Replies: 32
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110%er [5045]
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Honestly this is ridiculously simple
Jun 9, 2020, 12:44 PM
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There should be no question or argument if our students, players, and alum want the names of buildings changed then CHANGE THEM. The worst that’ll happen is you get the random guy acting the same as they did with the NFL crying that “they’ll never watch it again” as if the NFL or anyone else really cares. The times are changing and Clemson is no different with the fact that they need to adapt to survive and this is what is being called for therefore it’s an easy and obvious decision that it’s what they should do.
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Head Coach [776]
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Re: Honestly this is ridiculously simple
Jun 9, 2020, 12:46 PM
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Do you change the University name????
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110%er [9588]
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So...every student and alum want the names changed?
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Jun 9, 2020, 12:49 PM
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Or just some?
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CU Medallion [51445]
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You heard the man!
Jun 9, 2020, 12:50 PM
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...I mean person (sorry, trying to get with the times). EVERY SINGLE ONE.
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110%er [6153]
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It will definitely NOT be that simple ... it just won’t!
Jun 9, 2020, 12:50 PM
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The aggressive agents of change are looking far beyond any simple adjustments to the names of buildings and honors colleges.
The wholesale changes they will ultimately demand will be so divisive that no lasting good will come from it.
Not just at Clemson, but around the world.
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CU Guru [1657]
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Re: It will definitely NOT be that simple ... it just won’t!
Jun 9, 2020, 1:21 PM
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Amen!
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Starter [386]
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Re: Honestly this is ridiculously simple
Jun 9, 2020, 12:51 PM
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I'm an alum and I don't want to change them.
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110%er [5045]
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Re: Honestly this is ridiculously simple
Jun 9, 2020, 12:53 PM
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Can you give one real reason why besides a fake value the name gives you
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Commissioner [983]
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Re: Honestly this is ridiculously simple
Jun 9, 2020, 12:52 PM
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But how many people want them changed? 1%, 10%, 75%...? How much of the crowd are we catering to?
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110%er [5045]
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Re: Honestly this is ridiculously simple
Jun 9, 2020, 12:58 PM
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Who are you “catering” to by promoting a dead racist by keeping a building named after him? Is a buildings name so important to you that you’d consider it catering? Two of our most important Alumni have made it very public they wish it changed and many of our current athletes others don’t have the same platform they do so I don’t know who else because I haven’t seen it. There’s absolutely zero benefit to leaving the name. Just speaking football alone if we talk because of an inability to adapt to POC’s and make them feel more welcome the university could lose 100s of millions in revenue so it’s not just the smarter decision it’s the right decision.
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Legend [18637]
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dude you're wasting your time here
Jun 9, 2020, 1:26 PM
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Of course there is no benefit to keeping the names.
But no one is changing anyone's mind here or I seriously doubt it anyway.
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Commissioner [983]
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I understand what youre saying. I really do.
Jun 9, 2020, 5:53 PM
[ in reply to Re: Honestly this is ridiculously simple ] |
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I think we honor people in history based on their contributions to the University, and in the case of Washington, his contribution to our country. NOBODY is honoring these men because theyre racist. Pretending like removing names and statues will change anything is not going to solve any issues.
I was told in 2000 that removing the Confederate Flag from the State house would fix things. Then it was to be removed from the Monument. Now its everyones name who ever had slaves.
We ALL agree that Floyd (while not a law abiding citizen) didnt deserve what happened. We agree the cops should be in jail. He's facing 2nd degree murder. The other cops are facing charges, too. This situation was handled the same way it wouldve been had Floyd been white. The cop had 17 complaints (many by white people). He was an a-hole, not the face a systemic racism. Yet here we are, protests, riots, all in the face of this situation being handled appropriately and not being ignored.
To me, seeing how the cop was handled proves that we are making head way in equality. So what is being protested exactly? What will fix it?
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CU Medallion [67151]
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Re: Honestly this is ridiculously simple
Jun 9, 2020, 12:59 PM
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If everyone would calm down and listen I'm sure Oprah will possibly tell us what to do. She may even get Dr. Phil and Ellen to help.
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Legend [18637]
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You left out Dr. Drew***
Jun 9, 2020, 1:27 PM
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CU Guru [1657]
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Re: Honestly this is ridiculously simple
Jun 9, 2020, 1:08 PM
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The Name will change, and John C Calhoun's name will not be associated with Clemson any longer, and then the next time some career criminal is killed while in custody these same people, who profess they are looting and rioting over Black Lives, will find another person in history to blame for their plight in this world. Problem is, it will never end, there will always be someone else to hate, someone who at some point in history did something that offended someone and you will never do enough. The policeman who killed convicted felon George Floyd, should be punished harshly, but because he was killed doesn't make him a good person, he wasn't, look at his criminal record. The officers were fired the next day and one charged with murder two days later, yet all this lawlessness, riots, looting, and YES murdering police officers, began and continued. Do you think it was over George Floyd being killed, if you do you are very naive. The criminal actions took place, because they knew they could get away with it, BECAUSE those in charge in these cities of this lawlessness were afraid of the law breakers. They were afraid they would be called the R-word, (racist) which these people are just as afraid of as the N-word! President Obama said in a speech about the riots and looting in Baltimore, Md., "when the first brick was thrown, the first glass broken and the first fire started, they were no longer protestors, they became criminals and should and will be prosecuted." Put all these things together with the ignorance of people we have in congress who want to defund and disband the police departments, you will have anarchy and all the names on all the buildings and honors colleges will be gone, the sad thing is that the schools and the buildings well be gone too. All this because sports, are more important to some people than the actual Nation, a Nation of laws, that we call the United States.
Message was edited by: BBBII®
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Legend [16331]
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The clock tower building on campus will always be "Tillman"
Jun 9, 2020, 1:09 PM
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to me. And I will always call my 54 year old brother in law Tommy, even though he started going by Tom soon after he graduated Clemson. This is not me making any kind of political point. This is just reality and human nature. My son, a current Clemson student, says it will always be Tillman to him as well.
Change the name if we must, but it will likely be a generation at least before the new name takes hold. Not sure if that is an argument to change it ASAP, or an argument to just leave it alone. It will be interesting if this petition succeeds to see how my daughter (a high school senior) is affected. The building has always been Tillman to her, but if it is changed to "Old Main" or something else in the next year, maybe she will use the new name. We shall see.
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110%er [5045]
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Re: The clock tower building on campus will always be "Tillman"
Jun 9, 2020, 1:14 PM
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I understand and agree to your points however the change isn’t to support the past of Clemson but the future of Clemson. To us it’s just a name and it’s second nature to call it what it is to us but to others it means more.
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110%er [9588]
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Just like our baseball team plays at Tiger Field.
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Jun 9, 2020, 1:17 PM
[ in reply to The clock tower building on campus will always be "Tillman" ] |
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That’s what I grew up calling it.
I do not know or care who Doug Kingsmore is. (and oh...what if he ever said the n-word? Now we’re onto something)
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CU Guru [1722]
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Re: The clock tower building on campus will always be "Tillman"
Jun 9, 2020, 1:56 PM
[ in reply to The clock tower building on campus will always be "Tillman" ] |
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Yes I agree. It will always be Tillman to me too. But my daughter, Tiger freshman next year, asked the ultimate slippery slope question. Since the campus was a plantation and slaves were held there, do we need to just relocate? Sounds drastic but just saying.
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Orange Blooded [3639]
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Re: Honestly this is ridiculously simple
Jun 9, 2020, 1:13 PM
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I dunno about changing the names of buildings just because the majority of students or athletes want them changed. You have to be careful not to make knee-jerk decisions in moments of passion.
However, if sentiments remain very strong for some particular building(s) after a pause, the university must thoughtfully consider how students feel.
Gotta remember the long game here.
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110%er [5045]
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Re: Honestly this is ridiculously simple
Jun 9, 2020, 1:18 PM
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Ok long game if we don’t strongly outweighs if we do. Can’t think of any negatives for changing a name. Doubtful anyone donates because of the names of buildings or comes to the school due to the names of buildings and even if they do the effect of changing the name has more possible positive outcomes than negative.
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Orange Blooded [3639]
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Re: Honestly this is ridiculously simple
Jun 9, 2020, 1:34 PM
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Clarification: I don't necessarily disagree with changing the name, just saying a short pause before doing so might be a good thing.
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110%er [5045]
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Re: Honestly this is ridiculously simple
Jun 9, 2020, 1:42 PM
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I’ve heard this argument for years. The difference is now it’s during a bad time with people who have a large platform leading the charge.
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110%er [5121]
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Re: Honestly this is ridiculously simple
Jun 9, 2020, 2:18 PM
[ in reply to Re: Honestly this is ridiculously simple ] |
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The push for name changes has been going on for many years. How long do we need to pause?
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Orange Blooded [3639]
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Rock Defender [52]
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Legend [18637]
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Nothing is permanent....
Jun 9, 2020, 1:21 PM
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not buildings, heck not even this earth.
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CU Guru [1740]
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Just to counter one point...
Jun 9, 2020, 2:12 PM
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the NFL actually did care when fans said they wouldn't watch games....so much so that networks quit showing the anthem and weren't allowed to talk about it. I think they will be changed but not like it solves anything....those same people will still go by his house everyday but since its not called the Calhoun house and is called Fort Hill no one cares.
Is LSU gonna change their nickname? Probably not, bc woke culture doesn't even know where it came from.
You aren't really solving any problems by changing names of buildings or removing statues. Put more statues up....let both sides be told and seen.
if has to be changed, so be it, but its just today's demand...what comes tomorrow and the fact that other symbols are there but people just dont know.
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Orange Blooded [4600]
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Re: Honestly this is ridiculously simple
Jul 12, 2007, 4:17 PM
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What if the same people demand you should never be able to set foot on campus again? Should we all shun you to make them happy?
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All-TigerNet [10781]
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Re: Honestly this is ridiculously simple
Jun 9, 2020, 2:57 PM
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South Carolina is named after Charles I of England. He was somewhat despotic, leading to bloody civil wars. He was tried for treason and hanged. Should the name of the state be changed? See how ridiculous this can get?
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All-In [43580]
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I think it's simpler to tell people not to be offended.
Jun 9, 2020, 3:08 PM
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Calhoun played a role in Clemson University's formation, and he should be honored accordingly.
The fact that he owned slaves doesn't make his contribution any less significant or meaningful.
People need to stop looking for reasons to be offended.
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Orange Blooded [4354]
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Amen***
Jun 9, 2020, 3:09 PM
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110%er [5121]
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Re: I think it's simpler to tell people not to be offended.
Jun 9, 2020, 6:36 PM
[ in reply to I think it's simpler to tell people not to be offended. ] |
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What was Calhoun’s role in the schools foundation? Besides residing at Ft. Hill for a portion of his life.
Serious question. I can’t seem to get a straight answer from anyone.
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Replies: 32
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