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Hard to read story about Newtown findings -
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Hard to read story about Newtown findings -


Mar 28, 2013, 10:12 AM

Particularly if you have school aged children.


Newtown gunman Adam Lanza fired 155 bullets in less than five minutes, prosecutor says
By Michael Isikoff, Tom Winter and Erin McClam, NBC News
Thu Mar 28, 2013 9:23 AM EDT
NBCNews.com
Adam Lanza fired 155 bullets in less than five minutes on the day he killed 20 children and six adults at Sandy Hook Elementary School, the chief prosecutor investigating the massacre said Thursday.

The total included 154 fired from a Bushmaster .223-model rifle and a final bullet, fired from a Glock 10mm handgun, that Lanza used to take his own life, said Stephen Sedensky, the chief prosecutor investigating the shooting.

Three Samurai swords were recovered from the Newtown, Conn., home that Lanza shared with his mother, authorities said as they released search warrants from the second-worst school shooting in American history.

Also recovered were a National Rifle Association certificate, seven of Lanza’s journals, drawings that he made and books, including an NRA guide to the basics of pistol shooting, authorities said.

Other books included “Look at Me: My Life with Asperger’s” and “Born on a Blue Day: Inside the Mind of an Autistic Savant.”

Among the other items seized were a holiday card containing a check from his mother to buy a firearm, an article from The New York Times about a school shooting at Northern Illinois University and three photographs of what appeared to be a dead person covered with plastic and blood.

An FBI report included in the search warrants said that Lanza rarely left home, considered himself a shut-in and was an avid gamer who played “Call of Duty,” a first-person shooter game. The home had a safe holding at least four guns, and Lanza considered Sandy Hook Elementary School his “life,” the papers said.

Police recovered nine 30-round magazines for the Bushmaster that Lanza took to the school. Three of the magazines had a full 30 rounds still in them.

On Wednesday, a judge granted a request from prosecutors to withhold some information in the records, including a witness name, credit card information, telephone numbers and serial numbers.

Authorities say Lanza, 20, shot his mother to death at their home on the morning of Dec. 14, then drove to the school and killed 20 first-graders and six teachers and staff before taking his own life.

Among school shootings in the United States, the death toll is second only to the 32 people killed at Virginia Tech in 2007.

Lanza used a Bushmaster .223-caliber XM15-E2S rifle with a 30-round magazine to shoot the victims at the school, authorities have said.

Authorities also found the Glock 10mm semiautomatic pistol and a Sig-Sauer 9mm semiautomatic pistol in the school, one of which Lanza used to kill himself. In the car outside, police found a shotgun.

All those weapons were legally owned by the mother, Nancy Lanza, authorities have said.

There have been reports that Lanza was obsessed with other mass killers, including Anders Breivik, who killed 77 people in a shooting and bomb attack in Norway two years ago.

A law enforcement official told NBC News last month that Lanza had collected material on previous mass shootings, although the source said there was no indication that it played a role in the school massacre.

Police told NBC News in February that investigators were still a long way from determining Lanza’s motive. Police said then that they hoped to have a report on the shooting finished by June.

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A couple of points


Mar 28, 2013, 10:26 AM

1. 154 rounds in 5 minutes is 1.94 rounds per minute. Hardly an indictment of standard capacity magazines.

How fast could a Revolutionary War soldier fire a musket? Trained minutemen could fire 3 aimed shots per minute with a flint lock musket in a 15 movement drill.

http://www.history.com/videos/musket-loading-how-fast#musket-loading-how-fast

2. Media outlets have labeled Lanza's mother as a right wing gun nut who was obsessed with weapons. This has been linked to Lanzas obsession with weapons. Therefore weapons are bad, and all must be outlawed.

However.

The linked story has this little tidbit:

There have been reports that Lanza was obsessed with other mass killers, including Anders Breivik, who killed 77 people in a shooting and bomb attack in Norway two years ago.

A law enforcement official told NBC News last month that Lanza had collected material on previous mass shootings, although the source said there was no indication that it played a role in the school massacre.



This was a tragedy of epic proportions, must it be bastardized for the political fodder of the left? More kids have died at the feet of the mayor of Chicago since the Newton massacre, yet nothing is done there.

flag link military_tech thumb_downthumb_up

I think your math is off in your first sentence.***


Mar 28, 2013, 10:29 AM



flag link military_tech thumb_downthumb_up

correct. I didnt covert to seconds. I stand corrected


Mar 28, 2013, 10:34 AM

still. that could have easily been accomplished with 10 round mags. or even a revolver for that matter.

I have competed in revolver matches with a 6 shot .357. With speed loaders, the rate of fire is nearly the same.

flag link military_tech thumb_downthumb_up

Seems to make the case for gun control. If he fired a round


Mar 28, 2013, 10:46 AM

per every two seconds, that is an average rather than a limit of capabiliy. My guess would be there would 10 or 20 rounds fired very quickly, a 15 or 30 second walk to somewhere else, and another 20 fired very quickly.

Could this have been done with 5 round magazines? Maybe. I am not making the case for gun control. Personally I don't see a problem with going to small magazines, but that is another issue. I am just saying that the other side could maybe use that to their advantage, and if I were them I would.

2024 white level memberbadge-donor-05yr.jpg flag link military_tech thumb_downthumb_up


We're talking about exceptional and rare shooters


Mar 28, 2013, 10:51 AM

who could maintain any type of reload capacity of a 5 shot pistol vs a 30 round long rifle.

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You would certainly have to walk in with a bundle of clips,


Mar 28, 2013, 11:13 AM

which would totally destroy the cool factor. Hard to be Rambo with Santa Claus sack full of 5 round clips.

2024 white level memberbadge-donor-05yr.jpg flag link military_tech thumb_downthumb_up


Dillon Kleibold did it with 10 round magazines


Mar 28, 2013, 11:17 AM

his rifle was purchased DURING the "Assault Weapons Ban"

flag link military_tech thumb_downthumb_up

He practiced, a lot.***


Mar 28, 2013, 11:57 AM



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well we obviously need to outlaw practice then***


Mar 28, 2013, 11:58 AM



flag link military_tech thumb_downthumb_up

Are you Allen Iverson?***


Mar 28, 2013, 11:59 AM



flag link military_tech thumb_downthumb_up

I think the label gun nut aptly applies to Mrs. Lanza. She


Mar 28, 2013, 11:27 AM [ in reply to A couple of points ]

enthusiastically added numerous high powered weapons into a situation where clearly they should not have been introduced. Allowing free access to such weaponry by an individual known to be unstable is delusional thinking, or in the common vernacular, nutty.

flag link military_tech thumb_downthumb_up

She obviously wasn't to smart


Mar 28, 2013, 11:29 AM

She didn't keep her weapons locked up and didn't have a seperate locked stash for ammo. Poor parenting and gun ownerships skills on her part.

flag link military_tech thumb_downthumb_up

Nut = irrational thinking which was indicative of poor


Mar 28, 2013, 11:31 AM

parenting choices.

flag link military_tech thumb_downthumb_up

so to sum up this thread. 1) it was guns fault 2) moms fault


Mar 28, 2013, 11:32 AM [ in reply to I think the label gun nut aptly applies to Mrs. Lanza. She ]

there has yet to be any discussion of the CRAZY S.O.B. that thought up, planned, and carried out this horrific crime.

That is the par for the course these days.

Im done

flag link military_tech thumb_downthumb_up

And somehow the fact he was studying previous mass murderers


Mar 28, 2013, 11:36 AM

has nothing to do with what he did...OK

He used a Bushmaster, though!

2024 white level memberbadge-donor-15yr.jpgringofhonor-lakebum1-110.jpg flag link military_tech thumb_downthumb_up

Now you are injecting a right wing perspective here. The


Mar 28, 2013, 11:41 AM [ in reply to so to sum up this thread. 1) it was guns fault 2) moms fault ]

article detailed what happened that day, and how it happened, ie discussing at length how the CRAZY S.O.B. planned and carried out his crime. The article concluded that the investigation is still ongoing and that an FBI report will likely be published in June.

I am sure many on the far right are upset that claims by the police and coroner state that a Bushmaster was used and not the shotgun in the car trunk.

flag link military_tech thumb_downthumb_up

Would it have mattered if it was a shotgun?


Mar 28, 2013, 11:50 AM

The guy was shooting 6 y/o kids. He could have killed as many as he wanted with a musket or a rubber hammer. Outlawing magazines > 10 rounds would have done nothing to stop this for happening.

flag link military_tech thumb_downthumb_up

If he had a musket or hammer, he would have been overpowered


Mar 28, 2013, 11:56 AM

by staff. This was a small guy.

It is not likely he could have killed that many in so short a period of time with a shotgun, mallet or musket.

flag link military_tech thumb_downthumb_up

so its okay to kill 5 or 6 first graders just not 20


Mar 28, 2013, 11:58 AM

those 5 or 6 families will be happy to hear that.

flag link military_tech thumb_downthumb_up

Nice stretch. Maybe we should be glad that current laws


Mar 28, 2013, 12:01 PM

prevented him from having grenades and full automatics, thus sparing the remaining hundreds he did not get a chance to kill.

flag link military_tech thumb_downthumb_up

That's assuming the staff would have done anything.


Mar 28, 2013, 12:05 PM [ in reply to If he had a musket or hammer, he would have been overpowered ]

Most people freeze, hide, run away in those situations. My point is we are focusing on the wrong things when discussing outlawing types of fire arms. Making them illegal or harder to get will not stop lunatics from committing mass murders

flag link military_tech thumb_downthumb_up

This staff didn't run and hide.


Mar 28, 2013, 12:07 PM

The accounts make that clear.

badge-donor-05yr.jpg flag link military_tech thumb_downthumb_up

There were adults present.


Mar 28, 2013, 12:05 PM [ in reply to Would it have mattered if it was a shotgun? ]

If I'm in the room, and I'm still standing when he empties his shotgun, he WILL NOT reload. There were adults present who were apparently willing to give their lives to save kids. Many right wingers' insistence that it would not have mattered what kind of weapon he used (someone in the Gville News said it could be done with a baseball bat!) just doesn't hold water.
The fact that modern weaponry made his job easier in no way absolves him from guilt, but it's hard to deny that it did make it easier, and that more children died as a result.

badge-donor-05yr.jpg flag link military_tech thumb_downthumb_up

wasnt refering to article, was refering to thread


Mar 28, 2013, 11:57 AM [ in reply to Now you are injecting a right wing perspective here. The ]

my initial response incorrectly timed the shots. BUT it also called into question the statement that Lanzas obsession for previous murders may not be linked to the cause.

EVERY response in this thread focused on the two aspects in my post above.

1) Guns are bad

2) Moms fault.

no one even responded to my second point discussing the KILLER's obsession with murder.

but dont let me get in the way of your pitforked mob.

flag link military_tech thumb_downthumb_up

Name one statement I have made indicative of a pitforked


Mar 28, 2013, 11:58 AM

(sic) mob?

flag link military_tech thumb_downthumb_up

Parents should be strung up, but


Mar 28, 2013, 10:29 AM

in no way should gun control be enacted. Mentally ill people need to be kept up with in some manner so as to not allow them to acquire weapons...

flag link military_tech thumb_downthumb_up

But if there's no freaking background check...


Mar 28, 2013, 12:12 PM

... at the point of purchase, what good does it do to keep up with them?
I don't see further restrictions on the types of weapons available to public as being productive, but the right wings' vehement opposition to checks, training, and registration makes no sense.

badge-donor-05yr.jpg flag link military_tech thumb_downthumb_up

Because we all know where that road leads too...


Mar 28, 2013, 1:09 PM

We've all heard numerous high ranking politicians voice what their true agenda is and registration is just a stepping stone towards that goal.

2024 white level memberbadge-donor-15yr.jpgringofhonor-lakebum1-110.jpg flag link military_tech thumb_downthumb_up

lol, ooooookay. But you're right...


Mar 28, 2013, 1:34 PM

... even paranoiac have real enemies. If Dianne Feinsein ever becomes President for Life, watch out!

badge-donor-05yr.jpg flag link military_tech thumb_downthumb_up

Because she's the only one...***


Mar 28, 2013, 1:35 PM



2024 white level memberbadge-donor-15yr.jpgringofhonor-lakebum1-110.jpg flag link military_tech thumb_downthumb_up

You're right again. It's a least four.


Mar 28, 2013, 1:42 PM

Five if you count dead people.

badge-donor-05yr.jpg flag link military_tech thumb_downthumb_up

LOL, whatever keep that head shoved firmly in the sand...


Mar 28, 2013, 1:49 PM

Look at New York, for one example...The end game isn't hard to see, as a lot of them have shown their true colors in this gun control debate.

2024 white level memberbadge-donor-15yr.jpgringofhonor-lakebum1-110.jpg flag link military_tech thumb_downthumb_up

Complete failure by the government to run safe schools


Mar 28, 2013, 11:39 AM

IF it was a private school, they'd be sued out of existence for not having adequate security.

2024 orange level memberbadge-donor-10yr.jpg flag link military_tech thumb_downthumb_up

He shot the locks off. Maybe the next guy will ram his


Mar 28, 2013, 11:43 AM

truck through the doors. They were not oblivious with their security, but were overmatched. All the horror occurred within the FIVE minutes between the time the lock was shot off and the cops arrived.

flag link military_tech thumb_downthumb_up

And your point?***


Mar 28, 2013, 12:02 PM



2024 orange level memberbadge-donor-10yr.jpg flag link military_tech thumb_downthumb_up

See here -


Mar 28, 2013, 12:08 PM

Well stated by KT

http://www.tigernet.com/forums/message.jspa?messageID=13764221

flag link military_tech thumb_downthumb_up

Well then private schools better get their ###es in gear.


Mar 28, 2013, 12:14 PM [ in reply to Complete failure by the government to run safe schools ]

None that I know of has security that would have prevented this.

badge-donor-05yr.jpg flag link military_tech thumb_downthumb_up

LOL, right. The state gets a complete pass with you ########***


Mar 28, 2013, 1:26 PM



2024 orange level memberbadge-donor-10yr.jpg flag link military_tech thumb_downthumb_up

And you came to that conclusion...how?***


Mar 28, 2013, 1:30 PM



badge-donor-05yr.jpg flag link military_tech thumb_downthumb_up

simple logic***


Mar 28, 2013, 1:36 PM



2024 orange level memberbadge-donor-10yr.jpg flag link military_tech thumb_downthumb_up

Well you're sure cut out for that.***


Mar 28, 2013, 1:36 PM



badge-donor-05yr.jpg flag link military_tech thumb_downthumb_up

Replies: 41
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