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Scout Team [178]
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It has to be friggin tough...
Apr 8, 2015, 9:45 PM
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....to be Jack. Lets be honest, the man knows as much baseball as anyone in the country and he his just having a hard time getting his players to execute. Like I said in an earlier post, he did not bobble the balls, make wild throws, and get picked off third base with one out. I can only imagine being in his shoes and just grimacing every time a 18 year old screws up knowing that people are going to start riding his ### about it. CLEMSON NEEDS A PLAYERS ONLY MEETING WITH SOME VINEGAR IN IT!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Heisman Winner [111189]
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Re: It has to be friggin tough...
Apr 8, 2015, 9:49 PM
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I knew there was at least one of you left.
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Scout Team [178]
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Re: It has to be friggin tough...
Apr 8, 2015, 9:50 PM
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Haaaa there is more than me.
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110%er [6937]
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Re: Therein, lies our problem.***
Apr 9, 2015, 8:35 AM
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Starter [390]
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it is really tough being a tiger baseball fan
Apr 8, 2015, 9:49 PM
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Program has been in decline for the past 8 years.
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Scout Team [178]
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Re: it is really tough being a tiger baseball fan
Apr 8, 2015, 9:54 PM
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Don't get me wrong, I know the captain is responsible for the ship, but the only thing I think Jack waited a bit too long on was maybe changing the way pitches were called. Now it seems like our pitchers are on the right path and then the defense and hitting takes a break....just frustrating for everyone.
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Trainer [39]
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Re: it is really tough being a tiger baseball fan
Apr 8, 2015, 10:05 PM
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A good leader takes ownership of any situation. He has not figured out or corrected the fact that errors are made in what seems like, every game. Why can't the SS make simple throws to 1st. High left, high right, in the dirt....From someone living roughly 1000 miles away only being able to watch games via the internet, I just don't see him doing anything substantial. That's just me....and I've seen enough and read enough that I just can't make anymore posts on baseball....some may say heck yeah....but don't really care.
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All-In [30746]
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Freshman [1]
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Re: It has to be friggin tough...
Apr 8, 2015, 10:11 PM
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Agreed. Everyone wants to blame a hall of fame coach. Players need to pick it up.
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110%er [7104]
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If you would remove the words...
Apr 8, 2015, 10:12 PM
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A ONLY MEETING WITH SOME VINEGAR IN IT
from your last sentence, I think you'd have a solution for Jack's problem.
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Scout Team [170]
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Re: It has to be friggin tough...
Apr 8, 2015, 10:15 PM
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Jboy...I have to disagree with you. The buck stops and dies with the head man and that my friend is JL. He is the one who is making the big bucks and gets huge raises when the team makes the post season. On the flip side of that he also owns the lack of wining and bad performance by coaches and players. I have been to approximately 20 games this year both home and away. My observations have been the team lacks any chemistry. The players and coaches appear to be just absolutely flat. My thoughts are the players have given up on JL and he has lost their respect. When the players are happy and engaged in a program, they catch better, hit better, run faster, and just give more effort. It's time for a change. Clemson is better than this. Go Tigers!!
trek5500
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110%er [6321]
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but don't you think it is odd....
Apr 8, 2015, 10:17 PM
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that this has been going on for several seasons? Baseball went downhill when all the good assistants left for other programs...in which they succeeded. Most head coaches are only as good as the assistants and from what has been said many times, he can not get any good assistants work for him anymore. So, he ends up with Pep and Lecroy. IMO, both assts. try to change a player's pitching and batting. Why change it it was enough to get them recruited? Just my 2cents worth.
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Scout Team [178]
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Re: but don't you think it is odd....
Apr 8, 2015, 10:23 PM
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I stated before that I understand the Head Man is ultimately responsible. They do need a charge, I agree with your statement that they seem flat and unemotional at times.
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Scout Team [170]
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Re: but don't you think it is odd....
Apr 8, 2015, 10:32 PM
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Sorry I failed to read the posts after the first one. We are all Tigers for except for the house coots and know the history of Tiger baseball. We just expect a better team to be fielded. I really feel badly for the kids on the team. I'm sure they are all fantastic bb players or the would not be on the team. They must feel trapped. Hopefully they hang with the program and wait for the change.
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CU Medallion [55241]
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110%er [6937]
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CU Guru [1400]
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When you are 33 games into the season
Apr 8, 2015, 10:41 PM
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it's no longer a player problem.
And even if it were a player problem then it' still a coaching problem because he's the one that has trotted out a mostly unchanged lineup for 33 games.
At some point reality is going to set in with you that even though Jack has had a hall of fame career there has been a gradual decline over the past few years and we finally have gone over the cliff this year.
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CU Medallion [55241]
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Re: It has to be friggin tough...
Apr 8, 2015, 10:59 PM
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Yep, it has been the same problem last year and before and before. That's on Jack right now, and it will be on Jack and D Rat if it's still happening next year.
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CU Guru [1427]
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Re: It has to be friggin tough...
Apr 8, 2015, 11:04 PM
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Plenty of blame to go around but I also believe the players are not holding up their end of the bargain. I am disappointed they don't exhibit more pride. Too many of them appear to be happy and content to be on the team. And yes, it ultimately falls back on Jack if they don't produce.
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Varsity [203]
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Re: It has to be friggin tough...
Apr 8, 2015, 11:12 PM
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JBOYBOYD seriously... a player meeting is needed??"Vinegar"???...."Friggin tough" ...for how long....? CU baseball hasn't done squat for 6+ years so how is it the players? These players (who by the way move on every 4 years-or less- in case you haven't figured that out yet).Place the blame where it belongs---no enthusiasim,lack of motivation, average recruiting, many errors, no spirit---that's on JL.PERIOD!!
As the saying goes... "sh#% flows down hill" and JL has been at the top of that hill for a LONG time and just like any well paid CEO you have to produce or go.CU gave T Bowden a LONG time-10 years and JL has had 27(?) with the last 6+ years just plain pitiful."Coward" CEO's place blame on everyone else around them so let's see what transpires.MY bet...assistant's heads will roll before "arrogant" JL will take the fall.
D Rad needs SERIOUSLY to evaluate basketball.baseball and men's golf.... all records not up to CU standards.THEY CAN"T LIVE ON YOUR LAURELS or in the case of the basketball program "we'll be competitive because we spend $62m on a renovated facility"? BS! Golf and baseball have their facilities and where are the results? Heck... want results look at Track...Track has crap facilities and they win ACC Championships, produce NCAA Champions and World Champions --- check their record over the past 10 years.More $$ for Track ---they deliver!
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CU Medallion [55241]
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Re: It has to be friggin tough...
Apr 9, 2015, 1:43 AM
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Absolutely!!!
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CU Guru [1464]
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Is that you JackLeg? Step away from the keyboard.***
Apr 8, 2015, 11:36 PM
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CU Guru [1464]
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It was over in 2004, I just didn't realize it until 2010.
Apr 8, 2015, 11:40 PM
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Not for sure. I suspected it in 2008..thought in 2009 we should start looking to the future. 2010 I knew it was time.
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CU Guru [1111]
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bottom line SC player would run thru wall for Tanner CU play
Apr 9, 2015, 6:35 AM
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ers would not for Leggett
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All-TigerNet [14450]
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Re: bottom line SC player would run thru wall for Tanner CU play
Apr 9, 2015, 7:11 AM
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well we know kreiger and crownover would. probably others. we have plenty of problems, to many to talk about. but it aint players not liking the coach. yet another bs excuse.
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Legend [19352]
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Re: It has to be friggin tough...
Apr 9, 2015, 7:25 AM
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wow...
When it has been happening for over a decade maybe you should look at the common denominator.
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All-TigerNet [14450]
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Re: It has to be friggin tough...
Apr 9, 2015, 7:28 AM
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uh that did not seem to be the question. no doubt in my mind change will be made but it will not be because the players dont like the coach.
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Legend [19352]
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Re: It has to be friggin tough...
Apr 9, 2015, 7:30 AM
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You responding to the right guy deroberts?
I havnet made a statement saying they dont like Jack.
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All-TigerNet [14450]
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Re: It has to be friggin tough...
Apr 9, 2015, 8:02 AM
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gosh, looked like you were responding to my response. sorry.
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Legend [19352]
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Re: It has to be friggin tough...
Apr 9, 2015, 8:04 AM
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not a problem man
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Legend [17577]
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May I remind you that TB constantly laid blame...
Apr 9, 2015, 8:08 AM
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..at his players' feet. How'd that coaching change work out?
Not saying that Jack's blaming his players, but lack of fundamentals is the coach's accountability.
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All-TigerNet [13031]
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Re: It has to be friggin tough...
Apr 9, 2015, 8:09 AM
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> ....to be Jack. Lets be honest, the man knows as
> much baseball as anyone in the country and he his
> just having a hard time getting players
Fixed it for you.
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110%er [6937]
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Re: Jack Leggett recruited this team. The ultimate ...
Apr 9, 2015, 8:34 AM
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responsibility lies at his feet.
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All-In [43977]
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So what you're saying is, he knows a lot but isn't a very good teacher.
Apr 9, 2015, 8:48 AM
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Sounds like he only has 1 of the 2 qualities needed to be a successful coach.
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Scout Team [178]
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Re: So what you're saying is, he knows a lot but isn't a very good teacher.
Apr 9, 2015, 12:15 PM
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I do think Jack may have been a bit too slow to pull the plug on a couple of players and run someone else out there for an extended try....2-3 consecutive games to see if they can get into a flow.
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Scout Team [178]
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Re: So what you're saying is, he knows a lot but isn't a very good teacher.
Apr 9, 2015, 12:17 PM
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I am sure that if we went to practice we would see every infielder cleanly field a hundred ground balls and make the throw to first without having to have the first baseman make a 'nice save' each time. Somehow the skills are not translating to the game.
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CU Guru [1400]
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Guess what
Apr 9, 2015, 5:32 PM
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that's still a coaching failure since we have had all of these issues for significant stretches at some point over the past few years. This year is just the culmination. Instead of correcting one issue then having another pop up like it has been we had all of our issues......the shoddy defense, the lack of hitting in clutch situations, the baserunning blunders, the lack of performance of the pitching staff outside of the Ace, the lack of plate awareness by out batters....rear their heads at once.
If this were just something that showed up this year you could write it off as a player issue. When these issues have become a perennial thing even after an almost complete roster turnover you have to start to ask yourself if the players are indeed the problem.
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Orange Blooded [2519]
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No, but it's his job to get players to play good defense.
Apr 9, 2015, 5:35 PM
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Defense is mostly a matter of repetition and can be coached.
When usuc beat us in 2010 CWS, they beat us b/c of solid defense. THey weren't more talented, they were better at fundamentals.
Leggett's teams have had suspect defensive play for several years now. That's coaching more than anything.
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Scout Team [178]
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Re: No, but it's his job to get players to play good defense.
Apr 9, 2015, 5:48 PM
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In all honesty do you think that in college you have to teach a kid to field the ground ball and throw it to first? It is just the pressure of performing in the game that seems to come up and bite us. I would venture to guess that you could take every shortstop in the ACC, put them on the field at Daniels High School one Saturday morning and hit them 50 ground balls each and you would walk away being impressed with each one. Don't get me wrong, I do agree with performance coming down to the coaches, but I think it is MUCH less classified as a recruiting issue and more being able to find a way to motivate the players to just relax and play baseball. IMHO our at bats have not looked any different than our opponents for the most part. If you could teach clutch hitting, you would never lose a game...ever.
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110%er [6321]
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Re: No, but it's his job to get players to play good defense.
Apr 9, 2015, 9:20 PM
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any college batting coach worth anything should be able to teach clutch hitting. Clutch hitting is partly mental, but a coach should have taught players how to swing at certain pitches. A slow curve ball should be swung at faster and harder to get any velocity. He should be able to teach a player how to hit the ball to certain spots on the field. He should teach how to hit certain pitches. He should teach them how to hit the ball in the opposite direction. He should teach them timing of certain pitches. If he does his job and has the kid ready mentally, he should be able to hit the ball in a clutch hitting situation.
With all that said, we don't have a good batting coach and it shows
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Scout Team [178]
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Re: No, but it's his job to get players to play good defense.
Apr 9, 2015, 9:57 PM
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Hmmm based on that logic I would just coach 'clutch' hitting for every at bat...then the sky would be the limit!
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110%er [6321]
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Re: No, but it's his job to get players to play good defense.
Apr 9, 2015, 11:08 PM
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that is not even close to what I said.
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Scout Team [178]
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Re: No, but it's his job to get players to play good defense.
Apr 10, 2015, 8:41 AM
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Sorry...I must have misread:
"any college batting coach worth anything should be able to teach clutch hitting"
It can't be taught. Neither can clutch putting, clutch field goals, clutch free throws, clutch anything. "Clutch players" have an innate ability to repeat a successfully learned skill in pressure situations....can not be taught.
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Orange Blooded [2519]
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Scout Team [178]
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Re: Clutch is less coachable and more onthe player's mentality
Apr 9, 2015, 10:09 PM
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I will agree that many times our players do not look like they are trying to use all fields and seem a bit reluctant to 'hit it where it is pitched' so to speak.
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110%er [6321]
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Re: Clutch is less coachable and more onthe player's mentality
Apr 9, 2015, 11:11 PM
[ in reply to Clutch is less coachable and more onthe player's mentality ] |
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oh, I agree that clutch hitting is mental as I stated in my post. If a coach knew his players well enough he would know which ones to work with as far as the mental every at bat. Kids are different and he should realize that
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Orange Blooded [4098]
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Re: It has to be friggin tough...
Apr 9, 2015, 10:07 PM
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they already6 had one!! what improved?? not hitting,baserunnning,not throwing, not getting a man home from 3rd with NO OUTS.. the list is long!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Scout Team [178]
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Re: It has to be friggin tough...
Apr 9, 2015, 10:12 PM
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Bottom line, coaches get too much credit for wins and too much blame for losses....you win with what you load the bus with....ie Miami Heat.
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