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All-TigerNet [10613]
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Ed Orgeron = Gene Chizik + Jimbo Fisher
Sep 26, 2020, 11:32 PM
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One hit members of the lucky quarterback club!
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Re: Ed Orgeron = Gene Chizik + Jimbo Fisher
Sep 26, 2020, 11:34 PM
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with just a splash of the Muppets mixed in
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Heisman Winner [111373]
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Re: Ed Orgeron = Gene Chizik + Jimbo Fisher
Sep 27, 2020, 11:02 PM
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Jimbo can coach just fine, he just can't seem to manage a program. orgeron caught lightning in a bottle at the end of last season, I doubt we see anything like that at LSU for a while. chizik sucks.
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Legend [16186]
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Re: Ed Orgeron = Gene Chizik + Jimbo Fisher
Sep 28, 2020, 8:14 AM
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Don't judge Coach O too quickly. Since winning the title last year Coach O has lost a lot.
He lost QB Joe Burrow, DC Dave Aranda, Passing OC Joe Brady, and Mrs. Orgeron.
Wait, come to think of it the Jimbo connection might be valid.
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CU Guru [1149]
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Ed Flintstone is a much better coach than Dumbo Fisher or
Sep 28, 2020, 8:46 AM
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Gene Cheezdik, all else being equal. But LSU sold out for one special season hoping it would carry over. It won't because going the 'free agent' route isn't sustainable. Back in '97 the Marlins basically did the same thing, just to beat the Braves and win a World Series. They spent about a billion dollars bringing guys in. The names on that team were ridiculous. The very next offseason the owner totally dismembered the team saying he took a financial hit even though they won the WS. It wasn't sustainable because they their farm system sucked.
LSU did the same thing, except the college football version. They didn't dismantle the team but graduation and coaching defections were inevitable because they don't have the culture. Watching them get punked Saturday by Leach and MSU was not unforeseeable. And it was enjoyable. Hope they had fun with that shortest in history natty celebration. They look just like they did prior to 2019. Salty D and erratic O.
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110%er [6825]
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Re: Ed Flintstone is a much better coach than Dumbo Fisher or
Sep 28, 2020, 9:02 AM
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I don't care for Ed but I do think he is a good coach.
Here is one for you: He is (perhaps) more Mack Brown & Hobo Fisher. They are solid 9-10 win coaches that caught a hot QB. Toss Lloyd Carr and Fulmer into that group too. Heck Spurrier fits there too. Snicker, Dooley.
Gene Chizik is like Larry Coker. Steps out a winner then dives to .500.
All of that just makes me more thankful for Dabo. He has shown he can win with multiple guys - few coaches can do that and they are the elite of the elite.
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Re: Ed Flintstone is a much better coach than Dumbo Fisher or
Sep 28, 2020, 11:49 AM
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Besides losing 2 critical coaches and installing a new D with cv19 limitations, LSU roster was devastated.
LSU will not contend this year for anything but a bowl because everybody gets to go to a bowl.
Just before the game LSU AA DB Stingley was hospitalized and a DL starter didn't dress out. As a result:
>> 30 on the NC Game roster were missing.
>> 19 of LSU’s 22 starters from 2019 are either playing in the NFL, have opted out, or were unavailable for the game.
>> Seven of the 19 new starters put on an LSU uniform for the 1st time.
>> Seven of the 19 were replacing All-Americans.
Add to that a poor performance with what talent LSU had remaining and it was ugly.
The final score doesn't reflect how bad LSU looked.
LSU has a roster with great potential. Potential means They Ain't Done It Yet. No guarantee they will do it this year, especially with 4 of the remaining 9 games being against Top Ten Teams, 3 on the road and bama at home. Could be Fugly.
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All-TigerNet [10613]
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Re: Ed Flintstone is a much better coach than Dumbo Fisher or
Sep 28, 2020, 12:41 PM
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You are pointing out precisely the difference between LSU and Clemson. Clemson is a sustainable program that does not gear up for one year, either by luck or by choice. We don't hire coaches who are looking for better opportunities as soon as they arrive on campus. We don't build a program where we will miss 30 from a championship roster. We don't recruit where we have that many players opting out or even being drafted in one year .....roster management is key. We also have a lot of first time starters ..... but with loads of experience because we pull starters when we get big leads. We have to replace All-Americans too ...... including 3 1st round D-linemen last year .... and still made it to the CFP. I am not convinced that LSU will have a championship program under Coach O ...... but we will see. You are getting a lot of good players.
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110%er [6825]
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Re: Ed Flintstone is a much better coach than Dumbo Fisher or
Sep 28, 2020, 12:47 PM
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Bingo. But I do think that Ed will be back.
I looked around and while 2011 Auburn was a trainwreck going 8-5 and 4-4 in conference from a defending National Champ perspective, only Mich State in 1968 did worse (like 3-7)... LSU could post a similar record. Wins against only Vandy, Coots, and Arky could do it...
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That 4-year stretch for Auburn was incredible
Sep 28, 2020, 12:54 PM
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14-0 national champs 8-5 3-9 12-2 national runners-up
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110%er [6825]
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Re: That 4-year stretch for Auburn was incredible
Sep 28, 2020, 1:07 PM
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Their whole history is like that... it is like, quick, the NCAA isn't looking go, no wait, the NCAA is looking stop!
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Re: Ed Flintstone is a much better coach than Dumbo Fisher or
Sep 28, 2020, 5:22 PM
[ in reply to Re: Ed Flintstone is a much better coach than Dumbo Fisher or ] |
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Besides losing 2 critical coaches and installing a new D with cv19 limitations, LSU roster was devastated.
LSU will not contend this year for anything but a bowl because everybody gets to go to a bowl.
Just before the game LSU AA DB Stingley was hospitalized and a DL starter didn't dress out. As a result:
>> 30 on the NC Game roster were missing.
>> 19 of LSU’s 22 starters from 2019 are either playing in the NFL, have opted out, or were unavailable for the game.
>> Seven of the 19 new starters put on an LSU uniform for the 1st time.
>> Seven of the 19 were replacing All-Americans.
Add to that a poor performance with what talent LSU had remaining and it was ugly.
The final score doesn't reflect how bad LSU looked.
LSU has a roster with great potential. Potential means They Ain't Done It Yet. No guarantee they will do it this year, especially with 4 of the remaining 9 games being against Top Ten Teams, 3 on the road and bama at home. Could be Fugly.
Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
Last year you were on here blowing the lsu horn and we all knew lsu was a one hit wonder. Go suck some crawfish heads and cry in your beer.
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All-TigerNet [13036]
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LSU and Clemson
Sep 28, 2020, 1:15 PM
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"You are pointing out precisely the difference between LSU and Clemson. Clemson is a sustainable program that does not gear up for one year, either by luck or by choice. We don't hire coaches who are looking for better opportunities as soon as they arrive on campus. We don't build a program where we will miss 30 from a championship roster. We don't recruit where we have that many players opting out or even being drafted in one year .....roster management is key. We also have a lot of first time starters ..... but with loads of experience because we pull starters when we get big leads. We have to replace All-Americans too ...... including 3 1st round D-linemen last year .... and still made it to the CFP. I am not convinced that LSU will have a championship program under Coach O ...... but we will see. You are getting a lot of good players."
Orgeron is just getting started. LSU had terrible roster management when he arrived, got the job in '17 so didn't got into his recruiting until '18. If you want to compare coaches, compare where LSU is after 3 years of O and where Clemson was 3 years after Dabo took over.
When O got the job LSU had more Kickers on 'ship than LBs.
LSU lost one coach, a shooting star who was only one year in, got a NFL OC job. Lost Aranda after 4 years to a Power 5 HC job @ ~5-7mil/yr, he was ready to move on and up. The most successful organizations have some who stay for stability and some who come in, impact and move on.
Opportunities to develop young players don't come easily in SEC when team after team could kick your ###.
LSU caught lightning in a bottle, the most accomplished team in CFB history. Now LSU must rebuild. LSU will need another year or two to become sustainable. For LSU that doesn't mean getting to The Playoffs every year, this year that woulda required 5 wins over Top Ten teams only because cv19 got rid of one, otherwise it woulda been 6 just to get in.
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All-TigerNet [10613]
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Re: LSU and Clemson
Sep 28, 2020, 3:57 PM
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You have some good points, but your Natty doesn't really confirm yet anything about your program any more than Chizik or Fisher's programs when they won with an outstanding QB. Maybe Coach O will be able to do it, but I don't think your program had less talent than Dabo when he took over at Clemson. Our rise was fairly slow, but steady. I guess you could say that Deshaun Watson was our turning point, but he had a loot more talent around him than Auburn ...... but probably not as much as you had at LSU.
As good as you were last year, there is no reason that you should not have played a lot of players. This is a quote and I know it doesn't mention LSU, but I just don't think the SEC plays as many players regardless of who you are playing.
Quote: "A look at Clemson’s box score shows that the Tigers played 84 (eighty four) players on either offense, defense, or special teams. That’s almost all of the 95 total players listed on the roster. Only 85 are even allowed to be on scholarship. (We played NC State this game)
Just for comparison, from the same day: Alabama listed 44 players as having seen the field in its similar blowout win over Tennessee, and Oklahoma listed 49 during an easy win over TCU."
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Re: LSU and Clemson
Sep 28, 2020, 5:04 PM
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You have some good points, but your Natty doesn't really confirm yet anything about your program any more than Chizik or Fisher's programs when they won with an outstanding QB. Maybe Coach O will be able to do it, but I don't think your program had less talent than Dabo when he took over at Clemson. Our rise was fairly slow, but steady. I guess you could say that Deshaun Watson was our turning point, but he had a loot more talent around him than Auburn ...... but probably not as much as you had at LSU.
As good as you were last year, there is no reason that you should not have played a lot of players. This is a quote and I know it doesn't mention LSU, but I just don't think the SEC plays as many players regardless of who you are playing.
Quote: "A look at Clemson’s box score shows that the Tigers played 84 (eighty four) players on either offense, defense, or special teams. That’s almost all of the 95 total players listed on the roster. Only 85 are even allowed to be on scholarship. (We played NC State this game)
Just for comparison, from the same day: Alabama listed 44 players as having seen the field in its similar blowout win over Tennessee, and Oklahoma listed 49 during an easy win over TCU."
+
LSU has now won 3 NC games, Clemson has won 2.
SEC doesn't play as many players as Clemson because the SEC talent level is much stronger: In the first 3 rounds of the draft SEC had 40 taken, ACC had 8. SEC has won 11 of the last 19 NC games. There is simply no chance to relax.
Clemson turning point was D Watson, then came TL. We could make the case that Dabo has done will by having 2 outstanding QBs in back-to-back years.
By the end of this season LSU will be much better, but that could involve 5 losses.
LSU will not be able to match Clemson's Playoff run because LSU must contend with other programs that also contend: bama, UGA, UF, and maybe AU, are above anything Clemson must face every year.
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110%er [5927]
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umm
Sep 28, 2020, 5:11 PM
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we've won three.....
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Re: umm
Sep 28, 2020, 5:18 PM
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we've won three.....
Clemson has won 2 NC games, LSU has won 3.
If we include Poll NCs, Clemson has won 3 NCs, LSU has won 4.
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Re: umm
Sep 28, 2020, 5:26 PM
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we've won three..... Clemson has won 2 NC games, LSU has won 3. If we include Poll NCs, Clemson has won 3 NCs, LSU has won 4.
your cajun math is wrong. 1981, 2016, and 2018 is 3.
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Re: umm
Sep 28, 2020, 5:39 PM
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we've won three..... Clemson has won 2 NC games, LSU has won 3. If we include Poll NCs, Clemson has won 3 NCs, LSU has won 4. your cajun math is wrong. 1981, 2016, and 2018 is 3.
There was NO NC game in '81, that was a Poll NC. CU won 1 Poll NC and 2 NC games.
LSU won a Poll NC in '58 and NC Games in '03, '07 and '19.
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Re: LSU and Clemson
Sep 28, 2020, 11:53 PM
[ in reply to Re: LSU and Clemson ] |
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That is the same baloney that South Carolina fans spout. All college football games in the Power 5 conferences are physically hard. I don't care how many first round draft choices the SEC has. No one has argued that the SEC isn't loaded with talent. Their style of play is much more conducive to NFL than other conferences. I am not arguing that. I am talking about building programs and sustaining them in college. Alabama has done it, Clemson has done it, FSu did it when Bobby Bowden was coaching, Miami for a while, Notre Dame, Ohio State, and a few others. It remains to be seen if Clemson is able to continue for another 5 - 10 years and it sure remains to be seen of Ed O can do it at LSU.
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Re: LSU and Clemson
Sep 29, 2020, 8:44 AM
[ in reply to Re: LSU and Clemson ] |
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That's some BS and you know it about why they don't play more players in games. LSU won 8 games by 3 Tds or more last season. They could have easily built depth that would be ready to play this year. They didn't. LSU focused on building a Championship TEAM and not a Championship PROGRAM. That team last year was amazing and everyone involved in it are and should be proud of what they accomplished but that is all they were focused on doing, building a ONE and DONE.
LSU will be back in 3-4 years to compete for the National Championship. That is their cycle and most teams would be happy to be able to say that they win or compete for a National Championship every 5 years on average. (3 championships in the last 16 years.
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Re: Ed Orgeron = Gene Chizik + Jimbo Fisher
Sep 28, 2020, 12:56 PM
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Math is a bit off, it's Ed Orgeron = Jimbo Fisher - Gene Chizik
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110%er [5072]
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Re: Ed Orgeron = Gene Chizik + Jimbo Fisher
Sep 29, 2020, 9:13 AM
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I honestly cringe a bit at posts like this because it really comes off as nothing but bitterness due to them beating us last season. It's certainly true that LSU isn't likely to be in the CFP on a yearly basis, but I wouldn't call them a one off. They've won 3 NC's in the past 17 years, and lost in the NC game in another season during that time. They've finished in the top 18 of the top 25 in 15 out of those 17 years, and in the top 10 during 8 of them.
They recruit very well, and they're at least in the discussion for part of the season at least nearly every year. Yeah, their success over the past 5+ seasons hasn't been as good as ours overall, but posts like this make it sound as if NC State came out of nowhere to win a NC.
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