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There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board
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Game Day Hero [4362]
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There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board
Sep 19, 2021, 8:51 AM
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that it is laughable. I’m not disagreeing that there are some concerns offensively that deserve discussion, but 90% of you have no clue what you’re talking about. Just throwing darts based off one or two plays instead of the body of work. And rarely give the other teams any credit. Like I said…laughable.
Come on people, step back from the ledge. Think about it…
1. Every week, we get everyone’s best shot. Almost everyone we play is trying to avenge a loss to us (some for many seasons.) We still got the W.
2. It was a weird game with the delays that affected flow. You can’t plan for stuff like that. It’s football and that kind of stuff has happened since the beginning of time. Many teams have lost as a result of fluke conditions that wouldn’t have lost otherwise. We didn’t lose, btw.
3. It’s early in the season and we’re not the only team struggling. Take a look around the country. Bama is struggling. OSU is struggling. Oklahoma doesn’t look great. The whole ACC is a pile of dung. And everyone still has to manage around COVID protocols that we don’t know how it affects practice or gameday. But here we are still in control of our destiny.
4. We got better in several areas this week. It’s pretty clear now the direction we’re moving at RB. Lyn-J is done a d that’s not on coaching. That’s on him. You wanna blame someone, have at it. So we got a freshman and we have to ease him into it. He muffed a kickoff and fumbled last night. He’s a freshman. The coaches have to use caution for good reason. What are they supposed to do? The whole RB situation affects the entire offense.
5. DJ is struggling, as did DW and TL although no one wants to admit it. He completed 75% of his passes last night and he ran the ball in some key situations. We have to be careful how much we run him because he is the best QB we have. Some of you calling for Will Taylor and Puma are nuts and have no idea where they are in their development and recovery. Having said that, I do agree that we need to run DJ earlier in the game and take some pressure off the receivers until they settle in a bit.
Tony Elliot and the staff do deserve some criticism for sure. But to act as if this staff has just lost their mind after so many playoff and Natty appearances is just nuts. And to have zero appreciation for the Win and no respect for the other team is pathetic. Shut up and enjoy watching this team develop. Every week they are getting better and we will be just fine.
Go Tigers!
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Top TigerNet [28931]
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This was GT ... UNC would have blown Clemson out yesterday.***
Sep 19, 2021, 8:54 AM
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Hall of Famer [8111]
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Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board
Sep 19, 2021, 9:01 AM
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So here we go , the old “you don’t know what you’re talking about” post.
So “knowledgeable one” , please enlighten me while we are in shotgun formation on our own 2 yard line with only seconds left on the clock, and refused to put the quarterback under center? That was probably the dumbest thing I’ve ever seen coaching staff do since Tommy Bowden was the coach at Clemson. There’s simply no excuse for that sort of thing. You don’t have to be an ex-coach to understand that was a poor decision, and there’s been many other poor decisions this season
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Top TigerNet [31589]
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Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board
Sep 19, 2021, 9:02 AM
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I can guarantee you this: You'd have NEVER seen Danny pull that crap. Ever.
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Ring of Honor [21293]
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Did Danny ever use the shotgun?
Sep 19, 2021, 2:08 PM
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30-40 years ago was under center, option football. 3 teams run that now. Even Bama isnt under center now.
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Orange Beast [6559]
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1st Rounder [684]
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Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board
Sep 19, 2021, 9:16 AM
[ in reply to Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board ] |
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Why are you so worked up about a play that worked? Shipley cleared the goal line. He wasn’t tackled in the the end zone. If he didn’t fumble the play worked. You need to stop listening to dumb ESPN analysts and think for yourself.
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Game Day Hero [4362]
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Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board
Sep 19, 2021, 9:20 AM
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Exactly. I didn’t particularly like the call, but I agree with you that the play did work. Fumble was on the player. Thumbs up to you for an intelligent comment.
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Freshman [-94]
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I can promise you
Sep 19, 2021, 10:52 AM
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That with the exception of stupid Clemson fans no one thinks that was a smart play.
We looked like a poorly coached high school team at the end of the game.
Taking the penalty was stupid to begin with. We got the ball on the 4 yard line. Put DJ under center two guys behind him a.k.a. traditional victory formation and one snap take a knee the game is over. Instead we had all that drama. And got lucky!
It’s stupid, irrational, and not smart football!
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Game Changer [1789]
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Re: I can promise you
Sep 19, 2021, 3:14 PM
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The ball wasn’t on the 4. On the 2. Big difference
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Orange Blooded [2332]
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Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board
Sep 19, 2021, 9:33 AM
[ in reply to Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board ] |
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If you are under center you just go to one knee and there is no chance for a fumble. When you say that it worked if he didn't fumble, then it means it didn't work.
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1st Rounder [684]
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Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board
Sep 19, 2021, 11:01 AM
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Hmmmm, so snaps are never fumbled in football, eh? A fumble could happen in either scenario and in neither case is it a problem with the play call.
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Ring of Honor [21293]
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Our center has played 3 games there with
Sep 19, 2021, 2:12 PM
[ in reply to Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board ] |
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not one snap under center. Our QB has never taken a snap under center in his career.
But let's have them do something they've never done with the game on the line
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Redshirt [92]
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Rival Killer [2772]
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Dynasty Maker [3197]
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Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board
Sep 19, 2021, 2:22 PM
[ in reply to Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board ] |
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Just because a play “worked” doesn’t mean it’s the right call. A QB dive from the shotgun with two TE’s lined up as fullbacks would have been a much better play. There is no reason to even hand the ball off in that situation because you are creating an unnecessary opportunity for a mistake in the handoff. Should we run a QB sneak from under center if we don’t practice under center? Of course not. But that begs the question, why don’t we practice under center for specific instances. I’m sure we practice a fake punt, but how often are we employing it? Just because it’s rarely used doesn’t mean it shouldn’t be in our arsenal.
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Hall of Famer [8111]
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Game Day Hero [4362]
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Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board
Sep 19, 2021, 9:19 AM
[ in reply to Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board ] |
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Maybe put your glasses on and actually read what I posted before responding. I clearly said that the coaches deserved some criticism. The safety play you mentioned is one of those plays. Those are not the types of posts I was referring to. Signed, “Knowledgeable One”
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Game Day Hero [4437]
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Dynasty Maker [3119]
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IMO snap under center should be added to schedule
Sep 19, 2021, 10:33 AM
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To prevent more dumb ### decisions such as the one we saw at the end of the game.
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Trainer [41]
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Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board
Sep 19, 2021, 11:40 AM
[ in reply to Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board ] |
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That's the offensive coordinator's fault. Makes me wonder what did we practice in fall camp. Dabo said he was tired of playing Clemson, maybe he needs to rethink that!!
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Rock Defender [57]
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Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board
Sep 19, 2021, 10:10 AM
[ in reply to Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board ] |
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Well, it could be that the coaches who watch the team practice every day might know more about the players’ abilities, strengths, and weaknesses than we do after drinking 12 beers and badmouthing the guys on the field.
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Hall of Famer [8111]
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Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board
Sep 19, 2021, 3:46 PM
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Who is bad mouthing players? I have a problem with bad coaching incisions we seen this year, it’s not just been one. If Dabo never won another game at Clemson I would be forever grateful to him for the last 10 years of fun, but as long as he’s here making millions of dollars and we’re we are pouring money into the program, I don’t think it’s a tall ask to be able to do the basics.
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1st Rounder [639]
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Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board
Sep 19, 2021, 5:00 PM
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I don't think it is a tall ask to be able to go beyond the basics. We developed into an elite program - to expect anything less now is complacent.
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CU Guru [1251]
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You Can Count Yourself
Sep 19, 2021, 9:10 AM
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in that number.
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TigerNet Elite [74526]
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Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board
Sep 19, 2021, 9:21 AM
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we going to ever give someone our best shot? Well we're waiting......
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1st Rounder [684]
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Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board
Sep 19, 2021, 11:05 AM
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Ask Ohio State and Bama
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Valley Protector [1477]
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Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board
Sep 19, 2021, 9:21 AM
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You bring up some good points. But I do not remember DW or TL ever looking as unsure or jittery in the pocket.
Ever so often, DJ seems to lock in and wait for one WR (usually Ross) to get open. DJ seems to be a few beats slow to scramble. And his throws are more off than on. Is that not accurate after 3 games?
But he can improve. Sure he can. Now will we see it? Who knows?;
Now about coaches:, let's have you impart your knowledge:
What improved from UGA to GT game?
For play calling-
Where was TE good vs UGA?
Where was he good vs GT?
I did not see much adjustment by this staff until 2nd half of GT game. = DJ runs
Is TE limited by the Online? If so, how is he adjusting to maximize their good vs bad?
Is TE limited by DJ?
If so, how is he calling plays to build DJ's confidence? Or to maximize the good of DJ?
What frustrates me is when Dabo and TE say "this is what we do." Perhaps Clemson cannot do what it wants to do at the highest level and vs better teams or even teams that scheme to take away what we want to do?
I have seen teams flummox Clemson's vaunted Offense in some recent games. Top 6 teams have done it and average teams have done it.
Last questions:
Has Clemson's Offense become easier to plan for?
How are Clemson's Offensive leaders adjusting or are they?
The Hubris of "this is what we do" may get Clemson in trouble when it is trying to gel new with experienced, to build confidence and create flow.
Note, I am sick of hearing " We could not get into a rhythm" and "We could not get a flow going."
Figure out Why it is the case. Figure out what to avoid when it is occurring in the first two series. Better yet, alter things to make the Opponent question, guess and hesitate.
This year will be telling. This will be TE's biggest challenge year. He is the Head Coach of the offense. If he cannot get Clemson going really well, what does it say about his head coaching capabilities?
He has all the talent in the world. He needs to put it all together so that it functions effectively to produce the best outcome. He needs to prepare so that talent + scheme maximize his resources. Then he needs to see the game unfolding and adjust in game to leverage team's talents and resources to overcome challenges.
That is a head coach. This year is turning out to be a challenge. Go tigers
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Game Day Hero [4362]
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Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board
Sep 19, 2021, 9:38 AM
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I agree with some of yours points. Tony did say they had not seen GT defend that way before. They did utilize DJ in the 2nd half, though I believe they should have run him more in the first half as well. I think they are just trying not to get him hurt because we don’t want to see the offense with our backups. The weather also gave GT a second wind and time to scheme where they may have gotten tired and had less time to adjust if not for the delay.
There is no doubt that TE and Dabo have to figure out how to scheme around our weaknesses. Maybe we just don’t have the right pieces to do that yet. There are certainly some bad calls that need to stop, but overall the plays to win have been there. It’s mostly lack of execution in all 3 games. DJ is not sharp, WR’s running wrong routes, RB chaos and freshmen fumbling. We had multiple long drives where we shot ourselves in the foot and came away with zero points. That’s all players.
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Commissioner [970]
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Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board
Sep 19, 2021, 10:05 AM
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Your first paragraph reminds me of the time it only rained on ND only in reverse. It's too bad we didn't have the same opportunity as GT to recover and make adjustments.
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Trainer [41]
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Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board
Sep 19, 2021, 11:48 AM
[ in reply to Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board ] |
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Can't believe you are blaming players, well other than DJ. 90% of how an elite team plays is in the coaching, which is very lacking. Dabo needs to quit sugar-coating it and take ownership and thank God that BV is running the defense!! Got serious questions about TE's offensive strategy and versatility even going back to the OSU loss when he had Trevor.
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Orange Blooded [2332]
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Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board
Sep 19, 2021, 10:17 AM
[ in reply to Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board ] |
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I agree with most of what you say, but my frustrations are in not really knowing what is being done. It is always nice having everybody say all of the right things when we are being successful, but when you are not playing up to par it means that you internalize where blame belongs.
"This is what we do," and "We get everybody's best shot," should mean somebody screwed up and we didn't play up to our potential. I think that it does here, but I just wish that I could be sure. If "what we do" is the same for too long then it doesn't work anymore. "Everybody's best shot" should be something that even Duke receives, and I am confident that UNC, FSU, and Virginia Tech receives that effort from it's opponents.
What I hope is going on is that Elliot is using the greatest tool at his disposal, Brent Venables. I know Coach Venables has his own responsibilities, but a few more points for the good guys would make his job much easier. If anyone can tell Coach Elliot, where he is being predictable and where the offense's weaknesses are it is Coach V.
Though I still think that we were better off with Scott leaving rather than Elliot, I do long for the days with Co-OC's. We have problems right now, and the sooner that they are fixed, the more likely we can be to hear that we are peaking in time for the CFP. I don't mind the Coach-speak for the media. Just don't let that be what is going on behind closed doors. Somebody and more likely several somebodies need to be getting their butts chewed. I sure hope that is the case.
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Mascot [20]
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Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board
Sep 19, 2021, 9:22 AM
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For such a “knowledgeable” person you certainly are missing what’s wrong with this team. Equating DJs struggles to DW and TL’s is completely missing the point. DJ doesn’t posses the QB skills that those guys had, his mechanics are crap, he locks onto one receiver, and throws with zero touch. He’s also not the athlete that those guys were, he’s a lumbering 250 pound QB.
Of all the criticisms of the coaching staff I think moving Ross to the slot has been the biggest blunder thus far. Ross is one of the best boundary X receivers in the country, moving him into the slot has been foolish. What a waste of talent.
Also, We are not struggling like Alabama, OSU and Oklahoma. This offense has serious issues and dismissing people’s concerns as being a “lack of knowledge” is pretty comical, as your complete lack of awareness is in full view.
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Freshman [-57]
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Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board
Sep 19, 2021, 9:27 AM
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we do not control our own destiny.
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Game Day Hero [4362]
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Mascot [20]
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Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board
Sep 19, 2021, 9:45 AM
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Lol….
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Mascot [20]
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Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board
Sep 19, 2021, 9:57 AM
[ in reply to Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board ] |
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What a brilliant assessment from such a “knowledgeable” person. Of course if players make plays the game would be different, that’s kind of obvious. The issue is that these plays aren’t being made, and the offense looks bad even outside of the fumbles.
What’s next? You going to tell us that grass is green and the sky is blue?
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Game Day Hero [4437]
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Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board
Sep 19, 2021, 10:03 AM
[ in reply to Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board ] |
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When you run the ball for 4 yards and a cloud of dust pushing for the extra yard, fumbles are going to happen.
Only losing one is probably better than we should expect.
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Freshman [10]
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Ring of Honor [21293]
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Right now we have no slot receiver
Sep 19, 2021, 2:19 PM
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That's a big part of the problem. What we do leans heavily on the slot receiver to move the chains
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Game Changer [1789]
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Solid Orange [1367]
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Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board
Sep 19, 2021, 9:26 AM
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The last time I checked, it's early in the season for the teams we played too.
I am pretty sure the game flow (what game flow?) changing weather delay was the same for GT.
There is no comparison to TL or DW's struggles to what DJ is showing this year.
As far as everyone playing their best against us, If we are a championship team, that should not matter.
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Paw Warrior [4631]
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Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board
Sep 19, 2021, 9:32 AM
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I’m telling you the vast majority of folks on here have no clue what they’re looking at. It’s like trying to explain something to your wife who has no idea what she’s looking at. It’s both comical and sad.
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Athletic Dir [1194]
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Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board
Sep 19, 2021, 9:43 AM
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It's not difficult at all to determine what we are looking at. We are looking at an offensive train wreck and if you see it any different you are just blind or having issues seeing through those orange glasses. These are the types of things a head coach and his coordinators have to get out in front of quickly or all of a sudden Pitt has hung 30 on you and you can't score. With this type of offensive effort all it takes is for the defense to have a bad day and give up a couple of TDs. I'm just confused on what you think we are seeing that we have no clue about but you do.
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Freshman [4]
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Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board
Sep 19, 2021, 10:18 AM
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It's time to move over let someone else in no matter how much you cry you are no championship team
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Freshman [4]
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Orange Blooded [2332]
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Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board
Sep 19, 2021, 10:30 AM
[ in reply to Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board ] |
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Most people with a happy marriage will not tell their wife that they are unintelligent. It's much better just to avoid subjects that she lacks knowledge in.
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Standout [246]
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Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board
Sep 19, 2021, 9:51 AM
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Thankyou professor! We’ll all try to measure up to your obvious expertise.
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Trainer [45]
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Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board
Sep 19, 2021, 10:10 AM
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What I think myself and others find consistently disturbing is that we always hear the talk of "Playing to a Standard" and "It's not Who we play but How we play" and that goes both ways. Folks on this board understand we're getting everyone's best shot, and we know that Dabo doesn't have the killer instinct to run up the score and beat teams by 50. He'd rather win by 21, empty the bench, play 3rd and 4th stringers in the 2nd quarter, run a vanilla offense and let a defense that controlled the entire game give up 7-10 points in garbage time to make the score look closer than it should be. It keeps all the players engaged, continues to embody the "Family" culture he preaches, and develops depth so as frustrating as it can be at times for fans this is completely different than that.
There is a systemic level of complacency that fans are sensing and we don't like it. We know Clemson progresses throughout the season and builds but at the end of the day TE is a top 3 compensated coordinator and Dabo is a top 3 compensated Head Coach. All we are asking is to act like it. You can't consistently be out-coached against sub-par competition the entire game and not make adjustments in game or year to year. The excuses of "we don't run plays under center" has reared its head for the past 8 years. You look at the major teams that run in shotgun they still have a package under center for at least 4 plays (QB Sneak, FB Dive, QB Kneel, and a HB Dive). We run a "JUMBO" package under center why we're afraid to run QB sneak is beyond baffling.
For in game adjustments it doesn't take a rocket scientist to realize that our offense thus far mirrors the KB, and CS years. For whatever reason we have a hesitancy to not want to throw it deep and over the years Bama, UGA, Syracuse, Pitt, and others have given you the blueprint for how to make it difficult for us. Play press man, drop 8 into coverage, and have Clemson prove they can go on long drives without their QB making a mistake, our OC's getting cute, or having a bad play to get us off schedule.
You look at programs that we're compared to Oklahoma, Ohio State, UGA, etc and whether or not they actually fix the problem there is an urgency to do something and adjust whether it's good or bad. For us to stay competitive on the mountain we have to have that hunger to do the same. It's not because fans aren't educated, loyal, or because we don't care. It's because we care so much that we don't want to go back to where we were before and we know the only way to move forward is to continuously evolve.
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Orange Beast [6279]
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Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board
Sep 19, 2021, 10:14 AM
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It doesn’t take a lot of knowledge to see that our defensive recruiting and coaching up far exceeds the offensive version.
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Freshman [-94]
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That you Dabo?
Sep 19, 2021, 10:47 AM
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.
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Paw Warrior [4631]
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If you want knowledgeable football takes go to Shakin The Southland
Sep 19, 2021, 10:51 AM
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If you want estrogen filled rants with little incite into the intricacies of football this is the the place to be.
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Clemson Icon [26664]
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How long have you been watching football...?***
Sep 19, 2021, 10:53 AM
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Dynasty Maker [3566]
TigerPulse: 85%
34
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Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board
Sep 19, 2021, 10:59 AM
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So Bama is struggling? LOL and you think you know football. Stop being a fan boy and wake up .
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Recruit [82]
TigerPulse: 32%
9
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Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board
Sep 19, 2021, 11:01 AM
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Ummm...yeah, where to begin. Can you please explain the lack of continuity in the 1st half? The predictable play calling. The missed assignments. Starting the game with a false start? Failing to score more than 7 points with incredible starting field position. You know, before the "unpredictable" lightening delay.
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Recruit [82]
TigerPulse: 32%
9
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Re: There is such a lack...and you exemplify that to a T
Sep 19, 2021, 11:24 AM
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You just made a great example, albeit unintentionally.
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Trainer [41]
TigerPulse: 82%
5
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Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board
Sep 19, 2021, 11:31 AM
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Hope you are right, but it was Ga Tech and not UNC, Va, Va Tech, NCSU, or even Wake and we are ranked 6th for some reason! ???
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Paw Master [17860]
TigerPulse: 95%
51
Posts: 26681
Joined: 2006
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with our talent we stil should blow out g tech
Sep 19, 2021, 11:32 AM
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even when getting their best shot.
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Orange Blooded [2192]
TigerPulse: 95%
32
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This is a systemic problem on offense
Sep 19, 2021, 11:55 AM
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It has been getting worse over the past three seasons or so. Frankly our blocking has always been poor and our success has come in spite of this. We have a collection of former Clemson players Coaching that side and that may have gone too far into Dabo's decision to hire those people.
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National Champion [7474]
TigerPulse: 100%
42
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####### Sunshine Pumpers. Happy in mediocrity with Elliott!***
Sep 19, 2021, 2:27 PM
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Redshirt [92]
TigerPulse: 99%
10
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Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board
Sep 19, 2021, 2:30 PM
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Thanks for the Tigers support but your aggression to the fans is misdirected. Where there’s smoke, there’s fire. This a supposed Top 5 / CFP team that got pushed around by a team who just lost to MAC team that was winless last year
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All-In [34487]
TigerPulse: 100%
56
Posts: 13513
Joined: 2019
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Wow, so knowledgeable!!!***
Sep 19, 2021, 2:32 PM
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I've never seen someone so condescending miss the point entirely.
Congrats. Showingyourass like this takes real guts.
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Ring of Honor [21305]
TigerPulse: 100%
53
Posts: 12307
Joined: 2002
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Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board
Sep 19, 2021, 3:02 PM
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Meh.
There's some stuff seriously not working at Clemson right now. Not saying the coaches involved are bad humans or even need to be out of coaching - though one of them definitely does - but I am saying they either might be in over their heads or rigidly keeping on with a system that has sort of become the college football standard and is thoroughly...known, at the moment.
The game of football always moves on, always evolves. And we're at the point where stuff has gotten really stale and Dabo needs to re-evaluate where the program is at, and maybe revise his approach and coaching roster the way Saban did.
Or we are going to fall off, bigly.
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Game Day Hero [4593]
TigerPulse: 100%
36
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Re: There is such a lack of football knowledge on this board
Sep 19, 2021, 4:36 PM
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If you think Alabama is struggling, I am not sure I trust your analysis.
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