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Topic: I’m not a tree hugger...BUT
Replies: 63   Last Post: Aug 7, 2018, 8:56 AM by: WiFied
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Replies: 63  

I’m not a tree hugger...BUT

emoji_events [23]
Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 9:50 AM
 

I’m 60 years old, and on most issues very conservative politically. The older I get the more I realize we need to do a much better job in protecting our world’s natural resources.

The second largest killer of wildlife in the ocean are plastics.
By the year 2050 by volume there will be more plastics in our ocean than fish.
When plastic makes its way to the oceans, rivers or lakes it breaks down into smaller pieces which are consumed by fish. Plastics are now in all seafood we eat. It’s in all fish and it’s in salt we consume.

When you buy something at a store tell the clerk you want a paper bag or better yet no bag at all.
If you go to a restaurant tell them you do not want a plastic straw.
Below is video of plastic off the coast of Dominican Republic. Ocean currents flow from the Caribbean to the east coast of the United States.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/plastic-pollution-wave-video-dominican-republic-environment-parley-activist-santo-domingo-a8457251.html

This is just one area of plastic trash. You can google plastic trash and see and endless amount of information of it in our waters.


I’m with you and do what I can, BUT...

[4]
Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 10:06 AM
 

The US is not the big contributor to this problem. Whatever we personally do herein the US is not going to make a dent in this problem at all. We recycle and/or bury 99% of the plastics we consume/use. We don’t dump them in the oceans. If you want to see the big culprits and main drivers, read this...

https://www.pri.org/stories/2016-01-13/5-countries-dump-more-plastic-oceans-rest-world-combined

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Re: I’m with you and do what I can, BUT...

emoji_events [11]
Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 10:47 AM
 

Huffer, as tugboat operator for many years I have seen the massive amounts of garbage and in particular plastics that end up in American waterways and rivers . Those discarded items eventually end up in our oceans .
The Delaware and Schuykill rivers around Philadelphia and the Potomac and Anacostia rivers around DC are 4 of the most polluted systems in America . I have personally sat in a wash of floating garbage that surrounded my tug on all sides in both places .
The US may not be on top of the world in pollution contribution , but it has done its share and I am here to say that it's ongoing and very sad .
People don't understand that trash that goes on the street in a town 30 miles inland can end up in a river or ocean many miles from there .
We need to do a better job of stewarding this world .

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DB23


Thanks... you are seeing it personally, so I believe you

[3]
Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 11:20 AM
 

And 100% agree we need to keep striving to do a better job., just not sure how we fix those other countries. It doesn’t mean we should not try, but the solution eludes my little pea brain, thats all I am trying to say.

It gives me the “sad” when I see how we humans have utterly destroyed our ecosystem. I’m not placing the blame just on the US. We bear some responsibility too. But there is plenty of blame to go around in this world for sure.

All that said, I think overall, net-net , the US does more to help fix things like this than we do in creating the problem. Now we just need to convince others to help do their part too. It cannot be solved by the US alone. Again, if we handlie our own business in terms of reducing pollution, it barely makes a dent in the world problem and we need to make it clear that we, the US of A, is not the bad add guy here. We are one of the good guys, relatively speaking.

That is all I would like folks in the media to point out on stuff like this and climate change. We are doing our part. We can do more, but it is a rounding error if the others don’t step up in a big, big way. Our efforts here are futile.

Sometimes it seems like these “causes” spin up in the media and political class here in the US as if we are the main culprit we should be ashamed of our capitalistic lifestyle. That is hogwash and needs to be countered each and every time one of these causes gets spun up. We are not the bad guys in the world folks. We simply are not. And I am tired of anyone trying to assert we are as some anti-capitalist political agenda.

[And I am not saying anyone here is doing that by the way... I am preaching to the choir I suspect... getting off my soapbox now??]


Message was edited by: hufferbilly®


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Re: Thanks... you are seeing it personally, so I believe you

[1]
Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 11:26 AM
 

I think A solid move would be to start moving away from and trying in some instances to completely do away with "disposable" plastics and look for possibly educating and being a leader in helping these major offenders clean up this pollution and further enable future generations as people who see that the world is our ONLY sustainable resource , as a whole.


Message was edited by: Tigerdug23®


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DB23


yep, either biodegradable or recyclable is the only way***


Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 11:44 AM
 



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China quit taking our recyclables earlier this year


Posted: Aug 7, 2018, 8:56 AM
 

Which means that almost everything that you think is being recycled, is now all being dumped in the same landfill as the rest of your garbage. Sorting your recyclable garbage does nothing now. Just Google it.


Re: Thanks... you are seeing it personally, so I believe you

[2]
Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 12:35 PM
 

Tigerdug:

Just curious, how do you go about being a tugboat captain? Also, regarding the plastic waste issue, when I was a kid, all glass soda bottles could be returned to the store for a refund on the bottle. I think it was $0.03 - $0.05, but we collected them to return for candy money. Recycling is pretty big now, but in my area, they won't accept glass for recycling, so we have to trash it. The city said there is not enough market for glass. I say do away with plastic bottles and go back to glass with refund on bringing the bottles back.


Re: Thanks... you are seeing it personally, so I believe you


Posted: Aug 6, 2018, 1:12 AM
 

Love that idea , bring back refillable ,reusable glass .
I started out as a deckhand in 93 and I have made my way through the ranks over the years .
There's tests and accreditation stuff to get by . It's ok as a career , but you miss too much Clemson football !!

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DB23


Unfortunately, all other politics aside, we are not the good guys right now.

[3]
Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 12:27 PM
 

One only need look at current EPA leadership and repeal of enviromental protections over the last 2 years to see that we are not leaders on the environmental front. Also, this should not be a conservative vs liberal argument.

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null


Re: Unfortunately, all other politics aside, we are not the good guys right now.


Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 12:38 PM
 

Unfortunately, we cannot put our economy in a straight jacket when China, India, Indonesia and others are able to swing their arms freely at us. That is the #1 issue. We cannot unilaterally disarm our ability to compete in the global economy by hamstringing our consumption of inexpensive energy sources... environment be ######. Sad, sad reality of the situation actually.

I am not averse to green energy, but it has to be practical and inexpensive. You cannot transport goods across this nation on electric trucks. Or fly planes. Or expect consumers to stop wanting to tow their RVa and boats and stop them from wanting to drive safer, large SUVs.

I like the idealism,nut unfortunately, reality is what we must face. And unless we empower some central authority to make and enforce these lifestyle choices from the top down (warning, if that is the approach, freedom is toast), humans are never going to address this holistically anytime in our lifetimes.

Just the truth...

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I think that is true to an extext, but also sounds

[1]
Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 1:48 PM
 

like saying. Well if we can't get it completely right we shouldn't even try.
Industry is more difficult than individual I think. But consider tobacco.. once expensive tax was added, tobacco use decreased.

To use your reference, we have some of the cheapest gas in the world (spent $7-8 per gallon in Costa Rica last week). Increase gas tax and use the funds for renewable energy or mass transit. You'll see SUV sales decline and smaller cars being purchased.

Somehow California creates 635billion BTUs, about 1/4 of its energy usage, from hydroelectric, solar, and wind and has something like the 5th largest economy in the world (not the country, the whole planet Earth!!).. are you suggesting this could not be applied to other states?

Not looking to argue; genuinely interested in seeing our individual and collective conciousness grow and be more innovative/thoughtful.

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null


Re: I think that is true to an extext, but also sounds


Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 2:08 PM
 

I'll suggest that California is going bankrupt hand over fist and should not be held up as an example of anything to emulate. I'll also suggest that to raise fuel prices as you're encouraging would put our economy into a tailspin that would cause dramatic lack and suffering in our country not seen since the great depression. People who affirm such notions have no understanding of economics or our economy at all.


You sir are correct ??***


Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 2:20 PM
 

null


Message was edited by: hufferbilly®


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Fox news is all about California being broke


Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 3:11 PM
 

It's our nation's largest economy and had a $9B budget surplus this year. It's not that hard to be a little more environmentally friendly.


Perhaps you misunderstand CA social spending and its effective GDP economy.


Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 4:54 PM
 

So yes, CA is an economy to emulate in regards to production, but actually should be better with utilizing renewable energy. CAs troubles come on the social spending front.

I don't suggest a $7-8 per gallon, but when gas was $4 under Bush, you saw more smaller car purchases and less big vehicle purchases. Perhaps it was anecdotal, but it happened. And i think its reasonable that people have to consider their fuels consumption when choosing a Suburban because they like a big car.

For the record, I don't pretend to be an expert, but these are my observations..

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null


If you have 3 kids and a dog or two, a compact ain’t gonna


Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 5:54 PM
 

cut it... if you pull a boat or RV, a compact ain’t gonna cut it.

Plus, if you wreck in a Suburban vs a compact, you have a much better outcome.

So explain to me how smaller, lighter cars are better? Other than gas efficiency that is... they are not versatile or safe comparably speaking. Let the market decide.

Now if gas goes up due to resource shortages, that is one thing, but due to taxes, no way! The government will just use that $$ to buy votes and try to socially engineer behavior from DC like the elites they are. Nope. Not the way to go.

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I'll just leave it at this..


Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 6:54 PM
 

I began to type up honest responses, but erased it. We won't agree, and that's ok. I come to tnet for fun and occasionally some real world conversation... No need to create conteoversy here :)
I'm sure we can agree that our D is stout and we have the best coach on the planet leading our program (and us!).

Therefore, GO TIGERS!!

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null


Re: I think that is true to an extext, but also sounds


Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 2:15 PM
 

Have you seen how corrupt and wasteful govt funded mass transit and road systems are? Taxing so govt can reward certain voting areas with these overly expensive boondoggles is absolutely not the way to go.

I believe the market, if allowed to, will solve our transportation problem with automated, self flying “Uber-like”taxis.

But taxing fuel will not get you the results you seek. Look at Atlanta. They throw so much $$ at Marta and it is as useless as #### on a bull.

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Re: I think that is true to an extext, but also sounds


Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 2:19 PM
 

Also, understand the downside of Clear cutting thousands of miles to install massive solar panel and windmill farms. Do you know how harmful those are to the ecosystem? Just saying, that is not the answer for our growing, portable energy needs.

Nukes perhaps, but somehow the greens hate that option, but it is the mosrpt efficient energy producer. Just shoot the waste to the sun from a remote pacific island. It will be like a fart in a whirlwind to the sun. Just spit balling an idea/thought.

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China is bigger on renewables than we are


Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 3:14 PM
 

Courtesy of our recent tarifs on solar.

They are going heavier on solar over in China than we are now. And it's for the explicit purpose of reducing pollution.

We can do the same, too. It's all about politics.


Re: Thanks... you are seeing it personally, so I believe you


Posted: Aug 6, 2018, 2:04 AM
 

I respect the POVs of both you and Doug. No one wants a world full of floating ocean garbage, but it is undeniable that most main stream media outlets are quickest to call out the US as the greatest transgressors. That’s simply not the case. All that said, in as much a our country is and should be a global leader in a variety of issues, In my view it’s encombant on us to set high standards.

We already strive for it, but to highjack a phrase; “best IS the standard”. Even though most media won’t admit it, we’re pretty close to that in terms of our domestic, foreign, and environmental policy. I welcome the sensible and fair evolution of policies that bring everyone up.

2021 purple level member

Interesting article, but it doesn't mean do nothing bc others aren't.

[2]
Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 10:56 AM
 

Why not use bamboo straws instead of plastic? I can't remember the last time I used a plastic bag at grocery or a take out bag from fast food (be better Subway, nobody needs that bag). I bring utensils with my lunch, not new disposable plasticware everyday. I take a cup to Starbuck/coffee shop.. even take our same gabillion ounce soda cup back to the movies.
Do my singular actions make a difference? Yep. I can also be better, but I try. And the more we all do, the better it all is.
I don't ignore the facts of your article, but the more Americans that expect different and make different choices, the more those choices bleed into materials production and therefore availability in other countries.
Cheers, and GO TIGERS!!

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null


It’s amazing that all rational people see this happening


Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 2:45 PM
 

But it can’t seem to be stopped?

Should we be surprised if/when our echo system collapses overnight?


Next thing you are going to say is Calif can't solve CO2


Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 12:21 PM
 

pollution and that other countries produce CO2 so why should we try

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Re: I’m with you and do what I can, BUT...

[1]
Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 12:33 PM
 

Trees is the only thing that I can see that would help turn things around. And the world leaders that really want change for earth our planet, we need to get with a massive program of growing tress for paper and band anything that is made plastic or materials that are made from plastic. We can live without anything that destroys the earth, but we can't live without what the earth has to provide for us to live.

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Great sentiment, but not realistic unfortunately


Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 12:42 PM
 

I’m afraid the genie is out of the bottle at this point... kind of like nuke weapons

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Re: I’m with you and do what I can, BUT...

[1]
Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 3:39 PM
 

You must not hang out on the coast very much, there are tons of plastic products the flow down our rivers. The last decade I've seen 10 times more plastic bottles in the marsh, rivers, etc. than I have in previous decades. It's a global problem, saying we're not the worst offenders doesn't mean we're not offenders


True... I will give you that... we can do better, but


Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 5:56 PM
 

It won’t matter in the big scheme f things. Just sayin

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It's ok to hug trees***

[3]
Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 10:07 AM
 



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Cat on a tin roof, dogs in a pile,
Nothin' left to do but smile, smile, smile!!!!


Yes indeed! Guilty of it myself...??***

[1]
Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 10:14 AM
 



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Re: I’m not a tree hugger...BUT

emoji_events [5]
Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 10:13 AM
 

Dude, 98% of the plastic in the ocean is from China and 3rd world countries. It has to be fixed there. Best way to try to fix it is capitalism and reducing the amounts of poverty in those countries. But that will not happen due to the selfish demands of dictators, socialists and communists in those countries. So sadly those plastic islands will grow until some enterprising person from the West figures out a way to make money off of cleaning up the trash in the ocean from these other countries.

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Now you are just making too much sense... ??***


Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 10:16 AM
 



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Re: I’m not a tree hugger...BUT


Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 10:52 AM
 

I’d imagine tsunamis don’t help matters.


Plastic is Evil...

[1]
Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 10:20 AM
 

Ban Plastic. And posts that don't belong on Tiger Board, but in the Lounge. Or Political Board.

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It isn’t football season just yet... let us fill the void***


Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 11:47 AM
 



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Re: I’m not a tree hugger...BUT

emoji_events [6]
Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 11:08 AM
 

Again, here's where I just grate my teeth at the climate-change-denying derps. Stuff is happening - anybody informed knows that ("informed" probably being the operative word), but here's the thing: we're all going to die a horrible death, choking on plastic bags and cooking slowly in our own greenhouse gasses only if we're real stupid - you know, like putting coal lobbyists in charge of the EPA or something - and continue to put our heads in the sand.

For those who wanna apply their brains, there's this possible solution to the Great Pacific Garbage Patch, which I posted the other day:
https://www.fastcompany.com/40419899/boy-genius-boyan-slats-giant-ocean-cleanup-machine-is-real

Also, scientists just a few months ago discovered an enzyme that actually eats plastic, which might be even cooler:
https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2018/apr/16/scientists-accidentally-create-mutant-enzyme-that-eats-plastic-bottles

Humans - at least when we're not being complete derps - are actually fairly clever creatures, and our ability to create problems is usually exceeded only by our ability to solve them.

The side effects of technology and industrialization do have consequences...often severe ones, if we just ignore them. But if we face our issues, we've got some real good brains among us...and we can resolve those problems, too.


Again, agree wholeheartedly...just don’t think America is...

[1]
Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 12:00 PM
 

The main culprit. Ultimately, American ingenuity will be our saving grace, not putting limits on things in the hopes our constraints will solve these problems while other countries pollute with wreckless abandon. All the concern, outrage, protests and anger needs to be directed at them first and foremost.

Just trying to focus the attention where the problem really exists so the solutions can be actually effective. We produce somthing like 70% of the world’s economy but contribute approximately only 10% to the world’s pollution. While we can do better, we should strangle our economy thinking we will make a dent in things like climate change. If we stopped breathing and all fossil fuel power generation and all cattle farming, it wouldn’t make a dent.

Now something that I do think would make significant progress on climate change is stopping the clear cutting of our land and paving over everything. Embrace green roof systems. If we can get to automated, self flying taxis via a service like Uber or Lyft, we could stop all of the road widening. Traffic becomes verticalized. Owning a car becomes a superfluous to our daily lives. Efficient ridesharing is enabled. Personalized mass transit becomes a reality. And red light inefficiencies and traffic jams disappear.

But alas, humans are not very smart and thus we will middle along until the you know what hits the fan and then scramble like #### to do something innovative. Necessity is the mother of invention after all.

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plastic pollution is far greater threat than global warming

[1]
Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 11:33 AM
 

at least in my mind.

But the straw thing in California is like pissing on a forest fire

2021 white level member

So they banned straws but still give out free needles.


Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 11:43 AM
 

Makes sense.

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There's something in these hills.


Plastic straws...pure evil.***


Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 11:40 AM
 



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There's something in these hills.


Not to brag but at my HHIsland RV Resort for 10 years I’ve

[2]
Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 12:21 PM
 

walked the waters edge of the ICW that passes us and picked up plastics (bottles, bags, etc)..sometimes 2-5 bags worth..

and again on the entry road (fast food wrappers, glass & can beer containers, etc)..

and NOT one time has a resident or stranger stopped, said anything or offered to help me!

The type of stuff on the roadside (fast food wrappers, beer cans, athletic drink bottles) leads me to believe it’s from a younger age group.

Whatever, the few times in 65+ years that i may have ditched a wrapper or bottle has remained with me negatively plus my parents showed/taught me better..

which probably says it All..no parental guidance or teaching Right from Wrong!

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Re: Not to brag but at my HHIsland RV Resort for 10 years I’ve


Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 2:19 PM
 

Lightbulbbill --- Those onlookers may not have stopped and said anything or even offered to help but they sure as hello recognized there was one person who cared enough to do something about it. Thanks for your efforts.

We often hear or read about the need for educational programs to alert us to the pollution problems. My generation was made aware of this problem when we were kids. Those of us who were Boy Scouts participated in "clesn ups" that was a part of our regular program. I attribute much of our pollution to the attitude of many of our citizens. Vermont has an excellent program to prevent the trashing of their state. Deposits on cans, bottles and other items provides an incentive to return the items for refunds. Roadside trash is a rarity.

During my recent trip to England I was amazed at the difference in the amount of litter I observed compared to my past visits. Many of the roadsides were littered with trash, something I saw little of during my last visit. Much of it was hidden because most of their roads do not have shoulders and there is little roadside maintenance. Cigarette butts were everywhere.

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Re: I’m not a tree hugger...BUT

[4]
Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 12:14 PM
 

Humans are the dumbest mammals on this earth, and we will destroy this earth for any and everything on it except for maybe the cockroaches. And when looking at how much we have destroyed already, I don't know if turning back or making a total U turn now at this point, I don't know if earth could be saved. It really saddens and worries me, but I will be ashes before the final count down of turmoil on earth, it will be absolute mayhem!!!

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Amen brotha!***

[1]
Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 12:17 PM
 



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If you’ve ever stood the Redwood Forests in Northern California...

[3]
Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 12:26 PM
 

You realize it’s one of the amazing places in God Earth, and you can’t help but hug one of those massive trees. ??

Our environment is 100% worth protecting- air, land, and sea. It’s not a conservative or liberal issues. We all live here.


I have done that and agree...

[1]
Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 12:31 PM
 

Yosemite is my Mecca... if you see that and don’t believe in God, then there is no hope for your soul...

I think we all agree we need to protect the environment. The hardest part is getting everyone worldwide to agree “how” to achieve that without empowering some centralized, elitist policing power that will surely become corrupt and evil over time.

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recycle it??


Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 12:37 PM
 

cant e melt it down and reuse it??


Nice post


Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 12:38 PM
 

I think plastic probably causes cancer, I try and avoid it at all costs. Aluminum in deodorant is another thing I avoid completely. HFCS is another

For relaxing times, make it Suntory time


Re: Nice post

[1]
Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 12:43 PM
 

I think that each of us has an obligation to our selves to stop buying anything plastic or anything that has the same effect on earth as plastic. If people are going to continue to kill them selves by smoking, make a law against putting filters on them bc the butts are also a huge pollutant.

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we should outlaw fast food companies that use

[1]
Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 1:45 PM
 

so much paper and plastic to serve food. If people want to eat that #### okay, but there needs to be laws imposed to protect the rest of us from their trash.

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You are correct and wise... ??***

[1]
Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 12:45 PM
 



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"Plastics don't kill wildlife, people kill wildlife."


Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 1:38 PM
 

Specifically, stupid, trashy, selfish, people who are so lazy they just toss their trash anywhere the wish.

Plus ######### who build nuclear reactors on known fault lines and tsunami zones so they can pollute the whole Northern Hemisphere of the Pacific Ocean with radioactive waste.

https://www.globalresearch.ca/28-signs-that-the-west-coast-is-being-absolutely-fried-with-nuclear-radiation-from-fukushima/5355280


Wildlife kills wildlife. HTH.***

[1]
Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 1:40 PM
 



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Re: "Plastics don't kill wildlife, people kill wildlife."


Posted: Aug 6, 2018, 8:51 AM
 

That is not 100% correct, we are cutting down our forest and pouring concrete and laying asphalt in the very same place that wild life had live since the beginning of time. There is not enough forest to support enough wild life to "help support" human life for a day bc we are grossly over populated!!!

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I'm not a tree hugger either, but


Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 3:37 PM
 

I make a conscious effort to avoid plastics that are not recyclable, all my food containers etc. going to recycle bin, if a plastic is not recyclable, I will opt for a different material that is. This does not take much effort and will actually save you money if you are conscious of it.


Re: I'm not a tree hugger either, but


Posted: Aug 6, 2018, 7:04 AM
 

Most litter on the shoulder-ditch of our roads are there because of 2 things..Good ole boys throwing stuff in the back of their F-550 and ######### taking trash to landfills with an uncovered load.

2021 white level member

Also endorse draft beer! Kegs are reusable!***

[1]
Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 5:10 PM
 



nullbadge-donor-05yr.jpg

Buy Glass It Recycles 100% No Downcycling Nonsense


Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 5:44 PM
 

When not recycled it can harmlessly bread down to its natural components of sand, soda ash and lime. Even modern inks are fully biodegradeable

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Aluminum Cans Are Bad As Well They Are Lined With Plastic

[1]
Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 5:46 PM
 

You are not drinking beer from metal, you are drinking it from plastic.......YUCK

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totally with you on this one***


Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 5:57 PM
 



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Re: I’m not a tree hugger...BUT


Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 6:47 PM
 

Reuse glass bottles....oops the cola companies invented the plastic bottle. It’s cheaper for the to let someone else deal with their garbage

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We do Chicken right...it's not just for frying anymore!


Re: I’m not a tree hugger...BUT


Posted: Aug 5, 2018, 7:11 PM
 

BTW, California is not going bankrupt.
They have a lot of solar in California because the numbers make sense. Utility companies can now buy solar cheaper than coal. Solar has its drawbacks, it’s only available during daylight, but scheduling is clearly pretty easy. Bottom line is, when it’s daylight, solar is a lot cheaper than coal. Coal is done and over and it has nothing to do with Trump or Obama, it’s economics. With that said, coal and oil still receive billions of dollars of annual subsidies that were put in place over 80 years ago and do not require annual renewals. Merry Christmas. :)


The mealworm to the rescue...


Posted: Aug 6, 2018, 1:36 AM
 

https://earth911.com/inspire/mealworms-plastic/

2021 white level memberbadge-donor-05yr.jpg

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