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National Champion [8049]
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UCF - Clemson - Conference Parallel
Sep 20, 2019, 1:09 PM
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Not a UCF fan by any stretch - but football heads answer this for me. Clemson has proven beyond a shadow of a doubt it can be done despite conference perceived strength being weak.
What is the difference between what people currently think of the ACC versus the AAC? I think we need to let BC and Cuse go and pick up UCF and W. Virginia into the ACC.
If the commitment conference leaders made years ago or at least stated years ago is true - UCF and W. Virginia have both proven they put good teams on the field. Their basketball programs aren't bad either. But, this isn't the topic.
Why does UCF not get the love shown to them even after Clemson has proven the whole: "you wouldn't be able to compete with the big boys b/c you won't be use to the speed/size/strength/etc" thing wrong?
Again, if you are one who has bought into how bad and miserable the ACC is. Then you should also dang well be one who goes out of your way to acknowledge how good a job our coaching staff does getting the team prepared despite the competition! There is compelling evidence that indicates it gets blown out of proportion when it comes to the ACC and swept under the rug when it comes to the SEC!
What do you say? Is this a: "you're not in the club" thing? Or is their schedule so egregious they should not get a shot? Keeping in mind some would say that about our Tigers who have proven that wrong emphatically!
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Walk-On [137]
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Re: UCF - Clemson - Conference Parallel
Sep 20, 2019, 1:12 PM
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Haven't believed this in recent years but I am certain UCF would be the second-best team in the ACC this year. I still do not believe they have enough depth at key positions to play with the big boys (at the level they are winning now) for an entire season. They have enough to compete in a game but a season grind will throw in some losses without P5 depth through recruiting.
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National Champion [8049]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: UCF - Clemson - Conference Parallel
Sep 20, 2019, 6:13 PM
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RaleighTiger1 But, doesn't that lend itself to the argument the SEC homers use about Clemson?
That we couldn't handle the week in and week out grind of the second!
***This very thing is why I thought about UCF and Clemson together! Especially since Clemson smashes the notion so thoroughly.
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CU Medallion [19704]
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Re: UCF - Clemson - Conference Parallel
Sep 20, 2019, 1:12 PM
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I've always thought that UCF is playoff worthy and am in favor of expanding to eight.
And I also think the ACC is a dumpster fire this year.
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All-TigerNet [11478]
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Re: UCF - Clemson - Conference Parallel
Sep 20, 2019, 1:21 PM
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When Clemson made the jump to the elite group in 2015, the ACC was not what it is today.
In 2016 when Clemson won the national title, the ACC atlantic may have been the best division in college football.
2015 & 2017 we beat a top 10 team in ACC championship.
Clemson proved itself on the national stage when the conference foes were also playing well.
On top of that, Clemson has not only won postseason games, but has destroyed at least one team in the postseason every year since 2014 with the exception of 2017 when we lost to the eventual national champion.
Even though we lost to Bama in 2017 we destroyed a 1 loss Miami team in the ACC title game.
On the other hand, UCF has had no help from conference goes in terms of national presence to help boost their profile.
Through no fault of their own, UCF's big OOC wins usually end up being very average Power 5 teams.
They also gave up 40 points in the bowl game last year to an LSU team that couldn't score against Bama.
That didn't help either.
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Orange Immortal [67583]
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Last year...
Sep 20, 2019, 1:25 PM
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Clemson finished the year with a SOS ranking around 21.
Even after playing LSU in the bowl game, UCF's SOS ranking was still in the mid to lower 80's (which was up from the mid 120's prior to the bowl game).
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Campus Hero [13855]
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Using what SoS metric?***
Sep 20, 2019, 2:35 PM
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Orange Blooded [2278]
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Re: Using what SoS metric?***
Sep 21, 2019, 9:27 AM
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Tigers and cubs has a very important point. Several if not most would consider playing the 40th, 45th and 50th ranked teams harder than the 1st, 10th, and 125th ranked teams. I think most people would have the opposite opinion.
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National Champion [7853]
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not even close to comparable- UCF would fight with about
Sep 20, 2019, 2:03 PM
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10 other teams this year to be called the 2nd best team in the ACC. None of which are on the level of being playoff caliber teams/programs.
They were better last year and still got waxed by that LSU offense. They couldn't handle a season in a better league unless they improved their recruiting. Now having said that, joining the league would improve their recruiting just as it would for any AAC team. UCF as a university just doesn't fit with the rest of the league- nor does WVU. UL was a stretch IMO from an academic university perspective but a better athletic program than UCF.
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Campus Hero [13855]
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Wow. Sorry but that's a really bad take
Sep 20, 2019, 2:39 PM
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There's nowhere near 10 ACC teams on their level.
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Campus Hero [13855]
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Can't fathom why anyone would want WVU***
Sep 20, 2019, 2:33 PM
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National Champion [8049]
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Re: Can't fathom why anyone would want WVU***
Sep 20, 2019, 6:24 PM
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TigersAndCubs Can you enlighten me on the WVU and UCF academic "inability"?
Everyone doesn't live in that world, so excuse me for not knowing if they are not great academic institutions. Sincerely asking b/c I don't know. What standard does it require for a school to be considered for the ACC?
Certainly then Vanderbilt and Navy would be good fits no?
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Game Day Hero [4380]
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Re: UCF - Clemson - Conference Parallel
Sep 20, 2019, 2:35 PM
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You might only care about sports, but Clemson is a university and benefits from being in the ACC.
We should never have admitted Louisville and should never admit UCF or WV.
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MVP [541]
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Re: UCF - Clemson - Conference Parallel
Sep 20, 2019, 2:54 PM
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I don't think its completely fair to compare what UCF almost did vs LSU without McKenzie Milton at QB. I mean, I think if TL16 went down at the end of our season and we still won our conference and played well but lost in a top tier bowl, we would not feel justly represented as a 2nd tier team. We were a really good team who lost a top notch QB late in the season - don't dismiss us because we barely lost to an SEC West team in a New Year Six bowl game.
To me - especially this year - it is all about UCF's intent. And I think the committee sees it this way. Your conference is what your conference is. We can't help the ACC is down - they can't help who is in their conference. Those things are contracted years in advance. Same with who you play OOC. We can't help Texas A&M went 8-4 last year. When we scheduled them, they were living large with Johnny Football. Thankfully they are still decent if not truly good or great. But Clemson's intent was to schedule high quality OOC foes. And I think the same should be said of UCF. They scheduled Stanford and Pitt. The intent is there to play Power 5 teams. Stanford has been good or great...they may still be but not so far this year. Pitt won their conference division last year - they went toe-to-toe with Penn State. We will see how they turn out. Regardless of their schedule, the intent is there. They are trying to play Power 5 teams because you can't just up & change conferences each year based on who is good in football.I think they did get penalized last year because 1) they UNC game was canceled and 2) their star QB was lost at the end of the year. If they had any shot at the CFP, they lost them with those 2 factors. If they run the table this year, I think they deserve a shot at the CFP.
Unless its them or Clemson....then they need to get in line. 
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National Champion [8049]
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Re: UCF - Clemson - Conference Parallel
Sep 21, 2019, 8:59 AM
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"The Pac 12 looks like a secondary conference."
"they shouldn't even consider a Pac 12 school"
I fear that is that same SEC-like rhetoric people use to try and keep our Tigers out. Mostly out of fear of the Tigers. I believe UCF gets the same thing.
Not a conference "rah rah guy". But, your margin of error is much better the stronger the teams on your schedule are.
We lost to cuse and Pitt(won it this year of course) but the ACC wasn't looked at like it is currently. FSU was still decent when we lost to Pitt. Cuse finished the year ranked in 17 so did Nancy St. I believe.
Most of the threads about last chance PAC 12 team Utah - all echo many of the same themes I am sure people have about the ACC and whether or not it's champion is worthy or not. THEY CAN'T THROW CLEMSON IN THAT AT THIS POINT B/C THE TIGERS HAVE PROVED IT DON'T MATTER ABOUT OUR SCHEDULE - SPOT THE BALL AND WE PLAY FOOTBALL & see what happens.
Oregon still has a shot BTW b/c of "who they lost to" and "b/c they controlled that game and everyone knows Auburn got lucky"! Wouldn't count the Pac 12 out.
And 8 team playoff would just mean: the two finalist in the SEC West would get in plus the SEC East champ. So, if you are all about more SEC we should go 8 teams. But, look at their bowl record and nothing says they are that good when they aren't playing other over ranked over hyped teams!
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Standout [345]
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Re: UCF - Clemson - Conference Parallel
Sep 21, 2019, 9:10 AM
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There's more to this conference than football. I LOVE the fact that Clemson is part of a conference that's academically prestigious. CU would be 4th academically in the SEC (behind Vandy, UF, UGA) and way ahead of #5. We're something like 10th in the ACC (we float around, changing places with VT, 'Cuse, and sometimes Pitt from year to year in the USNews rankings. FSU actually jumped us this year). This year we're a bit down (or they're a bit up).
Either UCF or WVU would be a big heavy anchor on that academic prestige, and taking both of them while kicking out BC and 'Cuse would destroy the conference's reputation.
IMO Louisville was a mistake for that very reason (confirmed by subsequent scandals). The only schools that should even enter into consideration in the future IMO are Cincinnati and UConn (if they're clean), good schools that have proven they can field competitive teams in both major sports.
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National Champion [8049]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: UCF - Clemson - Conference Parallel
Sep 21, 2019, 9:25 AM
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cuthbert® Thank You a ton! I really appreciate it. Now I know and know where to get the info as well.
I can understand the comments about academic standards to my position on those two schools.
You wonder if we could lure UF from Florida then or Vandy one day!
***I know, I know ****
In my day dream you had:
ACC North:
Clemson
Pitt
Wake
Unc
VT
UVA
ACC South
Florida
Florida St
Georgia Tech
Vandy
Nancy St
Miami
**Yes Clemson would be in the north to hopefully make a compelling championship game!
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Standout [345]
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Re: UCF - Clemson - Conference Parallel
Sep 21, 2019, 2:32 PM
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My ideal conference includes both BC and Syracuse. I think they're overall good for us, and Clemson has something of a history with BC. Funny nobody brought up getting rid of UNC when they were 2-20 in Mack Brown's first two years, or 2017 when they were 3-9 (for example). Every program goes through the doldrums from time to time.
I prefer the older, smaller conferences, and so I'm partial to the original ACC: Clemson, WF, UNC, NCSU, Duke, UVA (came in a year later), MD. But since nothing's sacred anymore (Kansas-Missouri or Texas-TA&M, anyone?), I'll live in the present. My ideal ACC would be, south to north:
Miami
FSU
GT
Clemson
WF
UNC
NCSU
Duke
VT
UVA
Louisville (holding my nose)
Pitt
Cincinnati or UConn, pick 'em
ND
Syracuse
BC
East Coast dominance with some serious Midwest presence.
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Paw Master [16673]
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So shiny flashy objects get your attention?
Sep 21, 2019, 10:03 AM
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That's what I learned.
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