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Replies: 41
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Rock Defender [64]
TigerPulse: 69%
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QB battle simplified
Aug 12, 2018, 4:15 PM
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For everyone that is just baffled at how there could possibly be a QB battle, I mean TL was a billion star QB right? I think you have been playing too much playstation college football and riding a stellar spring game hype. So sit down, stop star gazing and get ready to for me to learn you a few things you missed, and show you it's entirely possible the battle is real close between KB and TL (and CB, he was a monster in high school)
TL had an incredible spring game, you got it. His passes were incredible, and KB's weren't. Competition over? NOPE! that's one day, in a structured simulation. KB had other great days in the spring that weren't broadcasted on TV.
TL is human and can make mistakes AND have games as ugly as KB's spring game. you don't believe me? whaaaaa??? go watch TL in the Army all American game. The announcers are hyping him up and talking about how few INTs he threw in high school and all his records and....INT! followed by another INT and two fumbles...in the first quarter. He also did not have a great showing at the Opening in Oregon, hence why Fields eventually overtook him for #1 QB in the class (wasn't an SEC conspiracy, it was TL's performance at the opening, didn't do bad but did come in 2nd)
So then KB. A QB that was the backup to the best QB in Clemson history, learning from him for two year. Has seen action against some of the toughest defenses in the country and entering his 4th year with the program and lead the team to the CFP a season ago.
So yeah! it's completely possible Dabo is telling the truth that the competition is too close to call. In fact it seems crazy that people would believe the true freshman that hasn't taken a college snap yet is clearly the frontrunner.
alright....cue the "sounds cootish" and "hey coot" replies. Go for it, I won't be able to hear you over the sound of my big gold clemson alumni ring
Also, if you think this is a replay of Deshaun and Cole situation. HEY! welcome to the Clemson fan family cause you obviously weren't a fan during that time and don't understand that whole situation. Or you're a stargazer
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Dynasty Maker [3517]
TigerPulse: 84%
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Re: QB battle simplified
Aug 12, 2018, 4:18 PM
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Yep and if we didn’t have a top 5 D last year, the season would have been like predicted
A rebuilding year
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All-TigerNet [10825]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: QB battle simplified
Aug 12, 2018, 4:26 PM
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Not cootish , there are a lot here that agree with you and have said a lot of the same things.
group 1 is super loyal to KB and think he deserves the job because he took us to the playoff last year.
Group 2 thinks KB should start the year #1 and keep the competition going until TL is ready to take over
Group 3 thinks KB can't throw and there is no chance he'll get better at it, therefore TL is the future and should get all the snaps for better or worse.
Which are you, group 1 or group 2?
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Rock Defender [64]
TigerPulse: 69%
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Re: QB battle simplified
Aug 12, 2018, 4:34 PM
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Ehh a little of all of them.
Totally possible TL eventually takes over, but without any game experience he's gotta be just insane, unreal, never seen anything like it to start from game 1. But it sounds like he's great and coming along.
Loyalty to KB to me just means treating him like a person still even if he loses the job, and being thankful for how hard he worked last year and what he gave the team last year. Doesn't necessarily mean he deserves this years starting role.
KB is a good player, but does have weaknesses. Not as exaggerated as some people think but they are there. He's also a hard worker and a smart kid, if he knows his weaknesses and is being coached how to fix them, I don't see why he could make some improvements in his game
So, I think it'll shake out. I believe them when they say we have 3 QBs we can win with, cause it's really true
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All-TigerNet [10825]
TigerPulse: 100%
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I agree with you, KB does deserve respect
Aug 12, 2018, 4:40 PM
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I'm a group 2 guy, I wouldn't mind seeing both QBs play this year. I think KB can help us throughout the year and it's great TL doesn't have to be thrown into the fire.
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110%er [8867]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Game Day Hero [4431]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: QB battle simplified
Aug 12, 2018, 5:19 PM
[ in reply to Re: QB battle simplified ] |
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I totally agree with this post. I am definitely group two. KB deserves to start game 1 but I feel TL will overtake him later in the season.
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CU Guru [1054]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: QB battle simplified
Aug 12, 2018, 4:56 PM
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I have no control over who is starter, just my opinion, and some right to state my opinion. I guess you also have the right to attack that opinion. You also have just as much a right to be wrong as some of us do. Someone is wrong, and it may be you. If would be nice in a world of multiple opinions if we could state them without being attacked.
"I think you have been playing too much playstation" - I dont play playstation
"So sit down, stop star gazing and get ready to for me to learn you a few things you missed" - So, in your opinion, my opinion is based on something I missed. poor ol' dumb me.
" it's completely possible Dabo is telling the truth that the competition is too close to call" - yes, and it is possible he's working to slow down the transition to get TL as acclimated as possible before the inevitable.
"I won't be able to hear you over the sound of my big gold clemson alumni ring" - that's a good argument if you majored in football, but here it's just a claim that you are of far superior intellect, to other fans. I would suspect some yes and some no.
"Also, if you think this is a replay of Deshaun and Cole situation. HEY! welcome to the Clemson fan family cause you obviously weren't a fan during that time" I've been a fan long before Cole came to Clemson. I think the coaches were hoping Cole would be successful enough to hold off Deshaun,
and I think they are hoping KB will be. I think Cole was good enough, but DW got under his skin (opinion) and he lost confidence.
I do believe they can win it all with either of the 2, and maybe with either of the 3.
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All-TigerNet [10825]
TigerPulse: 100%
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looks like I forgot a group
Aug 12, 2018, 5:02 PM
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Group 4, I feel attacked group
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Rock Defender [64]
TigerPulse: 69%
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Tiger Spirit [9225]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Probably not. You just sounded needlessly arrogant.***
Aug 12, 2018, 6:02 PM
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Rock Defender [64]
TigerPulse: 69%
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Re: Probably not. You just sounded needlessly arrogant.***
Aug 12, 2018, 6:35 PM
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you sound needlessly arrogant
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All-In [37023]
TigerPulse: 100%
56
Posts: 16328
Joined: 2008
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Do you always talk to Pastor's like that?
Aug 13, 2018, 8:49 AM
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I believe the rev was just trying to help you understand.
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All-Pro [730]
TigerPulse: 90%
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Re: QB battle simplified
Aug 12, 2018, 5:00 PM
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Decent point. BUT. The army all start game isn’t valid. Have like a week to learn plays, wr speed and capabilities. KB has been in our system for years... how do those equate to equal in any world?
I get the KB argument. He can manage the game. By that I mean know what needs to be done. Where he loses me is he just can’t execute it when it’s a pass (most of time). Great runner, great heart etc. but he became a qb strictly bc of his althetisism.. not his arm.
With our defense, why do we need that. I’d prefer we give TL the year to learn what he can and can’t do in college with a defense to save him. We’re really in the perfect situation.
If. Big if. We don’t open the playbook, these WRs were recruiting with start to look elsewhere where the ball is thrown.. not pitched or qb kept.
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Rock Defender [64]
TigerPulse: 69%
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Re: QB battle simplified
Aug 12, 2018, 5:09 PM
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yeah his arm is trash, most of the time he can't get the job done. that's why in the ACCCG he started 15/15 and finish 23/29. He must have relied on his legs and ran the ball over to the receivers. Must have been the case. Completing 66% of his passes on the year was also a fluke, he wasn't passing the ball he ran it to the receivers and they counted them as completions
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All-Pro [730]
TigerPulse: 90%
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Re: QB battle simplified
Aug 12, 2018, 5:15 PM
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One game. I’m lazy so can you pull stats on that 66%. How many were beyond 10 yards? Or even 7? We had a very short screen game or slant middles last year. We didn’t test the downfield game often.
I get it. I’m a tiger fan too. Support our boys. But be real. Do you believe KB is an elite or even average passing qb? If your answer is yes you’re not being honest with yourself and the orange tinted glasses are working.
Now. If he starts. I’ll be in my seat yelling for him non stop. Just don’t believe he’s our best option. That’s MY opinion.
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Rock Defender [64]
TigerPulse: 69%
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Re: QB battle simplified
Aug 12, 2018, 5:29 PM
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We didn't test the downfield game often, yes, but why? totally KB?....hmmm
Do you KNOW TL is an elite or even average COLLEGE passer? if your answer is yes those orange tinted glasses are working
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All-Pro [730]
TigerPulse: 90%
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Re: QB battle simplified
Aug 12, 2018, 6:20 PM
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That’s the BEST part. We know KBs ceiling. Trevor’s has yet to be explored. But yeah, I’ll take a gamble and say he can throw it better...
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Orange Elite [5304]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: QB battle simplified
Aug 13, 2018, 3:12 PM
[ in reply to Re: QB battle simplified ] |
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Because he couldn't make them catchable consistently. That'd be why he had only 25.6% completions past 20 yards.
That's also why 184 of his passes were 0-10 yards (plus 69 more behind the line of scrimmage), 80 were between 10-20 yards, and only 43-45 were past 20 yards...if you cared about actually answering his question. That means out of 376 passes, 253 of them (67.2%) didn't go past 10 yards.
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Dynasty Maker [3517]
TigerPulse: 84%
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Re: QB battle simplified
Aug 12, 2018, 5:29 PM
[ in reply to Re: QB battle simplified ] |
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Well about mid way through the 3rd of the TAM game , when TL is lighting it up.
Making a 14-7 game into a 31-10 kind of game , this debate will be over.
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Rock Defender [64]
TigerPulse: 69%
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Re: QB battle simplified
Aug 12, 2018, 5:32 PM
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I hope KB starts the whole season
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Dynasty Maker [3517]
TigerPulse: 84%
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Re: QB battle simplified
Aug 12, 2018, 5:39 PM
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I don’t care who starts as long as our very talented O is not being wasted.
Like last season teams knew we couldn’t throw and loaded the box , at times completely shutting us down for long periods of time.
Thank Goodness our D had some big pick 6s and pretty much put us in position to win.
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Orange Phenom [14588]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: QB battle simplified
Aug 12, 2018, 8:03 PM
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Defense controlled field position in many games waiting for the offense to get going.(which it did)
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Playmaker [374]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: QB battle simplified
Aug 12, 2018, 5:42 PM
[ in reply to Re: QB battle simplified ] |
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The best News is that we can win third NC with EITHER/BOTH and w Chase. Dominance of D and excellence elsewhere will make it a non-factor. Look for ALL to contribute to another special year. GO TIGERS!!!!
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Orange Immortal [61770]
TigerPulse: 100%
60
Posts: 37521
Joined: 1998
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Even simpler:
Aug 12, 2018, 5:17 PM
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KB is the starter until we see/hear otherwise.
TL is crazy talented, but young.
It's going to be an interesting season.
If Dabo plays it right, we should win the Natty.
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Walk-On [75]
TigerPulse: 53%
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Re: QB battle simplified
Aug 12, 2018, 6:04 PM
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I am for whoever the coaches think will move the ball best based on what they are able to show both in practice and as games begin. I think we win almost every game on our schedule regardless of QB. I hope TL proves out better early for one reason Justyn Ross mentioned in his recruiting processs…"If you're a wide receiver you go to Clemson". We are WRU an you don't stay WRU game managing the offense. Love KB's legs and know he can win most games, but never been in awe of his arm talent. If his arm is light years better this year so be it lets roll with him and TL can dominate starting next year when we need more points. My personal opinion is he will be a similar guy throwing and TL will win as we get into the season. We will see. Go Tigers!
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All-Time Great [97852]
TigerPulse: 100%
63
Posts: 97369
Joined: 2009
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It's not over yet.
Aug 12, 2018, 7:26 PM
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Don't insult people talking about them having their knowledge of football because they play it on a Play Station. Some of us were playing in the back yard with your grandmaw.
Don't act like it's over when there's 15 or more practice sessions to go. Don't think for a minute that TL's learning curve is anything like KB. KB has been here since TL was a 10th grader in high school and still can't run the RPO worth chit.
I love the boy and appreciate what he's done and how patient he was to sit behind DW but he doesn't think well on his feet when a team is hard enough to intimidates him.
KB will certainly start the first game. Even DW with all his moxie didn't get the start in his first game. KB ain't going to make the season as starter unless TL is hurt. That kid has DW's nerves and bails when he can gain yards.
Our offense will change when he's behind center. His deep threat will hold safeties and linebacker in check which will give our running backs a fair shot at one on ones in the opponent secondary.
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Rock Defender [64]
TigerPulse: 69%
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Re: It's not over yet.
Aug 12, 2018, 7:44 PM
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I'm surprised you don't work for ESPN
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All-Time Great [97852]
TigerPulse: 100%
63
Posts: 97369
Joined: 2009
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I learned everything I know from playing play station.
Aug 12, 2018, 9:04 PM
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I was in talks with ESPiN but they said I was overqualified..
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Walk-On [149]
TigerPulse: 42%
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Re: QB battle simplified
Aug 12, 2018, 7:46 PM
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I believe many Clemson fans want to see a better passing game given the talent we have at WR. And KB just doesn’t have a good enough arm. He throws ducks and his downfield accuracy is horrible. You just can’t argue with the numbers. He completed 25% of his passes thrown beyond 20 yards and only 46% of his passes thrown beyond 10 yards. If Clemson’s defense wasn’t so great, Clemson doesn’t go to the playoffs last year. Many Clemson fans are worried that we can end up in a situation where KB will have to beat a team with his arm. People are far more confident in TL being able to do that. KB is a below average passer, and the spring game was a perfect example of how bad he is. It wasn’t just “one” bad game. He had the same accuracy problems on downfield passes all season. Look at the NC State. He severely underthrows Trevion on an easy TD and then he overthrows Deon on another easy TD. Those were easy throws, but he completely missed them. And he did that the entire season. He doesn’t have a high ceiling, but TL does. And TL has the better arm.
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Rock Defender [64]
TigerPulse: 69%
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Re: QB battle simplified
Aug 12, 2018, 7:57 PM
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You're absolutely right!
In the NC state game KB had a horrible arm and that was really pervasive throughout the whole season. Under threw Tre overthrew Deon. Just can't have that!
Now if we look at TL's stats from the NC state game.....uhhh haha I mean the BC game...no I really meant against Florida state....why aren't there any good examples to prove TL is a more competent college passer?
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Walk-On [149]
TigerPulse: 42%
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Re: QB battle simplified
Aug 12, 2018, 8:13 PM
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Are you really trying to dispute which QB has the better arm? It’s obvious. TL has elite arm talent, KB does not. Deshaun had more arm talent than Cole Stoudt, and TL has more arm talent that KB. Those are just facts.
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All-TigerNet [10825]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: QB battle simplified
Aug 12, 2018, 8:44 PM
[ in reply to Re: QB battle simplified ] |
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You said you were all 3 groups but it's clear you are hardcore group 1. Loyal to a fault
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National Champion [7587]
TigerPulse: 100%
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He was Nick Schuessler’s backup too...
Aug 12, 2018, 8:29 PM
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So there’s that.
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110%er [3631]
TigerPulse: 96%
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Re: He was Nick Schuessler’s backup too...
Aug 12, 2018, 10:58 PM
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And he made poor reads as a third-stringer long before getting to make them as a first-stringer....
I love Clelin, but i had to laugh when he talked about Kelly's tendency to hold the ball and scramble for two yards resulting in a 3-and-out, even when he knew the opposition was game-planning to take away the QB run. Clelin called it 'trusting your teammates.' I call it 'seniors sticking together'; while KB might have trusted the Power Rangers to have his back (except against Bama), Kelly didn't have the offens
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110%er [3631]
TigerPulse: 96%
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Re: He was Nick Schuessler’s backup too...
Aug 12, 2018, 11:03 PM
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Didn't have the offensive players' backs.
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Orange Blooded [2217]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Yikes
Aug 12, 2018, 9:39 PM
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Cringed most of the way through this post.
-the spring game was a self-fulfilling prophecy for many who were expecting TL to take the reins during the off-season, despite being apparently unaware of the way Dabo operates and how he embraces competition at every position and no job is given without earning it.
TL showed off the talent we knew he had and KB underperformed when the lights came on (yes that was 1 of 15 spring practices but it’s also the one with the most pressure)
-comparing that to the Army AA game is irresponsible and shows you don’t know as much about football as you think you do. Getting under a week to practice with guys you’ve never played with and learn a playbook while getting 1/5th of the practice reps and playing maybe every 3rd series is not remotely the same situation. And if you knew as much about football as you think you do you’d know the Opening grades are largely based on 7on7 play where TL played very little and Fields played on Cam Newton’s team that played 7on all over the country all offseason. Still came in 2nd.
-Kelly has earned the right to have the job going into fall camp and probably into week 1 in a meaningless Furman game. There’s plenty of rational and reasonable fans here that are in the same camp. But saying KB “led” us to the CFP is not incredibly accurate. The defense led us there. It’s the classic QB truck vs trailer argument and KB is a trailer. You can get where you want to go with him but he’s not pulling you there he’s getting pulled. Part of the reason we’ve had such great success recently is that starting jobs are earned and KB has the opportunity to earn it, rightfully so, but so does TL.
-I believe the competition is tight. But it’s also in Dabo’s best interest to say that so Jimbo has to gameplan for both QB’s. I’m in the camp that I expect KB to be the starter probably going into Week 2 and when the heat cranks up for TL to take more and more control but who’s playing QB has no impact on my support for the team or the school. KB can absolutely get us back to the playoff but we saw his deficiencies against Bama last year and that’s who we’re going to have to beat. TL’s skill set opens up our offense more and would allow us to move the ball better (in theory).
-calling people “stargazers” because they believe in talent when they see it is dumb. Especially when the star they’re gazing at is what several objective and qualified observers have called the best QB prospect they’ve ever seen.
-you’re hardly the only Clemson alum on this board, I am one as well. But unlike you I won’t look down on or dismiss someone’s opinion just because they didn’t graduate from Clemson. You never know someone’s situation and I know many fans that didn’t graduate from Clemson that are more invested and knowledgeable than many Clemson grads I know.
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Rock Defender [64]
TigerPulse: 69%
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Re: Yikes
Aug 13, 2018, 2:11 PM
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Wow cringed through that post
you lost me in the first paragraph "didn't know how Dabo operates" just shows me you know nothing about the program and I didn't need to keep reading
But good on you bud for taking the time to write something
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Orange Blooded [2217]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Way to refute zero points
Aug 13, 2018, 3:04 PM
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Out of the several in which you’re dead wrong on. If you could actually read you would’ve seen I was saying that the people expecting TL to be named starter leaving spring don’t know how Dabo operates. But if that’s the hill you choose to die on so be it.
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National Champion [7353]
TigerPulse: 100%
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I do believe you're not gonna be around.
Aug 12, 2018, 9:42 PM
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Come November 24, 2018 when your team will be seeing Mr. Ben Batson come in to start the 4th quarter. As KB, TL, and CB will have lit up your coots again! I'm thinking CB and BB finish out the game. Until WE call the time outs to let our Seniors get their well deserved ovations!
P.S.
You ain't fooling no one. A real Clemson graduate shouldn't have to brag about a ring.
Hth.
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Solid Orange [1324]
TigerPulse: 99%
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391 words is not simplified***
Aug 12, 2018, 10:30 PM
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110%er [5045]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: QB battle simplified
Aug 13, 2018, 2:56 PM
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TL didn't do good in the AA game when he had no film to watch defensive schemes or have ever had to play against any of those guys before nor ever played with any of his OL RB or even WR before.
I see the highlight of KB went 15/15 against Miami as always the game pointed to by KB fans, what other game did he do well at, to that standard or close to it even? Just curious. Also not to be a downer but Miami was riddled with injuries when we played them.
TL who doesn't do 7 on 7s came in a close 2nd to a kid that camps 7 on 7s across the country. Also if you read on that Fields had the greatest performance in the history of the opening if you read about that and still lost his top spot to TL BECAUSE of TL performing best when it matters, in game.
If KB has improved enough to command the offense better and give us more opportunity then I will be very happy, NO MATTER what QB is put on the field for Clemson I will support them 100% because Clemson winning is what I care about more than who does the winning. But the truth is that fans and others know pretty much what KB brings to the table after a 14 game season we got to see last year. We know what his limits were all last year and when a team could finally match our skill groups defensively we had to trust KB to make the plays himself and he didn't get it done then we saw a replay of it in the spring. We don't know what TL's limits are but everyone that has worked with him has stated that he could be the greatest ever. Spring game was his first opportunity to show he could be great and he was by far the best QB out there that day and that's why people are excited to see that.
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