|
Shut it down and send them to class
|
Replies: 36
| visibility 4631
|
Game Changer [1900]
TigerPulse: 82%
31
|
Shut it down and send them to class
18
18
Dec 12, 2024, 8:31 PM
|
|
I've been reading about this NCAA/house settlement and it appears that this is heading towards a players union. I say the answer it to shut it all down for about 2 seasons. It would be drastic and as fans it would suck, but send these players to class. Let them see what being a real student is like. This is a case of spiloiled and catered to athletes that has gone off the rails. Send everyone home and stick your finger in the air. This is big boy business and it requires a bull in the room. I don't see one!!
|
|
|
|
 |
Clemson Conqueror [11445]
TigerPulse: 100%
46
|
Re: Shut it down and send them to class
2
Dec 12, 2024, 8:35 PM
|
|
Now back to the real world
|
|
|
|
|
|
Game Changer [1900]
TigerPulse: 82%
31
|
Re: Shut it down and send them to class
8
8
Dec 12, 2024, 8:50 PM
|
|
I know it's drastic, but it is the real world. How many local students get turned away every year, that have better academic success than these athletes? The answer is a lot! These athletes have been empowered to dangerous levels. They refuse to take compensation that is reasonable, free education, free food, free board, free medical, and access to world class training facilities. Send them to class and let them figure out how to pay for it. It won't happen, but tbis is going to end worse than a 2 year shutdown would ever be. Just watch. The money is going to dry up and it will be all over.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Clemson Conqueror [11445]
TigerPulse: 100%
46
|
Re: Shut it down and send them to class
2
Dec 12, 2024, 10:18 PM
|
|
The athletes help with enrollment and bring a lot of money into the schools. They aren't paying Dabo 11 million or whatever for nothing. He makes the school a lot of money.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Solid Orange [1319]
TigerPulse: 81%
28
|
Re: Shut it down and send them to class
2
Dec 13, 2024, 1:07 AM
|
|
I don't doubt football makes some programs money (though only a small number of them). And being elite in football does increase applications. However, while they could increase enrollment, that's not a good thing. The people who choose a school based on a football team are by and large not the students that help you as an academic institution. The elite students with high SATs/top of their class grades choose schools based on career prospects and academic prestige. It's the mediocre students who apply to schools because there's a guy who throws a football really well there.
There's a reason that all of our country's best schools exited the college football game (Ivies, MIT, Cal Tech, Chicago, NYU, etc.). Some have no football team. Others will not give athletic scholarships. Grant Jordan has been a very good QB for Yale this year. He's not getting a dime in NIL, nor would they give it to him. He's an actual student that just plays football on the side.
I agree with OP. I think we shouldn't be racing to the bottom along with the SEC, which, outside of Vandy and Florida, are laughing stocks academically. I'd much prefer they preserve the value of my degree than water it down in pursuit of athletics/having money to fund an already bloated administration. I wouldn't shut down football, but I would force the teams to break away from the school itself. Make them semi-pro players and just let them pay Clemson for the rights to use the paw/name. Why make players pretend to be students (because they aren't)?
|
|
|
|
|
|
Clemson Conqueror [11445]
TigerPulse: 100%
46
|
Re: Shut it down and send them to class
1
Dec 13, 2024, 6:53 AM
|
|
You're not turning Clemson into MIT. Losing football would crush the school. Never happening, and the original post, no matter how well meant, is completely ridiculous.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Game Changer [1866]
TigerPulse: 100%
31
|
Re: Shut it down and send them to class
1
Dec 13, 2024, 7:03 AM
[ in reply to Re: Shut it down and send them to class ] |
|
Nearly all of the players at Clemson are earning their degree, there is from proof of this.
Major CFB is big time business and a lot of money is involved, solely bc of the football program. Good for the kid at Yale, but fact is if he was good enough to play at Ohio St or Bama or Clemson, etc.. he'd go there and make a million bucks and likely get drafted in the NFL to make a whole lot more.
Some are blessed with more brains and others with more physical talents, both are good and fortunately college/life provides avenues for both.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rival Killer [2906]
TigerPulse: 72%
33
|
How many local students make millions of dollars for the schools
1
Dec 13, 2024, 7:14 AM
[ in reply to Re: Shut it down and send them to class ] |
|
fill the stands, and drive the local/regional economiea?
|
|
|
|
|
|
Athletic Dir [1142]
TigerPulse: 100%
26
|
Re: Shut it down and send them to class
3
Dec 12, 2024, 8:41 PM
|
|
We’ll said Jeffro!! Well said.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Commissioner [1271]
TigerPulse: 98%
27
|
Re: Shut it down and send them to class
3
Dec 12, 2024, 10:16 PM
|
|
I don’t understand why people are so upset at players wanting to be paid.
These players bring in millions every football season to the university, through the actual game of football and all it encompasses alone.
Successful football teams results in higher application #s, which also brings in more money to the university.
Not to mention the long term bodily harm they subject themselves to from playing the game.
If I knew I was directly making my job 10x the amount of money due to the work I was doing, it’s not asinine to approach the boss and ask for my fair share.
Anytime I see people complaining about players getting paid, it just screams “old guard” holding on to the last visages of CFB.
I will agree there needs to be a lot more regulation in how the system operates but also understand we’re in the VERY early stages of this entire process and it’s going to take time to get it regulated properly.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Solid Orange [1319]
TigerPulse: 81%
28
|
Re: Shut it down and send them to class
1
Dec 13, 2024, 1:14 AM
|
|
This isn't that complicated. I don't have an issue with players wanting to make money while they can. I've been very vocal that it's not a moral failing to choose a different school over Clemson because the other offered you more money. When you play football, you risk permanently injuring yourself. You likely will never make the NFL, meaning your body is breaking down and you're sustaining brain trauma for nothing. Might as well be paid.
But you're being extremely short-sighted. The issue isn't that they want to be paid. The issue is they want to be paid like NFL players, while still claiming to be students (which they aren't) and also gaining the benefits of amateurism. I am perfectly fine with a player joining a sort of farm system and getting paid. I have a problem with Clemson watering down its own academic reputation to become a moneymaking scheme/athletic powerhouse. There is a very strong inverse correlation between athletic prowess and academic prestige. It's going to get worse. You're literally harming your own child's degree.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Game Changer [1866]
TigerPulse: 100%
31
|
Re: you're being a bit dramatic***
Dec 13, 2024, 7:06 AM
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rival Killer [2906]
TigerPulse: 72%
33
|
|
|
|
|
|
Solid Orange [1319]
TigerPulse: 81%
28
|
Re: They are students. Stop.shillimg the canard that they aren't.******
Dec 13, 2024, 8:57 AM
|
|
They're not. They get in with dramatically weaker grades/test scores. They are shuttled to very specific majors/classes where the professors are going to pass them (think PRTM and "sports management"). Many do not attend classes at all. I know, I was in Spanish class with Tajh. He came to the first class and the last.
And look at the wonderlic to confirm what I'm saying. It's an extremely easy 50 question test. The average American get around a 22, and a college graduate is expected to get a 30. Functional literacy means you get at least a 13, because that's better than random chance. Here are some leaked scores from the NFL combine. https://wonderlictestpractice.com/nfl-wonderlic-scores/ Runningbacks almost always scored far, far below the average American. CJ himself got a 10, which is worse than randomly bubbling in answers.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Oculus Spirit [39665]
TigerPulse: 100%
57
Posts: 10876
Joined: 2015
|
Re: Shut it down and send them to class
Dec 13, 2024, 5:47 AM
[ in reply to Re: Shut it down and send them to class ] |
|
I do believe we are arguing 2 different points. Paid vs how they get paid. NIL deals=awesome… this other BS with teams poaching and buying players with no limits is unsustainable as far as competitiveness.
Not many are crying about being paid and if you do not understand the arguments being made scratch “folks crying” off your comeback list because it is not that.
|
|
|
|
|
|
CU Guru [1514]
TigerPulse: 93%
30
|
Re: Shut it down and send them to class
Dec 13, 2024, 9:15 AM
[ in reply to Re: Shut it down and send them to class ] |
|
Because it is an unwelcome change in paradigm. Its leading to people now saying highschool players should be paid...whats after that? Paying some PeeWee league or Pop Warner kids? Paying qualified parents to make children? Signing kids at birth because they have good genetic potential?
The out of wack problem is college sports have always been student recreation with actual students playing for their school. Now its morphed into a business that really has nothing to do with education other than some lipservice. It begs the question of why even have "College" football? Why have eligibility rules? Why not just hire anyone at all to play? Maybe Clemson could pick up Tom Brady next season. Even as an old man he'll out perform most college QB's. Why not have guys that get hired on when they are 18 years olds and never leave until they are 42 years old? After all they are just employees. It is a matter of time until someone sues over the predjucial barrier of academic qualifications when education has zero to do with how well you can play.
That's my problem with paying players in a nutshell. We are going all the way back to the days of having players on college teams that graduate and get a college degree when they cannot even read.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Legend [6650]
TigerPulse: 100%
41
|
Re: Shut it down and send them to class
2
Dec 12, 2024, 10:36 PM
|
|
Kind of ironic. I mean calling it a big boy business, but not wanting to pay the people doing the work.
|
|
|
|
|
|
National Champion [7294]
TigerPulse: 100%
42
|
Re: Shut it down and send them to class
1
5
5
Dec 12, 2024, 10:39 PM
|
|
It's the boomer mentality. Getting to the top and pulling the ladder up behind them.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Commissioner [1271]
TigerPulse: 98%
27
|
Re: Shut it down and send them to class
Dec 12, 2024, 10:50 PM
|
|
“Just pull yourself up by your boot straps.”
|
|
|
|
|
|
Ring of Honor [23156]
TigerPulse: 100%
53
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [2179]
TigerPulse: 100%
32
|
|
|
|
|
|
National Champion [7294]
TigerPulse: 100%
42
|
Re: Shut it down and send them to class
Dec 13, 2024, 9:20 AM
|
|
How many people in their 30s do you see in CEO or higher management positions? How many do you see in congress and the senate? not many.
Now how many 80 year olds do you see? a lot, and most of them are clearly senile and clinging on for dear life. Time to let go and let the new generation take over.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Clemson Icon [27691]
TigerPulse: 100%
54
|
There are bulls in the room.
4
Dec 12, 2024, 11:20 PM
|
|
And, they are pushing harder and harder to make academics and everything assocuated with it less and less important to the point it is irrelevant.
There is no one in any position of ower who is even daring to ask, "But what about their education?"
|
|
|
|
|
|
Clemson Icon [26748]
TigerPulse: 100%
54
Posts: 15009
Joined: 2011
|
BOOM....and there you have it. It's all about the money, so what
2
Dec 13, 2024, 5:38 AM
|
|
will result? A whole lot of young people with some money in their pockets for a short time only with poor educations at best.
Meanwhile, there are money-grubbers on the sidelines, lining their pockets off these kids, who could care less about those kids' futures unless they continue to make a lot of money.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Clemson Conqueror [11445]
TigerPulse: 100%
46
|
Re: BOOM....and there you have it. It's all about the money, so what
1
Dec 13, 2024, 6:57 AM
|
|
They are getting degrees at Clemson and maybe they are being educated. There are tons of students at universities around the nation that are wasting their time and money in college though Their degrees are almost worthless. Let's not get carried away with the value of a college education. It gets less and less for most.
|
|
|
|
|
|
National Champion [7294]
TigerPulse: 100%
42
|
Re: BOOM....and there you have it. It's all about the money, so what
1
Dec 13, 2024, 9:25 AM
|
|
I have two degrees, and I 100% agree with you. Its even getting hard for people with advanced STEM degrees to get a good paying job. Most of them end up taking a lesser paying job out of necessity, And these money hungry corporations know this. a lot of people used to talk down on blue collar workers, but in reality they are making more money, and doing a more meaningful job than most in this country. I work with a few engineers that I wouldn't trust to put together a lego set.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Tiger Spirit [9539]
TigerPulse: 70%
44
|
Re: There are bulls in the room.
Dec 13, 2024, 5:59 AM
[ in reply to There are bulls in the room. ] |
|
Dabo is.
(if you consider him to be in a position of power)
|
|
|
|
|
|
Game Changer [1654]
TigerPulse: 98%
31
|
I think we need to shut it down until these coachs salaries go down***
Dec 13, 2024, 5:54 AM
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
110%er [3717]
TigerPulse: 100%
35
|
Re: I think we need to shut it down until these coachs salaries go down***
Dec 13, 2024, 6:39 AM
|
|
Has something changed in how the portal players credits transfer that guarantees them eligibility at their new schools? Why did we hear about players being ineligible because of not enough credits for their class and players needing to go to summer school?
I don't know how it could be restored legally, but a transfer having to sit out a year would make a difference in how the portal is affecting College Football.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rival Killer [2906]
TigerPulse: 72%
33
|
Nope
1
1
Dec 13, 2024, 7:12 AM
|
|
Not gonna happen. Too much money involved.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Paw Warrior [4756]
TigerPulse: 100%
37
|
Re: Nope
Dec 13, 2024, 8:09 AM
|
|
Spot on ..
|
|
|
|
|
|
Game Changer [1640]
TigerPulse: 79%
31
|
Re: Shut it down and send them to class
1
Dec 13, 2024, 8:12 AM
|
|
No one cares about academics anymore and they shouldn’t. It’s all a bunch of uneducated liberal degrees anyways.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Ultimate Clemson Legend [98434]
TigerPulse: 100%
64
Posts: 97799
Joined: 2009
|
LOL, brother, politics will make you look stupid and it doesn't matter which...
1
Dec 13, 2024, 8:19 AM
|
|
side of the argument you're on. Every topic appears to be political to someone who is consumed by politics.
|
|
|
|
|
|
National Champion [7294]
TigerPulse: 100%
42
|
Re: Shut it down and send them to class
Dec 13, 2024, 9:30 AM
[ in reply to Re: Shut it down and send them to class ] |
|
I agree with half of what you're saying. Mainly that the value of a college education has gone down a lot, while the cost of one is steadily rising. But what a lot of people dont realize is that even advanced degrees are getting that way. Don't believe me, go to any job board and look at some of the salaries offered for jobs that require an advanced degree. Ive seen engineering jobs paying 40-50K per year! That was probably fine 10-15 years ago, but that seems like nothing now.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rival Killer [2906]
TigerPulse: 72%
33
|
Luddite, much?
1
Dec 13, 2024, 8:43 AM
|
|
Ever heard of online classes?
Why would anyone hate Clemson so much that you want to cost the school hundreds of millions of dollars and make us a laughingstock?
It's obvious that you want to do that, but no rational person would ever want to do so.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rival Killer [2906]
TigerPulse: 72%
33
|
The House case has nothing to do with unions.
1
Dec 13, 2024, 8:55 AM
|
|
It's about revenue sharing. Unions aren't required for that.
|
|
|
|
|
|
110%er [3897]
TigerPulse: 100%
35
|
Re: The House case has nothing to do with unions.
Dec 13, 2024, 9:27 AM
|
|
Actually it is begging to, House himself was part of a letter file to provide support for the option to form an association (union). It was filed just this week
From ESPN
"Although the letter lauds the terms of the settlement, House, Prince and Harrison warned that without player representation in negotiations with their schools and conferences, athletes would "inevitably remain in a vulnerable position" and the industry would remain mired in "continued litigation." They asked for the court to "lend its imprimatur" to athletes' efforts to collectively negotiate in the future through a players' association."
From Frontofficesports
"But the settlement could also be a way to halt the athletes’ rights movement from going any further. It provides restrictions, like a clearinghouse that could prohibit NIL deals with collectives or boosters are seen as “pay-for-play” and outside “fair-market value.” And the NCAA and conferences have said they intend to ask Congress to codify the settlement, as well as add a provision that athletes aren’t employees—and therefore can’t form a union or collectively bargain like their professional counterparts.
The players suggested Athletes.org, one of several groups attempting to organize college athletes, be used to form their association. More than 4,000 athletes have signed up to work with AO, which has chapters across the country and has begun helping athletes with NIL contracts and verifying agents, according to the letter.
It’s unclear how Judge Wilken could create a players’ organization on her own, besides requiring it as part of the terms of the settlement. It’s also unclear whether this organization could be considered a formal union, given that athletes aren’t currently classified as employees. That’s likely part of the reason the letter doesn’t call for a formal union, opting for the word “association” instead.
There are currently three cases—one in federal court and two at the National Labor Relations Board—attempting to classify athletes as employees. But clearly, players don’t want to wait for those decisions. “While the proposed settlement is a significant step forward, there still remains a critical need for structural changes to protect athletes and to prevent the failures of the past,” they wrote."
|
|
|
|
|
|
Replies: 36
| visibility 4631
|
|
|
|
50
