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All-Conference [406]
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Why does it suprise so many people that Vic was a good hire
Jun 6, 2012, 4:38 PM
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for UNC? Lets look at his numbers since he got to Clemson...
Clemson had only finished ranked top-25 in all four major defensive categories in the same season once in its history. Thats Scoring D, Rushing D, Total D, and Passing Efficiency D. In his four years at Clemson, he accomplshed this feat every season. He finished at Clemson in 08 with the number 18 Total D and 13 Scoring D. He did that with an offense that left our D on the field as much as they could bc they loved to go 3 and out.
In 2008, Kansas St finished 118 in Total D, and 111 in Socring D. Vic went there in 09 and finished 39 in Total D (up 79 spots), and 45 in Scoring D (up 66 spots).
In 2009, Illinois finished 92 in Total D, and 96 in Scoring D. Vic went there in 2010 and finished 38 in Total D (up 54 spots), and 48 in Scoring D (up 48 spots). In his second year with Illinois, 2011, he finished 7 in Total D, and 15 in Scoring D.
I think its safe to say the man has a proven track record. He showed VAST improvements at two schools after he left Clemson. He really didnt have the benefit of any offense at those schools either. Ive always been impressed with him and I cant figure out why so many people hated on him while he was here. Losing games late came down to having an offense that was 3 and out all the time. Did the D ever get a rest in the 4th quarters?
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CU Guru [1813]
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People hated him because his defenses put up great stats but
Jun 6, 2012, 4:43 PM
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didn't pass the eye test. If I had a nickel for every time we had the opposing offense dead-to-rights in a 3rd and long situation and they would pull it out of their hat, I'd be a rich dude. Time and time again this happened. It was mind-bogglingly frustrating to watch. What made it worse was that we would crush mediocre teams and then struggle mightily with elite teams. Beating up on the patsies helped to pad the stats. Of course I have no data to back this up right now, but that's just what I recall from memory. No doubt, he is a solid D-coordinator, but I will forever remember his defenses giving up big time conversions.
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Orange Blooded [4341]
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Re: People hated him because his defenses put up great stats but
Jun 6, 2012, 4:49 PM
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Why does BC 07 keep popping into my head?
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All-Conference [406]
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It wouldnt pop into your head if we catch a ball at the goal
Jun 6, 2012, 4:53 PM
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line late in the game or dont fumble a snap in a goal line situation. To give up 20pts to Matt Ryan and that offense was pretty good. We were given some short fields in that game and BC went for it a couple times on 4th down in Clemson territory. But we held. The D gave Cullen and company every opportunity to win that game.
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110%er [7020]
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All-Conference [406]
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Bowdens biggest problem was his loyalty to Spence***
Jun 6, 2012, 4:58 PM
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All-Conference [406]
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I agree with some of that. I loved Vic, but the 3rd down
Jun 6, 2012, 4:51 PM
[ in reply to People hated him because his defenses put up great stats but ] |
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conversions made we wanna pull my hair out at times. But if you look at his numbers and exclude offensive scores and special teams scores, he only ever gave up more than 30pts 5 times in 4 years Im pretty sure. You cant really count the non-offensive scores by other teams bc he couldnt control that obviously. Dont hold me to that, but I think its only 5. #### in 07, he gave up more than 21pts just once and that was when we put the scrubs in against Louisiana Lafayette. VT scored 41pts, but had 21 from their D and Spec Teams. That D in 07 was the best we've had since Simmons and Kirkland roamed behind the DL.
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Rock Defender [52]
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Re: VK Was Solid - Expect UNC to Be a Surprise Team
Jun 6, 2012, 4:48 PM
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I agree.....I think VK was a solid D-coordinator while at Clemson. There were times when I would have liked to have been more aggressive but overall his defenses held up well. The biggest issue was that we did not fare well in turnover margin. On the other hand, his bend but don't break philosophy rarely gave up big plays. There is something to be said for making other teams work hard and have to drive the length of the field to score on you. Not sure his D would have given up 34 to the chickens or had 70 hung on us by WVU.
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CU Medallion [67948]
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Expect UNC to Be a Surprise Team- if they are
Jun 6, 2012, 5:17 PM
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the ncaa penalties weren't nearly severe enough
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110%er [7020]
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Re: Why does it suprise so many people that Vic was a good hire
Jun 6, 2012, 4:53 PM
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face it...he wasn't good enough for dablo
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Orange Blooded [3363]
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Re: Why does it suprise so many people that Vic was a good hire
Jun 6, 2012, 4:55 PM
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You do not openly talk junk about a man that is going to be your boss. What was it, like 5 minutes after getting the head job that Dabo fired Vic?
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All-Conference [406]
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The big problem between them was Dabo was trying to tell
Jun 6, 2012, 4:58 PM
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Vic what to change. Vic didnt like that. For Dabo to go hire Steele shows that he doesnt know much about D. So he shouldve butted out of Vics business. How do you tell a guy with the #1 D in the ACC that hes not doing it right?
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Orange Blooded [4341]
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Vic did not believe Dabo should be head coach. Wide receiver
Jun 6, 2012, 5:05 PM
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coach over a proven d-cord? How could that happen? Anyways, i know if some fast talking subordinate tried to tell me how to run my area of expertise, there would be some push back for sure.
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Hall of Famer [22403]
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All-Conference [406]
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I guess you hated good defense***
Jun 6, 2012, 5:12 PM
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Legend [19588]
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110%er [7020]
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Re: Nope. Dabo wanted an aggressive attacking blitzing style
Jun 6, 2012, 5:40 PM
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and here we are...year 4 of the dabo regime...
if steele was a pinto, what was napier?
man should have never been hired...squandered ford and spiller on the same roster
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Rock Defender [52]
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Re: Nope. Dabo wanted an aggressive attacking blitzing style
Jun 6, 2012, 5:36 PM
[ in reply to Nope. Dabo wanted an aggressive attacking blitzing style ] |
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Yeah and what he got was a guy that couldn't stop anybody for the most part. I honestly think we would have been better off to keep VK vs Steele. But I can see VK responding well to Dabo telling him that he needed to change his style. I will give Dabo this......he is great at reading the pulse of the fanbase and acting on it.....criticism of VK was not aggressive enough so Dabo says we'll be more aggressive. Don't even need to comment on everybody's favorite OC in Spence so popular move to fire him asap. I am not saying that Spence didn't need to go, but then you give the reins to an inexperienced Napier ? All I am saying is I think Dabo is a great politician and as such will always tell the fan base what they want to hear. Time will tell if he turns out to be a great coach or not.
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CU Guru [1878]
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Rock Defender [52]
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Re: The big problem between them was Dabo was trying to tell
Jun 6, 2012, 5:29 PM
[ in reply to The big problem between them was Dabo was trying to tell ] |
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Agree. Also, I think Vic was understandably upset that he was not considered for the HC position. Given Dabo's lack of experience, I can see why Vic felt like he was getting the short end of the stick. Not that Vic would have been the right hire but can see why he had trouble taking criticism from Dabo. Probably a clash of egos and both Vic and Dabo agreed it was in everyone's best interest to part ways.
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Hall of Famer [22403]
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Vic definitely got his feelings hurt. His attitude was
Jun 6, 2012, 5:35 PM
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horrible after Bowden was fired. You knew he wasn't going to be sticking around after the way he handled the situation.
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CU Guru [1736]
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Wrong
Jun 6, 2012, 10:03 PM
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If Vic hadn't kept at it and had the defense playing well in 2008, TDP would have never had the cover to be able to hire Dabo. The week after Dabo got the job permanently, Vic went into his office and asked Dabo if he would commit to his being the DC after the Gator Bowl. Dabo was noncommittal. Vic turned in his keys and resigned. He already had other opportunities, including the one he took with Kansas State. Like anyone else, he could not risk a guaranteed job for a hope.
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All-Conference [418]
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Re: Wrong
Jun 6, 2012, 10:34 PM
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You said it exactly as it happened. So maybe they didn't get along, that happens in any business. But don't spin it that he is some really bad person and his defense was bad. Let him move on and get other jobs. Ron is a true Clemson guy who loves Clemson yet thought enough of Vic to go work with him at Illinois. Let these guys go coach and be happy. This business is hard enough as it is. I thought it was wrong to not keep them as coaches ( Ron didn't want administration) since the defense was good and really helped get Dabo the job but now a few years later just move on and let them have succes elsewhere. And Blackwell too wherever he is. I think Venables will do well here. I am sure I will get lots of thumbs down on this one. Ha.
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Scout Team [171]
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All-Conference [418]
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Re: Why does it suprise so many people that Vic was a good hire
Jun 6, 2012, 5:35 PM
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Vic is happy. Leave him alone. And Ron is happy too as co coordinator at Arizona State. They are good coaches and did a good job at Illinois. As they did at Clemson. Be happy with Venables and let it go.
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All-Conference [418]
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Re: Why does it suprise so many people that Vic was a good hire
Jun 6, 2012, 9:22 PM
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Ha. You can thumbs down me all the way to zero if you want. I don't trash people or speak negatively about dabo or clemson on here. Just give my opinion when I think fairness should be brought up on something. Sorry that upsets you so.
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All-Conference [406]
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The worst is people who TD you and dont have to balls to
Jun 6, 2012, 11:07 PM
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reply back and go back and forth with you.
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All-Conference [418]
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Re: The worst is people who TD you and dont have to balls to
Jun 6, 2012, 11:27 PM
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It doesn't bother me. Ha. But I don't like hypocrites. Might have spelled that wrong. I am sure I have been one at times myself, however.
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All-Conference [418]
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Re: Why does it suprise so many people that Vic was a good hire
Jun 6, 2012, 5:42 PM
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Vic is happy. Leave him alone. And Ron is happy too as co coordinator at Arizona State. They are good coaches and did a good job at Illinois. As they did at Clemson. Be happy with Venables and let it go.
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