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Question about end of Miami bkb game
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Question about end of Miami bkb game


Jan 3, 2021, 10:44 AM

Is there some sort of rule that states, unequivocally, that it is physically impossible to catch and shoot when there is 0.3 seconds or less on the clock? In other words, was Miami's only way to win yesterday -- when it had the ball with 0.3 seconds and down by one -- by way of a volley-ball style tip? I seem to recall this rule was put into place to take the guesswork out of the referees' hands. Judging by the reactions of Brownell and the referee once the game was over, I seem to think that is the case. Both were giving the "shot no good" signal, which, of course, was obvious, since the shot did not go in. But perhaps they were saying "shot did not count," since it seemed pretty clear that the Miami player caught the ball and then shot it, rather than just tipped or punched it. If that shot HAD gone in, assuming I am correct about the rule, I believe the referees would have immediately waved it off and would NOT have reviewed it. Man, that would have made some Miami fans mad.

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Re: Question about end of Miami bkb game


Jan 3, 2021, 10:48 AM

Not sure looked like it was out of hands before 0.00 showed. We lost to UCONN on similar play in NCAA tournament. Thankfully it missed.

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Re: Question about end of Miami bkb game


Jan 3, 2021, 10:56 AM

I agree, I believe it was out of his hands before the clock expired. But, if I understand the rule correctly, that is just human error on clock management. BY RULE -- again, if I am correct -- it is IMPOSSIBLE to catch and shoot a ball with 0.3 seconds or less, regardless of what the clock said.

I am painfully aware of that UConn loss, as I sat in horror watching it. But I believe this was before the clock went to tenths of a second. The 0.3 second rule, obviously, would have been put in later.

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I think the rule came about because our UCONN loss was so


Jan 3, 2021, 11:57 AM [ in reply to Re: Question about end of Miami bkb game ]

Controversial.

If not specifically about that one instance, then certainly about that and many other situations where an “impossible” shot stole a win.

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ua r right UConn made a prayer with .04 seconds. that was


Jan 3, 2021, 8:51 PM [ in reply to Re: Question about end of Miami bkb game ]

the 1st Yr. a clock showed tenths of a sec. that was the best team we ever had with Eldon Campbell & Dale David.Might have won it all that yr.

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Re: ua r right UConn made a prayer with .04 seconds. that was


Jan 3, 2021, 10:04 PM

I was in the Garden that night. Still hurts. Boo Young came up big.

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Re: Question about end of Miami bkb game


Jan 3, 2021, 10:49 AM

I thought he did only tip it .

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Re: Question about end of Miami bkb game


Jan 3, 2021, 10:58 AM

I think there is some subjectivity here, but to me it was a catch and shoot. I believe for it to be a tip there can be no clear possession at all. Kind of like volleyball.

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Re: Question about end of Miami bkb game


Jan 3, 2021, 11:22 AM

This is from the 2020-21 NCAA Men's Basketball Rules and Interpretations
Rule 5 -- Scoring and Timing Regulations
Section 1. Scoring/Try for Goal
Art. 19. In any period, when the game clock displays 10ths of seconds and play
is to be resumed by a throw-in or a free throw when 3/10ths (.3) of a second or
less remains on the game clock, a player may not gain control of the ball and
attempt a try for a field goal. Such player can only score a field goal by means
of a tap of a pass or of a missed free throw.

The key here is "gain control," and from what I saw yesterday, the Miami player clearly gained control before he made the shot. That would explain the "shot did not count" gestures that Brownell and the referee made.

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Re: Question about end of Miami bkb game


Jan 3, 2021, 11:31 AM

Brad Brownell on his post game said it would have not counted. The only type of shot in tgatcinstance that you can get off is a tip at the rim.

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That explains why it was not contested very well....


Jan 3, 2021, 11:51 AM

Guys were trying to not give any reason for a foul to be called....
But it was close....
A little too close.

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Re: Question about end of Miami bkb game


Jan 3, 2021, 12:14 PM [ in reply to Re: Question about end of Miami bkb game ]

Ive seen ACC refs do some stranger things. Had it gone I could see them counting it

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Ted Valentine would’ve done his best to count it.***


Jan 3, 2021, 10:01 PM



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"All those 'Fire Brownell' guys can kiss it." -Joseph Girard III

"Everybody needs to know that Coach Brownell is arguably the best coach to come through Clemson." -PJ Hall


Re: Question about end of Miami bkb game


Jan 3, 2021, 9:13 PM [ in reply to Re: Question about end of Miami bkb game ]

You are correct. I thought that the only way it could have counted was a tip. The Miami player clearly caught and controlled it. I don’t think the clock showed 0:00 until it was out of his hand, so that is precisely why you have to take that situation out of the clock operator’s hands.

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Re: Question about end of Miami bkb game


Jan 5, 2021, 9:00 PM [ in reply to Re: Question about end of Miami bkb game ]

You are correct. I thought that the only way it could have counted was a tip. The Miami player clearly caught and controlled it. I don’t think the clock showed 0:00 until it was out of his hand, so that is precisely why you have to take that situation out of the clock operator’s hands.

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Re: Question about end of Miami bkb game


Jan 3, 2021, 7:11 PM

From page 57 of the 2020-2021 NCAA Men's Basketball Rule Book:

"Art. 19. In any period, when the game clock displays 10ths of seconds and play
is to be resumed by a throw-in or a free throw when 3/10ths (.3) of a second or
less remains on the game clock, a player may not gain control of the ball and
attempt a try for a field goal. Such player can only score a field goal by means
of a tap of a pass or of a missed free throw."

So, in other words, a player may only "tap" the ball to the basket. They cannot catch then shoot the ball. A tap and make is good. A catch, throw and make is not allowed.

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Re: Question about end of Miami bkb game


Jan 3, 2021, 7:24 PM

From the same rule book, here's the definition of a "Tap":

"Art. 8. A tap starts when the player’s hand(s) or finger(s) touches the ball.
Art. 9. A tap ends when it is successful, when it is certain that the tap is
unsuccessful, when the ball touches the floor or when the ball becomes dead."

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