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TNET: Conference realignment is back, and Clemson has a decision to make
Jul 2, 2022, 8:00 AM
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Ultimate Tiger [38049]
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Re: TNET: Conference realignment is back, and Clemson has a decision to make
Jul 2, 2022, 8:05 AM
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Maybe I’m reading it wrong but it sounds like Phillips may have his head in the sand… thanks as always for sharing David, and good luck with your move!
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Asst Coach [740]
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IS THERE A CHANCE OF ACC SIGNIFICANTLY EXPANDING ???
Jul 2, 2022, 9:57 AM
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IN AN ATTRACTIVE WAY ….. ATTRACTIVE TO BOTH MEDIA (LIKE ESPN) AND UNIVERSITIES ??
WHAT IF THE CURENT ACC ADDED THE FOLLOWING:
- NOTRE DAME
- PENN STATE
- SOUTH CAROLINA
- FLORIDA
- WEST VIRGINIA ??
- MARYLAND ??
IT SEEMS THERE IS VALUE TO GEOGRAPHIC ALIGNMENT…IF IT MAKES FAN ATTENDANCE EASIER AND VENUES FULL
I KNOW ITS ALL ABOUT MONEY BUT MAKE THE ACC ATTRACTIVE FINANCIALLY FOR THE MEDIA !!!!!
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Orange Beast [6107]
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Re: IS THERE A CHANCE OF ACC SIGNIFICANTLY EXPANDING ???
Jul 2, 2022, 10:13 AM
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The only team on that list that the ACC can get is West Virginia. Maryland was the smart one ditching the ACC when it did. That would be a very nice lineup but, it is not going to happen.
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Team Captain [492]
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Re: IS THERE A CHANCE OF ACC SIGNIFICANTLY EXPANDING ???
Jul 2, 2022, 12:46 PM
[ in reply to IS THERE A CHANCE OF ACC SIGNIFICANTLY EXPANDING ??? ] |
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There is no way Florida leaves the SEC for the ACC, and Notre Dame will likely go Big 10.
The ACC is dead. We’ll be in the SEC in 5 years, along with FSU and Miami.
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Mascot [17]
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Re: IS THERE A CHANCE OF ACC SIGNIFICANTLY EXPANDING ???
Jul 2, 2022, 12:46 PM
[ in reply to IS THERE A CHANCE OF ACC SIGNIFICANTLY EXPANDING ??? ] |
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There is no way Florida leaves the SEC for the ACC, and Notre Dame will likely go Big 10.
The ACC is dead. We’ll be in the SEC in 5 years, along with FSU and Miami.
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Mascot [17]
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Re: IS THERE A CHANCE OF ACC SIGNIFICANTLY EXPANDING ???
Jul 2, 2022, 12:46 PM
[ in reply to IS THERE A CHANCE OF ACC SIGNIFICANTLY EXPANDING ??? ] |
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There is no way Florida leaves the SEC for the ACC, and Notre Dame will likely go Big 10.
The ACC is dead. We’ll be in the SEC in 5 years, along with FSU and Miami.
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Rival Killer [2873]
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Re: IS THERE A CHANCE OF ACC SIGNIFICANTLY EXPANDING ???
Jul 2, 2022, 8:17 PM
[ in reply to IS THERE A CHANCE OF ACC SIGNIFICANTLY EXPANDING ??? ] |
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Wow.
So all the ACC needs to do is just raid the SEC and Big Ten for 4 teams? Ok, so why would they leave those conferences? To make less money? To put their football future in jeopardy?
And besides those 4, why would even WVU or ND try to gain ACC membership versus trying to get into 2 conferences that are obviously going to pay more and not be at risk of staying relevant?
Thanks. Asking for a friend.
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110%er [7928]
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What Dabo has done is absolutely amazing
Jul 2, 2022, 8:08 AM
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but he can’t do it forever with less money - in fact much less money than the SEC schools- it’s time to move now
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Rival Killer [2873]
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Re: What Dabo has done is absolutely amazing
Jul 2, 2022, 8:27 PM
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Yup. Writing has been on the wall for a while. Since the last expansion going all the way back to 2003 (-ish), the ACC should have continued working aggressively towards additional expansion and they’ve continued to disappoint. It’s been especially evident over the past decade with the Big Ten and SEC. And the ACC decided to just wait and let them make the additional moves that put the conference at serious risk. Should’ve struck again prior to that. Yeah, Philips will go down as the commissioner that didn’t take evasive action to mitigate serious risk and drove the conference into the ground. Good job!
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Athletic Dir [1137]
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Re: What Dabo has done is absolutely amazing
Jul 7, 2022, 7:55 AM
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Acc has made moves just none have worked. Adding miami and vt were good. Letting ND string us along like they did Big east is stupid. Syr, Pitt, BC instead of WVu and Louisville dumb. Long term tv contract dumb. Do not see a move left for acc to survive. Swofford thought basketball was the golden egg. Should’ve looked st the past the big east basketball could not keep that conf alive.
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Freshman [-74]
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How has he built the 2nd best program of the
Jul 7, 2022, 3:53 PM
[ in reply to What Dabo has done is absolutely amazing ] |
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last decade when Clemson has brought in ~$200 million less than every team in the B1G and SEC? Similarly, how has all that money made any of their football programs better?
More money is great, but we obviously have enough to win at the very highest level. We have all the facilities and can grow if needed, and we obviously have one of the best coaching staffs in the country as well.
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Clemson Icon [27096]
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Re: TNET: Conference realignment is back, and Clemson has a decision to make
Jul 2, 2022, 8:08 AM
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It’s too bad this is going to overshadow the normal conversations at the ACC media days.
I agree David - ND joining the ACC is not going to save it.
It would seem that our contract with ESPN would just carry over if we joined the SEC. Isn’t SEC network also owned by ESPN?
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Game Day Hero [4331]
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Re: TNET: Conference realignment is back, and Clemson has a decision to make
Jul 2, 2022, 8:18 AM
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ND is not joining the sinking ship of the ACC and it would make no difference even if they did. FSU, Miami and even UNC are calling to find a new home and we must do the same. If not, we’ll be left standing on an empty pier after the ship has sailed. Leave or be left behind.
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Orange Blooded [2446]
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Re: TNET: Conference realignment is back, and Clemson has a decision to make
Jul 2, 2022, 9:47 AM
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Ummm, no. We could be the last to leave the acc, and there would be a huge bidding war to get us. As long as we are relevant, we won't be left behind. The question becomes, is our new AD up to this challenge. Make no mistake, he is going to be criticized whatever direction he turns. I would imagine the Board, and major donors, are going to push the direction. It will still be his decision.
My second question...if the real USC and UCLA join the B1G, and their tv contract gets renegotiated, why can't we add teams and renegotiate the ACCs pathetic contract? If we poached Okla st, WVU, and (insert team), along with ND, why wouldn't we renegotiate?
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Rival Killer [2873]
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Re: TNET: Conference realignment is back, and Clemson has a decision to make
Jul 2, 2022, 8:12 PM
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Key words: “…as long as we’re relevant”. If we are quickly put at a disadvantage, which has now already happened, it will be tough to stay relevant for very long. 5 years would probably be a bit of a challenge. Recruits will start to wonder about our future versus those that are already in or working towards super conference admission.
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Game Day Hero [4331]
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Re: TNET: Conference realignment is back, and Clemson has a decision to make
Jul 2, 2022, 8:20 AM
[ in reply to Re: TNET: Conference realignment is back, and Clemson has a decision to make ] |
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ND is not joining the sinking ship of the ACC and it would make no difference even if they did. FSU, Miami and even UNC are calling to find a new home and we must do the same. If not, we’ll be left standing on an empty pier after the ship has sailed. Leave or be left behind.
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Clemson Sports Icon [59612]
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Re: TNET: Conference realignment is back, and Clemson has a decision to make
Jul 2, 2022, 2:52 PM
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Not knowing what goes on behind tightly closed doors, and secure phone lines, but I believe that not so long ago, Clemson was offered, and passed on a good opportunity to pull out of the ACC, but bc of Clemson's loyalty to the ACC, the opportunity was passed up on, and the truth is, the ACC really don't give a really stinking pile of chit about Clemson other than the FB money that Clemson has brought into the conference over the past 10-12 years!!!
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Clemson Sports Icon [57844]
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Top TigerNet [31213]
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Time to go
Jul 2, 2022, 8:25 AM
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Recruit [96]
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Re: Time to go
Jul 2, 2022, 12:38 PM
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All you jumpers amaze me... Y'all like shiny things don't ya. News of the day is just that, it changes constantly. Whatever the powers that be require of your attention span, you're glad to oblige. Sorry, I wouldn't go anywhere.
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Top TigerNet [31597]
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Re: Time to go
Jul 2, 2022, 12:52 PM
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The horseless carriage is selling like hot cakes, but you still cling to making buggy whips? How'd that work out?
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CU Guru [1361]
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Re: Time to go
Jul 3, 2022, 3:40 PM
[ in reply to Re: Time to go ] |
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Swofford mismanaged the ACC into a bad corner. He spent too much time kissing up to tobacco road schools. No surprise - UNC alum, so he was loyal to his home school. Clemson should have told the ACC to pound sand when the conference added additional penalties on top of the NCAA limits. Nothing the ACC has done since then has helped Clemson in any way.
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CU Guru [1569]
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Re: Time to go
Jul 7, 2022, 5:43 AM
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Amen!
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Orange Blooded [2305]
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I've always been proud to be a part of the ACC, but...
Jul 2, 2022, 8:34 AM
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I agree that we'll be left behind, quickly, if the status quo remains.
People smarter than I will have to figure out the best way forward, but unless the ACC can pull a large rabbit out of its hat, I'm afraid we're watching its demise.
One thing is for certain: the next move will make or break Clemson as a major player. Let's hope that Neff/Dabo/BOT make a good decision.
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Clemson Sports Icon [57844]
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Re: I've always been proud to be a part of the ACC, but...
Jul 2, 2022, 9:05 AM
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Dabo always has a plan for everything. He foresaw this coming before most people even gave it a thought.
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Orange Immortal [61816]
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I'd feel better about it if they just said, in effect,
Jul 2, 2022, 8:45 AM
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"We're blowing up college football and it won't look like what you've always known." This is in fact what is happening, so just acknowledge it.
THEN (very importantly to me), cut out football from the rest of the NCAA. Make it its own entity. Call the conferences something different.
Conference realignment affects all other sports. We tend to forget that. No need to include lacrosse, softball, etc. in this madness.
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Athletic Dir [1159]
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Re: I'd feel better about it if they just said, in effect,
Jul 2, 2022, 8:52 AM
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Spot on
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Commissioner [970]
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Re: I'd feel better about it if they just said, in effect,
Jul 2, 2022, 10:07 AM
[ in reply to I'd feel better about it if they just said, in effect, ] |
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What is a football only conference going to do about adhering to Title 9? As long as these schools receive federal money they have to make arrangement for women's athletics.
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Orange Blooded [2278]
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Re: I'd feel better about it if they just said, in effect,
Jul 2, 2022, 11:43 AM
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Title IX does not confine all of your sports to 1 conference, and even carved out exceptions shortly after the passage. To avoid hamstringing revenue producing sports, they amended the original law to make "reasonable provisions considering the nature of particular sports". I doubt that Title IX would present much of a hurdle at all.
Schools wouldn't be introducing new programs. They would simply be changing the format under which they play. If it were a problem, how do they play the College Football Playoffs? They are not played under, or bound by the rules of the NCAA. With the kind of money involved, all kinds of things become "reasonable provisions."
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Trainer [46]
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Trainer [30]
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Re: I'd feel better about it if they just said, in effect,
Jul 4, 2022, 12:35 AM
[ in reply to Re: I'd feel better about it if they just said, in effect, ] |
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Title IX is gone soon anyway as soon as someone sues and it goes to this originalist supreme court (it wasn't mentioned in the constitution after all - but then again, neither was football)
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Orange Blooded [2278]
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Dynasty Maker [3152]
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Re: I'd feel better about it if they just said, in effect,
Jul 2, 2022, 11:27 PM
[ in reply to I'd feel better about it if they just said, in effect, ] |
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I think you make a really great point. Figure out a fair competitive way to handle football. Then leave the other sports in current conferences. Otherwise these other sports could be on the chopping block at some point.
It is all disappointing. I am not sure I am watching 5 years from now. This coming from a life long Tiger fan since birth.
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Scout Team [153]
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Re: I'd feel better about it if they just said, in effect,
Jul 3, 2022, 10:00 AM
[ in reply to I'd feel better about it if they just said, in effect, ] |
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Yes. Do Football Mega Conferences if we must. But can't we leave the other sports alone? Let everybody operate like Notre Dame. Do what you want with football. Let the schools get in where they fit in. But UCLA Volleyball traveling to Rutgers on a Tuesday night is dumb. Go back to more reasonable geographic Conferences for other sports. For Fans, Player's parents, and players.
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Trainer [46]
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Re: TNET: Conference realignment is back, and Clemson has a decision to make
Jul 2, 2022, 8:51 AM
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I grew up watching ACC basketball ball tournament living in NC. Moved to SC and watched my first college football game in Death Valley. BC beat Clemson in a night game, but it was close. I have been hooked on Clemson football since. I will miss the ACC rivalry’s but Clemson will have to do what is best for Clemson.
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Clemson Icon [27619]
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The other option
Jul 2, 2022, 9:03 AM
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Is to make the ACC stronger. Would adding Penn State,Notre Dame, West Virginia etc. help the league compete???
It’s really all about football isn’t it!
Perhaps having just a football league would be better than having a super conference for all sports. Tough questions to be answered looking ahead .
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Paw Warrior [4907]
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Re: The other option
Jul 2, 2022, 9:07 AM
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Why would Penn State leave the rich B1G for the broke ACC?
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Campus Hero [13214]
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Re: The other option
Jul 2, 2022, 10:28 AM
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I'm sure PSU would run nekkid to the ACC to make a third of what they will be making in the B1G. ROTFL!
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Athletic Dir [1140]
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Re: The other option
Jul 2, 2022, 9:49 AM
[ in reply to The other option ] |
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Please no one is giving up there money bro. The ACC is DONE OVER . Times have changed before our eyes. We better be calling the Big and SEC now to have a spot at the table.Dabo won't be able to recruit a 1star.
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Orange Blooded [2446]
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Re: The other option
Jul 2, 2022, 9:50 AM
[ in reply to The other option ] |
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Adding Penn St, along with the others, would be a saving grace. Not sure why PSU would want to leave a more lucrative conference, though.....
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Rival Killer [2898]
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Good article David
Jul 2, 2022, 8:53 AM
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But the reality is Jim Phillips should have been working on this prior to his interview to become the Commissioner and have some vision-strategy to address our current environment. This is not unexpected and TV has been driving the sport for some time. The fact that Swofford signed a deal through 2035/36 without some periodic market correction benchmarks, is the height of idiocy. By signing the current agreement, the ACC was destined to be left behind.
Interesting times for sure. Hopefully they are not perilous.
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Top TigerNet [31597]
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Re: Good article David
Jul 2, 2022, 1:01 PM
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Can't blame it all on Swoffie. The college presidents/AD.s bought what he was selling, hook, line and sinker. They could have rejected it until it was a better deal. They did not. It could not have been implemented without their signatures. I don't think anyone of them was forced at gun point to sign it.
I have no use for Swoffie, but w/o all college presidents/A.D.s supporting him, he had no power.
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CU Guru [1594]
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Re: TNET: Conference realignment is back, and Clemson has a decision to make
Jul 2, 2022, 8:55 AM
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We are heading to a super league or leagues. The acc should try to add some big market teams, then renegotiate our contract with espn proving these new teams offer more value.. If that doesn’t work I expect a few acc teams will band together and move. They will fight the grant of right in court and say that it is “negatively impacting student athletes” or something and win
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CU Medallion [18423]
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I hate to invoke this word in all of this, but here goes...
Jul 2, 2022, 8:55 AM
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Congress.
Seems like it would be an appropriate time to request a moratorium on any further college conference expansion in order for a larger, more holistic look at the situation. There are Title IX implications where enhanced travel will have significant impacts on womens sports that could be invoked as part of the pause and review. By the nature of the current design, it's an every man for himself scenario that will have very significant, long-lasting impacts on the entirety of college athletics all revolving around the popularity, and financial power, of one single men's sport. As they have involved themselves with other national sporting bodies in the past, largely in the best interests of the people, I could see a forced pause, mediation, and the time for a more thought out and thorough approach to allow for the best way forward.
As the overwhelming majority of programs involved are 'public' institutions getting 'public' funding and support in one way or another, it certainly would fall under their purview.
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Tiger Spirit [9819]
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Hate to invoke a different word on t, but here goes...SCOTUS
Jul 2, 2022, 8:15 PM
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Congress can pass any law that it wants to prevent movement of colleges from one conference to another under the guide of Title IX.
However, SCOTUS won't have that. There is no national security interest, nor is there a Title IX risk for any of the schools to change conferences.
More money from FB means more money siphoned off the non-revenue sports. Women's sports thrive if there is conference expansion to those which get the invitation.
SCOTUS will not penalize the schools which make moves for their own good by tying them to weaker conferences which hurt the 'better' schools opportunity to do better for itself.
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CU Medallion [18423]
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Congress has involved itself with professional sports
Jul 3, 2022, 11:42 AM
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leagues quite regularly over our time. I don't know that national security is the impetus behind that but national interest certainly is. Add in federal funding to most public universities and there becomes grounds there also.
College athletics is part of the American story. If conference realignment as it is unfolding threatens that, involving again many institutions benefitting from federal funding, then I can see a legitimate role they could play. If anything, just to step in and prevent further upheaval while all the interested parties gather together and hash it out.
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Asst Coach [844]
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Re: TNET: Conference realignment is back, and Clemson has a decision to make
Jul 2, 2022, 8:57 AM
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College football is not all about money. Clemson joining SEC or BIG would not put Clemson in equal economic footing with Alabama, Texas, Ohio St and possibly others.
Vanderbilt, South Carolina and others get the big SEC money, how are they doing? Maryland and Rutgers are getting the BIG money, has it helped their programs?
I do not want to leave ACC, I would like ND to join in football and I think they will. My question is what other schools would add value to the ACC?
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Asst Coach [844]
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Re: TNET: Conference realignment is back, and Clemson has a decision to make
Jul 2, 2022, 8:59 AM
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I value playing teams like GaT, USC and NCSt every year, those games are important to me. I do not want to give up for a few dollars more.
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Paw Warrior [4907]
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Re: TNET: Conference realignment is back, and Clemson has a decision to make
Jul 2, 2022, 9:11 AM
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I’d rather be watching games with Clemson at LSU, Bama, Georgia, College Station, The Swamp, etc.
Better competition and venues in the SEC than the lowly ACC!
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Game Day Hero [4509]
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Re: TNET: Conference realignment is back, and Clemson has a decision to make
Jul 2, 2022, 10:24 AM
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I agree! Let’s be honest, we have lost recruits because of our conference. Imagine what Dabo could do if we were a part of the SEC?
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Orange Blooded [2278]
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Re: TNET: Conference realignment is back, and Clemson has a decision to make
Jul 2, 2022, 11:15 AM
[ in reply to Re: TNET: Conference realignment is back, and Clemson has a decision to make ] |
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How about for a few (tens of millions of) dollars more? That's what we are actually talking about. It is not inconceivable to get into a few BILLIONS of dollars over the lifetime of the ACC contract given the growing gap in revenue.
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Tiger Spirit [9819]
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Re: TNET: Conference realignment is back, and Clemson has a decision to make
Jul 2, 2022, 8:19 PM
[ in reply to Re: TNET: Conference realignment is back, and Clemson has a decision to make ] |
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Yours and those opinions of those who like the old ACC rivalries are important.
However, more people would like to see games against better opponents.
Why do home games against UGA sell out so well? Don't tell me about historical rivalries with GA schools because home games against GA Tech don't mean nearly as much to our fans.
Back when Miami was a powerhouse (think of the 1990's), Miami home games (there were 2 if I remember correctly) were a huge fan draw.
Tradition the factor? Uhhh, no. Quality of a big time opponent to go against.
ACC doesn't make that happen ... sorry.
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CU Guru [1569]
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Re: TNET: Conference realignment is back, and Clemson has a decision to make
Jul 7, 2022, 6:31 AM
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Trade games vs. BC, Syracuse, Louisville, etc for Vanderbilt, Arkansas, Ole Miss, etc.
The big games vs. GA, Alabama, LSU, Auburn, Texas, OU, TAMU will be National games…
Throw FSU and Miami in the mix, and the TV draw in the SEC is obvious.
I expect ND and Pitt to end up in the BIG.
Better, tougher games across the board. Clemson has to go to the SEC, nothing else makes sense for us.
Natural rivals that are football crazy. We have been playing those schools for over 100 years.
The BIG would be poison ?? for Clemson. The ACC will be toast for football.
The ACC becomes the Big East on Steroids, basketball schools with a football team in the fall…..
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Clemson Sports Icon [57844]
TigerPulse: 100%
59
Posts: 23646
Joined: 2011
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Fan [37]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: TNET: Conference realignment is back, and Clemson has a decision to make
Jul 2, 2022, 9:31 AM
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Why would our current TV partner want to watch our Conference atrophy? Wouldn't it be better for them to renegotiate the rights deal and work with our fine Conference?
After all, won't these "Super Conference" champions need someone to face off with in an expanded playoff?
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110%er [3650]
TigerPulse: 100%
35
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I tend to agree w you in regards to Usuc, Vandy and Rutgers
Jul 2, 2022, 9:48 AM
[ in reply to Re: TNET: Conference realignment is back, and Clemson has a decision to make ] |
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However….
The money does help the entire athletic department. Vandy is a powerhouse in baseball. Facilities are top notch. Rutgers and Usuc also have their own moments. The cash put into the universities does make a huge difference across all sports.
The other fear, in terms of football, is that the ACC might not be able to schedule itself into the football games vs those 2 conferences. Those 2 conferences will essentially own the TV market and the pathway to the National Championship. One could argue that their 32+ could have their own CFP and tons of eyeballs would watch it and love it.
The rest of conferences almost become the new “Group of 5”. Heck maybe we turn into the new FCS with our own 16 game playoff bracket
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Associate AD [1074]
TigerPulse: 100%
25
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Re: I tend to agree w you in regards to Usuc, Vandy and Rutgers
Jul 2, 2022, 8:35 PM
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Vandy is a powerhouse in baseball because they game the scholarship issue.
https://www.bestofarkansassports.com/vanderbilt-baseball-legal-cheating-college-world-series/
"Under NCAA rules, a Division 1 baseball team’s 11.7 scholarships can be divided between a maximum of 27 players on a 35-player roster, with all players on athletic scholarship having to receive a minimum of a 25 percent scholarship.
That leaves room for eight walk-ons.
But Vanderbilt, a private schools, gets around this through Opportunity Vanderbilt, which promised that any student who was admitted to the school would not be prevented from attending due to cost of tuition."
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Freshman [-100]
TigerPulse: 15%
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Re: I tend to agree w you in regards to Usuc, Vandy and Rutgers
Jul 2, 2022, 10:52 PM
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Ole Miss? Miss St? Both have very nice baseball facilities and are powerhouses because of revenue. The SEC had half the field at Omaha, had more teams than any other conference in the NCAA BB tourney, and half the teams in the CFP. Heck even SC has some of the nicest facilities in the comments country. The SEC had NINE schools in the top 25 of the Director's Cup. Money matters. Exponentially.
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CU Guru [1594]
TigerPulse: 100%
30
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Re: TNET: Conference realignment is back, and Clemson has a decision to make
Jul 2, 2022, 9:22 AM
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Maybe we should just ask big 10 or sec to take all of our teams and negotiate new espn contract based on that
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Dynasty Maker [3579]
TigerPulse: 100%
34
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Re: TNET: Conference realignment is back, and Clemson has a decision to make
Jul 2, 2022, 9:43 AM
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If I understand the current agreement with ND, they must give the ACC first consideration to join a conference in football. What penalty do they pay if they don’t? Second, what’s ND’s tie-in for the GoR for all their ACC sports? Are they stuck until 2036 just like all conference members? Just curious what will be ND’s maneuvers to get all their sports into the Big10 to get same revenue as everyone in the Big10 under the upcoming Fox deal.
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Athletic Dir [1140]
TigerPulse: 85%
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Re: TNET: Conference realignment is back, and Clemson has a decision to make
Jul 2, 2022, 10:04 AM
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U guys are over thinking this thing ND will take care of itself. If they wanted to join fully they would have.The options for Clemson is clear leave or get left behind. The ACC will implode or be a lesser conference. It's time to be proactive. Leave while you can.
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Paw Warrior [4751]
TigerPulse: 100%
37
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Time to join the SEC!***
Jul 2, 2022, 9:46 AM
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Valley Legend [12941]
TigerPulse: 100%
47
Posts: 12660
Joined: 2001
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College football is so, so sick.***
Jul 2, 2022, 9:49 AM
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1st Rounder [608]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: TNET: Conference realignment is back, and Clemson has a decision to make
Jul 2, 2022, 10:07 AM
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Clemson to BIG is highly unlikely as we are not AAU. They would not be particularly interested. You could see UNC, UVA, DUKE there and all would fit. perhaps others too.
Clemson, FSU and Miami to SEC is the only current move.
But the SEC gaibs some big games but no new markets so us it worth it to them.
Remember, its about Universities NOT football so decisions are made by Presidents and Boards, not ADs and certainly not coaches.
When Maryland jumped neither the AD or any coaches even knew about it until it hit the press so just like some years ago, anything you read on social media us pure speculation.
Hey I just heard from an insider, we are forming the new APCC Conference wuth a Pacific and an Atlantic Division. You heard it here first!
??
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Associate AD [1074]
TigerPulse: 100%
25
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Re: TNET: Conference realignment is back, and Clemson has a decision to make
Jul 2, 2022, 8:37 PM
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TV markets don't mean much these days as more and more people go to streaming services. College "brands" mean more than their geographical location.
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Tiger Spirit [10048]
TigerPulse: 100%
44
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Re: TNET: Conference realignment is back, and Clemson has a decision to make
Jul 2, 2022, 10:17 AM
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We should have left years ago
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Recruit [97]
TigerPulse: 93%
10
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I don’t know why NIL keeps getting brought up in conference and school revenue
Jul 2, 2022, 10:20 AM
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They are not linked at all, the schools and athletic departments do not pay the players.
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Freshman [-100]
TigerPulse: 85%
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Re: TNET: Conference realignment is back, and Clemson has a decision to make
Jul 2, 2022, 10:21 AM
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I think it is time for a move IMHO. This is selfish, but I would love for Clemson to be in the SEC for traveling purposes.
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Athletic Dir [1140]
TigerPulse: 85%
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Re: TNET: Conference realignment is back, and Clemson has a decision to make
Jul 2, 2022, 11:19 AM
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You have to believe there's a ton of communication going on in the back channels . I think Clemson FSU and Miami are a package deal or should be. Strength in solidarity. These 3 need to move asap and fight the GOR in the courts.
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All-TigerNet [12666]
TigerPulse: 86%
47
Posts: 12291
Joined: 2011
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Great article David, but how can we move if we don't have an
Jul 2, 2022, 10:42 AM
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invite? That's what scares me.
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Letterman [259]
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Re: Great article David, but how can we move if we don't have an
Jul 2, 2022, 11:56 AM
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Not sure the SEC would vote Clemson in since being in the SEC is the only recruiting advantage SEC schools have against us. Why would they want to add a sleeping beast like a Clemson to change the entire dynamics of power in the conference? SEC schools would be terrified of Clemson’s success in the SEC. Seems like an uphill battle.
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Mascot [17]
TigerPulse: 77%
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Re: Great article David, but how can we move if we don't have an
Jul 2, 2022, 1:12 PM
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The SEac schools are not “terrified” of Clemson, at least not the Alabamas and Georgias of the world. Maybe Mississippi State and Kentucky, or Ole Miss, Tennessee, etc. But the powerhouse teams see us pretty regularly anyway, and they aren’t scared.
It’s the middle-tier teams who should fear expansion. They’ll make more money, but the reality is that any chance for a championship would be over. They’d never make it out of league play. Eventually, those lower-tier and middle-tier teams will be perceived as a drag on the Big Boys and will be jettisoned.
We need to make a move now. Ten years of having $50-60 million less per year in revenue will put us half a billion behind the SEC and Big 10 schools. And if that doesn’t scare you, it should.
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CU Guru [1569]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: Great article David, but how can we move if we don't have an
Jul 7, 2022, 7:02 AM
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Agree!
It will be tough competing for assistant coaches and supporting other sports to compete on a national level staying in the ACC.
Do what’s best for Clemson, not the ACC. No love lost……
SEC Alumni have wondered for years why Clemson is not in The SEC?
A Deep South Conference. We would be more welcome than in the ACC.
Soccer, baseball and other sports would do well too.
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Associate AD [1074]
TigerPulse: 100%
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CU Guru [1569]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: Great article David, but how can we move if we don't have an
Jul 7, 2022, 7:18 AM
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Actually, the TAMU vs. Texas again will be a big plus for many Aggies.
They like beating Texas as mush as we like beating the coots!
Texas hates losing to the Aggies so much, they really didn’t miss the game.
Both schools are rolling in money.
They both want championships at any cost……
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Clemson Sports Icon [58957]
TigerPulse: 100%
59
Posts: 23259
Joined: 2005
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"would be in the hundreds of millions".... USC and UCLA to..
Jul 2, 2022, 12:29 PM
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Get ? $100/year.
Easy math really. Gains are greater than losses for leaving.
Seems inevitable. Sucks really, but money does talk.
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CU Guru [1251]
TigerPulse: 90%
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For Those Pondering What Notre Dame's Doing
Jul 2, 2022, 1:01 PM
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It's waiting on Clemson to do the heavy lifting in breaking the ACC grant of rights in the courts.
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Fan [37]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: For Those Pondering What Notre Dame's Doing
Jul 2, 2022, 1:41 PM
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Oh woe is me. Bama, OSU, and Clemson don't have an NFL team in their respective States or major media eyeball demographics.
Yet all have florished, all have reached the highest levels. Because people care locally, and that's what matters, and that's what breeds champions and competitive endurance.
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Tiger Spirit [9788]
TigerPulse: 55%
44
Posts: 12869
Joined: 2006
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Re: For Those Pondering What Notre Dame's Doing
Jul 2, 2022, 4:43 PM
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I guess Dollar missed middle school because Cleveland and Cincinnati are in Ohio and they have NFL teams. Really?
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Orange Blooded [2131]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: TNET: Conference realignment is back, and Clemson has a decision to make
Jul 2, 2022, 1:40 PM
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I'm sure there are several ACC schools talking amongst themselves about leaving as a package deal. Once those teams announce they're leaving together the viability of the conference is no more and GOR is no more. UNC, FSU, Miami, Clemson, UVA, NCST, VATech, Duke. I include all 3 of the tobacco road teams because i don't think they're going anywhere without one another. GT could be in the mix as well bc of the ATL market but the BIG might be their destination bc of UGA. They don't all having to be going to the same place, they just have to leave at the same time. As i said before the TobRd teams would probably end up together. Just my conspiracy idea!
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Associate AD [1049]
TigerPulse: 100%
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The NCAA should have headed this off years ago
Jul 2, 2022, 4:33 PM
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They should have capped conferences at 12 or 14. But I think this is what the whole thing is about anyway. If the SEC gains any more power, they will dictate to the NCAA what will and won't happen. If the SEC and B1G get together in a boardroom and agree on things they'll dare the NCAA to go against them. The NCAA needs the conferences not the other way around.
As for us, the SEC doesn't need us. If we were to fall to a typical 8-4 record every year what would they gain't? We are a big player at the moment but we're 4 years of current ACC revenue away from irrelevant. FSU and Miami would seal Florida for the SEC. UVA and VT would be an added market as would Pitt and BC. The Tobacco Road Boys would be another region and add all the basketball revenue. I hate to say it but we really don't gve the SEC much incentive. We would probably be more lucrative to the B1G.
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Tiger Spirit [9788]
TigerPulse: 55%
44
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Joined: 2006
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Re: TNET: Conference realignment is back, and Clemson has a decision to make
Jul 2, 2022, 4:39 PM
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A couple of points about this guessing game article. If we are not in the game with NIL, it will not make any difference what conference we are in. NIL is about corporations that hire athletes, not schools or conferences. Along the same lines, the portal is the same for every school as hundreds of players who are not as good as they thought they were look for greener pastures and often find bare ground.
The idea that there will be "super conferences" is absurd because both the Big10 and SEC have weak teams. The idea that the ACC has been a better overall football conference than the Big12 and Pac12 is also absurd. We have been a better team than any in the Big12 or Pac12 but top to bottom, the ACC is behind.
Until we hear from Neff and Dabo, there is no need guessing what will happen but if the ACC could poach a couple of Big12 teams and a couple of PAC12 teams we would be right in the mix and the money will increase.
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CU Medallion [19392]
TigerPulse: 100%
52
Posts: 14911
Joined: 2010
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Well written as usual DHood ...
Jul 2, 2022, 5:09 PM
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You lay it out well . It's not the organizational attachment to the ACC, SEC or B1G, it's the $$$ that will drive the ability to compete as a school and the competitive existence of the conferences.
Next steps. Determine if SEC and/or B1G has an interest in offering Clemson. If yes, goodbye ACC. If no, prepare to lose players, coaches and nationally competitive program over the next few years. IMHO Swofford, ESPN and college presidents negligently binded ACC schools to long-term ESPN contract. Quality litigators can address the GOR matter. Whichever way the path winds, Go Tigers!!
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Trainer [41]
TigerPulse: 87%
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Re: TNET: Conference realignment is back, and Clemson has a decision to make
Jul 2, 2022, 5:17 PM
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Does the ACC have the ability to remove teams from its conference? Could the ACC remove two or three schools and replace with schools that would generate more revenue or gain a new TV market?
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Head Coach [912]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: TNET: Conference realignment is back, and Clemson has a decision to make
Jul 2, 2022, 7:01 PM
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I have no sentimental attachment to the ACC. I have NEVER forgotten how the hypocritical ######## nailed Clemson with a heavier penalty than the NCAA did in 1982. I have long felt that the ACC was a millstone around Clemson’s neck- especially in football. At this point it seems inevitable that Clemson, FSU, Miami, and possibly VPI and NCSU MUST leave the conference in order to have any relevance in the sport that matters most- football.
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Hall of Famer [8494]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Posts: 11313
Joined: 2011
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NCAA Needs To Grab Control
Jul 2, 2022, 8:10 PM
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And restore some order. College athletics and conferences are being destroyed. I don't see the point in having 2 super large conferences. Makes no sense.
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Head Coach [912]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: NCAA Needs To Grab Control
Jul 2, 2022, 8:29 PM
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I don’t think they can.
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Dynasty Maker [3152]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: NCAA Needs To Grab Control
Jul 3, 2022, 12:03 AM
[ in reply to NCAA Needs To Grab Control ] |
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Nope. CFB cannot survive like that. It relies on viewership from all CFB fans across the country. They are fans because their schools are in D1 football. This ain’t the NFL. These other fans whose schools are left out are not watching. CFB is heading for ruin unfortunately.
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Recruit [97]
TigerPulse: 93%
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Re: TNET: Conference realignment is back, and Clemson has a decision to make
Jul 2, 2022, 8:54 PM
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Standout [335]
TigerPulse: 82%
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Re: TNET: Conference realignment is back, and Clemson has a decision to make
Jul 2, 2022, 9:37 PM
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No real decision here. Just hold your nose and jump to the eSECpn. Beats going down in the ACC flames.
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Game Day Hero [4338]
TigerPulse: 98%
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Re: TNET: Conference realignment is back, and Clemson has a decision to make
Jul 2, 2022, 10:11 PM
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member, and grab Penn State also
Not gonna write a book …
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110%er [3631]
TigerPulse: 96%
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Re: TNET: Conference realignment is back, and Clemson has a decision to make
Jul 2, 2022, 10:35 PM
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Sooo, let's put this into a very visible analogy:
Coca-Cola has been the dominant brand and dominant family of soda beverage choices in the world for decades now.
Pepsico and the Pepsi family are #2.
#3 family is Keurig Dr Pepper.
In spite of dropping numbers, Coca-Cola still had sales revenues of more than $33B in 2021, trailed distantly by Pepsico's $18B and KDP's $12B (which is a 15% increase. )
Of the leading individual sodas, all of the top 10 worldwide belong to Coke or Pepsi except KDP's flagship product Dr Pepper, which is either #4 or #5 with Mtn Dew depending on whose numbers you use.
In some individual markets Pepsi can beat Coke, but Dr Pepper doesn't. Dr Pepper can't even beat Diet Coke.
So for this to work, Coca-Cola is the SEC with Bama and UGa as Coke and Diet Coke.
PepsiCo is the B1G.
Keurig Dr Pepper is the ACC, with us being the flagship Dr Pepper.
All analogies are flawed. But using this analogy, it's possible that one day soon the #3 family will supplant the #2 family as the biggest rival to #1 family. But the number #3 flavor will NEVER beat #1 head to head.
On two occasions recently Clemson has beaten the number #1 brand from the #1 corporation, but is it reasonable to think we can continue to compete at that level if we're going to be the flagship for the "Other Flavors" conference? Would they even invite us to the CFP any more? The other 2 conferences are increasing their separation from the "other" conferences.
If we say, "Dr Pepper is still relevant even if it doesn't win championships", that's fine, but many don't want to take that approach. Dabo has provided us a window where championships are possible. Is it a reasonable sacrifice to leave KDP (or the ACC) in all sports to accomplish that?
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Dynasty Maker [3152]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: TNET: Conference realignment is back, and Clemson has a decision to make
Jul 3, 2022, 12:08 AM
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Would you watch if the SEC and. BIG expanded? I would not.
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Standout [302]
TigerPulse: 92%
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Re: TNET: Conference realignment is back, and Clemson has a decision to make
Jul 2, 2022, 10:42 PM
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The ACC doesn't care about Clemson or football. Basketball is king in the ACC and Clemson has never achieved the prolonged success it takes to be a blueblood in basketball. It's time for Clemson to do what's best for Clemson. Go Tigers!!
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Dynasty Maker [3152]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: TNET: Conference realignment is back, and Clemson has a decision to make
Jul 2, 2022, 11:54 PM
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If the “super conferences” alienate a good portion of D1 schools the ratings will drop sharply. This is what I see ultimately happening. CFB is driven by overall national interest. It will lose fans whose schools do not win with the realignment and even traditionalist fans like me who just say I am out as they have killed the sport that I loved so so much.
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Dynasty Maker [3152]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: TNET: Conference realignment is back, and Clemson has a decision to make
Jul 3, 2022, 12:16 AM
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We as fans should commit to only watching our teams games and not others to show the damage that can be done with a lack of viewership.
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All-Pro [686]
TigerPulse: 90%
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Re: TNET: Conference realignment is back, and Clemson has a decision to make
Jul 3, 2022, 2:57 AM
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If we want to compete for championships after the next 1-3 years, it will have to be in the SEC. It’s an arms race at this point.
Big10 is not our fit, although it would be fun to have the new matchups.
I feel like the public money talk takes away from my enjoyment as a fan.
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All-Time Great [97897]
TigerPulse: 100%
63
Posts: 97400
Joined: 2009
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I have no allegiance to the ACC.
Jul 3, 2022, 7:40 AM
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I have no passion nor preference for any conference, neither love nor hate. This conference love is delusion and pure foolishness to me. However, I like Clemson being the big fish in this small pond like the ACC.
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Trainer [30]
TigerPulse: 96%
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Re: TNET: Conference realignment is back, and Clemson has a decision to make
Jul 4, 2022, 12:28 AM
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Why cant the acc/pac 12 / big 12 form a football only conference or 2 or 3 (level a, level b etc) and keep their basketball and other sports conferences? This is about FOOTBALL. Negotiate football only TV with OSU-Wash, Oregon-clemson etc games. Fantasy likely but maybe the only way to survive without joining the big 2 - spitballing here
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CU Guru [1569]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: TNET: Conference realignment is back, and Clemson has a decision to make
Jul 7, 2022, 7:29 AM
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Join the SEC.
Clemson cannot save the current ACC….
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Heisman Winner [79057]
TigerPulse: 100%
62
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Joined: 2003
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And, why would we WANT to? All the ACC has ever done is
Jul 7, 2022, 7:41 AM
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go out of their way to hurt Clemson whenever they could. I will never forget nor forgive the extra year of bowl probation the mighty ACC imposed on us, over and above what the already stringent (at the time) NCAA deemed necessary.
The ACC can go down with all seacocks open, far as I'm concerned, as long as we are not with them when it happens.
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Starter [299]
TigerPulse: 96%
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Re: And, why would we WANT to? All the ACC has ever done is
Jul 7, 2022, 3:33 PM
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I won't ever forget that extra year either courtesy of the tarholes.
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Scout Team [164]
TigerPulse: 100%
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If the ACC were wanting to remain a legit conference in this
Jul 4, 2022, 4:49 PM
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age, they would have at least gone after Cincinnati and offered something to ND (even though I think ND is a better fit for the B1G) to make them a full time member in football. Instead, they did nothing and are about to see the repercussions.
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National Champion [8097]
TigerPulse: 96%
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Cincy makes you legit now? LOLOLOLOL good grief***
Jul 7, 2022, 3:49 PM
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Starter [299]
TigerPulse: 96%
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Re: TNET: Conference realignment is back, and Clemson has a decision to make
Jul 7, 2022, 3:27 PM
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Clemson has to make a move because we can't get left behind in the ACC. It's all about the TV money and if we get stuck in a Conference with little chance of being in the CFB it will be devastating.
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