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Standout [225]
TigerPulse: 94%
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Riley Deserves this... need your thougthts
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Oct 29, 2023, 11:04 AM
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He should have the opportunity to build his own offensive staff
Austin, Grisham, Spiller, Richardson all need to reapply for their position next year along with any outsiders Riley wants to talk to.... Why should he be held accountable when he can't build his own staff.
Agree or Disagree.
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Asst Coach [808]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: Riley Deserves this... need your thougthts
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Oct 29, 2023, 11:05 AM
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Agree 100%
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Legend [16126]
TigerPulse: 97%
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If we want a new offense then yes. Riley should be able to build it.***
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Oct 29, 2023, 11:06 AM
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Orange Beast [6476]
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10000000% agree, but then Dabo cannot have his yes men around him.***
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Oct 29, 2023, 11:07 AM
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All-Time Great [97799]
TigerPulse: 100%
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YEP,,,
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Oct 29, 2023, 11:09 AM
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110%~
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Ultimate Clemson Legend [108265]
TigerPulse: 100%
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GR accepted the job knowing upfront Dabo makes all the position hires.
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Oct 29, 2023, 11:09 AM
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That included when BV and theChad came on board.
Dabo says he does include his Co-ords. in the process, but the final decision is Dabo's.
Whether people agree or not, the reason Dabo has given is he doesn't want to be left with other people's hires should someone leave, be terminated, retire or other?
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All-In [10131]
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Re: GR accepted the job knowing upfront Dabo makes all the position hires.
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Oct 29, 2023, 11:16 AM
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The reality is that Dabo doesn’t want anyone in the program that may openly discuss what goes on behind the scenes like his playcalling, micro managing etc. Can’t have a cult unless people stay quite about the leadership
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Ultimate Clemson Legend [108265]
TigerPulse: 100%
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I don't know that's the reality any more than you do.***
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Oct 29, 2023, 11:18 AM
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Orange Beast [6590]
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Re: I don't know that's the reality any more than you do.***
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Oct 29, 2023, 12:03 PM
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Well said DSP....well said. Listening to a Clemson presser is just like a D.C. presser these days. It is so full of fabrications, delusions, wishful thinking and outright lies, you get to where you don't know what to believe any more.
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Orange Blooded [2189]
TigerPulse: 81%
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All-In [10131]
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Re: GR accepted the job knowing upfront Dabo makes all the position hires.
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Oct 29, 2023, 11:27 AM
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We don’t know anything for sure, that right there somewhat proves my point. We’ve said it for years, we’ve seen the headsets, Dabo looking at his menu, jumping up and down calling plays. Riley is walking back and forth on the sidelines unengaged. Ray Charles can see that much and make deductions and that’s before we realize that the vanilla bean playcalling is identical to last years, and the year before that and nothing like what we saw Riley do at TCU. Ding ding, hello! Anyone up in that head you got?
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Ultimate Clemson Legend [108265]
TigerPulse: 100%
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In short, you don't know it's the reality at all, so why continue?
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Oct 29, 2023, 11:30 AM
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Because you're just too overly emotional about it to not?
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All-In [10131]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: In short, you don't know it's the reality at all, so why continue?
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Oct 29, 2023, 11:32 AM
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Why do we say anything on this board? If all we are to discuss is proven fact we don’t need this stupid echo chamber we can watch it on ESPN
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Ultimate Clemson Legend [108265]
TigerPulse: 100%
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"The reality is..." is a definitive statement, so why put it that way if you...
Oct 29, 2023, 11:34 AM
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know it isn't?
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All-In [10131]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: "The reality is..." is a definitive statement, so why put it that way if you...
Oct 29, 2023, 11:38 AM
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Because I believe that to be reality. I’ve heard other opinions and then there is you, what do you think the reality is if I’m wrong?
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Ultimate Clemson Legend [108265]
TigerPulse: 100%
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I've already said, the reality is you don't know that to be the reality...
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Oct 29, 2023, 11:44 AM
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any more than I do.
I guess I understand now how you miss these things.
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All-In [10131]
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Re: I've already said, the reality is you don't know that to be the reality...
Oct 29, 2023, 11:46 AM
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I guess you’ll believe it when you see it on the news.
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Ultimate Clemson Legend [108265]
TigerPulse: 100%
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I do try not to make definitive statements when there is nothing definitive.
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Oct 29, 2023, 11:56 AM
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That's common sense, good business, good form and best practice.
There are other, far better ways for people to accomplish the same and/or similar results especially those that don't accuse Clemson coaches of some sort of ~malpractice or wrongdoing.
If you're unhappy with the results, that's understandable. It's completely up to you how you respond, but don't be surprised when people question the way you have here.
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All-In [10131]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: I do try not to make definitive statements when there is nothing definitive.
Oct 29, 2023, 12:13 PM
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It’s not wrongdoing. He is HC and can do it however he like, he can call the plays, however if he is and it’s costing us games it is in fact malpractice. He’s running this team into the ground. If what you say is true, this is Riley’s offense then we missed on another one and he too needs to pack his bags and go. The moment that happens I can all but guarantee we will know the truth because he’s not going to let his career end if he wasn’t in fact in charge. It will be said and it will be loud.
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Ultimate Clemson Legend [108265]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Yes, he's HC and it's his program and I don't make a habit of making...
Oct 29, 2023, 12:23 PM
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definitive statements when there's nothing definitive, especially when all the supposed insider information I've seen is to the contrary.
Again, "the reality is" that neither of us know what the reality is. If you're going to be daft and don't want it pointed out, then don't reply to me in that fashion.
Since you've nothing other than running around in the same circles, have a good day.
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Valley Protector [1441]
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Orange Blooded [2336]
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Re: "The reality is..." is a definitive statement, so why put it that way if you...
Oct 29, 2023, 12:49 PM
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Most HC's got their jobs from being offensive or defensive gurus earlier in their career. Nearly all of them will depend on their coordinator on the other side of the ball, to tell them what they need. In Dabo's case he has never been a coordinator.
It appears to me that he is not willing to relinquish control to someone that is better qualified. Rarely, if ever, will you have a coordinator fired if all of the position coaches were doing a good job. There just wouldn't be a need for a change. So Streeter was SO BAD that he made a whole staff of good offensive coaches look clueless?
Maybe Riley underestimated TCU's assistants' influence on his success, and didn't ask for any changes. If that's the case it is on Riley. If Dabo didn't trust Riley to tell him what he needed then it is on him for hamstringing his new coordinator. Dabo may have the ultimate call, but it doesn't make it a good decision.
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Starter [279]
TigerPulse: 92%
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All-In [10131]
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Re: In short, you don't know it's the reality at all, so why continue?
Oct 29, 2023, 11:35 AM
[ in reply to In short, you don't know it's the reality at all, so why continue? ] |
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You and Francis Marion can share positive thoughts which amount to wishful thinking (aka stupid talk) all you want. A question was asked and I gave my opinion on what was going on. The facts are what’s going on right now ain’t good. It’s not even bad, it’s now catastrophic. What do you think led us here? Not enough positive thinking?
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Ultimate Clemson Legend [108265]
TigerPulse: 100%
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If you're going to get sideways when people point out you made a daft...
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Oct 29, 2023, 11:42 AM
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unsubstantiated, definitive statement, then maybe don't make them?
You responded to me with it, I didn't look you up. Did you lash out at Francis Marion® too because he brought into question something stupid you said?
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All-In [10131]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: If you're going to get sideways when people point out you made a daft...
Oct 29, 2023, 11:48 AM
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Yes, I was saying some stupid things to FM like it’s more then .015% Hiw incredibly dumb of me. He heard it from Dabo so it’s true and as accurate as physics
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Ultimate Clemson Legend [108265]
TigerPulse: 100%
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I'll put you down for a yes.***
Oct 29, 2023, 11:57 AM
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TigerNet Legend [146423]
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National Champion [7295]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: In short, you don't know it's the reality at all, so why continue?
Oct 29, 2023, 11:56 AM
[ in reply to In short, you don't know it's the reality at all, so why continue? ] |
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Look at the fsu game, and heck even the 4th quarter of yesterday's game (minus the last drive). It's a completely different offense. We were throwing the ball downfield, receivers were open, running lanes were open. Then we go ultra conservative against other teams and inexplicably, on the final drive yesterday!
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Valley Protector [1441]
TigerPulse: 94%
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Re: In short, you don't know it's the reality at all, so why continue?
Oct 29, 2023, 12:01 PM
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The play calling is primarily dictated by what the opposing defenses are giving us, and what our players can physically accomplish. It's not because of the coaches being too conservative.
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Standout [341]
TigerPulse: 86%
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All-In [10131]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: You have zero proof that Dabo is involved with the play calling
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Oct 29, 2023, 11:44 AM
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You can have zero proof your GF is cheating and yet know she is. You act like he isn’t wearing a headset and carrying the playbook around with him. That to me is evidence. The same calls getting called years on end also amounts to evidence. Sideline behavior….more evidence. You think GR has the playbook committed to memory because his hands are empty and he isn’t acting all frantic. He seems disengaged and bored during the game and I’m not the only one who has noticed this.
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Ultimate Clemson Legend [108265]
TigerPulse: 100%
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The only insider reports I've seen from DHood, Plyler from Jeff Scott,
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Oct 29, 2023, 11:48 AM
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Williams I believe and some others close to the program have said it is Riley's show.
Riley himself said it is the same offense he ran at TCU.
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All-In [10131]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: The only insider reports I've seen from DHood, Plyler from Jeff Scott,
Oct 29, 2023, 11:50 AM
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Well there you have it then. Case closed
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Ultimate Clemson Legend [108265]
TigerPulse: 100%
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You do as you please, but the only reported insider information of sorts...
Oct 29, 2023, 11:59 AM
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I've seen contradicts your definitive version of "the reality".
That's not my doing, just the news.
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Ring of Honor [21947]
TigerPulse: 86%
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Is Dabo enough insider for you?
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Oct 29, 2023, 12:03 PM
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Before the Duke game
Dan Mullen: Will we see the new Garrett Riley offense tonight?
Dabo: Well first it’s the Clemson Offense…
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Ultimate Clemson Legend [108265]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Yes, the same thing that was branded when theChad was here and...
Oct 29, 2023, 12:07 PM
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according to Garrett Riley it's the same offense he ran at TCU.
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All-In [10131]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: Is Dabo enough insider for you?
Oct 29, 2023, 12:21 PM
[ in reply to Is Dabo enough insider for you? ] |
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“Well first it’s the Clemson offense”
I’m not so sure Clemson wants to own this. It may be the Dabo offense but coaches come and go. Implying this is somehow written in stone on Howard’s rock is untrue. And it’s quickly getting the reputation of not being a good offense even with extraordinary talent. It’s looking like a WR coach with zero x’ and o’s drew up all the plays and calls them
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Game Changer [1656]
TigerPulse: 95%
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Re: GR accepted the job knowing upfront Dabo makes all the position hires.
Oct 29, 2023, 1:17 PM
[ in reply to Re: GR accepted the job knowing upfront Dabo makes all the position hires. ] |
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That's really pretty stupid of you. No organization is going to tell all about how they make the sausage and you'd likely not have the ability to evaluate what you'd hear even if they did.
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Orange Blooded [2336]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Ultimate Clemson Legend [108265]
TigerPulse: 100%
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It'll probably help you if you work your way through this on your own.***
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Oct 29, 2023, 11:26 AM
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Orange Blooded [2336]
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Re: It'll probably help you if you work your way through this on your own.***
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Oct 29, 2023, 11:59 AM
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I'm not sure what I am supposed to be working through. It simply is not a valid argument to say that he would be stuck with position coaches if the coordinator leaves. Are we giving guarantees to position coaches that I don't know about? A good coordinator will understand best what is needed from the position coaches to run his offense. However, I guess that goes back to Dabo saying that Riley was not hired to bring his offense, but instead brought in to run the Clemson offense.
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Ultimate Clemson Legend [108265]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Yes, contracts are not one year in many cases. So these position
Oct 29, 2023, 12:03 PM
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coaches hanging around are waiting for weeks/months to see if they have a job with the next coordinator or not?
So Dabo's left having lunch with them wishing them good luck and hope the next guy picks them up?
Seriously, you can't work through all the possibilities or at least some?
And Garrett Riley is running the offense Garrett Riley ran at TCU, per Garrett Riley.
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Valley Protector [1441]
TigerPulse: 94%
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Ultimate Clemson Legend [108265]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Some may ask to fill spots with their personnel, but ultimately the HC...
Oct 29, 2023, 12:09 PM
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is 100% responsible for all hires, firings, anything that comes up on his watch involving his staff, players, program et al.
That's why Dabo makes all the hires, but will include the co-ords. in the process when possible.
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Ring of Honor [21947]
TigerPulse: 86%
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1st Rounder [653]
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Re: Riley Deserves this... need your thougthts
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Oct 29, 2023, 11:10 AM
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He would be smart to pack his bags and go somewhere where he has an open minded HC that allows him to build his own offense. Dabo can talk culture and fit all he wants to but the team is not buying it anymore. Half of His kids didn’t want any part of thst game yesterday. The ship has sailed.
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Orange Blooded [2396]
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Re: Riley Deserves this... need your thougthts
Oct 29, 2023, 11:20 AM
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This year might ding his resume a little, but I expect he’ll land on his feet.
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Orange Beast [6283]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: Riley Deserves this... need your thougthts
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Oct 29, 2023, 11:12 AM
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He may enter the portal due to lack of coaching time.
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Varsity [109]
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Re: Riley Deserves this... need your thougthts
Oct 29, 2023, 11:16 AM
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I agree with this statement. No head coach has to use the existing staff.
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Varsity [100]
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Tend to agree and wondering if he wishes
Oct 29, 2023, 11:16 AM
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he'd stayed put.
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Rival Killer [3056]
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Re: Tend to agree and wondering if he wishes
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Oct 29, 2023, 11:21 AM
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Everything that is being discussed on this board is pure speculation.... Maybe Dabo has no say in play calling. Maybe Riley believes he has a great staff. If 20% of the speculation is true, Riley is established enough to have the pull to get what he wants.
If Dabo won't give it to him, they will part ways. It is going to be an interesting off-season. We will all find out shortly, and I think it will all happen very quickly Thanksgiving weekend.
Message was edited by: bobbyb99®
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Orange Blooded [2189]
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Re: Tend to agree and wondering if he wishes
Oct 29, 2023, 11:26 AM
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Maybe we believe Riley? He said we don't have the personnel.
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Standout [341]
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Riley is part of the problem. He is the QB coach and
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Oct 29, 2023, 11:19 AM
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the starting QB has been the worst position on offense this year. Get rid of Riley and bring back Jeff Scott.
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Rival Killer [3056]
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Re: Riley is part of the problem. He is the QB coach and
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Oct 29, 2023, 11:23 AM
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The only thing I am 100% confident about is that Jeff Scott will be on the payroll by 1 December in a full-time coaching capacity.
Its a friends and family hire for sure... but a good one. He is proven and one of the best recruiters we've had since Rick Stockstill.
Message was edited by: bobbyb99®
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Paw Warrior [4843]
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Absolutely! When he was hired last year I believed
Oct 29, 2023, 11:24 AM
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He should have been given the opportunity to bring on his own staff. At least one individual.
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Game Day Hero [4341]
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Rival Killer [2630]
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I believe the problem is more play design
Oct 29, 2023, 11:30 AM
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And play calling. I don't think having "his guys" changes that. I do understand the need to do something different on o line and receiver though.
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Scout Team [87]
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Re: Riley Deserves this... need your thougthts
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Oct 29, 2023, 11:34 AM
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That’s not how it works. There is not 1 OC in the country that has taken a job (when it’s not a brand new Head Coach) and been able to bring in an entire staff. You become a head coach for a reason, so you can make those kinds of decisions. If Dabo was just starting and the athletic department had fired the entire previous staff, and Dabo was trying to put his staff together, then he MIGHT consult the OC. No coordinator on Dabo’s staff has ever been able to bring in all of their people.
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Hall of Famer [8301]
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Maybe the TCU success was never Riley at all. Dwell on that.
Oct 29, 2023, 11:34 AM
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Makes as much sense as any other scenario. Because the scheme, play calling, creativity, imagination, execution, urgency.....every single bit of this offense has been horrible. I dare say it feels even worse than last year. Im not convinced riley could run a successful pop warner offense, much less a major d1 program.
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Standout [341]
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It was probably due to Sonny Dykes who has been apart of the air raid tree much
Oct 29, 2023, 11:42 AM
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Riley
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110%er [3625]
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Re: Riley Deserves this... need your thougthts
Oct 29, 2023, 11:49 AM
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At this stage he should. Fire them all and start from scratch and see what he can do.
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Valley Protector [1441]
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Re: Riley Deserves this... need your thougthts
Oct 29, 2023, 11:53 AM
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Disagree. Nobody else lets offensive coordinators build their own staff.
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Game Changer [1720]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: Riley Deserves this... need your thougthts
Oct 29, 2023, 11:58 AM
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Yes 100% agree.
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All-Time Great [91337]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Venables did great here and he wasnt allowed to bring any
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Oct 29, 2023, 12:06 PM
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of his coaches, either. Same with Morris and every coordinator that Dabo has hired.
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Asst Coach [816]
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Re: Riley Deserves this... need your thougthts
Oct 29, 2023, 12:10 PM
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Agree. And it’s bigger than Riley. If CDS doesn’t allow him to do this, we are at major risk of no longer being a program where quality assistants and coordinators will want to come.
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Hall of Famer [8119]
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Friends and family plan simply doesnt work
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Oct 29, 2023, 12:14 PM
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Family gets very complacent because they know they’re not gonna be fired. Friends see you as a peer, and not a boss. I’ve seen it time and time again. If you hire friends, some will undermine you out of jealousy. It just doesn’t work. Dabo has to go out and get seasoned professional coaches, who he admires, but has no family or friendship interests.
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Starter [297]
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Re: Riley Deserves this... need your thougthts
Oct 29, 2023, 1:23 PM
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AGREE
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Game Day Hero [4572]
TigerPulse: 61%
36
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I said it to begin with when he was brought here. Only thing
Oct 29, 2023, 1:26 PM
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I can think of is this… Dabo wanted to bring in a new OC, he did that. Dabo likely asked Riley to give this season a shot with who was already in place. If it works out, great. If it doesn’t then they will analyze at the end of the season and make changes as necessary. Only way I can see it being without Riley being able to bring his own ppl from the start.
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Walk-On [76]
TigerPulse: 100%
8
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Re: Riley Deserves this... need your thougthts
Oct 29, 2023, 1:36 PM
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Agree
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Oculus Spirit [39874]
TigerPulse: 100%
57
Posts: 10910
Joined: 2015
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Re: Riley Deserves this... need your thougthts
Oct 29, 2023, 1:43 PM
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No disagreement here but would be interested in hearing him say who he feels needs to go not TigerNet experts.
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Ring of Honor [21000]
TigerPulse: 100%
53
Posts: 12734
Joined: 2018
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Re: Riley Deserves this... need your thougthts
Oct 29, 2023, 1:46 PM
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He deserves to pick his staff but he also needs to recruit his own players.
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Athletic Dir [1143]
TigerPulse: 100%
26
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Re: Riley Deserves this... need your thougthts
Oct 29, 2023, 4:58 PM
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No doubt let him hire his guys
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