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Oculus Spirit [94945]
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Watched a couple OU games over the weekend.
Dec 14, 2015, 1:23 PM
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The PORankings are wrong but they got the seeding right. OU is the weakest link. I'd rank them in the mid to lower teens.
Clemson 54 OU 16-W/ a td and FG coming during slop time.
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Rock Defender [59]
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You're nuts. No way we hold them to 16 points.
Dec 14, 2015, 1:25 PM
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nm
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Orange Blooded [3820]
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Why not?? Still waiting on the d bags to score a TD
Dec 14, 2015, 1:31 PM
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against us... I mean come on.
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Oculus Spirit [94945]
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BM, may I call him that?
Dec 14, 2015, 1:50 PM
[ in reply to You're nuts. No way we hold them to 16 points. ] |
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BM is pretty good at throwing outside the pocket, that's because his line can't form a pocket. He's always on the run. He always throws to the side of the field he's on and usually rolls to the strong side. He puts way too much air under the ball on anything thrown 25+ yards. That's a problem when the defense has a good secondary. Bowling Ball hasn't changed and their running game only works after they've established their mid range passing game.
Their defense is easy to deceive. They don't seem to have worked on fundamentals and individual discipline. They can't tackle and they don't do well at keeping their assignments.
If a moron such as I can see those obvious weaknesses then imagine Venables licking his lip waiting for kickoff. We're a 40 point better team than OU but I don't think we'll pull it all out. Dabo, you know?
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Tiger Cub [14]
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Re: BM, may I call him that?
Dec 14, 2015, 8:08 PM
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Bm is good throwing outside and inside the pocket
the best td/isn't ratio in the country= best decision maker (arguably)
I agree he's right handed and will roll to the right side but that's with most qbs. He doesn't float his passes... I don't know what you are seeing but send me some links.
Last seven games we have used the threat of run to pass. Teams are threaten by having 2 nfl backs and a qb that run. They have forced baker to win games.
We changed our run blocking schemes..
Defense looked like that against Texas.. But I haven't seen that since then..
Venables didn't go up against a single team last year in the air raid. We are running that system this year with Qb and two nfl backs. ( air raid teams don't get backs with nfl talent, throw too much.. But it's a lethal combo)
Baker has had the game on his shoulders time and time again. Teams didn't respect his throwing ability. Every team used a combination of blitzes and he burned him. All I will say is that he has down a tremendous job taking care of the ball and has burned the blitiz every single game. ( Baylor.. Sterling catch. Jailhouse blitiz)
Also has a person this kid is a tenacious. He is swagger. He is confident. He hates being told no you aren't good enough.
I'm sooner that loves to talk football. No trash.
I would like to talk more
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110%er [6331]
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OU has not played a D or an O that is as good as
Dec 14, 2015, 8:17 PM
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CLEMSON. Heck, I tried to get a comparable team to us, and there is not one on the schedule. OU has not been tested, CLEMSON has beaten 3 top-10 teams.
I think we either lead the country, or are very close to it, for TFL's. The OU OL cannot block, and now they have to go against that DL? Also, our secondary is one of the best in all of CFB, can BM throw while being chased down by the likes of Shaq accurately enough not to get a couple of picks? I say no.
I think OU is a decent team, but backed their way into this by having a cake schedule.
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Tiger Cub [14]
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Re: OU has not played a D or an O that is as good as
Dec 14, 2015, 9:06 PM
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Please tell me the best offenses you've played
Unc is overrated. clemson was their first 25 opponent.
Florida state.. Clemson got with their backup maguire
Notre dame.. You got them with kiser making his first road start
Truth is, neither team has played a Qb as good as these qbs.
Mack and Shawn are the best pass rusher/ CB combo OU has seen.
But how is your 2nd..3rd and 4th corner because in an air raid it's a matchup nightmare.
BV bend don't break leave middle of the field wide open on early downs and blitz you on 3rd down defense is a death sentence. ( I loved BV at OU, tremendous coach I wish stayed but he as a weakness for giving too many drives for points.. Hence South Carolina and North Carolina score 30+.. Also, we didn't run the air raid last year)
This game won't be decided by the stars. Depth will decide.
Arguably OU Oline is just as good or better than your Oline that has 5 new starters. Wash
OU Dline is very good too and deep. We rotate 7-8 guys all year because offenses run uptempo and run 80+ plays a game. Which OU offense does as well wink.
Glanced at your Opponent O rankings. 5 teams below 115? Is that right..?
This game is going to be closer than last year.
My fav player on your team is Mack. Dude has range p, instincts and technique. Vs sterling Shepard who's had 4 drops all year! That is an epic battle I can't wait.
I can't wait to get this started
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Orange Blooded [4661]
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Re: OU has not played a D or an O that is as good as
Dec 14, 2015, 9:28 PM
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Starting with your first point, one always has to take into consideration, (and I've said it multiple times), in the Big-12, if you seriously know and love football, you have to ask yourself - are the offenses really as good as the stat sheet claims or is it the absence of legitimate defenses that make it appear so?? Any logical person, team-bias aside, must at least consider that notion. Rankings-wise, the best defenses y'all faced were Akron and Tennessee. It's not an argument, just a fact. As a man who seems to know the game well, you have to admit there both kinda trash, no?
Now what you're saying about BV's defensive schemes... Especially since you admired him whilst he was at OU, is rather insulting. Did you just say, with a straight face, that his scheme is a 3rd down death sentence? You know we lead the nation on 3rd down defense right? And we have played what three top-10 teams while you've played three in the top... 50?
North and South Carolina both scored points not because of scheme disconnects, but mostly because of tired players and injuries after 10 games straight. On NYE, you're going to face a rested defense that was leading in multiples metrics through the first 6 weeks against harder opposition that you've faced all year long.
I agree with you that depth is a concern, it has been since week one. But our secondary has played lights out (we are in 5th in the nation in passing yards allowed, y'all are 34th. Those are hard facts, not opinions).
Further, your statement that your offensive line is just as good if not better than ours? Then why are we number one? Why did your O-line allow 36 sacks this year (112th in the nation) and our "5 new starters" only allowed 14 against notably / statistically harder defenses?? Hardly a wash. Texas sacked Mayfield not twice but 6 times in one game and they suck. That's not a scheme issue, that's a dumpster fire.
Is the game going to be closer than last year? Yes, I believe so. And for your sake, geez, I hope so.
I hope I've made my points respectfully enough. I too cannot wait for kickoff!
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Tiger Cub [14]
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Re: OU has not played a D or an O that is as good as
Dec 14, 2015, 9:47 PM
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I can make the same argument with the absence of offense in your conference.
Tennessee is a top 25 team
In the air raid system, 3rd down defenses that blitiz as much as BV does leaves one v one matchups on the outside that is exploited in an simple system that is specifically designed to place players in winnable one v ones. (Carter) Clemson didn't face one last year nor this year from any team.
3 in top 10? I already made my argument on that..
Yes, tired players. I remember that back I the day.
Let me hit you with some knowledge.
BV's defense terminology is not easy to digest for younger players. Clemson didn't face a single team in the top 50 in avg plays per game.(team rankings.com) Clemson doesn't rotate Dlineman. OU rotates 6-8 all year. Depth.
I see your argue net on your oline has valuable. We already rearranged our Oline and its proved to not be the floor that of Texsa game. As far as your Oline, has it truly been tested with elite dlineman? Edge rusher?
How all-American defense lineman has your Oline been exposed too?
Go take a look.
1) Sheldon day ND..
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Orange Blooded [2014]
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Re: OU has not played a D or an O that is as good as
Dec 14, 2015, 10:54 PM
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I think you have been misinformed friend. Clemson doesn't rotate DLinemen? Are you nuts? I guess Reader, Wilkins, Pagano, Wakins, and Byers all play that the same time with Shaq, Bryant and Dodd playing Defensive end. So we have an 8 man front. Bro you OU fans are crazier by the day.. lol
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Tiger Cub [14]
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Re: OU has not played a D or an O that is as good as
Dec 15, 2015, 7:16 AM
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Please explain why the team gets tired when not a single team on your schedule runs more than the average number of plays in college football.
Watched the ND, flst, and South Carolina game and the announcers each said the line was gassed.
Can you explain?
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110%er [5112]
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10 straight games in a row with no bye week...
Dec 15, 2015, 7:39 AM
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is why the D was tired. No break to heal up and rejuvenate. Boulware, our MLB, has essentially been playing with one arm for the last 3 or 4 games. We are thin at the LB position too, so not a lot of choice but to play hurt and exhausted.
Just this week, after a week of full rest, he is now able to lift that arm over his head again. Give him 2 more without banging into opposing players and he will be almost as good as new and recharged! Similar nicks and wearing on others in key positions on D had its effect too when you play 10 straight weeks. You make mental mistakes at that point too.
Trust me, they won't be tired at any point in this game. In the ND game in the 4th Q they were not tired, they became tentative in order to not make a mistake. That is the wrong mentality to have because you always get burned when you take your foot off their throat. They learned from that for the FSU game and kept the heat on, but then the late season weariness became a factor against less concerning opponents.
The only exception was UNC. UNC played lights out and we made some mental errors on D late in that game. That is the truth. Without those errors it was a blowout, but errors are part of the game and why you must play to really know who will win.
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Orange Blooded [2014]
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Re: OU has not played a D or an O that is as good as
Dec 14, 2015, 10:52 PM
[ in reply to Re: OU has not played a D or an O that is as good as ] |
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MAGUIRE IS NOT THE BACK UP.. He was chosen by Jimbo Fisher two weeks prior to the Clemson game to be the starter. When will you guys read? Kisers first road start he was running for his life with arguably the best OL in College football. Your oline is nothing compared to theirs.
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Tiger Cub [14]
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Re: OU has not played a D or an O that is as good as
Dec 15, 2015, 7:21 AM
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I agree ND Oline is one of the best and you handled them early but that game was really close. Clemson Dline is really good. Lawson demands a double team that opens one v ones that has been exploited by the others.
Maguire had 2nd team reps all through summer and start of season. He is the backup.
Kizer is the backup.
Williams never played a top 25 team until Clemson. Untested 37 points.
Those are the facts
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110%er [5112]
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Re: OU has not played a D or an O that is as good as
Dec 15, 2015, 7:49 AM
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I was there. That game was not as close as the score makes it seem. Clemson dominated ND for 3 full quarters and 2 minutes into the 4th quarter.
Clemson let ND off the hook by playing not to lose in the 4th quarter and it almost cost them. Playcalling on O was no longer aggressive, it was predictable. The D was playing prevent and tentative.
Both sides of the ball were being coached too conservatively primarily because the coaches figured with the weather being as bad as it had been all night in that 4th, they were not going to beat themselves with a turnover and would force ND to make desperate plays in crappy conditions. On paper, the odds seemed to be with this approach, but football is not so black and white. It is a game of emotion and when you take your foot off the gas, you deflate your team's killer instinct.
If there is one thing that I could ding our current team on it is that we don't put our boot on the opponent's neck and finish them off. We are too nice sometimes or too clever by half and go into conservative mode. I would like to think that since we are in single elimination mode for real now, they won't be so inclined to be so nice and just jam it down on the opponent's neck!
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Varsity [203]
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You played Baylor without Russell, TCU without Boykin and
Dec 14, 2015, 11:39 PM
[ in reply to Re: OU has not played a D or an O that is as good as ] |
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OKST without Rudolph. Both Russell and Boykin were Heisman contenders. In all likelihood you lose to Baylor and TCU, but at least TCU with their starters. Not saying OK isn't good, but I don't think you have faced an offense like Clemson and certainly not one that has a defense to go along with it. It will be fun, but I am going into this game with more confidence that I went into the UNC game. Much to ESPN's disappointment I think Clemson will expose OK. Again.
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Rock Defender [59]
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Re: BM, may I call him that?
Dec 15, 2015, 7:48 AM
[ in reply to BM, may I call him that? ] |
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I agree with your analysis '88, and almost stated the same thing yesterday.
What I would add is that BM is really accurate on his short routes, usually from the pocket. He loves to hit the slants, and those routes to the RB (usually Mixon) out of the backfield can be deadly.
Also, Perine usually runs between the tackles, and Mixon runs outside the tackles.
I don't agree with the margin though. I still maintain OU scoring less than 30 and CLEMSON more than 40. OU can score, and they will. If we do not have TO-itis that day, then we can beat them handily I think.
I'm still wondering if this will be Mike Stoops last game at OU. If we beat them like you think we will, then it could be. Holiday dinners won't be as fun for the Stoops family if Bob has to fire his little brother.
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Varsity [215]
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Re: You're nuts. No way we hold them to 16 points.
Dec 14, 2015, 2:04 PM
[ in reply to You're nuts. No way we hold them to 16 points. ] |
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The best Defense OK played all year was Tennessee, who ranked 47th in total defense, and help OK to 17 points in regulation. Yes, we could hold them to 16 points. Turn off ESPiN and look at the facts.
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Orange Blooded [4661]
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Re: You're nuts. No way we hold them to 16 points.
Dec 14, 2015, 2:26 PM
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I thought the best defense they played was Akron? No, seriously. Lol
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All-In [36451]
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ranking wise yes Akron was the best D they faced. But...
Dec 14, 2015, 2:30 PM
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tejas probably the most talented. And they only scored 24 points
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Orange Blooded [4661]
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Re: ranking wise yes Akron was the best D they faced. But...
Dec 14, 2015, 2:33 PM
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And only sacked Mayfield 6 times. 
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Varsity [215]
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All-TigerNet [14921]
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I've been a little surprised by all the OU love.
Dec 14, 2015, 1:27 PM
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Obviously this is a much improved team over who we beat last year but our Offense is much improved as well.
They have 4 really good wins and IMO played the toughest November schedule of anyone (Baylor, TCU, OK State in a row). But, all 3 of those wins were against back-up QBs and they were a missed-2-point conversion from losing to TCU.
I'm fairly confident in saying ours is the best D they'll have played all year (especially coming off 3 weeks of rest) and I don't think I can say the same of their Defense.
Their O is obviously very potent but on par with UNC.
I can see this one going like the UNC game--shootout unless we can get into Mayfield's head.
GO TIGERS!!
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Orange Blooded [4903]
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Tulsa played them pretty tight and took 2 OTs to beat TN
Dec 14, 2015, 1:30 PM
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We should beat them by at least 10.
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Orange Blooded [2224]
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Re: I've been a little surprised by all the OU love.
Dec 14, 2015, 3:05 PM
[ in reply to I've been a little surprised by all the OU love. ] |
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You can watch ALL of the ESPN talking heads yap about the reasons why we are in trouble against OU, but at the end of EVERY show when they have to make a pick, 9 out of 10 pick us to win it. As a matter of fact 2 out of 3 said on one show that they still pick us to win the whole thing. Only Galloway says OU has a chance to beat us in the semi but even he was hedging with very little confidence in his pick.
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CU Medallion [54265]
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So you're still not scared.
Dec 14, 2015, 1:28 PM
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The Sooner trolls aren't going to like this.
Their reply will go about like this: something, something logical football talk, Perine, Baker, not the same team as last year. And then storm off in a huff back to their "awesome" message board.
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CU Guru [1476]
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I live in Texas
Dec 14, 2015, 3:56 PM
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All I know is that many more people will recognize my paw gear after we show them what a real defense looks like again this year.
We have OU people all over this place. They are at least better than Texas fans but we won't be hearing from them for years...
Won't this be 3 in a row over boomer sooner?
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All-TigerNet [12506]
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I watched the Texas game on Saturday
Dec 14, 2015, 1:29 PM
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I really don't get what all the fuss is about.
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Commissioner [977]
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Re: I watched the Texas game on Saturday
Dec 14, 2015, 1:33 PM
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I think OK will get some points, but DW4 is gonna go ape-bleep and our D will make some more plays than theirs. Tigers 41-28
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Orange Blooded [4661]
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Re: I watched the Texas game on Saturday
Dec 14, 2015, 1:55 PM
[ in reply to I watched the Texas game on Saturday ] |
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Right? The five-man rush had them flustered from start to finish. 6 sacks in one afternoon. Can't wait to see what blitz packages Venebles puts together for us.
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Oculus Spirit [83803]
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Dang, what did you watch Texas and UT games? I
Dec 14, 2015, 1:49 PM
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haven't seen 'em that much but was so impressed with them killing Oklahoma State, 58-23, on the road.
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Oculus Spirit [94945]
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I haven't watched that one yet, I'll get to it this week.
Dec 14, 2015, 1:53 PM
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IMO, defense is an after thought in Big 12 though I haven't seen the TCU game either. If my opinion changes I'll make amendments.
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All-TigerNet [13173]
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Mid to lower teens? List the teams you think are better.
Dec 14, 2015, 1:58 PM
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I'd like to see that.
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Oculus Spirit [94945]
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How about a list of those who I think will beat OU.
Dec 14, 2015, 2:48 PM
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FSU, UNC, ND, LSU, Stanford, Oregon, Michigan, Iowa and Ohio State in no particular order. Probables are NW and Old Miss...
All have better defenses and do fairly well against the run and pass. I might throw Florida in there if their starting QB didn't get busted for roids.
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Orange Blooded [4661]
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Re: How about a list of those who I think will beat OU.
Dec 14, 2015, 2:56 PM
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I agree with everyone you've listed except Iowa. Their record aside, I'm still surprised they are ranked #5 and I think Stanford embarrasses them on New Year's Day.
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All-In [36451]
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Oculus Spirit [83803]
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True but 58-23, on the road is pretty impressive
Dec 14, 2015, 2:35 PM
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over any Power 5 team. I'd assume OSU is legit top 25.
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Oculus Spirit [94945]
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OK, you have my attention.
Dec 14, 2015, 2:56 PM
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I'll move that game up on my schedule.
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Trainer [35]
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I feel much like I did last year going into this game (long)
Dec 14, 2015, 2:02 PM
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Looking at the defenses that OU has played, I really don't understand why everyone is so convinced that OU is the best team. They are good for sure, but would not say they are the most complete team. For instance, of the 12 teams OU has played, 5 are ranked in the 100's in total defense after the season. Most of these bad defenses came at the end of the year in Kansas, Iowa St., and Kansas St. Their one loss was to Texas who has the 106th ranked D. 3 of those 5 teams have the worst ranked defenses in college football. Of the other 7 teams played, 2 have defenses ranked in the 90's including OSU. The highest ranked D on a legit team that they played is Tennessee at 43rd. TCU is 63 and Baylor is 54th. The Sooners are ranked 111th in college football in sacks allowed with 36. And that is against some of the worst defenses in the country. I think that a rested Clemson front 7 will create a serious mismatch in the trenches. Our issues have been depth on D (tired defense after 10 strait games) and turnovers. If we tie or win the turnover battle, we win by double digits. I think that they will slow our run game down with Gallman but we will run it enough with Gallman/Watson to keep their D honest. Lots of pressure on their QB will lead to turnovers. 37-24 is my guess with 7-10 points for OU coming at the end when the game is in hand.
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Oculus Spirit [94945]
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Agree but...
Dec 14, 2015, 2:53 PM
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Gallman will have a field day with their poor tackling skills. It's as if they work on developing plays but leave out fundamentals such as blocking and tackling.
The most positive defensive play they have is when Shepard sees a pass under thrown he hides the ref's eyes from the defender and pulls the defender off the ball. That's pro stuff right there.
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Hall of Famer [21792]
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So are they that much worse than SCAR?***
Dec 14, 2015, 2:48 PM
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Oculus Spirit [94945]
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Not really.
Dec 14, 2015, 2:55 PM
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We looked past USuCk and worked on UNC while USuCk looked past ElCid and worked on beating us. Beating us was Elliot's only shot at that HCing job.
BTW, I know you were joking so no, they are better than USuCk but USuCk is a better blocking and tackling team than OU.
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Tiger Cub [14]
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Re: Not really.
Dec 14, 2015, 9:31 PM
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Sc and unc are terrible teams.. Neither has a top 25 win and both you allowed 30+ points..
I thought you guys were proud of your defense.
Clemson/OU will be a battle.
Please stop being delusional
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Orange Blooded [4661]
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Re: Not really.
Dec 14, 2015, 9:43 PM
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Sir, there is nothing more delusional than saying (a) that Brent Venebles scheme is a 3rd down death sentence (considering our ranking in 3rd down defense) and (b) that your line is just as good if not better than ours with 36 sacks allowed. 36 sacks is fn awful. Mayfield is a gamer and makes things happen but he won't be given 5-9 seconds like he's used having. Shaq Lawson & company are going to be in his grill all day long.
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Tiger Cub [14]
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Re: Not really.
Dec 14, 2015, 10:03 PM
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Please read everything I wrote and not nikpick words. This thread is about sc and unc being better than OU.
I will add to what I wrote earlier.
Baker has faced every blitz this year and he's burned it.
I know for a fact baker is getting sacked. No question about it.
But we faced ogbah and made him disappear.
Let's go back to this thread..
Sc and unc are not better than OU.
That is delusional
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All-TigerNet [13173]
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I don't want to get involved in this scrum, but people that say we beat FSU
Dec 14, 2015, 10:20 PM
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with their backup qb just look like ignorant fools. Golson was healthy and cleared to play but got benched in favor of maguire. They gave him another shot the following week against St after maguire lost to Clemson and golson was once again ineffective and got yanked in favor of maguire. FSU went on to score 40 something that game after maguire game in and they've been a much better offense with him at QB.
The Kizer thing is almost as dumb. He started almost every game for ND and led them to a 10-2 record. It's not like ND was 10-0 with Zaire and then lost to Clemson when they had to play Kizer. He won all of those games for them and was a last second fg at Stanford away from having ND solidly in the playoff discussion.
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Tiger Cub [14]
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Re: I don't want to get involved in this scrum, but people that say we beat FSU
Dec 14, 2015, 10:33 PM
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It's not a scrum just a discussion
I'm not saying Clemson didn't take care of business and win. I just disagree with the agreement that unc and sc are better than OU. It's delusional to think that a top 4 team is worse than a 3-9 team and a team that doesn't have a top 25 victory.
Clemson is undefeated. It's not being disrespected. It's the number one team in thecountry for 8 weeks?
But to say OU played no defense. Clemson didn't face the offenses.
We have no common opponents!
This matchup is awesome. It's going to be closer than last year because both teams are diff.
Is it interesting tho. Golson was benched, he was the number 2 at ND. Malik gets hurt and kizer gets the nod.
Nd essientally had their third string QB
Flst had their backup after sitting golson
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Orange Blooded [3560]
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Re: I don't want to get involved in this scrum, but people that say we beat FSU
Dec 15, 2015, 2:21 PM
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If ND had the third string guy then FSU had their starter; you can't use the same guy to make two arguments. Many would say that OU's toughest opponents all played their backup QBs. There is no telling where Golson would have been had he stayed at ND he was a turnover machine and would have likely gotten passed over for the other guys (much like he was at FSU).
I happen to agree and the defense in the ACC makes our offenses look worse than they really are while the offenses in the Big 12 make the defenses look worse than they are.
OU's def is similar to the one that was torched last year. OU's offense is completely different. Clemson offense is better than last year. Clemson's D is slightly (but not significantly) worse.
sc isn't better than OU (but they are probably better than texas - not more talented but better). Nobody really knows is UNC is better or not, the Baylor/UNC may provide some insight into that though.
I will say this - ND and FSU (even with their backup QBs) are at least as good as anyone OU has played in the Big 12.
This one is all about the match-ups and frankly I like our chances.
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Oculus Spirit [94945]
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This subthread is not about USuCK being better than OU.
Dec 14, 2015, 11:02 PM
[ in reply to Re: Not really. ] |
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It's about USuCk being better at blocking and tackling than OU. UNCheat is a better team. When the final rankings come out you'll see.
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Tiger Cub [14]
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Re: This subthread is not about USuCK being better than OU.
Dec 15, 2015, 12:27 PM
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USuCk scored 32, UNC 37..
This will be posted again on this forum after the game.
With the final score below it.
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Orange Blooded [4661]
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Re: This subthread is not about USuCK being better than OU.
Dec 15, 2015, 1:27 PM
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This banter back and forth will be forever-lasting. You have your team, we have ours. I'll maintain my contrarian view despite anything you or any of the "experts" at ESPN or the like have to say and that's just the way it is.
Clemson has been the underdog more than once and have repeatedly been undermined by the analysts from week 1 through this morning. Yet and still, we are the ONLY undefeated team, we've never given up the consensus #1 spot since December 6th, and we will, without a doubt, be THE hardest opponent you have faced since our last meeting. We will not walk lightly into this matchup and I believe our eagerness to change the public opinion of us will outweigh your hunger for revenge. I respect Oklahoma's program and tradition, I appreciate your views and ability to maintain a level-head through an argument. I just firmly believe we come away the victor and nothing changes that, nothing.
See you on the field & Happy Holidays!
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110%er [9174]
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I read your drivel
Dec 14, 2015, 10:23 PM
[ in reply to Re: Not really. ] |
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You are boom or bust. Inciteful on some imbecilic on others.
Your retort on top3 Top 10s is spin.
The points allowed at the end of the year were due to lack of depth and weary legs.
Speaking of legs, yours are still "Thick" from last year. 3 of your lineman from last year...and in the center are still there. 3 more are back-ups (Coach V is licking his chops, again). Shall we get to your 8 letterman on the D-Line? Oh boy...
Perine will get keyed on again this year making a roll out fest for your QB. Shepard will get locked down, just like Fuller.
And for your Air Raid, pffft... No one has thrown on the Tigers this year unless you can make the safeties overcommit. Alexander will talk so much shittoShepard he will lose his composure...
We have TWO lockdown corners. What makes you think last year isn't a XEROX copy?
-Doc Tesla
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Tiger Cub [14]
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Re: I read your drivel
Dec 14, 2015, 10:42 PM
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Dude, lack of depth costs teams games.. You can only out athlete so many team before you get caught.
Got tired? Seriously! The offenses you faced were terrible!! How can your defense be tired.
Go to teamrankings.com. Look at average plays per game. No offense you've faced is in the top 50!
tired = lack of depth
I honestly don't understand your English on the rest of your argument. Please retype.
Macks special cause he talks ####? Uh I think I've watched more Clemson football than you...
Mack vs shep won't be much more than shep getting a couple of grabs to keep him honest. Great battle but it won't decide the game.
Who's the other lockdown corner?
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Orange Blooded [4661]
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Re: I read your drivel
Dec 14, 2015, 10:50 PM
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Cordrea Tankersley, and he is that dude. He has 5 interceptions on the year and is no slouch.
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110%er [9174]
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Re: I read your drivel
Dec 14, 2015, 10:55 PM
[ in reply to Re: I read your drivel ] |
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Lack of depth has not been a problem. How many marks do you see under our loss column?
Offenses you faced were terrible!!... Syracuse, Wake, So Caroline...yes. You must have stopped there.
Average plays per game?.. Are you on your 14th. 3.2 beer? We run too many plays to let our opponents run many. You don't read enough in between the stats obviously. Now, if you wanna jump to the side of being tired .vs so many plays...
THIRTEEN AND OH
I honestly don't understand your English on the rest of your argument. What, you need to be spoon fed?
Macks special cause he talks ####? Uh I think I've watched more Clemson football than you...
Mack vs shep won't be much more than shep getting a couple of grabs to keep him honest. Great battle but it won't decide the game. My point exactly...Shepard just as well hit the NFL combines. He won't be a factor.
Who's the other lockdown corner? Tankersley..he will catch the pass, not your receiver. Or do I have to spell that one out to you?
-Doc Tesla
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Tiger Cub [14]
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Re: I read your drivel
Dec 15, 2015, 11:28 AM
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Air Raid offensive philosophy. Is a set of formations, pace and a shallow passing game that is designed to move the chains very quickly and allows the spread to be run on the move instead of out of the huddle.
OU has gone predominantly a run first mentality, often with two backs to either side of the QB, who can hand off, or keep on a zone read coupled with Air Raid principles. OU is unique in that we do both, interchangeably, within the game this season. OU uses a lot of the savvy of the Air Raid while keeping the versatility of the two back zone read offense similar to Oregon. The thing is, OU changes it back and forth play to play.
This offense has a QB that can run the zone read to perfection AND is capable of executing a traditional Air Raid in the passing game. Add to that two backs, each of whom is big and strong enough to serve as a lead blocker for the other and a skilled wr corp and you have OU's version of the Air Raid/Spread Option. It has all the passing tricks of the Air Raid which includes trips, wonky formations, no huddle, short passes to move the chains with a few deep throws tossed in, QB audibles -- all the hallmarks of the Air Raid, with the ability to use all the savvy of the Spread Option which includes two back sets, QB keepers, and zone read options.
-CrismonOberon
Jordan Thomas and Zach Sancehez have very similar stats has your Mack and Tank.
Mack is still the better corner out of those four. Teams don't want to throw his way.
Teams early in the year test Jordan Thomas because they know of ZS. Hes stepped up this year. His length gives WR fits. I'm assuming this happen with Tank as well, teams don't want to attack the mack.Tank stepped up.
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Varsity [238]
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I didn't know you were at the practices?!
Dec 15, 2015, 5:24 AM
[ in reply to Not really. ] |
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That must have been fun!
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Tiger Cub [14]
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Re: I didn't know you were at the practices?!
Dec 15, 2015, 11:41 AM
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1) I played.
Team splits reps 60/30/10 during summer. Changes a little in season. Limited time, have to name a starter and go.
2) I read
Maguire got his first start of the year at the Syracuse game. Golson had a concussion.
That was seven weeks of 30% of snaps.
I don't expect you to relate with someone who has played or reads but being named 2nd string for 7 weeks doesn't get you prepared to take on a great team (Clemson).
Clemson took care of business. But it was a backup QB getting his 2nd start just like Kizer..
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Varsity [238]
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I was talking about claiming the team prepared for UNC
Dec 15, 2015, 1:33 PM
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during SCar week. How do you know this? Were you at the practices?
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CU Guru [1806]
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I commend your enthusiasm, but don't agree with the result
Dec 14, 2015, 2:52 PM
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I think we win this game, but it will be much more similar to the ACC Champ game IMO.
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Orange Blooded [3507]
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I agree.***
Dec 14, 2015, 2:57 PM
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Mascot [21]
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Re: Watched a couple OU games over the weekend.
Dec 14, 2015, 3:44 PM
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So NC State, UNC, USC, Syracuse, BC, ND and Louisville, GTech all have better offenses than OU? ND outgained Clemson by 140 yards with their backup QB in the rain at your place. BV was always killed by the Air Raid - it will be no different this year.
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Orange Blooded [4661]
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Re: Watched a couple OU games over the weekend.
Dec 14, 2015, 4:00 PM
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What air raid? Every analysis of Mayfield that I've read said his long ball is terrible! And Deshawn Kizer is a better backup QB than any OU has faced all season. Come on man!
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Mascot [21]
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Re: Watched a couple OU games over the weekend.
Dec 14, 2015, 4:47 PM
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Yes Air Raid, doesn't mean bombs away - really look at the route trees from that offense and if you were incline to watch film there isn't one pass in that offense he hasn't completed. Tell me he doesn't throw a good long ball.
http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=espn:14131832
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Tiger Cub [14]
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Re: Watched a couple OU games over the weekend.
Dec 14, 2015, 9:11 PM
[ in reply to Re: Watched a couple OU games over the weekend. ] |
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Baker has as a passing efficiency on deep pass beyond 25 yards at 55% vs DW IS 45%.
Pro football focus .com
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Orange Blooded [4661]
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Re: Watched a couple OU games over the weekend.
Dec 14, 2015, 9:35 PM
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I've watched a few of your games and honestly, I'm trying to say this as nicely as possible, anyone can look better against pop warner defenses. I'm not being a jerk here either. I've seen highlights of Mayfield where the corners are 4-8 yards behind the receiver in stride. That's because of mismatch. You've heard of Fullee on Notre Dame right? Mackenzie Alexander made everyone forget his name by October 4th; he has 2 catches for a whopping 37 yards.
We arguably have one of the best secondaries in all of college football. Shephard won't be given 10 feet to catch a ball all game, trust me. Our d-backs are the real deal.
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110%er [9174]
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Tiger Cub [14]
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Re: Defenses ranked 125, 126 and 127 in recent games
Dec 16, 2015, 12:50 PM
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Adjusted efficiency rankings from fbsdrivestats.com
The disparity of the lack of offenses Clemson has faced is greater than the lack of defenses OU has faced.
Looking at how these teams are ranked 1 and 4. There isn't much in-between them.
This is definitely the closest matchup on "paper" than any bowl game.
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Tiger Cub [14]
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Re: Defenses ranked 125, 126 and 127 in recent games
Dec 16, 2015, 1:13 PM
[ in reply to Defenses ranked 125, 126 and 127 in recent games ] |
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Clemson efficiency rank on D is higher than OU.
OU is better at defending the pass than the run. Which isn't good for the run first mentality of Clemson.
OU's D is better on 3rd down on the first set of plays. 3 and out = literally the first 3 plays. Clemson has the best defense on 3rd down.
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Orange Blooded [4661]
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Re: Watched a couple OU games over the weekend.
Dec 14, 2015, 4:03 PM
[ in reply to Re: Watched a couple OU games over the weekend. ] |
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PS - Clemson is ranked #5 in passing yards allowed.
What's Oklahoma's ranked? Your arguments are terribly biased and not based on any merit other than you graduation from there.
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Orange Blooded [4661]
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Re: Watched a couple OU games over the weekend.
Dec 14, 2015, 4:04 PM
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Before you try some wisea$$ remark, yes, I meant "graduating".
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Mascot [21]
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Re: Watched a couple OU games over the weekend.
Dec 14, 2015, 5:11 PM
[ in reply to Re: Watched a couple OU games over the weekend. ] |
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OU played 5 teams in the top 20 for total offense - and when OU played them they kept them anywhere from 150 - 200 yds below their average.
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Orange Blooded [4661]
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Re: Watched a couple OU games over the weekend.
Dec 14, 2015, 5:17 PM
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Good points friend, but when all the defenses in the Big 12 are notoriously suspect, most offenses just look fancy.
They sure are hyping you guys, I'll give you that much. But I assure you of one thing - mayfield won't have those 5-9 seconds to find a target that he's become so accustomed to having. Every quarterback we've faced this year that was gassed with "ability to stretch plays" ended up with concussions and/or turf-stained jerseys. And knowing what you've told us before, that he loves to lower the shoulder and run head-first, I'd be surprised if someone doesn't take his head off by 3rd quarter.
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Orange Blooded [2550]
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Re: Watched a couple OU games over the weekend.
Dec 14, 2015, 10:05 PM
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Good point. Kaya was supposed to be "Homer The Wonder Dog" and his "Super Hero Skill" was finding the open man. And we all know how that turned out.
Fact is, OK has not played against a great pass rush - strong secondary all year.
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Tiger Cub [14]
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Re: Watched a couple OU games over the weekend.
Dec 14, 2015, 10:14 PM
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I agree, OU is playing the best Pass rusher/CB combo but the game will be won with depth not the stars.
Which team can find production from players that haven't been on film making plays.
We know of Lawson, Mack, Perine, mixon, Shepard, Watson, baker, wilkinson, tapper etc but the players that make the 3rd down conversion, the one v one sack, or turnover that are the 2nd tier guys will push their team over the top.
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Rock Defender [60]
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Re: Watched a couple OU games over the weekend.
Dec 14, 2015, 10:39 PM
[ in reply to Re: Watched a couple OU games over the weekend. ] |
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CUYankee,
We don't have to wonder if the big numbers achieved by the Big12 offenses are due to superior offensive play or inferior defensive play. Simply look back at the last few bowl seasons. Last year, Baylor played Michigan State which was ranked 8th in Total defense (which seems to be the stat of choice used by Tiger Fans). Baylor scored more points against them than eventual champs Ohio State (41 points), the most of any team. Meanwhile TCU played Ole Miss which was ranked 18th in Total defense. TCU put up more points than any team (42 points, the next closest was Auburn at 35).
The best Big12 offenses have shown they can put up points on good defenses.
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110%er [5915]
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Re: Watched a couple OU games over the weekend.
Dec 14, 2015, 10:42 PM
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And last year OU played an ACC team. I forget - how did that work out?
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Orange Blooded [4661]
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Re: Watched a couple OU games over the weekend.
Dec 14, 2015, 10:47 PM
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It seems to me that these guys have placed literally all of their stock in the air raid system and Baker Mayfield. You will need more than an up-tempo fancy offense and gamer QB to beat our defense. We have seen a couple pretty decent "spread the field" type of quarterbacks all year and all of them have ended up on their backs or flustered.
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Tiger Cub [14]
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Re: Watched a couple OU games over the weekend.
Dec 15, 2015, 9:47 AM
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They also scored 30+ points and neither of them are in any where the caliber of a QB baker or Perine/Mixon.
Whether you think so or not, OU is going to score points in bunches. (I'm not saying Clemson wont.)
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Mascot [21]
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Re: Watched a couple OU games over the weekend.
Dec 15, 2015, 10:26 AM
[ in reply to Re: Watched a couple OU games over the weekend. ] |
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I think that is a good bet. Look at the UNC and NCState games, beside the NCStates first drive (2:23) those teams all scored their offensive TDs in drives of less than 2 minutes. Either you can not play tempo, or you are all risk / reward and when you fail you fail big.
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Orange Blooded [2529]
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This is actually accurate
Dec 15, 2015, 3:26 PM
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I like to think of it as a "tempered glass" defense. It's really strong and gives you nothing, until you shatter it.
Thus, our defense has super-great efficiency numbers, and leads NCAA in 3 and out, but gets hit for big plays.
The big plays also would come more late in games as the LB's were worn out and missed assignments. The rest will help them a lot.
My biggest worry is that we seem to dominate teams on the field but only win by a few, I'd be sick if we are better most of the game only to get beat on something stupid like turnovers or penalties.
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Rock Defender [60]
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Re: Watched a couple OU games over the weekend.
Dec 14, 2015, 10:54 PM
[ in reply to Re: Watched a couple OU games over the weekend. ] |
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CountryGentleman,
OU stunk it up last year. It was quite embarassing. Some wondered if an injury to QB Knight at the end of the season (concussion against Baylor) was a factor, but evidently coach Stoops felt at least some of the problem was coaching -- people lost their jobs afterwards.
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110%er [5915]
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Rock Defender [60]
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Re: A Question or two, please.
Dec 14, 2015, 11:21 PM
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Country,
I think most Sooners were sorry to see Venables leave. At the time, the hope was that he would stay and work alongside Mike Stoops.
There were a few that shed no tears to see him go. At OU, his offenses placed heavy demands on the LBs. It seemed like an untimely injury would result in a loss, perhaps several because no backup could really have all the nuances down. For instance, there was a game against Texas where we lost our star LB in the second half and they totally turned the game around and beat us.
I was sorry to see him go, but wished him well.
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Tiger Cub [14]
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Re: A Question or two, please.
Dec 15, 2015, 9:56 AM
[ in reply to A Question or two, please. ] |
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Bob wanted to have mike and BV on his staff as co-def coordinators.
BV was going to get a raise regardless of hiring mike or not.
It was just an opportunity to bring another quality coach in mike.
He hired mike
Bob is not a micro manager. He gives his coordinators free reign to design gameplans and calls.
He left it up to Mike and BV to decide on who was calling plays.
BV called plays for 7 years.
Mike is an assertive personality.. He wanted to call plays.
Neither was going to let it go. BV said his goodbyes.
Honestly, BV made the right decision to leave. Giving up play calling after 7 years..
So he left, Sooners all wished him well. Absolutely zero animosity.
BV is still well liked and respected.
I actually thought it was a perfect fit in Clemson and I actually followed Clemson as a band wagon fan because of him.
Really passionate coach and his family was very involved in the community as well.
Proud of his work in Clemson but
these weeks we are enemies..
His defenses are well understood in the sooner base.
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Tiger Cub [14]
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Re: Watched a couple OU games over the weekend.
Dec 14, 2015, 9:13 PM
[ in reply to Re: Watched a couple OU games over the weekend. ] |
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Thank you, our point but "total" o/d is outdated
You have to look at efficiency numbers for non common opponents.
Every conference is built different.
You have to win your conference to go anywhere..
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Orange Blooded [4661]
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Mascot [21]
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Re: Watched a couple OU games over the weekend.
Dec 14, 2015, 4:43 PM
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SO you post an article from 12 weeks ago with film from 2nd game of the season? The only throw Mayfield can be accused of not throwing at times is the one out of bounds. He takes too many sacks when waiting for the play to develop rather than checking off, or dumping it away.
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Oculus Spirit [94945]
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He's neurotic.
Dec 14, 2015, 8:21 PM
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He thinks there's always a play he just has to hang onto the ball until it develops. His ability to read a defense is unquestionable, it just doesn't exist.
He doesn't know his limitations and doesn't respect the O-line's inability to block. He's a head case just like Tajh Boyd, bless their hearts.
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Tiger Cub [14]
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Re: He's neurotic.
Dec 14, 2015, 9:16 PM
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I watched every single interception DW had this year and most of them were throws DW couldn't plant his back foot(power foot) due to pressure. Baker had only 3 into similar. Other two were tips.
Baker takes better care of the ball.
He will need to continue that against the Clemson d.
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110%er [9174]
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Better care of the ball
Dec 14, 2015, 10:28 PM
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are you insane??? DW ain't no Jesus with the ball but there is no deficiency there. You're stretching, Sonny Boy.
DW downfall is not getting the ball at a high enough iangle that they get batted down.
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Tiger Cub [14]
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Re: Better care of the ball
Dec 15, 2015, 10:07 AM
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Im not wrong.
Go watch the interceptions on espn. He doesn't plant his back foot and he floats the ball or throws inside to a WR that lost his inside leverage. Honestly, that happens with a lot of QBs. You're right hes not Jesus with the ball. Miracles happen when Baker has the ball. ( it was just a joke)
I don't know why you're mad.
It wasn't that he doesn't have the arm strength or accuracy. Pressure got to him and he made a bad decision. Which cost his team 11 ints. That's seen on the film, he's a rhythm QB. OU is going to come after him and not let him get comfortable.
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110%er [5287]
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Re: Better care of the ball
Dec 16, 2015, 11:38 PM
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^same can be said for Mayfield...so you think OU will keep Watson uncomfortable, but the guy that is ahead of Striker in tackles for loss and sacks, along with the guy sitting right behind Striker in sacks won't do the same to Mayfield?? Nice day dream you have going there....
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Tiger Cub [14]
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Dr. Nikola Tesla
Dec 16, 2015, 1:03 PM
[ in reply to Better care of the ball ] |
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Pts per drive
OU 7
Clemson 12
and before you vomit.
the 3&out% is literally the first 3 plays to start a drive.
Clemson is the national leader in 3rd down conversion defense.
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110%er [5287]
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Re: Dr. Nikola Tesla
Dec 16, 2015, 1:26 PM
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...and those were against what defenses again...I forgot? 2 top 50?
Oklahoma
Top 50 (2): #17, #46
Mid 50-100 (5):#55, #59, #66, #95, #100
Bottom 100-127 (5): #107 (lost to), #108, #125, #126, #127
avg ranking of #85 with only 2 in the top 50
Clemson
Top 50 (8): 5 in top 20): #1, #12, #13, #15, #19, #38, #39, #43
Mid 50-100 (3): #76, #96, #99
Bottom 100-127 (0)
(+1 FCS)
avg ranking of #41, with 8 in the top 50
Since we are throwing up stats...how about the trenches ("where games are won" as they say), since you think OU will "keep Watson uncomfortable" but Mayfield will have all the time in the world:
http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/ncaaol
http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/ncaadl
So the 12th ranked defensive line will manhandle the 9th ranked offensive line that played against 6 more top 40 defenses, while the 4th ranked defensive line with the leading DE for TFL and sacks will struggle all day against the 23rd ranked offensive line. Do I have that right?
Might want to go back and watch that masterful picking apart of the Louisville game...sit in that delusion a bit more.
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Orange Blooded [4661]
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Re: Dr. Nikola Tesla
Dec 16, 2015, 5:58 PM
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??
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Mascot [21]
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Re: He's neurotic.
Dec 14, 2015, 10:23 PM
[ in reply to He's neurotic. ] |
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As the previous poster said, Watson threw 11 ints this year, Mayfield 5, and 2 of those over the last 8 games. Not reading a defense? Mmmm if that was the case I would expect more ints.
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110%er [5112]
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Or expect more sacks... Which he has ??***
Dec 14, 2015, 10:41 PM
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Orange Blooded [4661]
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Re: He's neurotic.
Dec 14, 2015, 10:45 PM
[ in reply to Re: He's neurotic. ] |
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Earlier today, weren't you the one saying that he holds onto the ball too long and takes a long time to read the defense? 5-8 seconds is a long time. I just looked, he was sacked 36 times with you guys and 24 times with Texas Tech in 2013. So in two years as a starter, he's been sacked 58 times. Now I know some of that is attributable to the line... But i'm starting to think your boy Mayfield does indeed take a long time to read the defense.
The air raid system is best defended in a bear package, cover 1 backfield. I imagine Venebles is quite aware of this already but stacking the box takes away the run, which I've noticed is heavily relied upon by Mayfield to set up his passing game. Using a lot of disguise tactics and zone coverages, we won't make it easy for him to read the defense at the line of scrimmage. And with 5-6 men in the box and great players at skills positions in our secondary, I don't think he is going to light up the sky as easily as you guys are making it sound. That is all I'm saying.
Most of "reading the defense" happens at the line, prior to the snap. It's Mayfield's ability to stretch the play, when the coverage breaks, that allows him to excel. But what I have been saying all along is that he won't be given 5 seconds to make these kinds of decisions.
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Oculus Spirit [94945]
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You can explain this until you're blue in the face.
Dec 14, 2015, 10:59 PM
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They wont' believe it until about way through the second quarter.
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110%er [9174]
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And like last year..
Dec 14, 2015, 11:06 PM
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they still won't believe it...
CLICK
CLICK
CLICK
CLICK
CLICK
CLICK
CLICK
CLICK
CLICK
CLICK
Go the TVs...
-Doctor Nikola Tesla
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Mascot [21]
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Re: He's neurotic.
Dec 14, 2015, 11:11 PM
[ in reply to Re: He's neurotic. ] |
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I said if there was a knock he keeps the ball too long trying to make a play in response to a comment about him not being able to go long. 3 Sacks a game with 80 plays a game, I will take that with the other offensive production and only 5 ints over 12 games.
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Orange Blooded [4661]
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Re: He's neurotic.
Dec 14, 2015, 11:31 PM
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Firstly, if the success of your team relies so heavily around the presence of your star quarterback, why on Earth would you ever be okay with an average of 3 sacks per game allowed?
Secondly, look at last year since you guys love this plays-per-game metric. Cal was 4th in the nation in plays per game, Alabama was 115th. I know it is a general consensus that more plays per game = more opportunities for play-makers to get the win, but this is another one of those "does it really matter?" metrics to me and many others.
The thought is that running more plays = an exhausted defense, right? I mean between that and all this talk about depth, I'm assuming that's what you and this other Sooner fellow are trying to get at. They actually studied this metric in depth and you can google it if you'd like. Running more plays than the opposition led to wins only 56.9% of the time. So basically, running more plays does very little for your chances of winning.
Further, the only thing that running more plays seems to have a positive impact on is points. It was found that a offense that runs more than 80 plays has the highest likelihood of scoring 41 points, or more than a 60% chance of scoring at least 31 points. Oklahoma averages 81.1 plays per game and Clemson averages 80.3... So....
WHAT IS YOUR POINT??
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Tiger Cub [14]
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Re: He's neurotic.
Dec 15, 2015, 12:22 PM
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1) Its not heavily relied on the QB. 3 sack average on the year isn't good.
2) It does matter when your defense lacks depth. Clemson doesn't have depth. Hence the team is tired playing an average of 60 plays a game.
3)More possessions = more opportunities. That's why turnovers and tempo are so important in cfb.
Since Clemson is -2 in turnover margin, lacks depth, hasn't played a team with a true uptempo spells trouble in the 4th qtr grind. ( NC STATE is the highest ranked plays per game at 50th, gave up 41 points.. Outscored in the 4th.. to NC state..jeez)
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All-In [26136]
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Sooners.... to the exits. Very much like last year.***
Dec 15, 2015, 12:25 PM
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110%er [5287]
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Re: He's neurotic.
Dec 14, 2015, 11:00 PM
[ in reply to Re: He's neurotic. ] |
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Watson played 8 top 40 defenses, 5 in the top 20...Mayfield played 2 in the top 40, only 1 in the top 20...just a point.
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110%er [9174]
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Exactly
Dec 14, 2015, 11:04 PM
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Some time Birddog points with his tail one way and is spot on, then in the exactly opposite direction...
It's like... huhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh???????
-Tesla
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110%er [5287]
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Re: He's neurotic.
Dec 14, 2015, 11:16 PM
[ in reply to Re: He's neurotic. ] |
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Interesting fact of that....try looking at the stats (though I know every OU fan like to think they are irrelevant):
http://www.ncaa.com/stats/football/fbs/current/team/695
http://www.ncaa.com/stats/football/fbs/current/team/457
Passing Yards Allowed:
Clemson ranks #5.
OU ranks #34
Clemson has played 7 teams in the top 30 in that category, OU...none in the top 30.
Passes Intercepted:
Clemson ranks #27 (but tends to play more shut down defense as the above #5 yards allowed ranking backs up, especially Alexander)
OU ranks #7
Clemson has played 4 teams in the top 30 in that category, OU has played 2 in the top 30.
Wonder what that says as far as the difference in interceptions....
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Rock Defender [60]
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Re: He's neurotic.
Dec 14, 2015, 11:30 PM
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Tiger,
I don't think stats are irrelevant. I do think they require some effort to put into context.
For instance, when you read that Georgia ranks number 1 in Passing Yards allowed, do you think you should consider the QBs that Georgia faced?
Are you familiar with FootballOutsider.com? They have several metrics where they attempt to normalize for competition. They hold Clemson in high regard based on their analysis. Guess what--they also like Oklahoma.
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110%er [5287]
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Re: He's neurotic.
Dec 14, 2015, 11:40 PM
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Yes, I am familiar with it. If you check land of theives, you'll see all the stats I've thrown out...and every answer was practically "that's irrelevant". But as you also state...with those QB's you also have to look at the defenses they've faces, such as your own....as stated above,Watson face 8 in the top 40(5in the top20)...Mayfield faced 2 top 40, 1 top 20...his stats can easily be skewed by playing weaker defenses just the same.
Like you state about the QB's...QBR stats (with Pass EPA, Run EPA, Sack EPA, etc)
http://espn.go.com/ncf/qbr
Clemson's QB #3
OU's QB # 8
Now what they've actually faced...
Yes I see Seth Russell at #1...but OU didn't play against him, so OU can't count him.
I also see Trevon Boykin at #7...but again, OU didn't play against him, so OU can't count him.
So OU played against #20 only in the top 40.
Clemson played whole games against #14, #21, #26 partial (count that Kaaya was in the Miami game, and didn't score anything prior to being injured), #31, #33..in the top 40 (also played against #41).
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Orange Blooded [4661]
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Re: He's neurotic.
Dec 15, 2015, 12:27 AM
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Great posts man, felt good not to be alone in the trenches.
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110%er [9681]
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Re: He's neurotic.
Dec 15, 2015, 12:35 AM
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Both of these teams are good teams. You can quote stats all night up to 4pm Dec 31st but the team that shows up ready to fight till the last quarter moves on to the Championship game. Plain and simple.
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Rock Defender [60]
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Re: He's neurotic.
Dec 15, 2015, 10:02 AM
[ in reply to Re: He's neurotic. ] |
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Tigerman,
Well, I can see why Clemson fans would just like to forget about OU's victories against Baylor, TCU, and Oklahoma State. The reason you don't see the QBs OU faced in those games among ESPN's QBR leader board is simple: ESPN only lists players with a minimum number of passes in their list.
Here's what OU has faced:
From Oklahoma State, Walsh who has a QBR of 89.5 which would be ranked #1 (http://espn.go.com/college-football/player/_/id/511260)
From Baylor, Stidham has a QBR of 86.0 which would be ranked #5 (http://espn.go.com/college-football/player/_/id/3892775)
From TCU, Kohlhaus has a QBR of 68.5 which would be ranked #43 (http://espn.go.com/college-football/player/_/id/512469)
SOOOOOOOO, to answer your question, OU has faced #1, #5, #9 (Mahomes from Texas Tech), #20 (Dobbs from Tennessee), and #43.
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Rock Defender [60]
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Re: He's neurotic.
Dec 15, 2015, 10:33 AM
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BTW, let's take a closer look at the QB's that Clemson's defense has faced. Below, I include each QB's ESPN QBR rating. (I actually think the old-fashioned NCAA QB rating formula is a better indicator, but let's stay with ESPN QBR for consistency):
Clemson faced App State’s Lamb (70.4), Louisville’s Bolin (50.9), Notre Dame’s Kizer (80.1), Georgia Tech’s Thomas (37.7), Boston College’s Smith (26.3), Miami’s Rosier (56.1), NC State’s Brissett (70.0), FSU’s Maguire (75.5), Syracuse Mahoney (36.8), Wake Forest’s Wolford (44.0), South Carolina’s Orth (63.5), and North Carolina’s Williams (77.0).
I would exclude App State based on their competition. You then would have Clemson facing #14 (Notre Dame), #21 (North Carolina), ~#22 (FSU), #33 (NC State).
For those keeping score, that’s not as impressive as facing #1, #5, #9, #20, and #43 like OU.
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Rock Defender [60]
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Re: He's neurotic.
Dec 15, 2015, 10:34 AM
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I don’t count players who played less than a quarter. If you are going to count just a few plays as having played a QB, then you would have to say OU played Oklahoma State’s Rudolph.
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Orange Blooded [2529]
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I would agree that Baylor and Okie St's QBreplacements were
Dec 15, 2015, 3:36 PM
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very good, with little drop off from the QB.
But the dropoff from TCU was huge. BOykin is a crazy good athlete and makes that team a contender.
The TCU backup threw 3 picks inteh first half, two were ducks completely onthe QB. The other was a great route-jump by #15.
(BTW, fellow Tigers, we should avoid throwing it at #15.)
OU was a bit lucky that Boykin was out, and unlucky that the TCU LB decided to try to put his head through BM's earhole. That is one of the few proper calls of targeting I've seen.
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CU Medallion [54265]
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By your logic then...
Dec 15, 2015, 11:17 AM
[ in reply to Re: He's neurotic. ] |
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Couldn't we say that their QBRs are so low because of the great defenses they faced?
Tigers win! Go Tigers!
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110%er [5287]
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Re: He's neurotic.
Dec 15, 2015, 1:24 PM
[ in reply to Re: He's neurotic. ] |
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See, there's where that spin machine I was talking about OU fans do comes in (trying to make a chocolate eclair out of a Twix bar). Seriously, we really don't need to get into a whittle everything down to the last detail....really pointless. But...
Let's really look at Walsh...you want to look at QBR on him (and that's why you want to use the Total QB rating), but the guy has only had 5 or less pass attempts and 8 or less rush attempts in 10 of his 12 games...12 rushes in Iowa State. The only game he had significant playing time was OU, in which he had 42 pass attempts and 12 rush attempts. So in reality, you should only be looking at his QBR in that game to get a real feel of him throughout an entire game...the others were backup garbage time and again, skew the reality. And in the OU game, his RAW QBR was 55.7, and Adjusted QBR was 77.2. Not really what I would say looks like #1.
Same can be done to Stidham...who in the 3 games he played significant time, his raw QBR actually averages to 73.83 and his Adjusted QBR averages to 83.6 (Kansas State, OU, Ok State). He's honestly the better route you have, considering Bram didn't play until at least mid-way through the third quarter. Sure you don't want to look up the guy you played more in that game for 2 and a half quarters, Foster Sawyer...who has a whopping 13.8 RAW QBR and 19.4 adjusted QBR?
http://espn.go.com/college-football/player/_/id/3116417
But why should we exclude App State's QB, who has played significant time in all of his FBS games? (you did know they are a Div I FBS school now, right? Nice we now should exclude certain FBS games just because they are not Power 5). I can get excluding FCS...like Wofford, but FBS? I digress.
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Oculus Spirit [94945]
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Mascot [21]
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Re: Consider your offensive line and...
Dec 14, 2015, 8:48 PM
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Sure after the sexaT debacle, the oline experiment ended, they changed blocking schemes, stop the right tackle experiment and average 300 yd/s game rushing. So yes I can say that.
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Orange Blooded [2550]
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Re: Watched a couple OU games over the weekend.
Dec 14, 2015, 9:46 PM
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Neither TCU nor Baylor play any D worth a squat. And TCU nearly beat OK at home.
Wait until the Scooters play against a good pass rush w/ an excellent secondary!
It may take a couple of quarters but OK's D will weaken and not know how to handle our explosive, multi-threat offense.
Plus, Clemson appears to like playing in Miami.
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CU Guru [1904]
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Re: Watched a couple OU games over the weekend.
Dec 14, 2015, 9:51 PM
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While I think they are indeed overrated, I would put them at 8 or 9, I agree in that they are the weakest link, but I don't know about that score. I hope you're right but I see more of a 49-31 type of game
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Orange Blooded [2218]
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Re: Watched a couple OU games over the weekend.
Dec 14, 2015, 11:39 PM
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I watched a good bit of the TCU and Texas Tech game. I'm not impressed with Mayfield. He's a tough player, which makes him likable, but he panics and gets sacked a lot from what I can remember. Get pressure on him and he will make mistakes. He's like Tajh.
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