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Ring of Honor [23484]
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I can't believe there are so many people going so negative
Dec 4, 2022, 2:00 PM
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on Dabo when he is clearly the best thing to ever happen to Clemson's football program.
Go ahead and be annoyed at the QB decision. Go ahead and wallow in hindsight and "I told you so's" Fine.... have fun. But every single person attacking his character or saying Dabo's a bad coach or he's an idiot or blind or whatever.... you guys are what's wrong with college football. You make it worse for the rest of us. The NFL is waiting for you with open arms if you want to use football to process your personal issues.
In terms of culture, in terms of success, in terms of morality, in terms of passion, in terms of memorable moments/stories, we are in rarified air. Having Dabo lead our program has been nothing short of a miracle.
Is he perfect? Obviously not. But it is INSANE to be taking such holistically negative shots at him. Saying others "bailed him out."
Whatever parts of Dabo's personality that you complain about, are the same elements of his personality that built what we have now. Would you trade our program for another? If so.... nobody is stopping you from leaving. I love our program. We are EXTREMELY LUCKY to have it. Our "problems" are things 90% of the rest of the country would dream to have as a success.
People are saying Dabo is harming the program? If he is, he's simply barely shaving something small off that HE built. Some of the rhetoric here is from spoiled rotten children.
The only reason that Dabo's decision which may have kept us out of the playoffs was a decision that KEPT US OUT OF THE PLAYOFFS, (and not the CARE CARE BOWL) is the program that Dabo built.
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Game Changer [1845]
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Re: I can't believe there are so many people going so negative
Dec 4, 2022, 2:02 PM
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For real.
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Game Day Hero [4231]
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We can all look back and see decisions Dabo made
Dec 4, 2022, 2:05 PM
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that we, the general fanbase, didn’t understand from the outside looking in. But the QB situation this year just seems to be so blatantly obvious to all of us.
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Ring of Honor [23484]
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Criticizing a decision (from the outside) is one thing.
Dec 4, 2022, 2:07 PM
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I am not saying we shouldn't discuss/criticize/second-guess decisions. Obviously we should. That's fun!
I'm saying that the people jumping in with two feet INSULTING Dabo and Questioning him as a coach altogether are mentally/emotionally defective.
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Oculus Spirit [40654]
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I especially don’t like the “liar” part. Maybe Dabo is a really big fan of DJ
Dec 4, 2022, 2:14 PM
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The person and wanted to see him succeed. Perhaps at some point that was to a fault. I believe after watching last night that if Cade plays some vs sc we are in the playoff. But I do not think he’s lying. Yes possibly a mistake. In the overall scheme of things we are 11-2 and conference champs.
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Ring of Honor [21298]
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Apparently a failure of a season these days***
Dec 4, 2022, 2:23 PM
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Ring of Honor [21298]
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Ring of Honor [23484]
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Seems to be.***
Dec 4, 2022, 2:17 PM
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Redshirt [99]
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Offensive Star [341]
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Re: Criticizing a decision (from the outside) is one thing.
Dec 4, 2022, 2:47 PM
[ in reply to Criticizing a decision (from the outside) is one thing. ] |
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I am not saying we shouldn't discuss/criticize/second-guess decisions. Obviously we should. That's fun!
I'm saying that the people jumping in with two feet INSULTING Dabo and Questioning him as a coach altogether are mentally/emotionally defective.
Facts 2.0
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Ultimate Clemson Legend [98436]
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You can't say the change you wanted would make the...
Dec 4, 2022, 2:34 PM
[ in reply to We can all look back and see decisions Dabo made ] |
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situation better with any proof. You can only prove that it would have been different but that would have changed more than one factor with many unknowns fouling your suppositions.
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Ring of Honor [23484]
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Exactly. Isn't fact vs opinion like 2nd grade material?
Dec 4, 2022, 2:38 PM
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Crisis of education it seems....
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Dynasty Maker [3265]
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They're doing that because . . .
Dec 4, 2022, 2:11 PM
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Dabo created a false narrative, quadruple-downed on it, chastise others for not going along with it, and then, when reality clocked him in the head and prove that he was wrong, he came out afterwards with the same lies about it never having been wrong in the first place.
Dabo deserves credit for everything he's done. That includes the highs. It also includes this. It's not that complicated. People don't like being lied to and they especially don't like it when The lights continue after reality settles the score.
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Dynasty Maker [3265]
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correction: "lies" ***
Dec 4, 2022, 2:12 PM
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H
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Ring of Honor [23484]
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It's emotional nonsense to say he "lied." People need to
Dec 4, 2022, 2:13 PM
[ in reply to They're doing that because . . . ] |
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GROW UP.
It's football, He's a coach. He has a TEAM to manage. It's not his job to tell fans everything and tuck y'all in at night.
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Standout [247]
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Re: It's emotional nonsense to say he "lied." People need to
Dec 4, 2022, 2:17 PM
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I agree with you CSO. Dabo has earned respect if nothing else. Calling him a liar is disrespectful.I have no problem with objective criticism but this crosses the line in my book.
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Top TigerNet [32259]
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Re: It's emotional nonsense to say he "lied." People need to
Dec 4, 2022, 2:49 PM
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Here's the Miriam Webster definition of lying.
marked by or containing untrue statements : FALSE
You may think using the appropriate definition re. Dabo is disrespectful, but what is disrespectful is his publicly lying to fans and media all season re. Cade not being ready. And why was he lying about it? To justify his decision to start DJ when he was catching criticism for DJ's play. I'm not criticizing DJ. I'm criticizing Dabo. And after last night, we all know he was lying when we saw with our own eyes that he was more than ready. His first full game in a Championship game, he wins the MVP. How is that not ready? Did Cade find Superman's cape just before the game?
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Ring of Honor [23484]
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Are you seriously trying to say intent has nothing to do
Dec 4, 2022, 2:57 PM
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with lying? So if someone has an incorrect opinion that they believe.... they are lying?
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Top TigerNet [32259]
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Re: Are you seriously trying to say intent has nothing to do
Dec 4, 2022, 3:36 PM
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An incorrect opinion? MVP in Championship game and the first full game for a guy who we were told all season was not ready? And he was not ready to play in the last game of the regular season. But a week later is lights out. If that is an incorrect opinion, why the hail are we paying him 10 million a year?
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Starter [263]
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Re: It's emotional nonsense to say he "lied." People need to
Dec 4, 2022, 2:27 PM
[ in reply to It's emotional nonsense to say he "lied." People need to ] |
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Fans ? You mean the taxpayers and donors who provide his exorbitant salary? Dabo lays his head on a cushion of OUR money and owes us as his employers (remember Clemson is a public university) respect and the truth Dabo has been arrogant entitled and flat out wrong We arent paying a million a game for a youth pastor and his Kim Jung Un attitude of being beyond criticism and is still on the DJ train while throwing everyone else on OUR team under the bus He is a coach not a God We deserve the truth and not this constant gaslighting
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Ring of Honor [23484]
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Dabo isn't paid that money to be your girlfriend, dude.
Dec 4, 2022, 2:28 PM
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He's paid to run an elite program. Which he is. If you need a tummy rub, it won't cost you 10 million a year.
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Redshirt [99]
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Standout [247]
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Offensive Star [341]
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Re: It's emotional nonsense to say he "lied." People need to
Dec 4, 2022, 2:59 PM
[ in reply to Re: It's emotional nonsense to say he "lied." People need to ] |
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Fans ? You mean the taxpayers and donors who provide his exorbitant salary? Dabo lays his head on a cushion of OUR money and owes us as his employers (remember Clemson is a public university) respect and the truth Dabo has been arrogant entitled and flat out wrong We arent paying a million a game for a youth pastor and his Kim Jung Un attitude of being beyond criticism and is still on the DJ train while throwing everyone else on OUR team under the bus He is a coach not a God We deserve the truth and not this constant gaslighting
Every coach has blinders on. No one is oblivious to this. He said last night, " We made some mistakes this season." The handoff to Mafah against the Coots had nothing to do with D.J or any Gamecock.... neither did Antonio's fumble. Put Cade in against the #####, we win...probably.
What I really want to know is:
After we looked like a playoff caliber team last night (after our disastrous start), why are we crying like little babies?
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Top TigerNet [32259]
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Re: It's emotional nonsense to say he "lied." People need to
Dec 4, 2022, 2:30 PM
[ in reply to It's emotional nonsense to say he "lied." People need to ] |
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He does not have to tell fans what they can see for themselves and then lie about it. Telling us that Cade did not look good in practice when Cade is getting reps with the bench warmers and thus telling us he is not ready to play, and then when he is finally given the chance, he gets the MVP award in his first full game is pretty ### telling that someone was lying. Spin it however you wish, but in reality,
and You mentioned "morality", it was a lie. In my book morality does not include lying to fans and sports media about one of your players not being ready in order to justify why you are playing another player and then berating every one who questions the lie.
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Ring of Honor [23484]
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Your post has more to do with your pain from the coot loss
Dec 4, 2022, 2:32 PM
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than it does for anything relevant to the state of our football program.
You guys who want to make it personal and emo need to step waaaayyyyyy back.
We judge coaches based on results..... not if they don't tell you what you want to hear.
Calling Dabo a liar looks desperate.
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Ring of Honor [21298]
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When did you see that prior to last night?
Dec 4, 2022, 2:33 PM
[ in reply to Re: It's emotional nonsense to say he "lied." People need to ] |
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One drive at Tech? Handing off all but four plays against Cuse?
It's fair to question the timing. It's unfair and just stupid to say Cade is that from game 1. You, nor I, have no way of knowing.
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Ring of Honor [23484]
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Exactly, people have a massively inflated sense of their
Dec 4, 2022, 2:35 PM
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ability to know things for sure.
Dabo PULLED DJ multiple times. THIS YEAR. Cade NEVER played like this before. It is DEBATABLE if he would have played better had he been started. It's not FACT.
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All-Pro [750]
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Re: It's emotional nonsense to say he "lied." People need to
Dec 4, 2022, 2:49 PM
[ in reply to Re: It's emotional nonsense to say he "lied." People need to ] |
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He does not have to tell fans what they can see for themselves and then lie about it. Telling us that Cade did not look good in practice when Cade is getting reps with the bench warmers and thus telling us he is not ready to play, and then when he is finally given the chance, he gets the MVP award in his first full game is pretty ### telling that someone was lying. Spin it however you wish, but in reality,
and You mentioned "morality", it was a lie. In my book morality does not include lying to fans and sports media about one of your players not being ready in order to justify why you are playing another player and then berating every one who questions the lie.
Last time I checked Dabo Swinney was the head football coach at Clemson. He doesn't need to explain ANYTHING to you. He plays players when he feels they are ready. That is what he is paid to do. Not cater to a bunch of whiny pansy ### fans that mostly have never even played football, much less coached. Dabo has always held QB's in particular back until he thought they were ready to go. That's what he's done with Deshaun, and Trevor. But for some reason a vocal minority think he's only ever done it with Cade.
To your point of Cades first real game action, everyone in the entire Clemson nation thought DJ was the second coming after the ND game his freshman season. How about now? Cade is the future, theres no denying that but some fans need to get off their high horses thinking they know better than a 2 time National Champion coach who built this team from the ground up.
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Dynasty Maker [3265]
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Not a bit ...
Dec 4, 2022, 3:24 PM
[ in reply to It's emotional nonsense to say he "lied." People need to ] |
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You got it exactly backwards. It's actually emotional nonsense to get all worked up about me using the word "lied," when the shoe fits.
People get really oversensitive about that these days, because no one is bold enough to say it regularly. Folks say all sorts of other things that amount to the same thing and no one gets worked up about those statements. It's like there's some sort of prudish assumption that the word can only be used for political scandals or war crimes. If someone is overly stubborn and dishonest about how much their ego is serving their attempt to save the phenomena, then they are lying. It's not some huge scandal, and it doesn't mean Dabo should be treated as if he didn't make this program what it is- but in the end, he did what he did here- he wasn't honest about the whole situation- and when reality proved him wrong he served up the same fake story.
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Campus Hero [13495]
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Redshirt [99]
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Ring of Honor [23484]
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Girls express excess emotion by crying...
Dec 4, 2022, 2:42 PM
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guys do it by accusing players of quitting and coaches of lying.
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Dynasty Maker [3265]
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Problem is ..
Dec 4, 2022, 3:31 PM
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. . . is that sometimes the word "lie" is also used to describe actual lies. Like here. It's not really emotionalism- it's just a dogged refusal to accept everybody's crap about the truth and the frankness.
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Dynasty Maker [3265]
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Nope . . .
Dec 4, 2022, 3:29 PM
[ in reply to Re: They're doing that because . . . ] |
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big fail there on your part. What you cited is me, and others, stating the truth.With frankness, yes, but true all the same. The reason we sometimes get those differences about it is because we have people telling us that it's not true when we all know that it is.
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Redshirt [99]
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Re: Nope . . .
Dec 4, 2022, 4:20 PM
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Sounds like you’re cootsplaining it to us well.
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Campus Hero [13495]
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people have to flex their e-muscles because they live
Dec 4, 2022, 2:21 PM
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a life being butt-hurt about everything and know absolutely nothing!
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Dynasty Maker [3265]
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Actually that is just a
Dec 4, 2022, 3:40 PM
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distraction from the lack of an argument. Last I checked, people on message boards criticizing others for flexing their e-muscles are, ironically, just making a point on a message board, too.
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110%er [3902]
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Re: I can't believe there are so many people going so negative
Dec 4, 2022, 2:32 PM
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Preach it!
Some are legitimately USuC fans causing trouble but most are Tiger fans who are either just miserable people or are so entitled that they can’t handle not getting what they think they deserve. Despite that they know almost nothing of what goes on behind the scenes
They are the ones who will drive Dabo out of here and then complain that they deserve better when he leaves
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Redshirt [99]
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Re: I can't believe there are so many people going so negative
Dec 4, 2022, 2:36 PM
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CU Medallion [19658]
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Re: I can't believe there are so many people going so negative
Dec 4, 2022, 2:43 PM
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I hear you Completely Solid Orange ... Dabo is a good man and a great coach. He is astute and a hard worker. He's also overconfident and arrogant; he's made some bad hires (who hasn't?), and he can be stubborn, defensive and thin-skinned; he loves the spotlight, a microphone and a TV camera; he's very good with players and their families, and he is typically sincere and generous. And Clemson is very lucky to have him. Dabo does not have to be universally loved to be a great coach and that's OK.
If you're a man of faith, you give Dabo his due as a great coach, but you don't put him on a higher pedestal than his fellow man. Dabo understands he's a man and not a saint or an archangel. Some of the Dabo shots are jealousy, some are competitive, and some are part of the job based on his public position and desire to be in the limelight. Times change, people change. Enjoy what Dabo built. It will be gone within the next decade.
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Ring of Honor [23484]
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The balance of what Dabo is, both "good" and "bad"...
Dec 4, 2022, 2:46 PM
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is the best thing that may ever happen to Clemson football for another century.
This is based on logic and statistics, not emotion.
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CU Medallion [19658]
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Re: The balance of what Dabo is, both "good" and "bad"...
Dec 4, 2022, 2:57 PM
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Agree Completely Solid Orange. +1. Good post! Bad and good, and so much more good and great than bad, we are very lucky to have Dabo as our Tiger HC. Time to enjoy his "miracle" Dabo has built!
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Offensive Star [341]
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Re: I can't believe there are so many people going so negative
Dec 4, 2022, 2:46 PM
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on Dabo when he is clearly the best thing to ever happen to Clemson's football program.
Go ahead and be annoyed at the QB decision. Go ahead and wallow in hindsight and "I told you so's" Fine.... have fun. But every single person attacking his character or saying Dabo's a bad coach or he's an idiot or blind or whatever.... you guys are what's wrong with college football. You make it worse for the rest of us. The NFL is waiting for you with open arms if you want to use football to process your personal issues.
In terms of culture, in terms of success, in terms of morality, in terms of passion, in terms of memorable moments/stories, we are in rarified air. Having Dabo lead our program has been nothing short of a miracle.
Is he perfect? Obviously not. But it is INSANE to be taking such holistically negative shots at him. Saying others "bailed him out."
Whatever parts of Dabo's personality that you complain about, are the same elements of his personality that built what we have now. Would you trade our program for another? If so.... nobody is stopping you from leaving. I love our program. We are EXTREMELY LUCKY to have it. Our "problems" are things 90% of the rest of the country would dream to have as a success.
People are saying Dabo is harming the program? If he is, he's simply barely shaving something small off that HE built. Some of the rhetoric here is from spoiled rotten children.
The only reason that Dabo's decision which may have kept us out of the playoffs was a decision that KEPT US OUT OF THE PLAYOFFS, (and not the CARE CARE BOWL) is the program that Dabo built.
??? #FACTS
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Ring of Honor [23156]
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Nah man, don't be so dramatic. Nobody is going negative on
Dec 4, 2022, 4:12 PM
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Dabo, like they're about to kidnap his kids and he'll have to pull off a heroic mission just to save them. It's just football that we're discussing here on a message board. That's all. Jesus. Nobody is attacking anybody. Nobody is lobbing hand grenades up underneath his car. We're just jacking our jaws a little bit, because we can, and because we're a tad disgruntled. That's all.
However, you did miss a good opportunity to utilize some of the coolest new terms like Spoiled, Millennial, Hater, Boomer, Entitled, Triggered, etc. You can do better. I know you can, because I've seen your work when you're really motivated.
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Redshirt [99]
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11 million dollar man - what basketball coach could we get
Dec 4, 2022, 6:02 PM
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So, criticism is fair game. Bottom line, his hubris and coddling of DJ cost the University an appearance in the CFP.
Which in turn cost Clemson University money, cost the ACC money, the staff, the players, etc...
If you truly believe that Dabo is above reproach and think he's bigger than Clemson you're not a true supporter of Clemson University and just a band wagon Dabo worshipper.
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