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YOUR BALANCE
For those still supporting Coach Brownell
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For those still supporting Coach Brownell


Jan 30, 2021, 9:27 PM

Keep pridefully patting yourself on the back for your loyalty to Clemson University, and while you are at it, remember Coach Tommy Bowden had more supporters than Coach Brad Brownell.

And you know what, Bowden's replacement Coach Dabo Swinney turned out all right. Go Tigers!

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Re: For those still supporting Coach Brownell


Jan 30, 2021, 9:47 PM

Maybe his problem is he is not a motivator. He doesn't often, seem to have a team pumped and ready to go.

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Re: For those still supporting Coach Brownell


Jan 30, 2021, 10:01 PM

Good point.

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Class of ‘71. Went through “rat season” and glad I did.


if true, hire an assistant coach to pump em up***


Jan 30, 2021, 10:31 PM



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Re: For those still supporting Coach Brownell


Jan 30, 2021, 10:31 PM [ in reply to Re: For those still supporting Coach Brownell ]

You got dog dookey for brains.

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Re: For those still supporting Coach Brownell


Jan 30, 2021, 10:31 PM

Like Coach. Respect he runs clean program. Something has gone astray and we need to make a change. No malice - no rancor - it just isn’t working. Guy over at SWU burning it up. Smart coach. Call him and tell him Terrence O part of his staff.

Watch what happens. It’s not complicated. You know basketball? You love the game? You spend free time looking for ways to get better? You like this generation of players? You have fun with them? I like your track record on getting them to play.

You want to coach at Clemson?
1. We will give you resources you need. What’s your plan?
2. Who are your assistants?
3. Don’t cheat don’t even hover in gray.

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Re: For those still supporting Coach Brownell


Jan 31, 2021, 9:06 AM

His replacement should be ask.Can you get players that now go to Alabama,Duke,Gonzaga or North Carolina? My suggestion is that any coach with great players has a chance to have a good team. Mediocre players have mediocre team. Coach don’t matter that much. Most every coach knows basketball pretty well. Some on here should be in coaching. Lol

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Everyone here should be supporting Coach Brownell


Jan 30, 2021, 10:36 PM

because he is our coach.

If you believe we would be better off with someone else, that’s fine, but that shouldn’t stop you from supporting him and his team.

Whether you like the man or not, he loves Clemson and works his tail off to try to make us a winner. No one in Clemson basketball history has cared as much. All previous coaches have either not succeeded or not stuck around. At least respect what Brad has done, and what he’s trying to do.

I feel that it’s reasonable to see how this season plays out before calling for his head and discussing replacements.

P.S. Comparing Brownell to Bowden is a lame move. Doing so shows how little you understand about basketball here compared to football.

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"All those 'Fire Brownell' guys can kiss it." -Joseph Girard III

"Everybody needs to know that Coach Brownell is arguably the best coach to come through Clemson." -PJ Hall


The comparison is fair.***


Jan 30, 2021, 10:39 PM



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"I've played multiple sports and would bet any amount that I'm still more athletic than you at this present time...."


No, it isn’t.


Jan 30, 2021, 10:50 PM

Clemson football under Bowden:
-Most popular sport on campus by far
-Winning tradition better than almost all of the other teams in the conference (only FSU had a better history)
-National championship and multiple conference championships in the past
-Weaker football conference so improvement should be easier
-Fertile recruiting territory
-Rabid fan support

Clemson basketball under Brownell:
-Not nearly as popular as football
-Worst basketball history in the conference
-No national championships or conference championships in the past
-Stronger basketball conference so improvement is more difficult
-Not very fertile recruiting territory
-Lukewarm fan support

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"All those 'Fire Brownell' guys can kiss it." -Joseph Girard III

"Everybody needs to know that Coach Brownell is arguably the best coach to come through Clemson." -PJ Hall


The expectations for the two sports aren’t the same either..


Jan 30, 2021, 10:57 PM

Football Expectations: National Championship every season
Basketball Expectations: NCAA Tournament on a fairly regular basis

That doesn’t mean you can’t draw parallels between the two coaches.




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"I've played multiple sports and would bet any amount that I'm still more athletic than you at this present time...."


The expectations under Bowden were simply to win the division


Jan 30, 2021, 11:00 PM

and play for a conference championship.

A BCS bowl was also a goal, but not an immediate one.

National championship wasn’t on Clemson’s radar at that time.

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"All those 'Fire Brownell' guys can kiss it." -Joseph Girard III

"Everybody needs to know that Coach Brownell is arguably the best coach to come through Clemson." -PJ Hall


Tommy Bowden was the hottest coach on the market...


Jan 30, 2021, 11:07 PM

in 1998. Clemson absolutely hired him with national championship aspirations.

And, assuming a BCS bowl appearance was the goal when he was hired, was Clemson justified in letting him go in 2008? Whether we’re talking National Championships or BCS appearances, Tommy didn’t meet expectations either way, which is the same thing fans are saying of Brownell.




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"I've played multiple sports and would bet any amount that I'm still more athletic than you at this present time...."


Re: The expectations under Bowden were simply to win the division


Jan 31, 2021, 5:11 AM [ in reply to The expectations under Bowden were simply to win the division ]

Bowden would have won the conference if Aaron Kelly had not dropped a perfect pass on the goal line. And I believe JD fumbled on the goal line to cost us 10 wins. If the players could not get motivated to win 2 more games TB would have had 10 win seasons. Some players under TB even admitted taking plays off during several games. IMO you can’t blame every loss on TB unless you’re going to do the same with Dabo!

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Re: The expectations under Bowden were simply to win the division


Jan 31, 2021, 8:53 AM

Yeah and we wouldn’t have lost to Duke by 30 if we made wide open 3s and jumpshots

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And regarding recruiting territory...


Jan 30, 2021, 11:46 PM [ in reply to No, it isn’t. ]

It looks like we are in a pretty good spot regionally speaking, very similar the football in fact.

https://watchstadium.com/ranking-every-state-in-the-u-s-by-the-college-basketball-prospects-it-produces-06-24-2019/amp/


Here’s some football recruiting info to help illustrate the similarities...
https://www.maxpreps.com/m/news/Y85mdocTXEiVazKvn-ABbg/which-states-have-produced-the-most-5-star-football-recruits-over-the-past-10-years.htm?amp=1




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"I've played multiple sports and would bet any amount that I'm still more athletic than you at this present time...."


Maybe not, but you can't keep using it as an excuse for


Jan 31, 2021, 8:39 AM [ in reply to No, it isn’t. ]

failure, and that's exactly what it becomes. At some point it's totally fair on every level to expect better for our basketball program, and from our head coach, no matter our history, no matter how much he loves Clemson, and no matter how hard he works. We reached that point some time ago, and those who don't recognize that simply have their heads in the sand.

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"Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want, and deserve to get it good and hard."
- H. L. Mencken


Who is using it as an excuse?


Jan 31, 2021, 10:50 AM

I’m simply stating that it’s short-sighted to call for the coach to be fired in the middle of a season. Let’s finish the season before we decide that it’s been a failure.

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"All those 'Fire Brownell' guys can kiss it." -Joseph Girard III

"Everybody needs to know that Coach Brownell is arguably the best coach to come through Clemson." -PJ Hall


I think you do.


Jan 31, 2021, 12:10 PM

Clemson basketball under Brownell:
-Not nearly as popular as football
-Worst basketball history in the conference
-No national championships or conference championships in the past
-Stronger basketball conference so improvement is more difficult
-Not very fertile recruiting territory
-Lukewarm fan support


Are you telling me you have never used any of that as an excuse for Brownell's lack of success?

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"Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want, and deserve to get it good and hard."
- H. L. Mencken


My post was addressing the absurd comparison between Bowden and Brownell.


Jan 31, 2021, 2:08 PM

It’s a lot harder to win as Clemson’s basketball coach.

Also, “Brownell’s lack of success?” Huh? If you believe that, you aren’t being objective at all. He’s had a lot of success. I think we can agree that we want him to have more, but this notion that he’s an awful coach and has us as an ACC bottom dweller simply isn’t true.

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"All those 'Fire Brownell' guys can kiss it." -Joseph Girard III

"Everybody needs to know that Coach Brownell is arguably the best coach to come through Clemson." -PJ Hall


I didn't say he was an awful coach, but Clemson basketball


Jan 31, 2021, 2:26 PM

has been the very definition of mediocrity under his tenure. That is an undeniable fact, borne out by the record. That is a lack of success. If you are under the deluded impression, somehow, that Brownell's run here has been successful, you are the one that has a problem with objective reality.

And I know it's a lot harder to win at Clemson in basketball, for the reasons you outlined. But those can't be permanent excuses. So, without those, what's Brownell's excuse?

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"Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want, and deserve to get it good and hard."
- H. L. Mencken


Re: Who is using it as an excuse?


Jan 31, 2021, 6:21 PM [ in reply to Who is using it as an excuse? ]

Agreed, not a classy move for a mid-season change. Firing a coach mid-season in B-ball is short sighted. I have doubts that it would motivate the players and the same staff would remain. Let the season play out and make a decision post-season when emotions don't lead to impulsive decisions.

Quietly evaluating a potential replacement would be a more proactive move.

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Re: Everyone here should be supporting Coach Brownell


Jan 31, 2021, 4:10 AM [ in reply to Everyone here should be supporting Coach Brownell ]

Judge, I agree that it is reasonable to wait and see how things play out for those of us that have not given up on the season. Our shooting has been awful, and I am not sure how much of that can be put on Coach Brownell. If that turns around then I think that we can be competitive with anybody.

At the same time, we have been blown out 4 of the last 5 games. It is understandable that there are fans that have lost faith. I haven't had much faith in most of Brownell's teams. Their success in close games this year leads me to think that this team is different, but they still have to get things turned around. I understand that you are unlikely to ever lose faith in Coach Brownell, but for most there comes a time where they think the future of the program would be better in other hands.

My suggestion is to urge fans to reserve judgement. Support the team and say a prayer for there success. If other fans choose to debate a different future, then let them. They should not attack you for holding out hope, but you shouldn't attack them for disagreeing either. I would hope that they would confine their critique to basketball because I do think that Coach Brownell is a good man. Just remember that does not in and of itself, mean that he is the right man for the job.

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I don’t have a problem with people being upset, disappointed, and angry.


Jan 31, 2021, 10:53 AM

I am all of those things too. Our performance these last few weeks has largely been atrocious. That is unacceptable.

However, it’s a long season. It’s too early to conclude that this season is a bad one, and it wreaks of an ulterior motive for fans to use this tough patch we are in to call for Brownell to be fired.

I believe the team deserves our support as long as we are playing. At the end of the year, the season will be evaluated. That’s what DRad will do, and I believe that’s what we should do.

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"All those 'Fire Brownell' guys can kiss it." -Joseph Girard III

"Everybody needs to know that Coach Brownell is arguably the best coach to come through Clemson." -PJ Hall


Re: I don’t have a problem with people being upset, disappointed, and angry.


Jan 31, 2021, 12:53 PM

I agree this isn't a time to do something rash. But it's getting to be to common for our teams to come out and look totally flat and down right embarrassing, when we know we have the talent to be more consistent. Its the AC wave form of our team which is so disappointing.

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Do we really have the talent to be more consistent in the ACC?


Jan 31, 2021, 2:14 PM

Our true freshman class was top 20, but they are still learning and can’t be expected to make a dramatic difference at this point.

Simms is preseason all-ACC, but interestingly we seem to play better when he isn’t the main go-to guy on offense.

Aside from Simms, who is a senior leader but not a top 5 ACC player in my opinion, who else on this team has star power?

We have some really good talent, but they are all on the younger side and are still figuring things out. That’s why you see guys like Honor, Dawes, Tyson, etc. have some great games, as well as some bad games.

Obviously it’s the coaches’ job to develop that talent. But just because we are more talented this year doesn’t mean that we are more talented than most of the ACC we are playing.

Based on recruiting and recent success, we are not as talented as UVA, FSU, or Duke. This isn’t to excuse the blowout losses to those teams, but to say that we are more talented than they are is incorrect. Maybe that’s not what you were saying, but that’s how I read it.

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"All those 'Fire Brownell' guys can kiss it." -Joseph Girard III

"Everybody needs to know that Coach Brownell is arguably the best coach to come through Clemson." -PJ Hall


Re: Do we really have the talent to be more consistent in the ACC?


Jan 31, 2021, 4:43 PM

I think I described it well . . we have enough talent to not be an AC wave. meaning, we shouldn't be so up and down. Huge changes , game by game. That's not good. We have lost these last 4 games by 25 points average.

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Re: Everyone here should be supporting Coach Brownell


Jan 31, 2021, 2:49 PM [ in reply to Everyone here should be supporting Coach Brownell ]

No one hear hates Brownell as a person. He’s just not the coach to take Clemson to the next level. He’s proven that after 10 years.

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Re: Everyone here should be supporting Coach Brownell


Jan 31, 2021, 2:49 PM [ in reply to Everyone here should be supporting Coach Brownell ]

No one hear hates Brownell as a person. He’s just not the coach to take Clemson to the next level. He’s proven that after 10 years.

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I think that list is down to 1: Mrs. Judge Brownell


Jan 30, 2021, 10:38 PM

Might as well have a mannequin on the sidelines

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Re: For those still supporting Coach Brownell


Jan 31, 2021, 12:08 AM

I have supported Brad Brownell up until this point, and will continue to do so until the season ends. But I have been adamant in my opinion that nothing short of at least a first round win this year in the Big Dance is enough to keep him.
He has had 11 seasons to get this program beyond the state it is now.
And this has nothing to do with Tommy Bowden.

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Re: For those still supporting Coach Brownell


Jan 31, 2021, 9:25 AM

Good post. Coach needs to leave. Some posters suggest adding more resources for basketball. Look at athletics-adding resources to any of our sports means taking away from another. Only cut the pie so many ways. Basketball has great resources. Football has unlimited resources. Track is gone because it had some resources.

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Re: For those still supporting Coach Brownell


Jan 31, 2021, 5:02 AM

That was pure luck! Most fans were mad when Dabo was as hired. Many wanted him fired after his second year. When Dabo was hired the university started pumping a lot of money into the football program. They really invested in coaches salaries, facilities, recruiting, which allowed a really unique HC to make many changes within the football program.

I don’t think TB would have accomplished what Dabo has but I believe he would have been much more successful. TB’s OC made about $350,000 and Dabo’s OC makes $1.6 million dollars and BV makes over $2.5 million dollars.

If TB could have offered his coordinators $500,000 I believe we would have been able to hire better coaches which most likely would have transferred into more wins. Every 2 to 4 years TB was on the hot seat with the fans. That’s a lot of pressure for anybody to work under.

IMO I don’t think its fair to compare Dabo vs TB because the circumstances are not the same. Dabo was smart enough to see the talent to hire Dabo then recommend him for the job when he left. TB loved Clemson that’s why he left for the good of the program. He never coached again, he did have offers after leaving Clemson.

Some of you should coach little league sports for a year. Then you may change your mind about calling for coaches to be fired.

I know it can get frustrating with our BB program. But Brad B has had as much success as any other previous BB HC. The schools in the ACC are average in football. Unless people want to give more money to sports there is only so much to go around. The majority goes to football. Our assistance are the highest paid in college football.

Maybe we just need more money put into the BB program with a couple of years will have consistent successful results each year.

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Re: For those still supporting Coach Brownell


Jan 31, 2021, 5:56 AM

Has basketball been provided everything that it needs to be successful? How are the extras when compared to Duke and UNC? The football facility can compare with anyone in the country. What about basketball? I am asking because I honestly do not know. If a coaching change is made, I want the guy to have the chance to be successful. I know that Dabo visited the AD and said “I need this because Alabama has it.” Dabo had a vision and made it happen. What is Brownell’s vision? What is DRad’s expectation for him? I know that my expectation is the team makes the dance. I also feel Clemson should be able to advance to the sweet 16 occasionally. Anything extra would be incredible. Basketball recruiting is different. Hotshot kids are able to one and done. Our chance was Zion and we all read how that went down. I felt so sorry for CBB because he thought he had landed Zion. Until the shoe contract bagman is eliminated, I feel that the elite 8 would be a stretch for Clemson. Regardless, men’s basketball is underperforming and DRad need to be talking with CBB on how to best move forward.

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Re: For those still supporting Coach Brownell


Jan 31, 2021, 8:58 AM

I don’t remember Bowden nor Brownell playing in a game. Were they third or fourth string?

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Re: For those still supporting Coach Brownell


Jan 31, 2021, 6:30 PM

So nothing falls to you if you aren't in the game? Ignorant thought.

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It would be preposterous, barring a surprising miracle run


Jan 31, 2021, 9:01 AM

deep into the NCAA Tournament, if we don't make a coaching change after the season. Even a tourney appearence with a first round loss would be a disappointment at this stage, and that's a real long shot. Regression to the mean is the clear pattern over time for Brownell. It is undeniable. Why keep hoping it will change? It's like being married to a short woman and holding onto the hope that some day she'll be taller. Why is it so hard to take an honest look at our program and commit to making it better?

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"Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want, and deserve to get it good and hard."
- H. L. Mencken


Re: For those still supporting Coach Brownell


Jan 31, 2021, 2:37 PM

Bowden did ok until the guy that made him famous (Rich Rod) left him Everybody loves and respects Brad but he is not a power 5 BB coach Previous players say he has no offensive identity This is why the offense has no confidence These are pretty good players that have lost all their confidence and that is on the head coach No one has gotten blown away as bad as us lately It’s all on the coach We need a Dabo type personality Brad does not inspire

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