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YOUR BALANCE
Clemson should play a season in Gvilles Bilo Center
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Clemson should play a season in Gvilles Bilo Center


Jan 26, 2013, 8:57 PM

and remodel Littlejohn completely, add some suites, ribbon boards, better video boards, etc. do it up right.

I LOVE going to the basketball games, and I think others do to,

Win or Lose, remodel (again) or dont, I still support our tigers, and love going to the basketball games,

perhaps do away with J-dew though... thats my only complaint,

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I completely agree


Jan 26, 2013, 9:02 PM

with eliminating JDew. He also works games at DII Lander & sucks there as well. Remodel of Littlejohn will take some serious $ which would be better spent on a totally new venue.

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Re: Clemson should play a season in Gvilles Bilo Center


Jan 26, 2013, 9:16 PM

Remodeling LJ would be a complete waste of time. You need to demolish that money pit and start over. Quit burning money putting it into a facility that costs more to fix up than to just start over.

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agreed but be shocked to see it happen***


Jan 26, 2013, 9:18 PM



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I don't get it. What's wrong with LJ and why is it a "money


Jan 26, 2013, 9:27 PM [ in reply to Re: Clemson should play a season in Gvilles Bilo Center ]

pit"?

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Re: I don't get it. What's wrong with LJ and why is it a "money


Jan 26, 2013, 9:37 PM

Here is a reason why. We spent 25 million on it over a decade ago and it still looks worse than some newer high school gyms. It has zero amenities, and is by far one of the worst coliseums in the ACC. You combine that with a program that has little tradition, and you get what we currently have.

1. Zero recruiting power
2. Coaches who leave when they get accomplished
3. Fan who are apathetic to a program because a commitment has not been show. Why commit to a program that isn't committed to itself

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I disagree with all of that.


Jan 26, 2013, 9:47 PM

I don't think it looks bad at all. It's a nice arena both inside and out. Good seating. Nice concourse. Nice grounds. It looks nothing like a high school gym. You know that's a silly comparison, right?

Please cite some tangible reasons how it's "one of the worst coliseums in the ACC". Don't just say it, explain why/how.

Our arena is not a reason why we don't sign McDonald's All-Americans. A lack of winning on a national level is the reason behind that. Coaches leaving has nothing to do with the arena, and fan apathy certainly doesn't either.

Our arena is fine. What we need to do to fix the things you mentioned is win. Win, that's it.

Please also explain why you say we aren't committed. Again, please cite tangible things, not just empty statements.

Also, you forgot to address how it's a "money pit". What does that even mean?

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Re: I disagree with all of that.


Jan 26, 2013, 9:52 PM

WillPhil,

I am not going to explain this to you anymore. If you cannot figure it out you never will. Looking forward to DRads plans set to come out in March.

Have a good day.

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"Anymore"?


Jan 26, 2013, 9:55 PM

You haven't even started.

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If you can't just look around at all the new facilities


Jan 27, 2013, 3:13 AM [ in reply to I disagree with all of that. ]

popping up around the country and tell how behind the times we are you have to be blind. Just look at the "New" ACC alone with recent new buildings. You can't even compare Littlejohn to arenas like Virginia's, GT's, Maryland, Louisville, Pitt, or even Miami's!

We desperately need updating but are now way behind the 8 ball b/c all we did was patch up the problem and didn't fix anything with the renovations and now a decade later we're again have a 2nd rate arena with no chance of changing it anytime soon b/c of all the money we just put into it. Does the money pit term fit now?

Fact is we *should've* just torn Littlejohn down when we had the chance and started from scratch. We need some luxury boxes for added revenue and to help some of the higher donors away from the floor allowing more access to the students. We need a new sound system, more electronic amenities, more TV's around the outside, more fan friendly amenities, better sight lines, wrap around video boards, etc.

This would all help increase excitement for the team, fans, and recruits. It will show our commitment to basketball and pump some adrenaline into the program. Unfortunately this isn't happening anytime soon so we'll just have to grin and bear it.

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I agree we should have a built a new one when we remodeled


Jan 27, 2013, 11:39 AM

LJ, but we didn't. And we sure as heck aren't going to tear it down and build a new one anytime soon. And really we don't need to.

Look, if you want to argue that some other schools have pretty arenas or whatever, that's fine, but like I asked the other guy - please list something tangible. How is LJ "second rate"?

Again, I think our arena serves us just fine, and it's most definitely not a reason we're not better at basketball. Is our arena nicer than Duke's? They sure do get better players than us. You wanna know why? Because they win. Win, and Littlejohn will look like the Taj Mahal.

One thing we could do immediately is move the the students courtside. I guess the sidelines are reserved for the big money donors, but it looks to me like they rarely use them. What a waste. And it's embarrassing to see it, and I would not be surprised if it reflects to recruits. If we're interested in making a more excited arena, move the kids. Immediately. Hopefully that's first on the new AD's agenda.

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I named plenty of things we are lacking and if you don't


Jan 27, 2013, 2:16 PM

understand how a new, modern arena with all the bells and whistles is not only very attractive to recruits but puts a jolt of renewed excitement into the program and fan base than there really isn't a reason to have a discussion with you. There is a reason why you constantly here the word "facilities" used by college coaches.

Trying to compare us to Duke is silly. Duke has won for how many years? We'd have to win for many years to get to be a program like theirs and unfortunately in this day and age it is a lot tougher to get that started consistently than it was years ago. Not to mention the fact that the only reason Duke's arena is still there is b/c people think it's historic. Even with that, there is still a huge push to get that place replaced.

There's no doubt Littlejohn is a serviceable arena. It's not like it's falling apart. It's in good shape. It's just nothing special and fans and recruits look at it as such.

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Thanks, however........


Jan 31, 2013, 12:47 PM

a new sound system,

Sound is fine in LJ, and it certainly doesn't affect recruiting.

more electronic amenities

Like what? For recruits?

more TV's around the outside

I can always find a monitor when getting concessions. Are those for recruits?

more fan friendly amenities

Like what? And for recruits?

better sight lines

Sight lines are fine in LJ. Some of the best in the ACC in fact. And recruits don't care about sight lines.

wrap around video boards

Err, what?

etc.

Like?



And upon realizing that none of your mentioned stuff directly affects recruiting, like you said, please don't switch to "well it will bring more fans which will bring more recruits".

Before you go there you need to realize that:

A) The coolness of unspecified amenities and wrap around They will only bring more people for the short term.

and,

B) Not having the above things is not a reason why fans aren't coming out in droves right now.

Again, the arena is fine. The much bigger part of the equation, like I said, is WINNING. Win and fans will come. Win and recruits will come.

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maybe you should try to have an open mind...


Jan 31, 2013, 1:02 PM

instead of asking folks to elaborate and then berating their opinions in favor of your own opinions.

This is why people stop talking to you...because you don't want to reason...just to cause drama.

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That's seriously one of the strangest posts I've ever read.


Jan 31, 2013, 6:20 PM

I asked him to elaborate. He did. He offered his opinions, and they were well noted and I said "thanks".

I then offered my opinions, which I think were extremely valid counterpoints to his opinions, and that's all I did.

I think my points were well stated and with solid reasoning, in spite of what you said, and I didn't try to force my opinions on him any way.

This is what people do here, and I didn't try to force my opinions any more than anyone else does n this FORUM. And I sure as heck didn't "berate" him in any way, nor did I remotely try to cause any "drama". Too, what the heck are you talking about with "people stop talking to you"? LOL. That's crazy talk man.

Seriously, what the heck are you talking about bud? I truly hope you at least try to explain, or at least apologize for obviously misreading something.

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I will now be the third person in this thread...


Jan 31, 2013, 6:27 PM

to tell you I can't talk to you anymore.

Yes, this is a FORUM for discussing differing opinions. You're welcome to share all you want to.

But you see, when all you come back with is trying to prove the person wrong...your requests for someone to "explain" or "elaborate" fall flat.

Every response to a post of yours has had explanation...yet you keep asking people to explain or give facts. You can't just pretend it isn't clear if it's not in agreement with your opinion. That's what I'm trying to say.

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Even stranger still.


Feb 1, 2013, 12:09 PM

Nobody but you has said they can't talk to me. That's strange.

At least we agree a forum is for sharing opinions. That should go without saying. It's also for debating opinions. Again, just common sense. Strange if you don't see that.

Debating opinions - isn't that the same as trying to "prove the other guy wrong"? Seriously, it's comical you would find my requests for elaborating as "berating" or whatever you seem to think it is. You make no sense. Again, that's strange.

Not every reply has had an explanation. That's not even close to being correct. The post in question offered examples of tangible things, but none of those are what's going to help us win in the long run. Read the counterpoints again if needed.

And I didn't "pretend" anything. Nothing at all. Again, dude, where are you even getting this stuff?? Strange.

All in all, feel free to debate anything you want. I feel like I offered excellent counterpoints to the "we need and arena to win" insinuation. What you said is simply not true. Instead of imagining all the strange stuff, you could always try to offer some substance instead of completely baseless accusations.

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Oh...and "at least apologize"...


Jan 31, 2013, 6:29 PM [ in reply to That's seriously one of the strangest posts I've ever read. ]

Bwahahahahahahaha. Don't ever say that again on this board...you'll get none such from us. lol.

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Well..........


Feb 1, 2013, 12:18 PM

Considering you swung and missed on basically every comment you made, I would say an apology is in order. No sweat though - just be who you are.

But who is "us" anyway? Were you sitting in a room with a bunch of people when you typed that? Do you imagine there are were bunch of guys sitting around you agreeing with you? Sorry bud, but again, that's strange. Just saying.

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if they give students gas vouchers I would be all for that


Jan 26, 2013, 9:19 PM

and before anyone goes off on the student section this was the first season I have missed an ACC home game as a student (currently a Jr.)

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Brad Brownell: more losses than any other coach in school history.


Re: if they give students gas vouchers I would be all for that


Jan 26, 2013, 9:38 PM

Gas vouchers? You serious bro? Get your ### out of your dorm room, drive to downtown Gville, drink some beers in a great atmosphere, and enjoy the game.

)*)*)*&)*&(*&(*&(* gas vouchers? Really. Freaking generation of entitlement

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I feel like if games were held in Portland students would


Jan 26, 2013, 9:59 PM

still be slammed for not going.

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Re: Clemson should play a season in Gvilles Bilo Center


Jan 26, 2013, 10:14 PM

And you are personally going to pay the difference in everybody's ticket prices per game( probably about $5 I would think plus their downtown Greenville parking) that it would cost because of the added revenue we would have to dole out to the Bilo Center while they completely remodel Littlejohn,which your first statement say needs it while in your third sentence you say remodel ,or not you still love going to the games.
Did you really take time to think this out or are you a polecat masquerading as a Tiger.
I will cut you some slack however.J-Dew needs to get a Mountain Dew,buy a cheap seat up in the far corner of Littlejohn and keep quite.
Forget the slack;one final thought.Where exactly in the new remodel Littlejohn do you plan on adding those suites?

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When we renovated we played in Anderson in lieu of BLC***


Jan 27, 2013, 3:03 AM



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This would also increase the Fan Base ....


Jan 27, 2013, 10:50 AM

Games in G'ville is a great idea. Increase exposure. Here in DC, Georgetown plays several games in the Verizon Center .... Georgetown is really thought as a regional team, a DC area College Team... and not just a Georgetown University only team

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Yup, only college Bball team around, really


Jan 31, 2013, 12:50 PM

worth watching, anyway.

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Clemson


Re: Clemson should play a season in Gvilles Bilo Center


Feb 1, 2013, 12:20 PM

Clemson would have to pay to bus students to Greenville. If you think people don't show up now, make them drive 45 minutes to the Bilo Center to watch Clemson basketball. If they had buses and incentives, like giftcards to local restaurants, free shirts, etc. they wouldn't have too much of a drop off in the student section by moving it to the Bilo center for a season.

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Re: Clemson should play a season in Gvilles Bilo Center


Feb 1, 2013, 12:35 PM

I've never felt inclined to post before, but here goes:

Before we pump millions of dollars into flashy new things for LJ, why don't we look at programs around us and the nation and see if new amenities or arenas worked for them.

-Did USC's major investment work? No.
-Virginia's? No.
-How in the world is Butler winning with their current facilities? Butler's success is an impossibility if you listen to some people on here.
-Why is Miami winning right now with the worst arena in the ACC?


The programs that typically spend the most money on basketball every year are programs with a track record of success. They have the best coaches and in-roads for recruiting. Their facilities are at the top of the league because the program brought them to the top first.

Lambasting LJ as the reason for our lack of success is misguided scapegoating.

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