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Virtuoso [610]
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I'm tired of hearing about recruiting. It's a BS excuse.
Oct 21, 2013, 4:29 PM
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7 or 8 of our last 10 classes were top 15 classes!!
Recruiting is what Dabo does best. If recruiting is our problem we might as well fire Dabo now, because in terms of "football" it's one of the few things he excels at!!
Sorry folks, but the truth hurts. Bottom line, it's coaching. We had a losing record 3 years ago. Dabo learned some lessons and brought in better people, but Morris' scheme gets shut down by teams that play physical.
Since TB we have finally started winning the games we should win, but in 5 years we have 2 big wins: LSU & UGa. And LSU didn't want to be there and had it won till Les Miles did what he's famous for - blowing a close game with poor clock management. Yea, we went down and scored, but had Miles been smarter they would have won.
We have lost multiple games where we had a TO on the first drive and never recovered and were blown out. That's mental. That's not having heart. That's soft!!
You folks give Dabo wayyy too much credit for things that are not exceptional. Winning 10 & 11 games (out of 13 or 14), in the ACC, with our talent and who we are should be a given. We should be winning at least 11 or 12 games every year.
The "great" things you folks want to celebrate and praise Dabo for are basic goals that we have had since the late 70s. Dabo isn't doing anything exceptional. He's doing what should be expected. What's sad is how bad we have under achieved for so long, which makes doing what's expected look like something extraordinary.
The problem is, Dabo's failures are not just loses, but monumental collapses that should never ever happen. Not once, much less repeatedly. We have earned the "Clemsoning" moniker. No other program in the country has had our talent and so much media love and attention, only to turn around and have so many monumental & disappointing collapses.
There is only one place to point the finger for such repeat failures - coaching!
Two years ago we gave up the most points in bowl game history. Saturday we gave up the most points in Death Valley history. We were heavy favorites vs. WVu. We were ranked #3 going into Saturday with 2 All-Americans and Heisman trophy candidates. And at home only put up 7 points. You kidding me?
Going back to 2011 our loses have been blowouts. We've been dominated and embarrassed in our loses. Yea, everyone loses some games, but teams with this much talent that are ranked in the top 25 consistently and in the hunt for titles should not have any blow out losses, zero, much less every loss being a beat down. USC has owned us 4 years in a row. WVu & FSU were epic fails!
Inconsistency on this level in a team sport is poor coaching. Period.
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CU Medallion [73569]
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I'll take 11-1 every yr imo
Oct 21, 2013, 4:34 PM
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a NC would be bonus but I dont expect it. The only reason this loss hurts more is we imploded. This is the best we have been since Ford and even he lost to the NCST's of the world.
Again, there are only a few undefeated's every yr and only a few 1 loss teams. We are doing great.
But we MUST be the coots this yr.
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Hall of Famer [21848]
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I never want to be the coots....***
Oct 21, 2013, 4:35 PM
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Virtuoso [610]
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Other teams aren't losing the way we lose. It's not just a
Oct 21, 2024, 12:32 AM
[ in reply to I'll take 11-1 every yr imo ] |
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few loses, it's how we lose. Over & over & over again! Anyone that can't understand that has issues.
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Legend [15216]
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We lose like that largely due to
Oct 21, 2013, 4:39 PM
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the type of offense we run combined with Tajh being "off."
When he's off, he's just off and it snowballs. I agree that Chad abandons the run a little quickly, but things can get ugly when you have dumb turnovers right off the bat against an elite level team. You pretty much have to begin to force the issue.
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110%er [7913]
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the offense is too reliant on the QB because I don't see a
Oct 8, 2024, 7:21 AM
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talented RB that can carry the load against a great defense. Sometimes you're qb is going to be off....even in the NFL it happens...we don't seem to answer when it does happen though.
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Virtuoso [610]
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Which is poor coaching.***
Oct 21, 2013, 4:45 PM
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Virtuoso [610]
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Other teams play this style offense and don't have our
Oct 21, 2013, 4:44 PM
[ in reply to We lose like that largely due to ] |
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repeated blow outs and ugly loses. Lameeeee excuse!
And if true, then we aren't playing an offense that can be counted on and win championships.
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All-TigerNet [10360]
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110%er [6219]
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Re: I'm tired of hearing about recruiting. It's a BS excuse.
Oct 21, 2013, 4:34 PM
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First of all, your last 8 classes don't matter. Only your last 4-5 matter. Second, getting Top 15 classes doesn't result in winning national titles or beating a team that is consistently getting Top 5 classes (FSU).
We should not have lost by 37 points, but had we brought our "A" game, FSU was still 2-3 touchdowns better thanks to their superior talent. I know you don't want to hear that- a lot of Clemson fan's don't- but that's a fact. If you watched the game, you should know that.
That debacle was partly on coaching for sure, but it had a lot to do with talent also.
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Virtuoso [610]
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Our last 4 are the best since the Ford days. And our classes
Oct 21, 2013, 4:39 PM
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every year are equal to or better than USC yet they have been dominating us.
FSU's recruiting has always been consistent. The winning & losing not. Why? Coaching!!!
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Hall of Famer [23693]
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Until we consistently recruit quality offensive linemen...
Oct 21, 2013, 4:45 PM
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we can still win like we're doing, sure. But expect FSU to consistently beat us. Until our oline consistently pushes our opponents like FSU did us and Alabama does every game, every year, we will not be where we want to be.
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Virtuoso [610]
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We were beating FSU till last year.***
Oct 21, 2013, 4:46 PM
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Legend [15216]
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Well, we beat them 6 of 10 during the worse stretch
Oct 21, 2013, 4:50 PM
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of recent FSU football history.
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Virtuoso [610]
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And during inconsistent CU football. So talent has not been
Oct 21, 2013, 4:55 PM
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the issue for either team the past 10 years. It's been coaching. I blind man can see it.
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Orange Blooded [4098]
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Virtuoso [610]
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Exactly. I've been saying it since TB's 3rd season. Until we
Oct 22, 2013, 12:24 AM
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get a head coach that understands the key to success and consistency is a great OL nothing is going to change.
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Orange Blooded [4098]
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110%er [8008]
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Annnnndddd the broken record troll is back.
Oct 21, 2013, 4:34 PM
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You've been waiting all season long to start spewing again, huh?
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Legend [15216]
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It's an issue against FSU. IF we could've landed
Oct 21, 2013, 4:35 PM
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a few guys who we finished 2nd for, it would've made a significant difference Sat night.
Guys like Fuller, Darby, Gurley, Lawson, Adams, Joyner, etc. Not to mention a few OL.
Think if FSU didn't land Winston. Recruiting is huge, and FSU gets elite talent. Dabo has us on a great level regarding recruiting. But FSU is the class of the ACC as far as talent goes. And talent can overcome mistakes.
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110%er [7913]
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missing on Gurley hurt***
Oct 21, 2013, 4:37 PM
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Legend [15216]
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No doubt. FSU has Joyner and we have Robert Smith.
Oct 21, 2013, 4:41 PM
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I mean, it's comical the deficiencies we have in the secondary.
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Zealot [868]
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BS
Oct 21, 2013, 4:40 PM
[ in reply to It's an issue against FSU. IF we could've landed ] |
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We are just as talented as FSU.
Tajh wasn't as highly rated coming out of high school as Winston but he's a 5th year senior for gods sakes and Winston is a freshman.
We lost this game Sunday-Friday.
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Legend [19686]
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Winston was the #1 player in the country, Tajh wasn't that
Oct 21, 2013, 4:44 PM
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Edwards was the #1 player in the country. Goodman. The difference is they have the 5 stars. Those really elite guys. And that is a difference.
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Virtuoso [610]
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Tajh was highly recruited and a 5th yr senior, Winston is a
Oct 21, 2013, 4:48 PM
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freshman in only game 6 in Death Valley.
Tajh sucked vs. SC State. How much talent do they have?
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Legend [19686]
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Winston will be the #1 pick in the NFL, Tajh won't go in the
Oct 21, 2013, 4:49 PM
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first round.
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Virtuoso [610]
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So what, he's still a freshman vs. a 5th year senior that
Oct 21, 2013, 4:59 PM
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was a Heisman candidate on our home field.
You folks are so ready to praise Dabo for the good, but make excuses after our repeated collapses,m which other team,s do not have.
No team has been as Jekyll & Hyde as Clemson the past 10 years. Explain that. Can you? I can. Coaching!!
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Legend [19686]
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So what? The #1 pick? Unlike your world talent means a lot
Oct 21, 2013, 5:03 PM
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on the football field. Tajh is not near as talented as Winston. Was Jimbo a better coach 2 years ago or now with more talent? We had the same QB
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Virtuoso [610]
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Experienc is critical and FSU did blow us out just b/c of
Oct 21, 2013, 5:07 PM
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their QB. He wasn't on the field making Boyd play like crap.
You folks either have no clue about football, which s often obvious, or can't stop your Dabo worship long enough to be objective.
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Legend [19686]
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Dabo didn't play, just like, Bear, I mean Danny didn't
Oct 21, 2013, 5:13 PM
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in the wth games he lost, every year after 1981
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Virtuoso [610]
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How many teams blew Danny out? 1 in 11 years. During the
Oct 21, 2013, 5:16 PM
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few down years during probation.
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Legend [19686]
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D.ick Sheridan embarrassed Danny repeatedly with far
Oct 21, 2013, 5:17 PM
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less talent. I remember 1989 and a 30-14 homecoming loss to GT. Duke beating him 34-17 at Death Valley, in a year we were ranked #3 at one point. Danny coughed up a bunch of games
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Virtuoso [610]
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None of those were blow outs and those programs won
Oct 21, 2013, 5:22 PM
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some big games and titles.
How many times did Ford have a team show up and get punk'd in a BIG game?
Never!!
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Legend [19686]
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27-3 was a blowout. I know facts don't matter to you
Oct 21, 2013, 5:26 PM
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but teams ran the ball 50 times a game then and defense came first, points were not near as prolific then as now
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Virtuoso [610]
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That was Fords only loss maybe 2 max by more than 21 points
Oct 21, 2013, 5:33 PM
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in 11 years. Not all teams ran the ball. You folks act like the forward pass is a new invention. And the rules were different too.
GT has stomped TB & Dabo several times. How often do they throw it?
You are trying to compare exceptions under Ford to common occurrences under TB & Dabo.
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Legend [19686]
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For comparison. Not one offense under Danny averaged
Oct 21, 2013, 5:36 PM
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30 points or better, but yeah, eras don't matter
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Virtuoso [610]
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So what. Ford's teams showed up in big games. You can count
Oct 21, 2013, 5:46 PM
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on 1 hand with spare fingers the times we were dominated and embarrassed under Ford in 11 years. I need 2 hands for Dabo in 5. It's no contest.
Dabo - Biggest bowl loss ever. Most points given up in Death Valley, ever! Multiple games with a turnover early then blown out.
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Legend [19686]
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You mean like Jawja in '82 and '84 when we lost as
Oct 21, 2013, 5:53 PM
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a top 10 team? Turned it over 7 times as I remember in '84. Lost at home as a top 10 team to GT on homecoming 30-14. Down 30-0 at the half at home to NC St?
You have a very selective memory
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Virtuoso [610]
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Not at all, you look childish and desperate trying to compar
Oct 21, 2013, 7:28 PM
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Ford to Dabo.
Were we blown out in either of those games?
NO!!
In fact, unlike Dabo's teams, that roll over and give up, we came back in the NC State game and should have won. We were at mid field with plenty of time and Rodney threw 4 straight incomplete passes. I always felt had we called a few running plays, which would have worked since state had everyone back in coverage, we could have gotten the 20 yards we needed for an easy game winning touchdown.
Against Georgia in '82, had there been video reviews like today we would have won that game.
So please tell me how two games lost by less than 10 points combined is getting blown out or not showing up?
You are desperate and reaching and look stupid trying to defend Dabo from his lack of coaching & motivating ability.
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Legend [19686]
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You said Danny's teams ALWAYS showed up in big games
Oct 21, 2013, 7:51 PM
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7 turnovers at Jawja is not showing up. Being down 30-0 at the half is not showing up. Getting dominated by GT on homecoming is not showing up. Getting beat by Duke by Stevie when un defeated is not showing up. Believe they gave the ball away a bunch of times in that game as well. All coaches have teams where their teams play badly, and lose badly
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Virtuoso [610]
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Again, those were close games except for '89 GT. His teams
Oct 21, 2013, 8:03 PM
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did show up. And most of those are not classified as BIG games!! A BIG game is a highly ranked team, bowl games, etc.
Turnovers happen and again had thee been replay we win the 82 UGa game and we came back vs NC State. And we should have won that Duke game too.
You want to make every bad game as not showing up. That's BS. No Dabo nor TB team would ever show the kind of fight Ford's teams did in the games you listed. Yea, UGa, 4 fumbles and still almost won and should have since his knee was down on one of the fumbles. A historic comeback vs. NC State.
Stop reaching. Dabo ain't Ford. Not even close. Ford had only a few games where we simply didn't show up.
Dabo - 0-4 vs USC as official HC.
Dabo - 2-3 Ford 6-2
Dabo - Most points allowed in a bowl game.
Dabo - Most points allowed in Death Valley.
Just stop, you look stupid.
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Legend [19686]
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I was at that NCS whipping of 27-3 where Rodney was throwing
Oct 21, 2013, 8:10 PM
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passes and hitting our linemen in the head, it was not close. Their are many others where Danny was the first to admit we were whipped, whipped, whipped. Teams, none we played, threw for 400+ yards then. It was option and veer for the most part, and you know that. Grind it out games didn't get to 50 much. In todays game it happens 10-15 times a week
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Virtuoso [610]
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Plenty of teams threw. My god. And I never said we won evey
Oct 21, 2013, 8:20 PM
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game but Ford NEVER EVER had a game like GT 3 years ago, or WVu 3 years ago, or a streak like Dabo vs. USC, or a game like Saturday night.
Yes, we had some ugly games vs. GT & NC State under Sheridan. They had Ford's number at times, but when we played truly big games, ranked teams on national TV, bowl games, etc. few were better coaches than Ford in those games. TB & Dabo SUCK in those games!!!
You can count humiliating loses under Ford on one hand with fingers left over and he was here 11 years. I need both hands for Dabo in only 5 years and no loss under Ford was as bad as GT and WVu that year or FSU Saturday. Not even close!
Dude, Dabo, most points EVER in a bowl loss and Death Valley. Enough said, shut up already, this isn't even a debate comparing the two.
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Legend [19686]
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In the 1980's who threw it like they do today? Anyone?
Oct 21, 2013, 8:27 PM
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Even when Morrison brought the run and shoot to Columbia Ellis threw for 200 yards, not 3-4-500 like QB's do now. Okay, challenging you to use all 10 fingers on both hands. Name them, the number of what you consider embarrassing losses under Dabo. I;ll give you 3. Saturday, WVU, NCS in 2010. Remember, your standard is a blowout, not just a bad loss of which we had many under Danny
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Virtuoso [610]
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I guess you missed BYU, Miami, FSU, Maryland, and other
Oct 22, 2013, 12:21 AM
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teams that threw the ball a lot. Florida ring a bell? Spurrier at Duke?
You folks don't know football. Lots of teams threw the ball back then. The reason you see video game numbers now is because the rules have all but neutered defenses. It's not because teams didn't throw back then. They did, but the rules are killing defenses.
Bad loses for Dabo ... USC x4, GT, WVu, FSU the last 2 years, and those are off the top of my head without even thinking or looking back over the schedules.
Yes, Ford had loses, but only a few true humiliating losses. Dabo has many. Dabo had a losing season in a pathetic ACC with plenty of talent.
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CU Medallion [58411]
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I've documented it before - we lost to a lot of unranked
Oct 21, 2013, 5:27 PM
[ in reply to D.ick Sheridan embarrassed Danny repeatedly with far ] |
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teams or teams that we were supposed to beat under Danny. They were great days for Clemson football because they were so much better than the preceding 20 years, not to mention that those of us who were around were much younger, and everything was better then  . We were not as good or as dominant as many here would like to remember, however. One top 5 finish under Danny Ford, two more top 10 finishes. it was a great time for Clemson football, Danny was a great coach, but come on guys, let's enjoy the here and now - this may be the best team we've had since that national championship team. I don't understand why Clemson fans would not want that. I'm sure Danny himself does.
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Virtuoso [610]
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No sh!t Sherlock. Loss, yes!! Blown out, humiliated, NO!!
Oct 21, 2013, 5:36 PM
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You kool aid drinkers can't see the difference in a loss in an average game vs a blow out in a big game. Ford's teams showed up in big games.
Compare Ford to Dabo & TB vs. USC, in BIG games, in bowl games, etc. It's no contest!!
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Virtuoso [610]
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Talent is NOT the issue. Our highly recruited Heisman QB
Oct 21, 2013, 4:42 PM
[ in reply to It's an issue against FSU. IF we could've landed ] |
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didn't show up and has played poorly a LOT this year.
Our issues are ...
1. OL
2. Weak & soft mentally
3. Inconsistent QB play
4. Coaching - And 1-3 are part of coaching.
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Legend [15216]
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Tajh isn't perfect, but he's the best QB we've had since
Oct 21, 2013, 4:45 PM
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Steve Fuller if not better.
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Virtuoso [610]
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I totally disagree. He has big time stats thanks to the
Oct 21, 2013, 4:49 PM
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system we run and a weak ACC.
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Legend [19686]
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Who's been better?***
Oct 21, 2013, 4:51 PM
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Legend [15216]
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Edisto Tiger probably isn't even Riggs level donor.
Oct 21, 2013, 4:53 PM
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So I doubt he's really even a true fan.
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Legend [19686]
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I was hoping he'd say Nealon Greene***
Oct 21, 2013, 4:55 PM
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Virtuoso [610]
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Eppley, Moraco, Rodney, Jordan, Woody, Charlie all had
Oct 21, 2013, 5:05 PM
[ in reply to Who's been better?*** ] |
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as much or better success, which is what counts. The ACC has been down and we have had great skill players and a pass happy offense for Tajh.
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Legend [19686]
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Yep, those guys played a stacked ACC
Oct 21, 2013, 5:08 PM
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Other than Rodney, ahem, like he was the reason we won, none have beaten more ranked teams
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Virtuoso [610]
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There was no top 25 then. And the ACC was better back then.
Oct 21, 2013, 5:19 PM
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And they won ACC titles, beat SC, and won bowl games.
Dabo has 1 ACC title, 2 bowl wins, 1 win vs. USC.
That's pathetic!!
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Legend [19686]
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No top 25? lol! How did we finish #1 then?***
Oct 21, 2013, 5:22 PM
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Virtuoso [610]
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There was the top 20. The top 25 started during the TB era.
Oct 21, 2013, 5:25 PM
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A lot of those top 25 wins for Dabo & Tajh were vs. #21 or higher so comparing them to teams in the late 70s & 80s is not apples & oranges.
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Legend [19686]
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Let's see. Georgia #5, LSU #6, VT, #5 and #10, FSU #11
Oct 21, 2013, 5:34 PM
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yep, right again
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Virtuoso [610]
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Why not list them all if I'm so wrong? Some of the 7 were
Oct 21, 2013, 7:33 PM
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teams outside the top 20.
Also it's rare for a Clemson QB to get many chances like Tajh because back then it was rare to have a QB start more than 2 years. Rodney was the only one. Tajh is a 3rd year started, which back then didn't happen much.
Also, there was no ACCCG which creates more opportunities too.
He's still overrated and his draft stock is falling.
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Legend [19686]
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If you listen to the guys who rate the draft, his draft
Oct 21, 2013, 7:49 PM
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stock wasn't that high. He's the 5-6th rated QB in the draft. Winston would be #1 this year. That's talent, not coaching
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Virtuoso [610]
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Winston would not be #1 this year. And the pros and college
Oct 21, 2013, 8:05 PM
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have nothing to do with each other. Tebow is classic proof of that, as is Charlie Ward.
Dabo sucks as a HC. Dabo is our problem, not our talent.
If it was purely talent Boyd would have looked like a superstar against SC State & NC State.
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Legend [19686]
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Winston would be number 1 by a mile this year
Oct 21, 2013, 8:12 PM
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no QB in this draft is remotely close to him. He has everything NFL scouts look for
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Virtuoso [610]
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They talked about it Dan Patrick today. No he wouldn't. We
Oct 21, 2013, 8:23 PM
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didn't put any pressure on him. No one has really hit him yet. If you think he's going to play like this forever you are nuts. But he isn't why we lost and neither is talent. We didn't show up and our coaches suck.
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Legend [19686]
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Who was the draft expert saying this? Remember, Dan Patrick
Oct 21, 2013, 8:28 PM
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isn't a draft expert
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Virtuoso [610]
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He knows more than Tnet pumpers and he talks to experts
Oct 22, 2013, 12:25 AM
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and NFL GM's.
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CU Medallion [58411]
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That's the funniest thing I've ever heard!
Oct 22, 2013, 9:50 AM
[ in reply to There was no top 25 then. And the ACC was better back then. ] |
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Besides Clemson, only one other ACC team finished in the top 10 during the entire decade of the 1980s, and that was UNC in 80 and 81. That was it.
In the last 10 years, the ACC has had 5 different teams finish in the top 10 (other than Clemson), for a total of 9 times. It's not even close - the ACC is MUCH better now than it was in the 1980s.
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CU Guru [1142]
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Re: Talent is NOT the issue. Our highly recruited Heisman QB
Oct 21, 2013, 4:49 PM
[ in reply to Talent is NOT the issue. Our highly recruited Heisman QB ] |
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Ding!Ding!Ding! We have a winner! I've been saying exactly the same thing for two years, but I can tell you now, the truth is not really popular around here.
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Virtuoso [610]
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Never is around here.***
Oct 21, 2013, 5:08 PM
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Orange Blooded [4504]
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Fan [75]
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Re: I'm tired of hearing about recruiting. It's a BS excuse.
Oct 21, 2013, 4:36 PM
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You'll be burned at the stake for this post. I was earlier. But I agree with you 100%. It HAS to be coaching. It's not for lack of talent, never is!
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Virtuoso [610]
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Players come & go, some coaches have come and gone, but
Oct 21, 2013, 4:54 PM
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the common denominator has been our inconsistent play and the HC --- TB & Dabo. And only 2 people think Dabo was worth hiring as a coach - TB & Gene Stallings.
When a program has unique problems long term like we have with lots of turnover everywhere but HC it's obvious where the problem is.
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Zealot [868]
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Re: I'm tired of hearing about recruiting. It's a BS excuse.
Oct 21, 2013, 4:38 PM
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I agree that the problem with these big games is Dabo and the coaching staff not having the team mentally prepared.
But you can't throw Dabo to the dogs just yet. The man wins ballgames. But I believe he gets caught up in the hype himself sometimes and that translates to the players and we lay an egg every now and then.
I've been saying this for a couple years and got flamed for it every time. Dabo is too emotional as a head coach.
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Legend [15216]
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LOL. How bout Auburn, FSU, VT in 2011. How about
Oct 21, 2013, 4:43 PM
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the LSU game? How about the UGA game? All of those games were on huge stages.
Crazy how soon people forget.
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110%er [8008]
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Re: They don't forget, they just spin it to support their
Oct 21, 2013, 4:48 PM
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position. Sad part is, I think some actually begin to believe it.
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Virtuoso [610]
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Auburn sucked that yr, vastly overated from year before
Oct 21, 2013, 5:28 PM
[ in reply to LOL. How bout Auburn, FSU, VT in 2011. How about ] |
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same with VT. They didn't beat anyone that won more than 7 games that year. Auburn didn't finish ranked.
The UGs game this year is our 1 big regular season win in years and at this point it doesn't mean much.
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Virtuoso [610]
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I'm 47 and have played & watched a LOT of football. I have
Oct 21, 2013, 5:14 PM
[ in reply to Re: I'm tired of hearing about recruiting. It's a BS excuse. ] |
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never, at any level - high school thru NFL - seen a program as utterly bi-polar as Clemson under TB & Dabo. Never. Not even close!!
We either win, or lose big. It's insane.
Reminds me of Loyola Marymount basketball.
And I've never seen a team give up 1 TO so early in a game so many times then just collapse and get blown out - WVu, GT, FSU, Bama, and I think 1 or 2more times. VT maybe?
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All-TigerNet [10360]
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As good as our recruiting has been....FSU has been better...
Oct 21, 2013, 4:44 PM
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in the last decade our 2 BEST classes were as follows
2008: #12
2011: #8
in our "best recruiting years" FSU was
2008: #9
2011: #2
that being said it's no excuse to have what happened saturday happen, but compared to our schedule we should be 11-1 no questions asked........so if we lose another ALL CRITICISM to ALL parties involved w/ clemson football is warranted.
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Virtuoso [610]
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Yet the last 10 years we wn more than we lost to FSU so
Oct 21, 2013, 7:37 PM
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there is no excuse to get humiliated on national TV again, esp at home, to them.
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All-TigerNet [14921]
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Yeah LSU and their physical D sure shut us down...***
Oct 21, 2013, 4:45 PM
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Legend [16207]
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AND GUESS WHAT????
Oct 21, 2013, 4:47 PM
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Those top 15 classes have us in the top 10!
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All-In [44044]
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One of the first things I thought about after we lost to FSU
Oct 21, 2013, 4:51 PM
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was that you would be on TigerNet spewing your same, tired drivel about how we aren't tough, our coaches aren't as good as when Ford was here, etc. Just shut up already. You're full of crap and you know it.
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Legend [19686]
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Love Danny-but he lost 2 games or more every year except
Oct 21, 2013, 4:54 PM
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1981 and the following 2 years when we were on probation. Great teams, but people claiming the ACC is weak now, man, can they not remember the 80's
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All-In [44044]
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I agree. Danny was a great coach and person, but
Oct 21, 2013, 4:56 PM
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he had at least one if not two bad losses each year to inferior teams (1981 being the obvious exception). Our schedule was not nearly as tough then, and the competition for recruits wasn't nearly what it is now either.
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Legend [19686]
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See, their's a little "truth" on this thread
Oct 21, 2013, 5:11 PM
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revised history is Danny is Bear Bryant and never lost a game he should not have. Wonder if those losses were about coaching? Danny sure took the blame. And you know what, so does Dabo
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Virtuoso [610]
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No one is saing that but Dabo aint Ford not even close and
Oct 21, 2013, 7:43 PM
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Ford's teams showed up and very rarely got humiliated or blown out. Only a few times in 11 years. Dado gets blown out and humiliated regularly.
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Legend [19686]
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In 1980 were you ready to fire Danny?
Oct 21, 2013, 7:57 PM
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If that magical 1981 season had not happened, how long would he have been here, especially with the probation. Dabo isn't Danny. I don't see anyone arguing that. But Dabo has done more since Danny than anyone else, so why do yu want him fired after every loss? We're finally back on the national stage, even after a horrible loss. That has not happened since Danny's last years
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Virtuoso [610]
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He is the best since Ford. Wow, Give him a medal. B/c
Oct 21, 2013, 8:12 PM
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everyone since Ford sucked. We are weak & soft under Dabo. We have peaked. We aren't going to get any better. This is exactly what I predicted before we hired him. I posted that we'd be marginally better but not truly improve enough to compete for a national title. We aren't close to winning a title. We are mentally weak & soft and roll over with just a little adversity in big games. We have the talent. We don't have the schemes or coaching. Period!!
I ws right about TB and I'm right about Dabo. And the evidence supports me
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Legend [19686]
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You predicted he'd win 21 games in 2 years?
Oct 21, 2013, 8:18 PM
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Win an ACC championship(how much more worthless is Dabo's due to competition than Danny's). He'd have us in the top 10 3 straight years. You predicted all that?
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Virtuoso [610]
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In he weakest ACC ever and with more games. I said we'd be
Oct 21, 2013, 8:26 PM
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better but not truly competitive on the national stage. We beat an LSU that didn't want to be there and then gave it away. We beat UGa. Two big wins in 5 years.
How we doing vs Spurrier & USC?
How'd we do Saturday night?
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Legend [19686]
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Who were the ACC juggernauts we played in the 80's?
Oct 21, 2013, 8:30 PM
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Maryland was good, not great a few years. Who else. NC a couple of years? ACC was worse then than now
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CU Medallion [58411]
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Virtuoso [610]
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McFly how many blowouts? 1 And look at his record in
Oct 21, 2013, 7:41 PM
[ in reply to Love Danny-but he lost 2 games or more every year except ] |
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bowl games, vs. USC, in BIG games, etc.
Ford's teams showed up in BIG games and won and NEVER got blown out. In 11 years there were only like 2 humiliating loses. The 1989 GT game was one. Dabo gets humiliated in almost every loss. To even think of comparing the two is nuts and makes you look stupid. Dabo ain't close to being Ford and never will.
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Virtuoso [610]
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CU Guru [1346]
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So many people get lost in the recruiting rankings, both
Oct 21, 2013, 4:53 PM
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overall and for each recruit. It is far from a science. My favorite example is Nuk - came in as a 4 star, played as a 5 star, and was picked in Round 1 of the draft. Was he an underrated high school player?? Or do all kids turning into men develop and evolve?
But I agree that a lot can be put at the feet of coaches in college. Not only are coaches responsible for getting kids to grow into men, from a football playing standpoint, but they are responsible for motivating and squeezing performance out of them. When both sides of the ball blow it in a colossal why like WVU and FSU games, coaches should carry much of the blame.
Recruiting strength has something to do with it. But the difference between #2 and #8 in any given season might not mean much. It matters more whether you got the right players for your needs and the right players to develop into better talent than when they walked on your campus.
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All-In [44044]
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I agree. Great points.
Oct 21, 2013, 4:59 PM
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I feel like it's so tough for college coaches because they not only have to manage coaching the players, but also:
-making sure they go to class and perform academically
-making sure they stay out of trouble
-serving as a parental figure at times
-speaking at booster club meetings
-fundraising for the university
-recruiting high school talent
It's a tough job. And I think Dabo is doing great.
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Legend [19686]
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CU Guru [1346]
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Probably more rare than busts for lower ratings
Oct 21, 2013, 5:16 PM
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But not unheard of. Some go due to academics. Others get into trouble with the law. Of the remainder, some just don't make the transition that well or never really grow as players.
The only one that comes to mind is Russell Shepard who played for LSU and is now playing for winless TB. I don't think he did anything outstanding at LSU, and I remember reading about how he was a disappointment. Nothing going much at TB either.
But, yeah, if you recruited all 5 stars you probably have a better chance of having a top team than if you recruited all 2 and 3 stars. But the difference between a 4 star and 5 star here and there isn't such a big deal if your coaching is good. If...
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Legend [19686]
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Any coach will tell you, nothing matters more than talent
Oct 21, 2013, 5:21 PM
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period. Their are 15-20 5 star guys a year. Their are hundreds and hundreds of 4 star guys and even more 3 star guys. FSU has 8-10 5 star guys, we have 1. Elite talent covers a bunch of things. BTW, a 5 star recruit is a projected 4 year starter. A 4 star, 2 years by and large
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CU Guru [1346]
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And a 4 star vs 5 star rating doesn't guarantee the 5 star
Oct 21, 2013, 5:41 PM
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will always be a better player after 3 or 4 years. Because, as you say, talent matters. Winston's 5 star talent translated well and he has been coached well. Kyle Wright was a 5 star who blew it at Miami about 10 years ago as QB. Talent? Coaching? Both? Same with Russell Shepard, except we was even worse.
Nothing is a sure thing. I don't disagree we should be trying to land as many 5 stars as we can. Don't know where you get your numbers, but if true, how many teams do you expect to compete for those "15-20" and how many do you expect us to get? 1 or 2 a year seems fair if your numbers are right.
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Legend [19686]
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If you want to be elite, you have to recruit with the FSU's
Oct 21, 2013, 5:50 PM
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and Bama's. They get the 5 stars. Why do you think Bama has won 3 of the last 4 MCN's or FSU finished in the top 5 for 13 straight years? So, why are we not elite yet? Seems pretty straight forward to me. And it's also a tough gap to close
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CU Guru [1346]
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I'm guessing Dabo and staff are open to suggestions...
Oct 21, 2013, 6:08 PM
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...about how you steer 5 stars away from Bama and FSU.
But I'll stand by my original point with this example: Bama recruited Eddie Lacy, a 4 star RB and made him a huge star by his last year with them. In the neighborhood of 1400 yards and near 20 TDs (not sure exact numbers.)
So, Bama, with all that 5 star attraction and talent, turned a 4 star into a 5 star by the time he left. I'm not arguing you are wrong or I am more right. Just pointing out there are some real world issues. And getting the right 4 stars can cover for not being as competitive as you want with 5 stars. I'm hoping our staff can make 5 stars out of Oglesby or Adam Choice as RBs that are coming in next season, just as Bama did with Lacy.
I'm also questioning how accurate the starts are to begin with. After all, ESPN only gave Jameis 4 stars. Easy to say they were wrong on that one, but I'm sure there is another rating they were more accurate in choosing. It isn't random. But it isn't a prefect science either.
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Legend [19686]
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Getting the righ 2-3 stars can do that. Lacy, Richardson
Oct 21, 2013, 8:15 PM
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and the likes at Bama were running behind 5 star OL's. You don't think that makes a difference. You win recruiting battles one player at a time, but just like hoops, the elite sem to go to only a few schools. It's exactly why to try to be consisten, which if we finish strong, we can begin to establish with 3 straight 10 win years. You hope for that year where you have the right guys together and can legitimately play for a NC. It's happened once here
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Virtuoso [610]
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Virtuoso [610]
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Posts: 1017
Joined: 3/29/13
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Orange Blooded [2253]
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You just can't fix stupid !! *****
Oct 21, 2013, 5:03 PM
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Legend [19202]
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BS agenda against Dabo again? Good Lord you pound an
Oct 21, 2013, 5:07 PM
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agenda to death don't you Old Blue.
Hey are you going to Maryland to stand behind our young men? Stand tall and proud if you go.
GO TIGERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Legend [19686]
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Awww, give him a break. He's had to be quiet since
Oct 21, 2013, 5:15 PM
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the SCU game last year.
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Orange Blooded [4504]
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And it has eaten him alive but at least he has some coots
Oct 21, 2013, 8:23 PM
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agreeing with him on this rant.
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Oculus Spirit [93668]
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He'd cheer for the turtles if he thought it...
Oct 21, 2013, 5:16 PM
[ in reply to BS agenda against Dabo again? Good Lord you pound an ] |
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would damage Clemson. His issue ain't football, I really don't think he gives a chit. When he shows up here it's about disrupting our fellowship and brotherhood. He just like to spread discord.
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Oculus Spirit [93668]
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Deer Blue Country Low Caddy,
Oct 21, 2013, 5:13 PM
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Just come out and say it, you hate Clemson.
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Legend [19686]
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Dabo stole his lolly***
Oct 21, 2013, 5:15 PM
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Oculus Spirit [93668]
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He's as vindictive as a woman scorned.
Oct 21, 2013, 5:17 PM
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I thankful to God I don't have to live with that horrible attitude he has.
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Legend [19686]
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The opposite of Proverbs is true for Blue-Edisto
Oct 21, 2013, 5:24 PM
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"it is better to live on the corner of your roof than with a man who had his lolly stolen"
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CU Medallion [58411]
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This may be the best team we've had since 1981.***
Oct 21, 2013, 5:16 PM
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Oculus Spirit [93668]
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Posts: 95418
Joined: 12/25/09
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We lost a game so we need a new coaching staff.
Oct 21, 2013, 5:19 PM
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Is Kippen still looking? sml
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Addict [448]
TigerPulse: 27%
Posts: 843
Joined: 11/14/10
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Re: We lost a game so we need a new coaching staff.
Oct 21, 2013, 6:22 PM
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So you would summarily dismiss Saturday nights total failure as ...eh ..just a loss ..a loss would mean we had tried...played hard ...hadn't quit..actually had a game plan ...other than getting medals after the game from the Governor...
Ostrichs
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Virtuoso [610]
TigerPulse: 62%
Posts: 1017
Joined: 3/29/13
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They are right you can't fix stupid, but the stupid ones are
Oct 21, 2013, 7:52 PM
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the ones that see Dabo & TB get humiliated over and over after years in the program with highly respected recruiting classes and think something will change.
That think Bama would come calling for Dabo if Saban left.
That think we will win a national championship with Dabo. We won't even compete for one as long as Dab is here.
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All-Conference [427]
TigerPulse: 47%
Posts: 1883
Joined: 7/2/04
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Re: I'm tired of hearing about recruiting. It's a BS excuse.
Oct 21, 2013, 5:37 PM
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Recruiting is part of the problem. We have a top 15 class but they have a top 5 class. We recruited Darby too. The coaching was bad too last Saturday.
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All-In [30483]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 62655
Joined: 10/4/99
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Whoa, whoa, whoa.
Oct 21, 2013, 6:21 PM
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We put up 14 points.
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110%er [5021]
TigerPulse: 88%
Posts: 8274
Joined: 12/9/12
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What's with this recruiting
Oct 21, 2013, 6:28 PM
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Crap? Dabo is a great recruiter and has done well doing the hardest thing in recruiting, SELLING THE UNIVERSITY! FSU has such a rich tradition and media coverage, it's much easier for them to pull in this talent. Mix all that in with cheating, because they do regardless of what anyone says, then it makes to be one of hell of a team.
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110%er [5021]
TigerPulse: 88%
Posts: 8274
Joined: 12/9/12
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Also.
Oct 21, 2013, 6:34 PM
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FSU is VERY experienced this season. Joyner's dumb ### wasn't good enough to go last season so he's back this year beating up on Mike Williams (Freshman) and Seckinger(Fresh)...All of their WR have been in the system for 3 years including Shaws sorry ###. Their O Line has 3 seniors on it and a RSJunior. So that helps cater to QB inexperience.
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Amateur [36]
TigerPulse: 86%
Posts: 85
Joined: 2/5/12
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Top 15 classes gets you top 15 finishes - not a NC
Oct 21, 2013, 6:37 PM
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You can't tell me that our recruiting is on par with Alabama, and that the talent level difference isn't at least a major influence on their dominance. Granted, they have the best coach in the game right now but when it comes to recruiting large, dominant O linemen and D linemen we just aren't there right now. A few great skill players only gets you so far.
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Virtuoso [610]
TigerPulse: 62%
Posts: 1017
Joined: 3/29/13
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Wrong. Our talent with great coaching and we'd stay in the
Oct 21, 2013, 8:28 PM
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top 10 and compete for national titles. We aren't close right now.
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Orange Blooded [2191]
TigerPulse: 97%
Posts: 2565
Joined: 5/7/01
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Stand up and tell us how you really feel.
Oct 21, 2013, 7:43 PM
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Or sit there and ####.
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Orange Blooded [4504]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 9112
Joined: 11/30/98
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Yea and FSU is usually 10 spots above us in recruiting. But
Oct 21, 2013, 8:08 PM
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You've never been good at figuring things out so just forget that fact. The rest of your rant is just hot air as usual.
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Virtuoso [610]
TigerPulse: 62%
Posts: 1017
Joined: 3/29/13
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False. We have been around #12 and they in the top 10 yet
Oct 21, 2013, 8:30 PM
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they sucked for years. Why? Coaching!!!
And recruiting rankings are grossly misunderstood.
Our coaching sucks. We are soft. Our OL sucks.
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Varsity [248]
TigerPulse: 99%
Posts: 316
Joined: 1/2/05
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Re: I'm tired of hearing about recruiting. It's a BS excuse.
Oct 21, 2013, 9:57 PM
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They are better than us. Their players are better than ours. . That is ALL about recruiting.Give Dabo and his staff their players and Dabo could win. Two yrs ago FSU fans were ready to get rid of Jimbo and bring Bobby back. Trust me I live in Florida not many of our players other than Sammy Watkins and Blanks were even on their target list. You guys who live in SC really don't understand how much better HS players in Florida are. FSU is loaded. We never had a chance. I too wish we had played better but im not ready to give up on Dabo or this team. Keep playing. keep recruiting. college fotball is all about cycles.
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Orange Blooded [4680]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 2246
Joined: 11/19/12
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Agree. Florida is the 4th most populated state.***
Oct 21, 2013, 10:21 PM
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Orange Blooded [4680]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 2246
Joined: 11/19/12
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Re: and FSU had a top 5 class nearly every year.***
Oct 21, 2013, 10:17 PM
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Freshman [3]
TigerPulse: 67%
Posts: 7
Joined: 9/17/12
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the focused team won, and FSU was special..
Oct 21, 2013, 10:27 PM
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Clemson walked into a focused team, and it had nothing to do with recruited talent, but training, and there are not that many coaches out there that understand that.
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Freshman [3]
TigerPulse: 67%
Posts: 7
Joined: 9/17/12
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125 responses-noone is giving fsu credit for being special***
Oct 21, 2013, 10:28 PM
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Athletic Dir [896]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 784
Joined: 9/14/00
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You're making up controversy and then spinning your own...
Oct 21, 2013, 10:30 PM
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answers to your own arguments. You answer your own fiction. Get a life "my friend." I'm not sure where you're headed or what your agenda is, but it is confused and, ultimately, self-serving. Have you considered admitting yourself? Nothing shameful in that.
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Legend [16252]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 12783
Joined: 11/14/09
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Welcome back, Blue. Now go away.***
Oct 21, 2013, 10:32 PM
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