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All-In [26968]
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A thought I've been bouncing around: Conspiracy Theories
Nov 30, 2020, 1:58 PM
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By "conspiracy theory," I mean the belief or idea that something unproven has occurred or is occurring, that involves significant malevolent collusion among parties that are in authority or typically trusted.
I come at it, like I do a lot of things, from a spiritual perspective. (Many of you would probably use the word "religious" there...same meaning.)
The thought is this: Conspiracy theories are gossip on a large scale. It's discussing people doing wrong ("conspiracy"), that you really can't say you know for sure about ("theory"). Is it ever right to talk about people doing wrong, when it has yet to be proven that it occurred?
Any thoughts? Agree/disagree? Especially interested in Christian perspectives.
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Heisman Winner [119554]
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Again...is this a Holy-Roller perspective?
Nov 30, 2020, 2:07 PM
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Trying to gauge your spriritual aggressivness...
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Oculus Spirit [93604]
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That's ugly.
Nov 30, 2020, 2:32 PM
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It's an insult to Pentecostals and to a Baptist.
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CU Medallion [59974]
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We put the screws on China
Nov 30, 2020, 2:15 PM
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they released it a virus that has gone world wide. They have wrecked economies and lives. Now, Uncle Joe will come in, cozy up, get some vaccinations out there and the world will be telling their grandkids about 2020.
That isn't a conspiracy, that is fact.
Now I think we need people pointing out what they believe are conspiracies so that if true in nature and then can be proven, they have done good work.
If not proven, let it go and dont try to wreck lives.
This is my main problem with a guy like Alex Jones. The guy has called some stuff and its been proven correct. However he has been so wrong, like Sandy Hook and ruined some lives, it overshadows what he has done that is good. But I feel like we need him and Bill Maher, Keith Olberman, Tucker Carlson. We need all of these guys because they can get some things right. However, they need to learn to say sorry when wrong.
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Oculus Spirit [82972]
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It’s not a fact that China released the virus on the
Nov 30, 2020, 3:34 PM
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world and it’s own people intentionally. That’s another conspiracy theory.
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Letterman [257]
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Haha he’s a moron. “That’s a fact.” I don’t think he knows what a fact is.***
Nov 30, 2020, 3:40 PM
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Legend [17220]
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Read where US Army concluded virus was natural and not
Nov 30, 2020, 3:53 PM
[ in reply to It’s not a fact that China released the virus on the ] |
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genetically manipulated. Apparently still a significant expertise exists regarding biology and chemical weapons.
Not to say China wasn’t honest and forthcoming at the onset. Incompetence and / or cover up seem to be reasonable allegations.
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All-In [26467]
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All-In [48078]
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Re: We put the screws on China
Dec 1, 2020, 6:57 AM
[ in reply to We put the screws on China ] |
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That's laughable. They didn't purposely do it.
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CU Medallion [59974]
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yes they did
Dec 1, 2020, 8:56 AM
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the strain has been altered and contains proteins not found in the novel virus structure. Its interactions with mitochondria and with amino acids isnt really found with other viruses.
china spread a mutated version of coronavirus. it came from a lab and was spread.
you can think what you want and be a sheep, but facts are facts.
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Letterman [257]
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Haha it’s funny to watch the GOP become the conspiracy theory part.
Dec 1, 2020, 9:11 AM
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It’s unfortunate, because the Dems are sucking more and more for different reasons, so it would be great to have a reasonable alternative to support. But the GOP and people like you are quickly making the party a clown show.
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Oculus Spirit [93604]
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Re: A thought I've been bouncing around: Conspiracy Theories
Nov 30, 2020, 2:31 PM
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Absolutely agree. Now please watch the video I posted.
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Hall of Famer [24442]
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Two things come to mind:
Nov 30, 2020, 2:32 PM
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1. Christians should be familiar with how conspiracy theories work, because the only explanation for the existence of the New Testament documents - aside from the events actually occurring - is some form of conspiracy, either in the production of the original documents or in a later rewriting. As has been said in this forum many times, conspiracy theories don't usually hold up to examination. But some do occur. Not this one, but some.
2. Both the old and new testaments discuss conditions and events to come as of the time of the writing. Some have occurred, some as yet to occur. People want to understand what those are, and this, I think, leads to the gossip issue you are addressing.
We Christians tend to look beyond the intent of the warnings, wanting to be prepared in an earthly way, and this leads to personalizing those predictions/warnings. It's this guy/group or that guy/group we were warned about, some will say. They become the bad guys, as if all of us are not all equally to blame for evil in the world. We turn the world into us vs them. So yes, in that sense, the desire for special knowledge turns into conspiracy theories which can be called high tech gossip, the result being the division the bible says gossip brings.
If one thinks a thing has happened, should it be investigated? Sure. The difference between that and gossip is a matter of the heart, I suppose, and one's view of where one can find security. If one thinks it can be found by uncovering an earthly conspiracy, the gossip you mention is likely right around the corner.
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Orange Blooded [4365]
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Re: A thought I've been bouncing around: Conspiracy Theories
Nov 30, 2020, 2:55 PM
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I tried to teach my students to be reasonable skeptics.
One of the most effective ways that happened occasionally was to overhear them gossiping about a fellow student and then stop them and ask this question, "have YOU ever beedn accused of something that you did not do ?" When they reflect on it from their perspective, they can easily see how unfair it is to the accused.
The other thing that we, as skeptics, worked on was waiting for evidence before coming to a conclusion. I am willing to take seriously these claims of voter fraud, but i am not coming to any conclusions until I see real evidence.
It seems that many people cannot hold on very long before their suspicions become "facts" - without the supporting evidence.
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All-In [42000]
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Re: A thought I've been bouncing around: Conspiracy Theories
Nov 30, 2020, 3:18 PM
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The world would indeed be simpler if more people took the, "Let me actually look into this possibility before declaring to the public that it is true" attitude. Or if those of us who demand to see evidence first were heard above the loud, frightened, and anxious people who spread the gossip and conspiracies.
Thankfully the ideology of our court system was built on the ideas of the former, and, while certainly not perfect over time, has mostly been effective. We're watching our justice systems smash ridiculous conspiracy theories in real time as we speak.
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All-In [42000]
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Why conspiracy theories, especially harmful ones, develop...
Nov 30, 2020, 2:59 PM
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Has been proven in the past. Conspiracy theories are generally embraced by anxious, frightened people who feel they have lost control. Rage and anger tend to easily disseminate from them as well.
This is not only why Trump's most loyal followers flock to him, but why they believe the garbage he spews along with sources like QAnon.
Trump most appealed to the segment of Americans who felt something deeply wrong and out of control in the world, from immigration issues to what they perceived to be creeping socialism.
Trump spoke comfort to them and helped push the conspiracies that brought them answers to their anxiety and loss of control, like the Obama birther stuff. They were people who were easily conned, and Trump's a skilled con man. Thus, they ignored actual true stories that showed Trump wasn't their type of person, and dismissed the media as "fake news" because the media have to tell them uncomfortable truths.
For four years, they thought that their fear had been reconciled. He was the Spurrier to their little chicken hearts (sorry, Prod).
Now that he's lost, that anxiety, fear, and loss of control has come roaring back. They really weren't prepared for it. So, obviously, the answer is that they delve deeper into conspiracies. No way that giant orange Truth Man could have lost. It must have been evil Dems, and Deep State, and voting software, and fake mail-ins, and guys dropping off ballots in vans, etc.
Frightened little people don't grasp Occam's Razor very well, which applies quite well here: Trump simply lost.
Look at what we're seeing on this board. Trump's most adamant adorers over the past four years are not handling this well. I'm actually legitimately concerned about 88's well being as he has gone full-blown conspiracy. He's scared. T3 has fallen into typical rage (like calling for post-election violence). Lately he's been twisting himself into knots, pretending to be a lawyer and just getting waxed by Spooneye. Some of the big loyalists, as you'll note, have suddenly stopped posting.
They feel a loss of control again. They're scared. So they turn to conspiracy.
So, from a Christian perspective? I dunno. Could we argue that some people cling fervently to religion out of that same fear, anxiety, and loss of control in life?
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/people-drawn-to-conspiracy-theories-share-a-cluster-of-psychological-features/
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Rock Defender [53]
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"They get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or
Nov 30, 2020, 8:56 PM
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antipathy to people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations."
Conspiracy theories that rationalize and validate their world views are the next logical progression.
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Commissioner [940]
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Conspiracy Theories Have Been Around Forever
Dec 1, 2020, 6:55 AM
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The translated prose is kind of a slog, but if you're really interested in the history and psychology of conspiracy theories, check out Umberto Eco's novel, Foucault's Pendulum.
It traces the history of conspiracies back from the Middle Ages--Templars, Rosicrucians, etc. The Q Anon stuff is not new and follows a very old pattern, recycling material that's been grist for the conspiracy mill for a thousand years.
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All-In [26467]
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Liberals are scared of China and Muslim
Dec 1, 2020, 8:58 AM
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Countries ...
China is the greatest polluter in the history of the world. Liberals claim they are the champions of climate change. Then they defend China every chance they get
Muslim countries are abhorrent towards women and gay rights. Liberals claim they are the champions of women and gay rights. Then liberals give pallets of money to Iran
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All-In [42000]
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Re: Liberals are scared of China and Muslim
Dec 1, 2020, 9:09 AM
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Please provide a link to any well-known liberal politician, or anyone on this board for that matter, defending China and Muslim nations.
Didn't all you Trumpies defend Saudi Arabia when they murdered that journalist? Haven't y'all defended them for years?
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All-In [26467]
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u serious Clark?
Dec 1, 2020, 9:18 AM
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Joe biden ... “they aint bad people”
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All-In [26467]
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All-In [42000]
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Oh, is this one of those...
Dec 1, 2020, 9:49 AM
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P&R Classics:
1. Nutjob Trumpie makes outlandish claim.
2. Nutjob Trumpie is challenged to prove his claim.
3. Rather than prove it--because he can't--he replies with "R U Serious?!" and "Why don't you prove that I'm wrong!?"
Because you can't prove it.
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