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Lot o points [180915]
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Stewart should be arrested for vehicular homicide.
Aug 10, 2014, 3:00 PM
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There's no defending what he did.
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All-TigerNet [13190]
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Should the guy that was directly in front of Stewart
Aug 10, 2014, 3:10 PM
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Be charged with attempted vehicular homicide because he only swerved at the last second to avoid hitting the idiot standing in the middle of a dirt racetrack.
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Lot o points [180915]
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No, "avoid hitting" is the key.
Aug 10, 2014, 3:12 PM
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Tony did nothing to avoid hitting the guy, in fact he he made the rear of his car swerve towards the guy. Pay attention.
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All-TigerNet [13190]
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When you swerve in a dirt car
Aug 10, 2014, 3:15 PM
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You kick out the back end. Is it possible that Tony didn't see him until late, swerved and kicked out the back end of his car, because that's what I see in the video.
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Lot o points [180915]
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Oh he swerved to get out of the way by gassing his engine.
Aug 10, 2014, 3:17 PM
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got it.
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Lot o points [180915]
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He was trying to show up the ####### that got out on the...
Aug 10, 2014, 3:19 PM
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track, and failed. Vehicular homicide.
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All-TigerNet [13190]
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The dude directly in front of him almost clips him
Aug 10, 2014, 3:19 PM
[ in reply to Oh he swerved to get out of the way by gassing his engine. ] |
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He comes within a foot of Ward. Stewart see him a 1/2 second late because he is behind the other car, tries to miss him, and hits him with the wheel. This all happened in fractions of seconds.
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Heisman Winner [112363]
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I would say it will never happen and IMO...........
Aug 10, 2014, 3:29 PM
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there would be no way to prove it.
But it is the liberal state of New York so who knows?
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Lot o points [180915]
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The video shows Tony using his car...
Aug 10, 2014, 3:31 PM
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as a weapon, to me. He didn't have to be anywhere close to that kid on the track by the time Tony got there.
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All-TigerNet [13190]
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Why was the other guy within a foot of the guy then?
Aug 10, 2014, 3:34 PM
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I mean, he didn't have to be anywhere close to the kid either, unless, of course, that guy didn't see him either.
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Lot o points [180915]
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I haven't read anywhere that either driver didn't see him.
Aug 10, 2014, 3:35 PM
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One avoided him, one didn't.
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All-TigerNet [13190]
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I thought Stewart didn't have any reason
Aug 10, 2014, 3:39 PM
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To be close to the guy and only got close to teach him a lesson. That's the argument, correct? Why would the car in front of Tony narrowly miss the same guy? Was the car in front of Tony also trying to prove a point to the driver, because he could have very well hit the guy was well. If you can explain that to me, I'll join your side.
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Lot o points [180915]
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The driver in front of Tony has a better argument for not...
Aug 10, 2014, 3:41 PM
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ever seeing the kid, since the kid was out of his car for a shorter period of time. He avoided him, Tony didn't.
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CU Medallion [58379]
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There are a couple of scenarios that could sway this
Aug 10, 2014, 3:59 PM
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one way or the other, and none of them can be determined conclusively from this video. Maybe the kid was at fault and just got too close to Stewart or moved into his path in a manner that did not allow Stewart adequate time to avoid him(he was foolish at the very least). Just because the driver in front of Stewart missed him does not mean that the kid didn't move closer into Stewart after the first driver passed him by. I think it's impossible to tell from the video. On the other hand, a car can be heard revving at the exact instant Stewart makes contact with the kid. While it can't be proven that it was Stewart's car that was revving, it's cause for further investigation and could prove damning in court.
I don't know if there will be any criminal charges filed, but I would be surprised if they are not. I can almost guarantee you there will be a civil suit.
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Lot o points [180915]
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I think some different video angles from people at the race
Aug 10, 2014, 4:09 PM
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may help clear things up. Not in Tony's favor.
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All-TigerNet [13190]
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Maybe you should wait until those are available
Aug 10, 2014, 4:14 PM
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Before you find him guilty of murder?
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Lot o points [180915]
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Never said anything about murder.
Aug 10, 2014, 5:16 PM
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dumbazz.
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All-TigerNet [13190]
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There will be a civil suit
Aug 10, 2014, 4:11 PM
[ in reply to There are a couple of scenarios that could sway this ] |
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There is no possible way to prosecute a criminal case, where you would have to prove beyond of shadow of a doubt, that T.S. intentionally hit a guy moving towards him on the race track, with his rear right tire.
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Lot o points [180915]
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Doesn't have to be intentional to be vehicular homicide.
Aug 10, 2014, 5:18 PM
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Dumbazz. Is Tony your butt buddy or something?
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All-TigerNet [13190]
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No not my butt budy
Aug 10, 2014, 5:38 PM
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Wondering if he made someone in your life his butt buddy.
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Oculus Spirit [81651]
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He's arguing against somebody who potentially
Aug 10, 2014, 5:39 PM
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committed vehicular manslaughter, you're vehemently attempting to defend him at all cases...
Sure, flip that on him.
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All-TigerNet [13190]
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I have no idea what happened
Aug 10, 2014, 5:47 PM
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It was a split second thing that happened to a guy that was standing in the middle of a race track.
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Lot o points [180915]
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No, he just killed someone with his car.
Aug 10, 2014, 5:42 PM
[ in reply to No not my butt budy ] |
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When he didn't have to.
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All-TigerNet [13190]
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You have no idea what happened either.
Aug 10, 2014, 5:46 PM
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If it was so f'ing obvious he would have been arrested all ready. It's not the a clear cut case of Tony Stewart seeking out this guy and mowing him down.
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Lot o points [180915]
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Sure appears that way.***
Aug 10, 2014, 5:55 PM
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CU Medallion [60205]
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heard a dirt track racer on the radio this morning
Aug 10, 2014, 4:16 PM
[ in reply to There are a couple of scenarios that could sway this ] |
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discussing the differences that most fans would not realize. He said several things that were interesting and may or may not make a difference in your opinion:
1 - these tracks are short-short, basically a circle, nothing like a "regular" track.....when a yellow flag comes out, sometimes it take a lap or two before everybody even notices it. Concentration on the few feet in front of you is required - no time to glance around much. is If you see it and try and slow down too fast, you get run over and flipped. So you have to maintain a decent speed until it is safe and everyone is on the same "page" so to speak. Totally different means of "yellow flag" racing.
2 - dirt racing requires you to be in a controlled slide almost the entire time. MUCH more difficult for a driver to have total control over his car and swerve quickly to avoid anything. Cars just don't have the traction. It's like being on ice the entire time. Again, the concentration requires you to focus on the few feet in front of you, not look upstream. It's insane to be exposed out on the track at ANY time because of this - nobody would be aware or ever expecting a person on the track.
3 - these cars do not have clutches and if you just apply the brakes, you immediately stall out. You cannot just "stop" like a normal car. You have to constantly accelerate and he guessed that's why it appears Stewart accelerated at that odd moment.
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CU Medallion [58379]
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I don't think that what the guy in front of Stewart did will
Aug 10, 2014, 3:49 PM
[ in reply to I thought Stewart didn't have any reason ] |
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have any bearing on determining whether or not Stewart was at fault.
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Lot o points [180915]
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You could show the difference in how one car/driver reacted...
Aug 10, 2014, 3:53 PM
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vs the other one.
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CU Medallion [58379]
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I know what you are saying, and they may have reacted
Aug 10, 2014, 4:04 PM
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differently, but it will all come down to how Stewart, and Stewart alone reacted. Just because the first guy missed him does not necessarily mean Stewart should have.
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Lot o points [180915]
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I'm convinced that if Tony had reacted differently...
Aug 10, 2014, 4:07 PM
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and many things he could have done differently, the kid would be alive.
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All-TigerNet [13190]
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I'm convinced
Aug 10, 2014, 4:12 PM
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That if the guy didn't walk down the race track, into the direct line of cars forced into that line because his car is blocking the top of the track, that he would still be alive, regardless of T.S. split second reactions one way or the other.
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Lot o points [180915]
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Wow, you're a genius!***
Aug 10, 2014, 5:20 PM
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CU Medallion [58379]
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All-TigerNet [13190]
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Oculus Spirit [81651]
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Dude, watch the video again, Ward charges down the track.***
Aug 10, 2014, 3:58 PM
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All-TigerNet [13190]
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The first guy misses him
Aug 10, 2014, 3:59 PM
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Then Ward takes another step down the track, directly into Stewart's path.
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Oculus Spirit [81651]
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I don't see the second step towards the track.
Aug 10, 2014, 4:01 PM
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I do see the first car slow down like a normal reaction.
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Lot o points [180915]
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Not directly in Stewart's path.
Aug 10, 2014, 4:02 PM
[ in reply to The first guy misses him ] |
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Stewarts rear end hit him when he gassed it to make it swerve towards him, thus hitting him. geez man.
Stewart was trying to show up the kid for being an idiot. Vehicular homicide where i'm from.
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CU Medallion [58379]
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Maybe, but even if so, the first guy didn't kill him. There
Aug 10, 2014, 4:11 PM
[ in reply to I think if you say ] |
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are 3 questions here, as I see it:
1. Did Stewart intentionally hit this kid? If so, then that's it. If not, then . . .
2. Did Stewart engage in reckless behavior that resulted in the otherwise avoidable death of this young driver? If so, then that's it. If not, then . . .
3. Did Stewart take adequate measures to avoid hitting the kid?
What the other driver did or did not do shouldn't matter.
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All-TigerNet [13190]
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I think the first driver plays one key role
Aug 10, 2014, 4:14 PM
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If you argue that T.S. should have been farther away from the guy, so there was no chance of hitting him, why wasn't the first car farther away. You're talking about fractions of a second, and fractions of inches one way or the other.
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Oculus Spirit [81651]
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Re: I think the first driver plays one key role
Aug 10, 2014, 4:14 PM
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All-TigerNet [13190]
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What part of Ward got hit first?
Aug 10, 2014, 4:16 PM
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Was it his right leg that is sticking out farther than the rest of his body?
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CU Medallion [58379]
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All-TigerNet [13190]
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I think that takes the wrecklass endangerment
Aug 10, 2014, 4:16 PM
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Unless you charge the first driver with the same thing.
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CU Medallion [58379]
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But we're not talking about reckless endangerment, we're
Aug 10, 2014, 4:24 PM
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talking reckless homicide (by Stewart). Maybe both are indeed guilty of reckless endangerment, but only Stewart's resulted in a death. So maybe they should charge the first driver with endangerment, big deal.
Also, it may not be that both drivers were too close to the kid, maybe they weren't, maybe that won't be the argument. It may come down to whether or not Stewart gunned it in an attempt to scare the kid.
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All-TigerNet [13190]
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Wait?
Aug 10, 2014, 4:28 PM
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2. Did Stewart engage in reckless behavior that resulted in the otherwise avoidable death of this young driver? If so, then that's it. If not, then . . .
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CU Medallion [58379]
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?***
Aug 10, 2014, 4:29 PM
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All-TigerNet [13190]
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Ok, then in terms of criminal charges
Aug 10, 2014, 4:31 PM
[ in reply to But we're not talking about reckless endangerment, we're ] |
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Investigator: T.S. did you gun the car to try and scare Ward?
T.S.: No, he was closer than I thought and I tired to avoid him.
The only one that can testify to T.S.'s intentions is T.S. Unless he wants to go to jail, even if he did intentionally gun it to scare the guy (which I don't think he did) he's not going to say that, leaving the cops to deal with a guy that gets hit while scurrying down a racetrack and into traffic. There is simply no way to prove intent or negligence in my view.
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CU Medallion [58379]
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Well, there's the video.
Aug 10, 2014, 5:01 PM
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And maybe more video.
While I agree that the video we have seen doesn't prove anything conclusively, there doesn't have to be proof beyond a reasonable doubt to charge or indict, and if there is other evidence, a jury may indeed find it sufficient to convict.
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