|
Replies: 86
| visibility 9605
|
Orange Blooded [3394]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 1104
Joined: 10/3/21
|
I applaud Dabo for
39
39
Jul 7, 2024, 9:05 AM
|
|
Handling NIL the way he does and for being the coach he is. Instead of giving in to the entitled, immediate gratification generation of young athletes, he’s doing it his way. The way he believes is the best for everyone involved. He could be running his program the same way Kirby smart is running Georgia and we could be putting up with all those type problems.
He’s being a great example to the young men that come to play for him about life and teaching them how to prepare for life after football.
I do get frustrated with the program from time to time because I don’t understand why the coaches are doing some things they are doing. But at the end of the day, I do believe Dabo is a good man, a good Christian, a good leader and a good coach.
Yall can hate on me for my opinion but I really don’t care
I hope everyone has a great Sunday!
|
|
|
|
 |
110%er [7748]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 9725
Joined: 7/11/03
|
I too respect it, agree with it, and hope that it can work in the long run.
5
5
Jul 7, 2024, 9:09 AM
|
|
I just think he is fighting an uphill battle and will simply walk away from it when he realizes that the “right” way is losing out to this greed driven generation. Doing things right often means you are different!
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [3275]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 3305
Joined: 9/10/04
|
Re: I too respect it, agree with it, and hope that it can work in the long run.
1
Jul 7, 2024, 9:30 AM
|
|
Maybe eventually he will move onto a G5 school where these recruiting bidding wars won’t play a factor. Players will still be attracted to his program for the same reasons as ten years ago. I just can’t see him moving onto the NFL because his mission has been about developing teenagers into young men. I don’t think the big paycheck matters to him. Of course he’d have to adjust to a coaching at a school with way less budget and resources.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Legend [18941]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 17578
Joined: 9/1/12
|
Re: I too respect it, agree with it, and hope that it can work in the long run.
Jul 7, 2024, 11:09 AM
|
|
Let me fix this for you:
“Maybe eventually he will move onto a G5 school where these recruiting bidding wars won’t play [ AS MUCH OF ] a factor. “
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-In [45729]
TigerPulse: 78%
Posts: 34249
Joined: 2/22/03
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rock Defender [69]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 53
Joined: 6/20/21
|
Re: So its greed driven for players to want to maximize their financial position?
Jul 7, 2024, 1:17 PM
|
|
YES, I certainly do, since by definition greed simply means a persons avid desire for gain or wealth. BUT, that doesn't mean it is bad on the players part. I think at some point almost all of us have been guilty of selfish desires and/or greed. I know I have. Therefore I hold no ill will towards these kids being greedy and making money while they have the opportunity to do so. I personally don't see it as being a wrong or right thing to do. It just depends on the individual and the way they see the future for themselves. Some over estimate themselves, while some under estimate themselves. It is just how life is, especially now for this generation of talented athletes. If NIL and all this other stuff were available to us when were coming out of high school, it would have been no different for us than it is for them now. Some of us would have went for the money, and some wouldn't have. It just depends on the individual desires and the character of the person. Nothing wrong with either decision though, because you won't know if you made a mistake about your decision for a year, two years, or longer down the road, just like everything else in life. As a former athlete from a financially poor environment, it would have been extremely difficult for me to turn away from the money if offered to me. Give these kids a break, you don't know what life is like for them. Some of them might just be greedy, but that doesn't mean they are wrong for it.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [2235]
TigerPulse: 98%
Posts: 2890
Joined: 1/2/20
|
Re: So its greed driven for players to want to maximize their financial position?
Jul 7, 2024, 2:40 PM
|
|
It is extremely rare for kids from poor environments to make it D1 nowadays. With all the elite camps and coaching the poorer kids have been priced out. Most of these kids come from money or upper middle class families. It’s just plain greed most of the time.
Clemson has a great NIL program. Dabo isn’t in the business of giving unproven 18 year olds huge sums of money. Giving kids deals out of highschool is just a dumb financial move. Wait and see if they produce and earn the money. See how much money Caleb Williams made? the team never won jack. Buying players out of highschool isn’t the recipe. Never will be. See Texas a&m.
|
|
|
|
|
|
110%er [5160]
TigerPulse: 92%
Posts: 6202
Joined: 10/9/08
|
Conceptually I agree, however practically our cupboard may get bare in the
2
Jul 8, 2024, 8:05 AM
|
|
Meantime waiting for everyone else to come to the same conclusion. Our current recruiting has fallen from 5 to 10 and maybe even headed to below 15 if we keep having critical targets committing elsewhere like they have been doing a lot as of late. And NIL $ was definitely a factor in a lot of those cases. I’m just concerned we are cutting our nose off to spite our face here trying to “do it the right way”.
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-American [564]
TigerPulse: 86%
Posts: 770
Joined: 6/5/15
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-TigerNet [11149]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 11512
Joined: 10/24/00
|
Dabo will do what's best for his players, that will never change
6
6
Jul 7, 2024, 9:25 AM
|
|
even if it means losing. That's the way he's always operated, and he's taken a lot of crap for it. I also think he will walk away from CFP as his next major move. CFB has little room left for coaches with integrity.
|
|
|
|
|
|
CU Medallion [70818]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 116579
Joined: 11/30/98
|
Re: Dabo will do what's best for his players, that will never change
1
Jul 7, 2024, 9:37 AM
|
|
I believe he tries to. Some guys want to play immediately or jump to the NFL before they are ready. He can't always convince them because when you are college age you think wou know everythign including what is best
|
|
|
|
|
|
110%er [5160]
TigerPulse: 92%
Posts: 6202
Joined: 10/9/08
|
The top talented players want to earn $$ day 1 in college-that is in their best
2
1
Jul 7, 2024, 9:46 AM
[ in reply to Dabo will do what's best for his players, that will never change ] |
|
Interest in their opinion. As a result, they are committing where they get paid handsomely immediately instead of hoping they can earn in the NFL later. If the $$ is compelling right now can you blame them? You would be insane not taking $1.5 million day 1 of your college career!
Dabo better get with the program on this ASAP or Clemson is going to continue to decline. Look, we use NIL $ to recruit in basketball and baseball as well as the portal. Why not in football? This a principled stand by Dabo. That is all that is holding us back. At some point, reality will set in for the boosters and those giving to NIL and once they realize we are choosing not to use it like the other teams are in recruiting and it is causing the program to decline, changes will be made. It is inevitable. So why not stem the bleeding and change the policy right now? Maddening to me… 🤷♂️🙄
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-TigerNet [11714]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 12122
Joined: 6/29/01
|
|
|
|
|
|
110%er [5160]
TigerPulse: 92%
Posts: 6202
Joined: 10/9/08
|
Better be happy with mediocrity on the football field then b/c we are losing the
1
2
Jul 7, 2024, 9:37 AM
|
|
Talent battle with his approach. If winning is not the objective, then keep doing what he is doing. That is the reality in the new world of big time college football. Our recruiting classes need to be near top 5-8. It appears this year we will fall even further behind on the recruiting front and drop out of the top 10. There is a reason the team that seriously contend in the playoffs for the natty are routinely in the top 5 of recruiting (e.g UGA, OSU, Bama, etc). TCU got there but got there you know what pushed in by UGA.
How long will Clemson boosters and fans tolerate being on the outside looking in year after year until Dabo finds himself on the hot seat? My guess is it could be a soon as the end of this season if it looks anything like the last 2-3 seasons. And by the looks of our talent gap at this point, it is very likely we lose 4 regular season games this year, maybe even 5. The downward trend is only going to be tolerated for so long.
I hope I’m wrong, but data and numbers don’t lie. Just sayin. You can stand on principle all day long and cut your nose off to spite your face but understand that approach will take you out of the upper echelon of college football. Hope everyone iscpacetic with that. For me personally, I am not. Fight fire with fire Dabo!
|
|
|
|
|
|
110%er [5962]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 2179
Joined: 11/9/11
|
Re: Better be happy with mediocrity on the football field then b/c we are losing the
3
Jul 7, 2024, 9:50 AM
|
|
Interesting note: Dabo’s championship teams were only top 15 in recruiting. Including the Lawrence team that was 18th by two services. They were reranked after their four years and landed top 3. Just saying.
|
|
|
|
|
|
110%er [5160]
TigerPulse: 92%
Posts: 6202
Joined: 10/9/08
|
Before NIL, you could secure exceptional talent with a top 15 class not anymore
Jul 7, 2024, 10:00 AM
|
|
We may even fall below 15 in this recruiting cycle. It ain’t over yet. Brace for impact!
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-American [564]
TigerPulse: 86%
Posts: 770
Joined: 6/5/15
|
Re: Better be happy with mediocrity on the football field then b/c we are losing the
Jul 7, 2024, 2:50 PM
[ in reply to Re: Better be happy with mediocrity on the football field then b/c we are losing the ] |
|
This is just absolute bull malarkey. 2012, 13, and 14 were 14 and 13th respectably but after that they were well in the top 5 in 15, 16, and 18. So no he hasn’t really made a living off winning with 15th ranked classes. Yes some were higher in the early teens but it’s a fact that talent is more spread out now than it was then. Nil and the transfer portal has changed those ranking needs. I just don’t see top15 classes doing it now with the way talent can and will move around.
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-American [564]
TigerPulse: 86%
Posts: 770
Joined: 6/5/15
|
Re: Better be happy with mediocrity on the football field then b/c we are losing the
Jul 7, 2024, 2:50 PM
|
|
Well in the top 10 I’m sorry changed my though and didn’t edit.
|
|
|
|
|
|
110%er [5160]
TigerPulse: 92%
Posts: 6202
Joined: 10/9/08
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-TigerNet [11714]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 12122
Joined: 6/29/01
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-Pro [686]
TigerPulse: 79%
Posts: 1030
Joined: 12/1/02
|
Re: Better be happy with mediocrity on the football field then b/c we are losing the
Jul 7, 2024, 11:47 AM
[ in reply to Better be happy with mediocrity on the football field then b/c we are losing the ] |
|
Clemson doesn't have the money to compete in football, baseball, etc. as long as we are in ACC. It takes a lot less dollars in basketball. But, if you don't like it then give money to Clemson designated to NIL and live by your principles.
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-American [564]
TigerPulse: 86%
Posts: 770
Joined: 6/5/15
|
Re: Better be happy with mediocrity on the football field then b/c we are losing the
Jul 7, 2024, 2:43 PM
|
|
I would but it’s hard for me to donate when I know the head coach refuses to use it the way intended.
|
|
|
|
|
|
110%er [5160]
TigerPulse: 92%
Posts: 6202
Joined: 10/9/08
|
I agree why give $$ if they dont use it to compete for players***
Jul 8, 2024, 8:10 AM
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Starter [355]
TigerPulse: 97%
Posts: 455
Joined: 12/14/08
|
Re: Better be happy with mediocrity on the football field then b/c we are losing the
1
Jul 7, 2024, 1:06 PM
[ in reply to Better be happy with mediocrity on the football field then b/c we are losing the ] |
|
Fight fire with fire you say?...
UGA, TX, A&M, USC (the real one), Al. etc come to the NIL bidding war with "Big $$ NIL guns."...all we currently have is "Little NIL knives."
Clemson does not have the alumni base dollars, the big heavy donors or marketing partners to currently outbid them.
If Dabo goes "All in" on the NIL and Port-O-Let, would that not just give the players another bargaining chip to drive up the price for their services to other schools. And Clemson may still not get the player. And do you want someone who is a mercenary who has no loyalty and just as soon transfer when someone with a bigger "BAG" comes to call?...ahh...there goes those unintended consequences thing again..
Ps: Had these thoughts while deciding to either take a nap or go out to cut the grass in 94 degree, 104 degree heat index.
|
|
|
|
|
|
110%er [5160]
TigerPulse: 92%
Posts: 6202
Joined: 10/9/08
|
But use what you have at the tip of the spear otherwise why donate?***
Jul 7, 2024, 10:59 PM
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-Conference [445]
TigerPulse: 95%
Posts: 368
Joined: 9/1/23
|
Re: I applaud Dabo for
3
Jul 7, 2024, 9:40 AM
|
|
The issue has nothing to do with Dabo's integrity and faith (though certainly top notch). It has to do with all the Clemson cry babies upset we aren't playing the portal more to get that prized player from Gardner Webb or whatever the latest money chaser is.
|
|
|
|
|
|
110%er [5160]
TigerPulse: 92%
Posts: 6202
Joined: 10/9/08
|
Dabo has openly stated he wont use NIL $ to recruit HS players this
Jul 7, 2024, 9:49 AM
|
|
Is beyond the portal. We are now double handcuffed in recruiting! Given this approach he better upgrade his position coaches big time on the O side of the ball b/c they are gonna need to develop a lot of 3* players from here on out just to have any chance at staying relevant!
|
|
|
|
|
|
110%er [5962]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 2179
Joined: 11/9/11
|
Re: Dabo has openly stated he wont use NIL $ to recruit HS players this
Jul 7, 2024, 9:52 AM
|
|
Dabo can’t use NIL dollars or dole them out. It’s against the rules and always has been. He couldn’t even facilitate and can’t h til august when new rules take effect. NIL can be utilized by any player and could never be restricted by any school. It’s an opportunity for the player to sign deals to rent his name image and likeness. The rules are simple. Read them.
The National Collegiate Athletic Association (NCAA) adopted several new Name, Image, and Likeness (NIL) rules in 2024 that will take effect on August 1, 2024:
Disclosure and transparency
Student-athletes must disclose NIL deals worth $600 or more within 30 days of entering the agreement. The NCAA also adopted a rule to promote the sharing and centralization of information about NIL deals, such as contract terms and service providers.
Institutional assistance
Schools can help student-athletes pursue NIL opportunities by identifying them and facilitating deals with third parties. However, student-athletes are not required to accept this assistance and must retain control over the terms of their NIL agreements. Schools can also increase NIL-related support for student-athletes who disclose their arrangements.
Athlete rights
The rules allow athletes to pursue NIL opportunities without restrictions from the NCAA, conferences, or universities. The NCAA also agreed to a court settlement in May 2024 that, if approved, will further expand athletes' rights to monetize their NIL, including ending the prohibition against colleges directly compensating their athletes.
|
|
|
|
|
|
110%er [5160]
TigerPulse: 92%
Posts: 6202
Joined: 10/9/08
|
Wrong all that has changed why do you think others are openly
Jul 7, 2024, 9:56 AM
|
|
Doing it?
Also, if you are the only power football program not doing it and everyone else is with zero consequence with any enforcement, then the rules really matter do they? Cutting your nose off to spite your face just leaves you without a nose. Principles in this situation an .75 cents will get you a cup of coffee… maybe. 🙄
|
|
|
|
|
|
Legend [17411]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 13279
Joined: 11/14/09
|
You are misquoting Dabo, which is typical of the panic (and troll) crowd.
3
Jul 7, 2024, 10:45 AM
[ in reply to Dabo has openly stated he wont use NIL $ to recruit HS players this ] |
|
He has stated that we don't 'lead' with NIL in recruiting HS players. If that is first and foremost from a recruit (or his parents) we are not a good fit. He has never stated that there are no NIL opportunities for incoming recruits. He has made it clear that those opportunities increase the more you contribute to the program, and that our emphasis with our resource pool is on that. He clearly puts a focus on keeping the players we've developed in the program as he feels they offer us the best opportunity for success on the field.
We can't match the size and spend of many of the big schools and their bases - ever, as it's constructed today. It's classic Art of War at work - you don't go to battle straight up with a superior force, which is what a bidding war represents for us. We have to be more creative and sell intangibles that others cannot offer. Dabo has been doing that since the beginning. We weren't snagging the top classes during our historic CFP run. We were, however, through his highly selective recruiting process (the most select in the business), bringing in winning athletes with mindsets that fit our program and culture where the whole was clearly better than the sum of its parts.
|
|
|
|
|
|
110%er [5962]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 2179
Joined: 11/9/11
|
Re: I applaud Dabo for
2
Jul 7, 2024, 9:46 AM
|
|
He kinda can’t do it his way anymore. They removed limitations. Dabo really didn’t have much control over it anyway. Before this season, a coach couldn’t coordinate NIL deals. They could make recommendations to say 110 society. But, NIL deals are exclusively between collectives and kids. It’s our endorsements. Coach Swinney couldn’t promise kids deals. He still kinda can’t. I recommend reading the NIL rules. I can pay a player for using his name image likeness and Dabo couldn’t stop it. The NCAA only mandates that the player report it to the school. When reports say Texas lineman making $100k a year; the school didn’t have anything to do with it. That was Texas oil money buying the best player available. Again, the school couldn’t pay players NIL money or facilitate NIL deals.
It’s the Wild West when it come to NIL deals. Dabo doesn’t have the control he’s led us to believe. I will provide some links for you.
https://www.ncsasports.org/name-image-likeness#:~:text=in%20college%20sports.-,What%20does%20NIL%20mean%3F,while%20participating%20in%20college%20sports.
https://georgetownlawtechreview.org/nil-and-data-transparency-implications-for-student-athletes/GLTR-05-2024/
The National Collegiate Athletic Association (NCAA) adopted several new Name, Image, and Likeness (NIL) rules in 2024 that will take effect on August 1, 2024:
Disclosure and transparency
Student-athletes must disclose NIL deals worth $600 or more within 30 days of entering the agreement. The NCAA also adopted a rule to promote the sharing and centralization of information about NIL deals, such as contract terms and service providers.
Institutional assistance
Schools can help student-athletes pursue NIL opportunities by identifying them and facilitating deals with third parties. However, student-athletes are not required to accept this assistance and must retain control over the terms of their NIL agreements. Schools can also increase NIL-related support for student-athletes who disclose their arrangements.
Athlete rights
The rules allow athletes to pursue NIL opportunities without restrictions from the NCAA, conferences, or universities. The NCAA also agreed to a court settlement in May 2024 that, if approved, will further expand athletes' rights to monetize their NIL, including ending the prohibition against colleges directly compensating their athletes.
|
|
|
|
|
|
110%er [5160]
TigerPulse: 92%
Posts: 6202
Joined: 10/9/08
|
^^^ GOOD POINTS ^^^ and
1
Jul 7, 2024, 9:52 AM
|
|
Coaches can now direct where NIL $ needs to be spent and it can be used to entice and recruit high school players, not just portal players. Clemson football has to get up to the times or be swept into the dust bin of history!
|
|
|
|
|
|
110%er [5962]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 2179
Joined: 11/9/11
|
Re: ^^^ GOOD POINTS ^^^ and
Jul 7, 2024, 9:57 AM
|
|
No. They cannot. They can make recommendations starting in august. They can facilitate to a certain degree. The deals are between players and collectives. They are between players and corporations. The school cannot hold or pay NIL dollars. It’s pure contract law and endorsement contracts. 110 society is just a pool of Clemson booster donations. Dabo has no control or power over it.
|
|
|
|
|
|
110%er [5160]
TigerPulse: 92%
Posts: 6202
Joined: 10/9/08
|
Recommendations is such a gray area and you know that even today, coaches
Jul 7, 2024, 10:03 AM
|
|
Are directing where to use NIL $. Why would an NIL group fund a player the coach doesn’t prioritize as much as say some other recruit? That would be a poor use of the NIL $.
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-In [45729]
TigerPulse: 78%
Posts: 34249
Joined: 2/22/03
|
Then why has Dabo said that he wont lead with NIL?
4
Jul 7, 2024, 10:51 AM
[ in reply to Re: ^^^ GOOD POINTS ^^^ and ] |
|
Why has he said that he will use it to retain players?
If he has no say in it, why would he make comments like these?
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [4093]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 3570
Joined: 8/19/03
|
A better question is why do you claim to be a Clemson fan?
Jul 7, 2024, 3:05 PM
|
|
When you clearly hate on Dabo every chance you get. (Along with women’s softball, baseball, etc etc.)
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-TigerNet [10144]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 6142
Joined: 9/7/09
|
Post hoc ergo propter hoc
1
Jul 7, 2024, 9:52 AM
|
|
You seem to think Jawja has legal problems with their players simply because the have NIL deals; that's just not true. There are plenty of good respectful top flight players out there who know what they're worth economically. In my book a kid who does all the right things AND knows how to maximize his well being by getting what's available to him was raised right. The kids aren't the problem; as they say don't hate the player hate the game.
|
|
|
|
|
|
110%er [5160]
TigerPulse: 92%
Posts: 6202
Joined: 10/9/08
|
^^^ EXACTLY ^^^***
Jul 7, 2024, 9:57 AM
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
110%er [5962]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 2179
Joined: 11/9/11
|
Re: Post hoc ergo propter hoc
Jul 7, 2024, 10:00 AM
[ in reply to Post hoc ergo propter hoc ] |
|
I agree with your concept. However, Georgia isn’t paying players NIL dollars. No one is except corporations and collectives. Schools can’t legally offer $5 million dollars to a player in NIL deals. Georgia collectives can. Corporations can.
Starting in August schools will be able to help line some of those deals up. As of right now no school can legally promise NIL deals to anyone.
|
|
|
|
|
|
110%er [5160]
TigerPulse: 92%
Posts: 6202
Joined: 10/9/08
|
The coaches are indirectly letting the NIL collectives know who to prioritize..
Jul 7, 2024, 10:05 AM
|
|
And essentially puts them on the job to get it done. Ever major program is doing it, just not us. Dabo has tied our hands behind our back.
|
|
|
|
|
|
110%er [5261]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 1258
Joined: 5/5/19
|
Not the point
1
Jul 7, 2024, 10:07 AM
[ in reply to Post hoc ergo propter hoc ] |
|
But glad you admit that Jawja has a discipline problem (inferred with your first statement that it is not caused by NIL).
The point is that if the NIL money is enticing people to go to a school like Jawga with proven discipline problems with players, then they are not "stand up" kind of guys! Everyone knows Dabo runs a "clean" program, which would put us higher on the moral scale than most other programs. So, if child has to choose between us and a team like Jawga, and lets higher pay from them decide their future, they are not the moral character we prefer...
There is no way to downplay the decision process..."I know Clemson is better for me for my life, but Jawga will pay me more now"...
|
|
|
|
|
|
110%er [5160]
TigerPulse: 92%
Posts: 6202
Joined: 10/9/08
|
A bird in hand is better than 2 in bush you cant eat off moral superiority***
Jul 7, 2024, 10:10 AM
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
110%er [5261]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 1258
Joined: 5/5/19
|
Re: A bird in hand is better than 2 in bush you cant eat off moral superiority***
1
Jul 7, 2024, 10:17 AM
|
|
Does not apply to NIL money....the bird is not in the hand when the bribe is paid. You have two choices, a good program like Clemson and a team like Jawga...and you let the money of Jawga make your decision for you. If you are good, you will get NIL money at Clemson...it is just not promised before you sign!
|
|
|
|
|
|
110%er [5160]
TigerPulse: 92%
Posts: 6202
Joined: 10/9/08
|
Then continue to see a plethora of decommits simple as that***
Jul 7, 2024, 11:32 AM
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [3394]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 1104
Joined: 10/3/21
|
Re: Not the point
1
Jul 7, 2024, 10:12 AM
[ in reply to Not the point ] |
|
Yes, exactly
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-TigerNet [10144]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 6142
Joined: 9/7/09
|
And you missed the point of my point
1
Jul 7, 2024, 1:35 PM
[ in reply to Not the point ] |
|
The OP implied, upon which I inferred, that he believes Jawja has discipline problems BECAUSE of NIL; this is absolutely false. The butt sniffers have had multiple players arrested every year for decades before NIL; even when they had a good Christian man like Mark Richt as their coach. The argument that NIL has something to do wit it is a logical fallacy.
To your point; not every player we lose in recruiting is to Jawja, we’ve lost them to many other schools. Every other program in the country uses NIL as a recruitment enticement, and many of them also have tremendous personal development programs for student athletes. Tennessee has their vol for life program 0310 state has a program that brings in a different Fortune 500 CEO in each week to work with players; there are no shortage of schools that care about developing great men. Dabo and Jeff Davis do a tremendous job with PAW journey and as an alum it makes me proud to see; but it ain’t the only game in town. Dabo isn’t the only good Christian man in college coaching either. Mack Brown, PJ. Fleck, Brent Venables are all great men. Many of you believe the only righteous choice is to come to Clemson without NIL and if you choose a place that offers NIL you’re picking the gutter. That’s illustrative of your bias not reality. It’s entirely reasonable for a good kid to be on the fence between Clemson and 2 other schools for all of the “right reasons” and then let compensation be part of the decision calculus.
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-TigerNet [13466]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 5420
Joined: 10/31/03
|
Re: I applaud Dabo for
1
Jul 7, 2024, 9:58 AM
|
|
I think Dabo is a fine man as well. However, I sometimes look at his own contract which says...Dabo, we are going to pay you more and more and more to KEEP YOU AT CLEMSON...because this is the market and we don't want to lose you. Dabo agrees and takes the money.
So now there is a new method for getting/retaining players. But Dabo wants "loyalty". The same loyalty would apply to Dabo when he was earning $2,000,000, but he chose to renegotiate to earn more.
There is a disconnect here.
|
|
|
|
|
|
110%er [5160]
TigerPulse: 92%
Posts: 6202
Joined: 10/9/08
|
Dabo to players: what is good for me is not for thee!***
Jul 7, 2024, 10:07 AM
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
110%er [5261]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 1258
Joined: 5/5/19
|
Re: I applaud Dabo for
2
Jul 7, 2024, 10:14 AM
[ in reply to Re: I applaud Dabo for ] |
|
But Dabo has not openly said to every other school that he is on the market, so this is not a valid comparison. Dabo renegotiating and a player playing the field are not related. Sure, there is a thought that Dabo would leave if not compensated, but that is the admins thoughts. Did the admins initiate talks for pay increases during Dabo's down years? Did Dabo market his coaching abilities to other teams after good years? That is what the portal is doing.
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-American [564]
TigerPulse: 86%
Posts: 770
Joined: 6/5/15
|
Re: I applaud Dabo for
1
Jul 7, 2024, 10:15 AM
|
|
That all sounds well and good until you realize the players are the ones that win the game. You need them. Just don’t see this working out and the cost is the destruction of our program.
|
|
|
|
|
|
110%er [5261]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 1258
Joined: 5/5/19
|
Re: I applaud Dabo for
Jul 7, 2024, 10:20 AM
|
|
And we just had a recruit say that he likes that Clemson does not use the portal....but nobody ever mentions that aspect of what Dabo is doing!
|
|
|
|
|
|
110%er [5160]
TigerPulse: 92%
Posts: 6202
Joined: 10/9/08
|
And they commit elsewhere for NIL $ payout***
1
Jul 7, 2024, 10:33 AM
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-TigerNet [10677]
TigerPulse: 85%
Posts: 14224
Joined: 11/9/04
|
"doing the things they are doing"....?.....
1
1
Jul 7, 2024, 10:28 AM
|
|
Quit the holier than thou crap. Most coaches are just playing by the new rules........you can hate the "new rules" all you want, but to act like Dabo is God and the rest of the coaching world are devils is ridiculous.
Tommy was also a good man, and a good Christian, but he got fired for being "Mr. 8-4".............if you think Dabo can be a "good man" and have repeat 2021-2023 seasons over and over and over again w/o repercussions then you don't understand "the business". Dabo has bought time for where he's taken the program from 2011-2019, but even the Bobby Bowdens of the world run their course.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [3555]
TigerPulse: 63%
Posts: 3961
Joined: 11/24/17
|
Re: I applaud Dabo for
2
Jul 7, 2024, 10:30 AM
|
|
The way Kirby Smart is running Georgia? You mean fielding teams consistently competitive for national championships? Developing players and putting them in the league at a record levels? Yeah, why would a D1 player want any part of that.
I'll stand by for the obligatory "Kirby is cheating" reply.
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-TigerNet [10677]
TigerPulse: 85%
Posts: 14224
Joined: 11/9/04
|
that's the ridiculous mindset of most on here......
1
1
Jul 7, 2024, 10:32 AM
|
|
if you're not DABO, you're the devil.
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-In [45729]
TigerPulse: 78%
Posts: 34249
Joined: 2/22/03
|
Yes, they have created this weird narrative that Dabo is good and pure
3
Jul 7, 2024, 10:57 AM
|
|
while everyone else is evil and cheating.
They use this for justification purposes too. When we don’t get a recruit or don’t win, Dabo “doing things the right way” is a universal salve to rationalize losing.
|
|
|
|
|
|
110%er [5160]
TigerPulse: 92%
Posts: 6202
Joined: 10/9/08
|
Sounds like the Democrats who rationalize bad acts***
Jul 7, 2024, 11:03 AM
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [4093]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 3570
Joined: 8/19/03
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [3394]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 1104
Joined: 10/3/21
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-In [37952]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 21837
Joined: 10/27/03
|
If You Don't Like What You Hear on This Bored, You Can Go Back to Dawgpedos.com
Jul 7, 2024, 2:21 PM
[ in reply to Re: I applaud Dabo for ] |
|
or whatever other panders to Kirby and his systematic killing of athletes.
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-In [45729]
TigerPulse: 78%
Posts: 34249
Joined: 2/22/03
|
I respect it too.
3
Jul 7, 2024, 10:39 AM
|
|
Unfortunately, it doesn’t seem to be congruent with being an elite football program in this current era of college football.
If we want to return to being among the best college football programs, Dabo needs to adapt and change, or we need to find a new coach.
If we decide we aren’t willing to change, and are thus accepting that we won’t be a top tier program again, then we should reduce Dabo’s salary and football expenses accordingly.
|
|
|
|
|
|
110%er [5160]
TigerPulse: 92%
Posts: 6202
Joined: 10/9/08
|
I cannot agree more!***
1
Jul 7, 2024, 11:03 AM
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-Conference [445]
TigerPulse: 95%
Posts: 368
Joined: 9/1/23
|
Re: I respect it too.
Jul 7, 2024, 11:14 AM
[ in reply to I respect it too. ] |
|
Yes. We need an anonymous internet poster to tell us how Dabo should be doing things instead of a real person like Dabo who has won actual nattys.
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-American [564]
TigerPulse: 86%
Posts: 770
Joined: 6/5/15
|
Re: I respect it too.
1
Jul 7, 2024, 11:47 AM
|
|
This is a dumb point when literally every other coach in college football doesn’t agree with the moral high ground dabo is trying to take.
This is what it boils down to. Dabo built a program pre nil based on family and it worked. It worked very well. However it’s hard to stand on all the principles he build on when you throw nil and transfers into it.
With that said I don’t think that rd is going to work when a guy gets 100,000 reason why they stuff doesn’t matter. If I’m them or if it were my son, I don’t know what the future holds. I might not pan out in college so I’m going to take while the iron is hot. It’s buisness.
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-Conference [445]
TigerPulse: 95%
Posts: 368
Joined: 9/1/23
|
Re: I respect it too.
Jul 7, 2024, 11:16 AM
[ in reply to I respect it too. ] |
|
If someone thinks we are going to reduce Dabo's salary and expenses, that person does not live in reality. I mean thats just nuts.
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-American [564]
TigerPulse: 86%
Posts: 770
Joined: 6/5/15
|
Re: I respect it too.
1
Jul 7, 2024, 11:43 AM
|
|
And again you totally missed the point. He never started be thought that would happen. The point is dabo is payed at a high level to keep this program at a high level. So far in the last 3-4 it’s declining and anyone that isn’t totally blind can see it.
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-Pro [686]
TigerPulse: 79%
Posts: 1030
Joined: 12/1/02
|
Re: I respect it too.
Jul 7, 2024, 12:58 PM
|
|
According to your logic any team that didn't win the Natty or compete in many CFP's in the last 8 years is declining. Poor old Georgia, Michigan, Ohio State, Oklahoma are declining.
Not everyone can be Alabama or Clemson...
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-American [564]
TigerPulse: 86%
Posts: 770
Joined: 6/5/15
|
Re: I respect it too.
1
Jul 7, 2024, 1:36 PM
|
|
Dude this team is no where near where it was 14-18 and you know it. If you don’t think so you are seriously lying to yourself.
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-In [45729]
TigerPulse: 78%
Posts: 34249
Joined: 2/22/03
|
We are declining. It started in 2019.
3
Jul 7, 2024, 1:44 PM
[ in reply to Re: I respect it too. ] |
|
2018: 15-0, national champions
2019: 14-1, blown out in national championship game by LSU
2020: 10-2, blown out in playoff semifinals by Ohio State
2021: 10-3, missed playoffs, won lower tier bowl game.
2022: 11-3, missed playoffs, blown out by Tennessee in major bowl game.
2023: 9-4, missed playoffs, won lower tier bowl game.
This is five years in a row of decline. It’s concerning.
Those other schools you mentioned have not declined like we have.
|
|
|
|
|
|
110%er [5160]
TigerPulse: 92%
Posts: 6202
Joined: 10/9/08
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-American [564]
TigerPulse: 86%
Posts: 770
Joined: 6/5/15
|
Re: I respect it too.
1
Jul 7, 2024, 11:40 AM
[ in reply to I respect it too. ] |
|
Yes I agree with this as well. Can’t have your cake and eat it to.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [2184]
TigerPulse: 97%
Posts: 2960
Joined: 2/10/02
|
You have a strange concept of "top tier", i.e., football vs basketball***
Jul 8, 2024, 4:18 PM
[ in reply to I respect it too. ] |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
CU Guru [1443]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 1240
Joined: 2/3/19
|
Re: I applaud Dabo for
Jul 7, 2024, 11:01 AM
|
|
Amen !
|
|
|
|
|
|
Athletic Dir [860]
TigerPulse: 99%
Posts: 428
Joined: 12/9/16
|
Re: I applaud Dabo for
Jul 7, 2024, 11:24 AM
|
|
Didn’t you see Brownlee got to the elite 8 and lost using luck and the portal. He’s the example of how to win in college sports now. It took him 14 years to get to the elite 8. How long did it take Dabo to get to a title game? It was 2009 right? ACC championship? How many times has Brownlee done that?
You gotta have all the 5 stars and all the portals to be good. Name a 5 star who came and was a superstar outside Trevor Lawrence.
JK and several others on here like to throw stones from glass houses with straw stilts for a foundation.
Message was edited by: TigerChrisL®
|
|
|
|
|
|
110%er [5261]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 1258
Joined: 5/5/19
|
5 stars?
Jul 7, 2024, 11:43 AM
|
|
There are many 5 stars that did well at Clemson under Dabo....But more importantly are the three, four and even no stars that have done extremely well under Dabo, that would never have been able to go to Jawga or other schools because of what they do with 5 star guys! Of course, Renfrow comes to mind, but what about people like Deshawn Williams, Grady Jarrett, Adam Humphries, BJ Goodson...and those were just four from the 2011 class! There were also two 5 stars in that class that did great...Sammy Watkins and Stephone Anthony!
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [3555]
TigerPulse: 63%
Posts: 3961
Joined: 11/24/17
|
Re: 5 stars?
1
Jul 7, 2024, 12:52 PM
|
|
Three stars can't do well at Georgia? Stetson Bennett, Deandre Baker, Ladd McConkey, Eric Stokes, Devante Wyatt, Monty Rice, Jake Camarda, and Javon Bullard. All drafted.
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-In [45729]
TigerPulse: 78%
Posts: 34249
Joined: 2/22/03
|
You keep talking about Dabos success in the 2010s.
3
Jul 7, 2024, 12:15 PM
[ in reply to Re: I applaud Dabo for ] |
|
That’s ancient history at this point.
How successful has Dabo been since the transfer portal rules changed to allow for players to transfer without sitting out a year? How successful has he been since NIL became a thing?
Not nearly as successful as he was previously, and not nearly successful enough to justify his current salary and our investment in the program.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Athletic Dir [860]
TigerPulse: 99%
Posts: 428
Joined: 12/9/16
|
Re: You keep talking about Dabos success in the 2010s.
2
Jul 7, 2024, 12:24 PM
|
|
He just won the ACC year before last. I guess by your idiotic theory we should have canceled the basketball program in year three or four under brownlee. Last National championship was just 6 years ago last appearance was 5 last final 4 was 4 years ago. Why does Clemson have a basketball team if we go by your delusions. Brownlee has never done anything his program is and has been funded by football which is the only program that brings in money.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Legend [17411]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 13279
Joined: 11/14/09
|
And like hoops this season we were one win away from the Final 4
Jul 7, 2024, 1:17 PM
|
|
all the way back in 2022 - season before last.
Shameless trolls gonna shameless troll.
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-In [45729]
TigerPulse: 78%
Posts: 34249
Joined: 2/22/03
|
Winning the ACC doesnt justify being the second highest paid coach in football.
3
Jul 7, 2024, 1:54 PM
[ in reply to Re: You keep talking about Dabos success in the 2010s. ] |
|
We lost 3 games that year, including being blown out by Tennessee in the bowl game.
The ACC was arguably the weakest power 5 conference that year. ACC teams were 7-14 against power 5 teams that year.
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-In [37952]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 21837
Joined: 10/27/03
|
COOT 100%***
2
Jul 7, 2024, 2:23 PM
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Legend [15226]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 9639
Joined: 8/30/18
|
Re: You keep talking about Dabos success in the 2010s.
Jul 7, 2024, 2:29 PM
[ in reply to You keep talking about Dabos success in the 2010s. ] |
|
Even with the last 3 years being less than we like the program still brings in a great ROI no matter what he is paid. There is nothing else that comes close.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Legend [15226]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 9639
Joined: 8/30/18
|
Re: I applaud Dabo for
1
Jul 7, 2024, 2:25 PM
|
|
If he can’t replicate his previous success doing it his way in a changing landscape, he will have some challenging decisions to make. Grow or get left behind is the world we live in.
|
|
|
|
|
|
110%er [5160]
TigerPulse: 92%
Posts: 6202
Joined: 10/9/08
|
Yep reality***
1
Jul 8, 2024, 8:13 AM
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [3639]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 1787
Joined: 4/20/04
|
Re: I applaud Dabo for
1
Jul 7, 2024, 2:54 PM
|
|
AMEN! Dabo is the man!!
|
|
|
|
|
|
Legend [18707]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 14607
Joined: 10/24/10
|
All right Barojohn
Jul 7, 2024, 4:47 PM
|
|
But remember few make more than Coach Swinney and the Tiger coaching staff largely hired after the glory years. And this season, we hope to see the Tigers beat the Duke-level programs. Go Tigers!
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [3394]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 1104
Joined: 10/3/21
|
Re: I applaud Dabo for***
Jul 8, 2024, 3:51 PM
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Replies: 86
| visibility 9605
|
|
|
50
