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Oculus Spirit [80921]
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"the American people — don’t deserve a straight answer on
Oct 14, 2020, 12:00 PM
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court packing"
Interesting. I should try this tactic on my next job interview when asked about an important aspect of the job. "I'm not sure I want to tell you that, and you don't deserve to know my opinion until after you hire me"
I wonder how quick they'll be to offer me a gig?
https://www.washingtonpost.com/outlook/2020/10/12/court-packing-biden-threat-supreme/
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Hall of Famer [22380]
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the Republican healthcare "plan" and pre-existing conditions
Oct 14, 2020, 12:12 PM
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protections?
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Oculus Spirit [80921]
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ACA, that was crammed into law at 12:30 am that we had to
Oct 14, 2020, 12:13 PM
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read the law so we know what's in it?
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Hall of Famer [22380]
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So much for your original "point."***
Oct 14, 2020, 12:14 PM
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Oculus Spirit [80921]
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Except no one crammed a republican healthcare bill into law***
Oct 14, 2020, 12:36 PM
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All-In [34089]
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Or even proposed one.***
Oct 14, 2020, 1:36 PM
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Oculus Spirit [80921]
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That really wasn't his attempted point, was it?***
Oct 14, 2020, 2:26 PM
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All-In [34089]
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He can correct me, but I think it was exactly his point.***
Oct 14, 2020, 2:57 PM
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Oculus Spirit [80921]
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I'd like to read his explanation
Oct 14, 2020, 3:24 PM
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As the two topics really have nothing to do with each other.
Which is yet another lib attempted redirection.
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All-In [34089]
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That's correct.
Oct 14, 2020, 3:49 PM
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It's merely a whataboutism to show that dodging questions is something politicians do all the time.
It doesn't make it OK for Biden to dodge an issue just because a bunch of Republicans dodge issues.
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CU Guru [1405]
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Oculus Spirit [80921]
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WOT?
Oct 14, 2020, 3:47 PM
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It passed the house on March 21, 2010, by a 219 – 212 vote. No republicans voted for it. 2 days later Obama signed it into law.
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All-In [34089]
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Re: WOT?
Oct 14, 2020, 3:51 PM
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He's referring to its source. It was McCain's version with the individual mandate, rather than the one Obama campaigned on. Before McCain had it, the Heritage Foundation developed it.
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Legend [15730]
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There is a fundamental difference between Biden’s stance on a bery
Oct 14, 2020, 12:39 PM
[ in reply to the Republican healthcare "plan" and pre-existing conditions ] |
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Clear concept - court packing - and a complete proposal on US Healthcare that would take legislative debate etc.
Terrible comparison.
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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one thing would have made this a non-issue...
Oct 14, 2020, 12:58 PM
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if Trump and the pubs had a plan. They all say they want to keep pre-existing conditions, but we have NO plan in front of people to show.
So, when it is pointed out by the dems that Trump and the pubs want to repeal the ACA, there is no leg to stand on, because the alternative is nothing. There should be a plan ready to put in place if the ACA is repealed.
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All-In [26968]
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My observation is that they use the ACA as a bogeyman
Oct 14, 2020, 2:15 PM
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for political motivation. But there's not actually a substantive rebuttal or alternative to it.
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All-In [38514]
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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It's reality...
Oct 14, 2020, 2:40 PM
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I TRY to stay objective.
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Oculus Spirit [80921]
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There is no argument to that.
Oct 14, 2020, 2:39 PM
[ in reply to one thing would have made this a non-issue... ] |
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That, and they are two completely different incomparable topics.
I note that several libs have attempted that same line of redirection in this thread by making analogies that have nothing to do with each other. Odd how they like to change the topic.
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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I don't know....
Oct 14, 2020, 2:49 PM
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there are several libs on here that I've quit reading their garbage.
My argument here is that it is true that Trump and Republicans sy they don't want to take away pre-existing conditions. I believe they think this, but without a plan ready to be put in ACAs place that hads pre-existing conditions covered, the reality is repealing ACA would mean pre-existing conditions would not be covered.
Now if we want to talk about ACA being crammed down our throats...that is true as well. I believe the way it was handled is exactly why the dems lost the majority in Congress in 2010.
The truth is, both parties think there are significant problems with the ACA, but NOBODY is trying to really fix it.
So, we are stuck with "pre-existing conditions" as a political football because Congress can't get anything done across the aisles.
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Oculus Spirit [80921]
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Going back to Tbag's post..what does ACA have to do with
Oct 14, 2020, 2:52 PM
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court packing?
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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I got ya***
Oct 14, 2020, 2:53 PM
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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Oculus Spirit [82957]
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His answer should be:"I haven't decided yet."
Oct 14, 2020, 12:24 PM
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Which is probably the truth.
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Oculus Spirit [80921]
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He told you what he thought, as has Harris.
Oct 14, 2020, 12:27 PM
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For some reason, liberals, and the media, don't want to say it.
Apparently, "we don't deserve to know" his answer.
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CU Medallion [55989]
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I don't think the non-answer is an answer.
Oct 14, 2020, 12:36 PM
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The left wants court packing and I think Biden doesn't want to say he won't do it because he doesn't want to lose their vote.
That said, flat out refusing to answer is a really odd solution.
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Oculus Spirit [80921]
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He's not going to lose the lefts vote
Oct 14, 2020, 12:39 PM
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He could say pretty much anything; I mean look at his history with creepily touching kids and women, and women are polling like 2/3 favorable towards Biden.
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All-TigerNet [10354]
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he's trying to keep both the Left and moderates happy, but..
Oct 14, 2020, 12:41 PM
[ in reply to I don't think the non-answer is an answer. ] |
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the reality is that he doesn't "need" the LEFT vote, they're voting against Trump regardless. The moderates are the ones he needs more, I think he's winning either way, but there would be no question if he just said "not packing the court" and the moderates vote Biden and the left votes Biden.
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All-In [34089]
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He actually does need the left vote.
Oct 14, 2020, 1:43 PM
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Some of them are considering not voting at all because they don't know if there's any important difference between Biden and Trump.
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All-In [34089]
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CU Medallion [55989]
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But now not answering has become the story.
Oct 14, 2020, 1:44 PM
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It's the Kobayashi Maru of 2020 campaign questions.
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All-In [34089]
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hahaha
Oct 14, 2020, 1:47 PM
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But it's barely a story. It's just Trumpers making a stink about it. Are there any Biden voters rethinking their vote over it?
Meanwhile, if Biden says yes it becomes an insane campaign promise, and if he says no he turns off the SJWs who were about to vote for him.
There is a solution, which is actually what he's doing. It's not perfect but it might save the Maru.
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Oculus Spirit [80921]
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I'm no trumper, but I do have a problem with making the
Oct 14, 2020, 2:42 PM
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SCOTUS a kangaroo court by needlessly expanding what has worked for 151 years.
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All-In [34089]
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Re: I'm no trumper, but I do have a problem with making the
Oct 14, 2020, 2:59 PM
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I'm against adding 18 new Justices in one year, but I'm fully in favor of gradually expanding the number by that amount over 9 years.
Will your vote depend on whether Biden answers the court-packing question?
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Oculus Spirit [80921]
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I'm not voting.
Oct 14, 2020, 3:19 PM
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So, no, it won't.
I doubt anyone who is voting for Biden it would matter, either. Because they don't want Biden, they just want Trump gone.
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All-In [47785]
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Oculus Spirit [82957]
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Sure. There’s a whole multitude of people he needs to check
Oct 14, 2020, 12:38 PM
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with.
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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I do think this is one thing he is telling the truth about
Oct 14, 2020, 12:53 PM
[ in reply to His answer should be:"I haven't decided yet." ] |
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but I believe someone running for POTUS should have an answer for the question.
With that said, I don't think his answer changes any votes.
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All-In [34089]
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Right. And it's not up to him.
Oct 14, 2020, 1:34 PM
[ in reply to His answer should be:"I haven't decided yet." ] |
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But any answer will become the news story, and there's nothing to be gained for Biden's electoral chances in that.
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Oculus Spirit [80921]
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Its not going to be the new SCOTUS judge to
Oct 14, 2020, 2:30 PM
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overturn Roe v Wade, or a million other things she's being asked her opinion of. Certainly, she'll have input (like Biden would about court packing) but she can't decide any issues she is being asked by herself.
But this is another one of those things you know, but say it anyway.
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All-In [41908]
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Which means we already know the answer.
Oct 14, 2020, 12:50 PM
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They're going to pack the court.
And for the record, I'm not a fan.
Kind of wish the Supreme Court had its members serve terms, not life appointments, but whatever.
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CU Medallion [55989]
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But if the non-answer is the answer, then there's no
Oct 14, 2020, 1:03 PM
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benefit from refusing to answer the question. They must have considered that when they arrived at their decision to refuse answering the question.
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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sometimes the answer isn't even the answer...
Oct 14, 2020, 1:07 PM
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so the same questions keep getting asked.
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All-In [31822]
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His mumbling non-answer 2 days ago....
Oct 14, 2020, 2:15 PM
[ in reply to Which means we already know the answer. ] |
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made it sound like he didn't favor expanding the court.
My bet would be that he would be against is. He is a traditionalist at heart.
I understand politically why he's not answering the question, but he SHOULD be answering the question. He's just trying to keep the liberal side of his party turning out.
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All-In [41908]
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I could see how he's not...
Oct 14, 2020, 2:17 PM
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But I'm not sure how much the party is going to let him drive the car in January.
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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Pelosi is working toward getting POA...
Oct 14, 2020, 2:37 PM
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and taking the license away pretty early.
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All-In [41908]
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No doubt.
Oct 14, 2020, 2:41 PM
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In 2016, it was, "Hey, y'all ready for a woman president?!"
And America was like, "Nah, not THAT woman president. We'll take a complete moron before her."
And this year it's, "Listen up, b!tches. You're getting a woman president."
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All-In [31822]
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Yeah, everyone is saying that, but...
Oct 14, 2020, 2:55 PM
[ in reply to I could see how he's not... ] |
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once he's sworn in, he can do what he pleases, within limits. He's not going for a 2nd term, so he will be much less controlled by party than most 1st term Presidents.
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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Legend [15492]
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Re: His mumbling non-answer 2 days ago....
Oct 14, 2020, 2:38 PM
[ in reply to His mumbling non-answer 2 days ago.... ] |
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made it sound like he didn't favor expanding the court.
My bet would be that he would be against is. He is a traditionalist at heart.
I understand politically why he's not answering the question, but he SHOULD be answering the question. He's just trying to keep the liberal side of his party turning out.
Seems like campaigns are much like war. The first casualty is truth.
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Orange Blooded [2688]
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the history is too messy for a Dem candidate to address
Oct 14, 2020, 12:55 PM
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if you go there you will stuck in the weeds trying to explain the ugly history. The only way to address it is to attack Mitch McConnell and his role as Senate Minority and Majority Leader for the last two decades. Attack him for acting like a petty tyrant. Unfortunately, the Dems are actually quite horrible at playing this game.
The question is whether, in the year of Covid, the average voter cares that Mitch McConnell blocked 105 Obama appointments or wouldn't consider the appointment of Merrick Garland 270 days before the election? I doubt they care much about it which is why Biden & Harris are stuck suggesting that only way forward is for the electorate in 2020 to decide whether Mitch McConnell can keep playing these games.
It is better to table the issue until after the election because it is way too messy and would negatively reflect the current impotence of your party in the Senate.
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Oculus Spirit [80921]
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How does Mitch McConnell blocking 105 Obama appts
Oct 14, 2020, 2:33 PM
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have anything to do with Biden not answering if he supports packing the SCOTUS?
And why are you conflating two completely different subjects?
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Orange Blooded [2688]
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Re: How does Mitch McConnell blocking 105 Obama appts
Oct 14, 2020, 9:16 PM
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Because McConnell brigading the Senate over judicial appointments is central to the plot. Without him, you wouldn't even have this question.
And your challenge to me here is exactly why Biden and Harris shouldn't even touch it. No one wants to do a root-cause analysis because it is primarily about raw power of the Senate majority. Til you have it in your hand, there is nothing you can really do, so no point to even answering the question. Otherwise you risk years later being called out as a hypocrite a la Lyndsey Graham.
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Orange Blooded [3501]
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I wonder which we will get first
Oct 14, 2020, 1:10 PM
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Biden’s answer or a good look at Trump’s tax returns?
For the record, I’m not a fan of packing the court, but dems are going to have to play hardball if they want to want to level the playing field that McConnell has spent years modifying to ensure minority rule in the country for decades to come.
So, if dems take control...do away with the filibuster, pack the court, and grant statehood to PR and DC...it would be a wild abuse of power IMO...the pubs would have no one to blame but themselves.
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Oculus Spirit [80921]
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Will I hit the powerball first, or just ex-pat to Costa Rica
Oct 14, 2020, 2:35 PM
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first?
WTH does one thing have to do with the other?
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All-In [34089]
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Prediction: If the Dems actually had control of Congress
Oct 14, 2020, 1:36 PM
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and Biden won, they still wouldn't change the number of Justices.
At best, they'll add some much needed rules like age limits.
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All-In [26968]
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Wouldn't they need 60 votes in the Senate anyway?***
Oct 14, 2020, 2:19 PM
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CU Medallion [50635]
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the rules of the senate are set by majority vote
Oct 14, 2020, 3:15 PM
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so if if the dems control the senate they can do away with the 60 vote
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Legend [15492]
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I think it's interesting the fear the Dems will engage in
Oct 14, 2020, 2:28 PM
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court-packing while at the same time, the Pubs are currently, actively engaged in court-packing.
Hypocrisy is strong in that group.
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Oculus Spirit [80921]
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There are courts that are being expanded to only allow
Oct 14, 2020, 2:37 PM
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conservative judges? Where is that happening?
And what does that have to do with bakeries and masks?
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Orange Blooded [3993]
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Re: "the American people — don’t deserve a straight answer on
Oct 14, 2020, 2:38 PM
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Do you feel the same on a Supreme Court nominee who won't give a straight answer on Roe vs Wade or whether a sitting POTUS can pardon himself?
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Oculus Spirit [80921]
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Do I feel we don't deserve an answer?
Oct 14, 2020, 2:43 PM
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Because you really don't care what I think, what do YOU think?
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Orange Blooded [3993]
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Re: Do I feel we don't deserve an answer?
Oct 14, 2020, 2:49 PM
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Did I expose your hypocrisy? My bad
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Oculus Spirit [80921]
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Your bad...what?
Oct 14, 2020, 3:11 PM
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As I don't know you from anyone, I'm not sure why you care about my opinion, about anything. I feel that you don't, and as shown, you are attempting to catch me in some "gotcha" moment. You've failed.
But to answer you so you'll be able to sleep tonight, personally I don't care what any supreme court decision is on Roe V Wade. It's not a topic that will ever affect my life as I'm not a woman who desires access to an abortion. The nominees opinion, which from what I've read seems to revolve around super precedents and technicalities of the law, seem like something I'd want to hear from someone who practices law above a level that involves divorces or personal injury cases.
So before you ask because you seem very concerned, my personal opinion of abortion is that if you are a woman of sound mind and want an abortion, you should be able to get one if you can pay for it. I'm not sure Roe V Wade as a case really has anything to do with that ability, as my rudimentary understanding revolves around "excessive government intervention", and doesn't make abortion illegal. I could be completely incorrect about that, however, as I've never cared enough to look into it with more than a cursory 2 second google search, because, as I've stated, I don't really care because IT WON'T EVER AFFECT ME.
As to Trump pardoning himself, I'm not sure how that would work. I'd imagine a court somewhere would probably have to examine that legality with that same fervor of knowing "what "is" is". That might be something I'd be entertained by Amy Coney Barett's opinion on.
so sorry..no gotcha today, regardless of "your bad".
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