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Okay, when your lawyers are quitting from a case...
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Okay, when your lawyers are quitting from a case...


Jan 30, 2021, 11:15 PM

...you already know you're going to win, you've got issues.

Thanks to Rand Paul forcing a procedural vote this past week, it's already known - or at least strongly suspected - that there's nothing like the 67 votes it would take to convict Donald Trump in the Senate.

And yet...despite the fact that he has this thing seemingly totally, completely in the bag...here's Donnie finding yet another way to make life interesting for himself.

His whole legal team - which was mostly fairly crackerjack legal eagles from right here in South Cackalacki - just quit on him. Because not only had he not paid them yet (of course), instead of, you know, arguing the impeachment case he's about to be tried for, he wanted them to grandstand on election fraud.

They glanced over at Lin Wood, Sidney Powell, and Rudy Giuliani...and declined. Gosh, I can't for the life of me imagine why.

If he gets himself convicted, the fool's truly got nobody to blame but himself, at this point. He's worked at this, he really has.

https://www.cnn.com/2021/01/30/politics/butch-bowers-deborah-barbier-trump-impeachment-team/index.html


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Re: Okay, when your lawyers are quitting from a case...


Jan 30, 2021, 11:29 PM



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I go back to this...even if he was 100% correct, it wouldn’t matter.


Jan 31, 2021, 10:17 AM

The country has moved on as a whole. What does he think the end result would be of this election being overturned in February 2021. The country would be torn apart. So put aside the fact that virtually every lawsuit they have brought to court has been given the boot...it’s too late. If Trump believed that elections are being rigged, and he truly wants that brought to light, he can spend the next four years developing some full-proof systems, reviews, oversights, etc. A platform. A team. Be ready to make your case in 2022 or 2024. Because right now it’s a very transparent tantrum that, if it even could succeed, would be the worst thing for the country in a long long time.

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null


Re: I go back to this...even if he was 100% correct, it wouldn’t matter.


Jan 31, 2021, 10:33 AM



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Re: I go back to this...even if he was 100% correct, it wouldn’t matter.


Jan 31, 2021, 11:13 AM [ in reply to I go back to this...even if he was 100% correct, it wouldn’t matter. ]

I wait with bated breath for Trump's crack team of eagle-eyed forensics investigators and lawyers to begin their analysis. He's assembling only the best people already, I know it.

Elite Strike Force. (Part Deux.)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pMXvH6T2vtM

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Re: Okay, when your lawyers are quitting from a case...


Jan 30, 2021, 11:46 PM

Case has no standing, no lawyers needed.

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Re: Okay, when your lawyers are quitting from a case...


Jan 31, 2021, 1:35 AM

Case has plenty of standing. We all watched the evidence play out live.

If someone, or some group, other than trump (left or right) created promoted and led that rally and then went directly to the capitol and carried out the same actions, they would be in jail right now.

The dumbarses that stormed the capitol are in jail but the pathetic “leader” that created the rally and told em to go to the capitol and lied about joining them is not in jail and u say there’s no case? You have been conned.

My sources in the former White House say trump was a no show at the capitol because of his bone spurs.

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Re: Okay, when your lawyers are quitting from a case...


Jan 31, 2021, 9:20 AM

Impeachment conviction is used to remove one from office. He is not in office. Even Trump hating Roberts knows this, that he why he is not presiding over the circus.

Your evidence:
"I know that everyone here will soon be marching over to the Capitol building to peacefully and patriotically make your voices heard,"

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Re: Okay, when your lawyers are quitting from a case...


Jan 31, 2021, 10:02 AM

If that’s the only evidence you’ve seen, you should hear about this new technology (invented by the deep state) they invented in the 1970s. It’s really cool.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_video#Digital_video_coding


So, what happened is ....... trump conned his nutcases into going over to the capitol and starting a fight. The funny thing is these dumbarses not only videoed themselves before during and after, but they posed for this new photography technique called selfies, ie they took a pic of themselves and posted it on this thing that Al Gore invented called the interwebs. So bottom line is, it turns out there is a lot of evidence, ya just gotta really dig for it.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Internet


And don’t be misled by the MSM, Q knows that Al Gore and the deep state invented the interwebs as a method of tracking the wave patterns in the right side of our brains. Do u see what big government does to us?

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Re: Okay, when your lawyers are quitting from a case...


Jan 31, 2021, 10:06 AM

I forgot to mention, Trump did not go to the capitol with his dumbarses because he has really bad bone spurs.

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Speaking at a rally or even organizing one


Jan 31, 2021, 10:15 AM



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Re: Speaking at a rally or even organizing one


Jan 31, 2021, 10:59 AM

We can argue the finer points of law all we want.

I'd convict him, personally. Actually, just speaking for myself...I'd lock him away in whatever equivalent we could find of the Tower of London and throw away the key; I personally take a dim view of insurrection and I've always been a ruthless-minded SOB with a disinclination to leave functional enemies in my backfield. But that's neither here nor there.

Trump knew exactly what he was doing. He invited the mob there; he wound them up; he pointed them at Congress, he had a real good idea what they were going to do. That's premeditation and intent, anybody says anything else, I'm really not interested in debating it anymore. I saw with my own eyes what happened and so did anyone else not in full-on denial.

That said, the way the law's structured, it'd take 17 GOP Senators with the will to convict him and those appear to be in short supply. They say "guilty", they've got the power to make it so...because, well, they're Congress and who's the higher authority that's going to override them again?

But they likely won't...and that's just how it is, however much former Never Trumper/RINO's like myself would like the Party of Reagan back. Well...tough. It ain't coming back, it looks like, not anytime soon, anyhow. Which means Trump is going to skate on impeachment - again - and despite the fact that he's already cost his party the presidency, the House, and Senate in just four short years and ended as the least-popular American president in the last 50 years will also remain the dominant figure in the GOP. Which in turn means the GOP is going to continue to metastasize around an increasingly extremist base of 30-35% of the country that is increasingly hostile to and alienated from the rest, which is not exactly a recipe for success going forwards. Especially since that 30-35% is convinced that the other side is engaged in untraceable voting fraud...which is going to have a highly negative effect on voter turnout to go along with the fact that they're shedding middle voters like crazy anyhow.

To me that's a recipe to get reamed in future elections, but if the GOP wants to do that, clearly even the prospect of losing elections isn't going to stop them, so hey. Have at it. I hope the GOP politicians going along with this enjoy those seats of theirs on the Titanic. But I genuinely do not get it, I really don't.

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Re: Speaking at a rally or even organizing one


Jan 31, 2021, 11:08 AM



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They were ready to convict before he took office***


Jan 31, 2021, 11:14 AM



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I veiw the killing and distruction of private property far


Jan 31, 2021, 11:13 AM [ in reply to Re: Speaking at a rally or even organizing one ]

worse than marching on the Capitol. If you have a problem take it to the people that make the laws. Certainly some went to far, but they were still far less violent than the thousands of rioters that have been tearing our country apart for months.

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Re: Speaking at a rally or even organizing one


Jan 31, 2021, 11:15 AM [ in reply to Speaking at a rally or even organizing one ]

You have been kind. The dangerous demagogue u been following is going down, becoming less dangerous and more irrelevant.

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Re: Okay, when your lawyers are quitting from a case...


Jan 31, 2021, 11:43 AM

Yes, Trump may ###### defeat from the jaws of victory. I again do not see the political tool of impeachment being of any use, when Trump is already out of office. If he is felt to be guilty of inciting a riot, he deserves his day in court and if guilty should be given jail time.

I do not think he will be convicted in the Senate and think this is just another effort by the Dems to strut and preen before the cameras and put GOP senators on the record. This is pure raw politics. Trump is in FL, not the White House.If the evidence is strong enough to try him as a criminal for inciting a mob, let's hear the evidence and move forward.Many if not most legal scholars do not think Trump would be convicted if such charges were brought forward.

I do get the impression that Trump always perceives of himself as the smartest person in the room. That's not a good move anytime, but especially in legal matters.

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Re: Okay, when your lawyers are quitting from a case...


Jan 31, 2021, 11:45 AM

Haha! Sna-ch! Trump is probably looking for some of that too.

2024 orange level member flag link military_tech thumb_downthumb_up

if you are a liberal you are really scared


Jan 31, 2021, 1:02 PM [ in reply to Re: Okay, when your lawyers are quitting from a case... ]

and want to fix the vote before the vote happens

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The Senate has already voted nine times on the


Jan 31, 2021, 11:45 AM

constitutionality of this impeachment - 10 times if you include last week's vote where the Senate tabled the motion and moved forward with the trial.

The SCOTUS is the ultimate arbiter of constitutionality of laws and actions. This very US Senate has over the years confirmed all nine justices that make up this panel, including three appointed by the defendant, to perform this very function. They have already addressed this issue by prior actions. They've done their job in this regard. Now the Senate's job is to convict or not convict Trump of the charge levied.

Considering Trump has participated in over 3,500 lawsuits over his career, he would certainly appeal a conviction, which would ultimately make its way to the SCOTUS for them to do their job and rule accordingly.

The GOP is trying to frame this in false terms, and thus far succeeding. They are finagling a "get out of jail free" card instead of fulfilling their lone responsibility - is Trump guilty of the offense or not.

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Re: The Senate has already voted nine times on the


Jan 31, 2021, 12:16 PM

The House called no witnesses. Trump had no legal representation when the House voted. The point of a conviction for a person impeached is removal from office. The voters have already performed that task. If the legal evidence is sufficient, Trump should be criminally charged and if guilty sent to prison.

Some conservative legal experts indeed do think it is constitutional to proceed with the Senate trial. Some liberal legal experts don't. That's interesting.Again, Trump has been removed from office. Do you honestly think he will win a federal office in the future?

I have zero problem with a criminal trial if the prosecutors feel they have a winnable case. However, the impeachment trial is political theater, nothing more. If everyone is convinced that Trump is guilty of inciting a riot, then why waste time with this exercise.


Message was edited by: rons1®


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Re: The Senate has already voted nine times on the


Jan 31, 2021, 12:45 PM

Trump committed this offense only after having been voted out of office in an attempt to overthrow that very outcome in violent fashion, so that line of reasoning is conflicted.

Trump committed this violation of his Oath of Office while serving in the office of President. Impeachment articles were filed while he was still serving as President.

Impeachments are also meant to serve as barring officials from ever serving office again. The offense happened while he was in office, serving. He should without question never be allowed to hold public trust like that again. That is a clear function of impeachment.

There are plenty of scholars arguing for both sides. That is absolutely not the point. The one and ONLY body assigned the ultimate role of determining constitutionality is the SCOTUS, which the Senate, as a body, has placed there - all of them - for this very purpose.

The constitutional argument is moot. If GOP Senators want to vote not to convict, they are choosing not to hold a POTUS accountable for fomenting a violent insurrection - the charge at hand. This POTUS and this POTUS alone could have prevented this. He chose not to. He chose instead to fan the flames and help incite. Our Capitol was sacked. Five people are dead. Two additional Capitol cops have committed suicide in the aftermath. Serious injuries remain for many not killed.

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Re: The Senate has already voted nine times on the


Jan 31, 2021, 12:54 PM



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And that's what a Senate trial is for, Bubba.


Jan 31, 2021, 1:28 PM

Did he violate his Oath of Office or not. All the defense and evidence and such will have ample opportunity and be on full display during the impeachment trial, mooting those arguments also.

What has already been decided, by this very Senate, is the constitutional parameters in place. Last week the Senate voted to move on with the trial. Done. Nine times prior the Senate placed the ultimate arbiters of constitutionality in place on the SCOTUS. Done.

I know this sort of thing is very inconvenient for a self-professed constitutional originalist as yourself. The evidence (actual evidence, mind you) will be on full display. The GOP is free to reject it all - but it must be tied to the actual charges, and not peripheral arguments and rehashing of "constitutionality" that they have already voted on and established prior.

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Re: And that's what a Senate trial is for, Bubba.


Jan 31, 2021, 2:01 PM



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Re: And that's what a Senate trial is for, Bubba.


Jan 31, 2021, 2:39 PM

I'm not a US Senator so what I feel about what I've witnessed over the past months doesn't matter squat in the upcoming trial.

The SCOTUS is the ultimate arbiter of constitutionality. There isn't a debate about that, right? The GOP Senate defense of voting to convict is wrapped around this being an illegitimate impeachment, as you continue to state in questioning its mere existence. My point here is that the Senate has already voted on and taken action on the constitutionality of this impeachment by placing justices who decide those matters in their places. The House didn't fill the SCOTUS. The President only nominates a SCOTUS. The justices themselves don't hire a SCOTUS. The US Senate and the US Senate alone places the justices there. The Senate also only last week failed to pass a motion to delay the trial based on its constitutionality by a 10-vote margin. Again, the Senate has spoken on this matter by virtue of its votes and actions.

The next duty, and only duty at this stage, is its obligation to hold a trial on the impeachment charge. There will be plenty of evidence shared, much we have yet to see considering the thousands and thousands of hours of recorded documentation leading up to and during. GOP leadership worked out a timeline for Trump to gather a defense team - the Senate once again agreed and moved on.

Not sure how much more I can simplify this for you in terms of what steps the Senate has already taken to take "constitutionality" off the table as a defense. I Bubba'd you for the CNN MSNBC slight - it's a great big world out there.

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Re: And that's what a Senate trial is for, Bubba.


Jan 31, 2021, 3:01 PM



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Re: And that's what a Senate trial is for, Bubba.


Jan 31, 2021, 2:40 PM [ in reply to And that's what a Senate trial is for, Bubba. ]

I'm willing to wait on the evidence, all of the evidence. I definitely believe Trump was not presidential during his term and certainly not after the election. I think his words were inflammatory and ill advised. I would never vote for him again, but it remains to be seen that he wanted the Capitol attacked, legislators attacked and potentially killed.

Some reports indicate that the rioters had planned on this move days ahead.

This "coup" would never have succeeded.If the GOP senators are presented with convincing evidence that Trump desired and knowingly caused the Capitol attack, he will be convicted in the Senate and furthermore, will almost assuredly later face criminal charges as well he should if the evidence is there.

I'm willing to bet the evidence will be such that the Senate will not convict and I suspect he will not be criminally charged. If the evidence shows otherwise, I hope he is convicted in the Senate and especially in criminal court.

We don't know many things at this point. That is the point of any trial Bubba. The House did not follow proper protocol.Why? Politics. Absolutely zero is keeping a prosecutor from charging Trump. In fact, many of them probably need a change of underwear just thinking about taking the Orange man's scalp.

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I agree with just about everything you posted here.


Jan 31, 2021, 3:26 PM

The only distinctions really are that impeachment isn't a criminal trial, it's inherently political, but in that more political sense as accountability for office holders, those in the political realm itself. The CEO of our company got tossed out by its shareholders. Did he help light a fire under the law factory and the people in it on his way out the door to the detriment of the company because he thought it would save his job? If so, should he ever be allowed anywhere near company operations again, even though he's no longer in charge, or anyone else in the future that might also go scorched earth in this fashion? This is the realm of impeachment. Sedition, inciting a riot, aiding and abetting the enemy, these are criminal matters which will wind their way along as more details come to light, or don't.

The speed of the House vote was definitely unprecedented; it was already being rolled out the day after the Capitol sacking. Options were being given to the Executive branch elements to take their own action in lieu of; conversations with the Joint Chiefs on nuclear access and wag the dog scenarios took place. At the end of the day, under emergency style proceedings, it was the most bi-partisan impeachment vote to proceed to trial for a sitting President in our nation's history. But it's just a charge - not judgment.

The coming trial is justified in a historical sense, and we deserve a judgment based on whether the evidence upholds the charge, not whether there should have been a charge to begin with. There shouldn't have been a Capitol sacking to begin with, but here we are.

As far as job responsibilities go, yeah, not exactly presidential there on the way out.

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Re: I agree with just about everything you posted here.


Jan 31, 2021, 3:49 PM

...and the fact remains, I'm still not 100% sure what Mitch McConnell is going to do.

I'm not sure McConnell is really afraid of Trump and I'm pretty sure he's got the votes if he does decide to impeach. McConnell is, what, 78 years old, he just won re-election anyhow and won't stand again until 2024 in any event.

Yeah, he voted against the "constitutionality" of impeaching a president no longer in office but that's also classic McConnell, it gives him an out should he decide to use it. It just keeps his powder dry. He also - very clearly - reserved the right to "listen to the evidence."

I have personally seen zero indication Mitch has made his mind up any which way. And Trump's busy acting the fool yet again, just ran off his entire legal team less than two weeks before the trial and is all set to turn the whole thing into a circus. He's going to end up sending Rudy or Sidney Powell by default because he literally has no one else.

Is everybody really 100% certain Mitch McConnell has decided the best thing for the Republican Party is to remain under Trump's spastic and tiny thumb for the foreseeable future? Because I actually am not.

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Re: I agree with just about everything you posted here.


Jan 31, 2021, 4:16 PM



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Re: I agree with just about everything you posted here.


Jan 31, 2021, 6:12 PM

A precedent for what?

McConnell wants his seat back...in 2022. I think he can get it, personally, if he breaks with Trump hard and gets middle America back into the GOP's court again. Mid-term elections don't tend to be good for the incumbent party. The Dems' big tent is also getting awfully crowded and it's only holding so many right now because Trump has scared a bunch of folks that really don't ordinarily like each other a whole lot all together. As long as Trump continues to loom large over the country, the Lincoln Project keeps on keeping on, the Bernie Bros on the left and Biden moderates in the center stay grudging allies, and all those little fractious identity-politics coalitions (like, say, Ilhan Omar and and the myriad of Jewish reps and Senators in Congress) that ordinarily might splinter and break in normal times stay together. Lifeboat politics. Big Bad is still out there, and he is only driven away, not vanquished.

Of course, the longer that coalition lasts, the harder getting those votes back will become.

The GOP doesn't need Trump anymore...and in fact would probably do a whole let better in '22 and beyond without him. Nobody would be scared of, say, Nikki Haley but Trump keeps the Dems motivated...and One Big (Dysfunctional) Family.

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Re: I agree with just about everything you posted here.


Jan 31, 2021, 6:21 PM



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Re: I agree with just about everything you posted here.


Jan 31, 2021, 6:38 PM

He may do that.

Mitch is nothing if not practical and I have no doubt Mitch will do what he feels is ultimately best for the GOP and for Mitch. Truthfully, Twitter cutting off Trump at this juncture has probably helped Donald mightily in this regard because he's not running around making a spectacle of himself. Out of sight, out of mind.

Here's the thing, though - Donald might have behaved himself up to this point and not re-platformed because impeachment's hanging over his head, but you know the second this impeachment thing is decided Trump's going to find himself another platform...and then it's on. Full Donald, with no filter, and no White House staff on hand anymore to intervene, free to rant and rave and go Full Donald against anybody he ever even thought wronged him.

At which point Mitch may really wish he had finished Donald off when he had the chance. And I wonder if Mitch is canny enough to know that, too.

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Re: I agree with just about everything you posted here.


Jan 31, 2021, 6:46 PM



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Re: I agree with just about everything you posted here.


Jan 31, 2021, 7:13 PM

The problem is going to be the "kiss the ring" effect.

There's a pretty good article in Politico called "The Antipope of Mar-a-Lago" that makes a pretty good case for what Trump's post-presidency might look like.

https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2021/01/29/trump-antipope-president-mar-a-lago-463238


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