the 2nd half? Danny would tell you that's sure-fire losses in the subtle guise of victory. Danny would say that's a team living on someone else's time. Danny would tell you that's a young, young team who doesn't know how to win, they know how to escape against bad teams. Danny would agree with the pundits - this time - and say it's all likely gonna come to an end.
A chip shot FG from losing, and nothing we can do about it. We committed the ultimate heresy. We gave up control. We were no longer the masters of our own fate. The bullet in the gun was aimed at us, not somebody else. And no amount of holding up our hands or proclaiming our innocence or cursing the fates was going to do a dang thing about it.
Giving up control: In the world of politics that's the same as dead, even as you don't yet know it, even if it's not yet actually chiseled into the stone scorebook. And if you don't believe me, then ask Trump how that feels.
The hard truth is that Clemson lives in a political world where it doesn't control it's own image. And because, rightly or wrongly, the world hates the righteous goody-two-shoes, the world is always gonna try to pull the fangs from Dabo and his Tigers. That's life folks - stop whining about it. Even Dabo knows that the only way to deal with this problem is to win out, ALL IN win always, win until they don't put anymore games in front of you, just win baby, just win.
Because in the winning is the fu, errr... no. That's the party line. That's for the kids. Really - because in the winning is the control.
And that's all you need to know.
For Clemson to get to the CFP, they've got to win out. Win. Out.
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Orange Blooded [3350]
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Wow, you are quiet a writer.***
Oct 23, 2016, 11:22 AM
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Orange Blooded [3362]
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Re: Wow, you are quiet a writer.***
Oct 23, 2016, 10:06 PM
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42 to 36 is ALL that matters
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Orange Blooded [3820]
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Naive...
Oct 23, 2016, 10:11 PM
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nm
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Orange Blooded [2783]
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Can someone post a executive summary
Oct 23, 2016, 11:24 AM
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Clemson controls it's destiny.... just keep winning and we'll be in the final 4. See, I think I summed that up in two sentences.
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Orange Blooded [3820]
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you forgot the Trump has already lost thing...
Oct 23, 2016, 11:29 AM
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just sayin' 
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Orange Blooded [4659]
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Re: Louisville or Clemson - who's in control?
Oct 23, 2016, 11:25 AM
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We beat Louisville, period. And that padding they were expecting in their only showcase game left against Houston is looking quite laughable after Houston's loss against SMU yesterday.
Lamar Jackson might win the Heisman, but Louisville will not be in the CFP.
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Oculus Spirit [83127]
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Zero chance Louisville gets in over a 1 loss Clemson
Oct 23, 2016, 11:26 AM
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team if we win the ACC. Now, if we lose in ACCCG and that is our only loss, it could happen.
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Orange Blooded [4745]
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Correct, as long as Clemson wins the ACC, even with
Oct 23, 2016, 11:42 AM
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a loss in the regular season, we get in over Louisville.
The Committee has been consistent, they give preference to conference champions, and head to head wins. We would be in over Louisville on both counts.
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CU Guru [1714]
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Re: Louisville or Clemson - who's in control?
Oct 23, 2016, 11:26 AM
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Yeah, I just woke up and don't really care to digest what you are putting out here. I give up reading this post, point for your for my forfeiture.
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Orange Blooded [3820]
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All-In [38427]
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Re: Louisville or Clemson - who's in control?
Oct 23, 2016, 11:30 AM
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Then we have no worries , because we aren't capable of losing . Didn't you watch the end of the Louisville and NC State games ?
Can't . Loose.
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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So it's rigged?***
Oct 23, 2016, 11:35 AM
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Orange Blooded [3820]
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ask Roy Williams if it's rigged...
Oct 23, 2016, 11:45 AM
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nm
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All-TigerNet [10929]
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You are 100% correct.
Oct 23, 2016, 11:37 AM
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Crack is whack.
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Orange Blooded [3968]
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All that for something that could be answered in a few sentences
Oct 23, 2016, 11:56 AM
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Bottom line is we have the head to head win over them which the playoff committee ranks as one of the top criteria. Outside of us dropping 2 games, we're going to the playoffs and Louisville will be sitting on the couch watching.
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CU Guru [1712]
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Clemson is in control
Oct 23, 2016, 12:01 PM
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Yes, there's politics everywhere, including in college football.
But Clemson proved last year that it can thrive in that political world. All it needed to do is win.
Win. Win. Win.
And if it came down to the committee having to pick between Louisville or Clemson, Clemson has a way better resume.
Comparing resumes and highlights:
Clemson: win at 5-2 Auburn, 6-1 Troy and oh, a win over Louisville despite turning the ball over
Louisville: a loss to Clemson
There's no comparison.
So politics or not, all Clemson needs to do is take care of business. Win. Win. Win.
Go Clemson!
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Team Captain [468]
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it'a really not that complicated it is tv ratings***
Oct 23, 2016, 12:26 PM
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Orange Blooded [4744]
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The Khazars are in control.***
Oct 23, 2016, 1:00 PM
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Scout Team [196]
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Re: Louisville or Clemson - who's in control?
Oct 23, 2016, 8:08 PM
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Haha well written, but you're wrong.
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Orange Blooded [3820]
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won't be the last time...
Oct 23, 2016, 9:30 PM
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for either of us
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All-In [36409]
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Question For You - What Brand of Tin Foil Do You Make Your
Oct 23, 2016, 9:36 PM
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Hat From? Reynolds Wrap or Wal-Mart Store Brand? By The Way a 1-Loss Clemson Still Goes Ahead of Loserville, Even in the ACCCG.
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Orange Blooded [3820]
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whatever the cheapest they sell at Was Mart, of course...
Oct 23, 2016, 10:10 PM
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why go expensive if you're gonna float out in left-field?
by the way, you may be right that a
1-loss Clemson goes to the CFP before Louisville
but there's going to be a helluva argument and tons of politicking from the talking bobbleheads
before it happens.
Everyone thinks the H2H means the most; I think that's naive.
We beat Louisville by 2 yards AT HOME - that's what they're going to see, and the Committee
will discount that.
They'll also discount it being an early season game, and then there's the late season trend -
Louisville has been on a monster roll, and Clemson will have lost a game in the latter stages.
In addition to Conference Champions and H2H, the Committee has also talked about how important late season trend is.
You may be right even still; but I wouldn't bet your house on it.
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All-TigerNet [14488]
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Well said
Oct 23, 2016, 10:12 PM
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+1
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CU Guru [1330]
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Re: Louisville or Clemson - who's in control?
Oct 23, 2016, 11:19 PM
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The per-play efficiency stats vs Louisville should tell a decent voter all they need to know.
CU Yards per pass: 10
CUYards per rush: 6.5
UL Yards per pass: 6.5
UL yards per rush: 5.0
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All-In [28401]
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Re: Louisville or Clemson - who's in control?
Oct 23, 2016, 11:29 PM
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did they put in 1 loss ohio st last yr over mich st? uh...no. and osu was considerered better than all 4 playoff teams. want to know why??? they lost head to head. both msu and osu had one loss but look who got in. enough said
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Orange Blooded [3820]
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just a couple of points for comparison....
Oct 23, 2016, 11:48 PM
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1) the Ohio State loss to Michigan State was AT Ohio State. Louisville's loss to us was not at UL, but instead at Clemson,and there is at least a 3 point advantage given to the Home Team. I suggest that the Committee will likely discount UL's loss to us some because it was an away game for them. Since Mich St beat Ohio St in Columbus, kind of hard to argue that the Bucks were better than Mich State on ANY field.
2) last year, Mich St lost to Nebraska BEFORE they beat Ohio St - in their 9th game. Mich St was clearly the better team at the END of the year. If Clemson loses at some point going forward that means UL will have a 7 game win streak since their loss to us, and our win streak will be the ACCCG + 1 or so. The Committee stresses a few things - Conference Champion and H2H, but also late year trend. If both teams are one loss, no matter where Clemson's loss comes, UL will have a better trend for the end of the year.
3) I think anyone who thinks the H2H here is ALL important is simply naive: that game will be discounted for the three reasons above - AT Clemson, early season game, and Clemson will have a loss afterwards.
4) Notably, Mich St's loss was AT Nebraska. See discussion above about discounting that loss.
5) Last year there was no undefeated Pac 12 team. This year, Washington may do it. That limits the Committees options. Also if a conference were going to get 2 bids it would likely be aTm ad Bama, not Clemson and UL. You know all the reasons there.
6) Face it - LJ is the new media darling, and UL is going to get some real mileage out of the points he's been putting up. Further, there's a fair number of media who don't like Dabo's act nor his professed faith. That's just the world we live in today - the media almost prefers the Bobby Petrino's to the Dabo's just because it's a counter-culture world.
Anyway, I'm just trying to get people to see that it does matter how we win and that the team does need to show out more. And if there is anything to be scared of, it's politics in a money-is-king-world.
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Hall of Famer [24779]
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Re: just a couple of points for comparison....
Oct 24, 2016, 12:02 AM
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1) We won by more than 3
2) We have had much tougher competition other than FSU
3) Our loss would also be on the road, assuming FSU
4) Notably, see (3) above
5) You cite the media bias; it's been toward the ACC THIS year
6) Media doesn't participate on the CFP committee
Now this, I agree with...
Message was edited by: SOLOS®
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Orange Blooded [3820]
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Re: just a couple of points for comparison....
Oct 24, 2016, 4:09 AM
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1) We won by more than 3 - actually, assuming they would have made the XP,
we won by either 3 yards or by one score. either way the difference is essentially nothing.
And while the math doesn't suit you, other people see it as a wash. I suggest the
Committee might readily go there as well.
2) We have had much tougher competition other than FSU -
This I agree now, though by the end of the year, this too will be a wash.
We'll both have an ACC Atlantic schedule, and for our Auburn they'll have Houston.
USuCk hurts our SOS, and Troy, while having a good record, is still American Conf.
They'll have Kentucky to compare as well. In the Coastal they have Duke to our Ga Tech.
That's in their favor. Overall = wash.
3) Our loss would also be on the road, assuming FSU -
I made no assumptions on where we'll lose, and given the performance against NCSU
it makes no sense to assume we won't lose to Pitt. Again, as you say, a wash at best.
4) Notably, see (3) above - again, wash at best for us.
5) You cite the media bias; it's been toward the ACC THIS year - This I find
hard to believe anyone would write with a straight face. There was love for us at first but
now we're last year's disappointing Ohio State. There may be love for Louisville
but that's what hurts us. If we lose one, the higher ranked two-some from the
same conference might instead be aTm and Bama. So again I only see significant
possibility that a loss for us puts us at extreme risk of missing the CFP
because for sure Louisville will be higher ranked than us then.
6) Media doesn't participate on the CFP committee - They may not be in the
room, but the media influences everyone. Get real.
This is exactly why I wrote this - people are so locked into going to the CFP
again, they aren't assessing the season honestly. It appears the team is having
the same problem. You knee-jerked, wrote some points down, but on closer
inspection, you didn't come up with much, if anything, to refute the issue.
But hey, hide your head in the sand if you want. You've got lots of company.
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Orange Blooded [3371]
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Caller on Sirius XM CSN's Sunday w/ Staples
Oct 24, 2016, 12:18 AM
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Brought that up in a question tonight whether the CFP committee would take an 11-1 UL over a 12-1 Clemson if we lost an ACC game but won out & claimed the ACC title. Soon as the question made it out the caller's mouth, Andy Staples said 'no'. He more or less said that the given the emphasis the committee has put on conference championships & that the committee would place emphasis on the H2H if it came down to the committee having to Clemson or Louisville for a playoff spot, it would be us getting the nod.
I would have to believe he's right. As much as most ppl want to wish that Oct 1st never happened or use any transitive property argument possible so they can tout UL as the best team in the ACC, if the committee overlooks our body of work that would include more top 25 wins, a better OOC schedule, & an ACC title, then the CFP will have shot itself to #### faster than the BCS system did.
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CU Guru [1898]
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So, the clear answer is ....
Oct 24, 2016, 12:41 AM
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JUST WIN OUT!!!!!!
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Orange Blooded [2951]
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Clemson - the VICTIM??
Oct 24, 2016, 2:38 AM
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It seems to me you're saying Clemson is a victim here. Personally, I don't buy it. Forget Louisville's whining and crying - they lost. End of story. No matter how they spin it, Clemson won the game. It's been a foregone conclusion that to make the playoffs will require winning out - with maybe one hiccup along the way. Nothing changes. The plan is the same.
The Tigers have complete control over their destiny - in a better position than pretty much any team in the country. So I don't buy that Louisville or ESPN or committees or anyone else can control Clemson. The plan has been executed very well so far - not perfect but one can't argue with the results. Steer the course and we remain in control and in terms of power, it is ours until we give it up.
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Legend [15914]
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Lots of words.. but your wrong; we do control out own destiny.
Oct 24, 2016, 3:07 AM
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The polls had us 3 or 4 last year, the committee had us 1.
Beat FSU, and it the first committee ranking will be 1 Bama, 2 Clemson. Guaranteed based off of SOS.
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CU Guru [1239]
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You're mistaken.
Oct 24, 2016, 4:54 AM
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Clemson was #1 in every poll from Week 12 till after conference championship games. The only earlier poll that we weren't ranked #1 is Coaches Poll in week 11. They had Ohio State at #1 then.
After all conference championship games, Clemson was the only undefeated team. Other than Clemson, Iowa was the last unbeaten team that lost before the playoffs, but they weren't highly regarded.
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Legend [16861]
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Re: Louisville or Clemson - who's in control?
Oct 24, 2016, 8:01 AM
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Epifunny...you need to come clean. You're really Mark May using an alias here, ain'tcha?
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Orange Blooded [3049]
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What kind of drugs are you on?
Oct 24, 2016, 8:15 AM
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Take a deep breath and calm down. It will be OK.
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110%er [5287]
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Here, let me educate you a bit on what you are missing
Oct 24, 2016, 9:16 AM
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http://www.collegefootballplayoff.com/selection-committee-protocol
Start by reading that.
Proposed Selection Process:
Establish a committee that will be instructed to place an emphasis on winning conference championships, strength of schedule and head-to-head competition when comparing teams with similar records and pedigree (treat final determination like a tie-breaker; apply specific guidelines).
The criteria to be provided to the selection committee must be aligned with the ideals of the commissioners, presidents, athletic directors and coaches to honor regular season success while at the same time providing enough flexibility and discretion to select a non-champion or independent under circumstances where that particular non-champion or independent is unequivocally one of the four best teams in the country.
When circumstances at the margins indicate that teams are comparable, then the following criteria must be considered:
Championships won
Strength of schedule
Head-to-head competition (if it occurred)
Comparative outcomes of common opponents (without incenting margin of victory)
Some of the guidelines and protocols expected to be established to guide the committee would include, but not be limited to, the following:
Strength of schedule, head-to-head competition and championships won must be specifically applied as tie-breakers between teams that look similar;
So, in summary...
If Clemson stays undefeated, they will ALWAYS be ahead of Louisville....why? because they do not have comparable records.
If Clemson was to lose a game, and both teams are 11-1, Clemson STILL gets in over Louisville, for 3 reasons:
1) Clemson will be in the ACC-CG. If they win it, they have the Championship win that Louisville doesn't.
2) Clemson won the head-to-head competition between CU/UL, thus they get the nod.
3) Check the SOS I posted earlier. Clemson is ahead of Louisville in SOS, thus CU gets the nod by SOS.
...a 4th part of this will be comparing outcomes of common games (i.e vs FSU, NC St, etc).....however, note the phrase "(without incenting margin of victory)". So as long as Clemson defeats FSU, they will both be evebn there. It will not matter how many points Louisville scored on ANY opponent vs how many Clemson scored....margin of victory is not incentivized. All that matters is win vs loss.
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Orange Blooded [2951]
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Very Interesting....
Dec 16, 2016, 2:26 AM
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....to go back almost 2 months and see what the discussion was then....
Seems to me the Tigs took the challenge and kicked a#$........BEAT OSU!!
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Orange Blooded [3820]
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tell Tigerman to check out Penn State....
Dec 16, 2016, 3:30 AM
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how did the B1g Championship and H2H win over OSU
work out for the Nittany Lions ?
Had Louisville won out and finished with 1 loss,
Clemson's loss to Pitt may have invalidated the ACCCG and the H2H win over the Cards,
and
may have changed who got into the CFP.
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Commissioner [970]
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Re: tell Tigerman to check out Penn State....
Dec 16, 2016, 6:49 AM
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Didn't Penn State have 2 losses? If we had 2 losses against 1 loss for louisville then you could start making comparison between louisville and osu.
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Legend [17786]
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Re: Louisville or Clemson - who's in control?
Dec 16, 2016, 7:00 AM
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Let's get you a warm meal
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50
