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Topic: Herbstreit Commentary About CFB Playoffs!
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Herbstreit Commentary About CFB Playoffs!

[2]
Posted: Dec 18, 2020, 7:59 AM
 

In the event you have not seen this; I posted the link below.

I found this particularly interesting because it was coming from Kirk. Interesting still, he included his Alma Matter in the names of "usual suspects"! It's true, of course what he is saying, but I am still kind of shocked.
In a non pandemic year there are schools all over the country that start football seasons with no realistic hope of making it to the National Championship. Yet, football at many schools is the number one revenue generator for an athletic program. Football drives the bus and basically carries these athletic programs and this is true in H.S. as well. When they say - "most athletic departments don't make a profit" it's likely true - but it's not because of football. Otherwise, all the schools with no chance would stop. What happens is - football generates enough money to pay for the non-revenue sports. Sports with very little attendance and money generated from have to be paid for too.
I said all that to say, even with no realistic shot - a hope and a prayer that year might be The Year - most schools don't have a shot at a National Title. Yet, stadiums get filled, people pay good money to tailgate and park and buy concessions and jerseys for that team. Every G5 team fits in this box. Vanderbilt, Wake, Northwestern, Duke, Oregon State, Rutgers, Illinois are among some P5 schools that are in that box as well.
Kirk saying we have to find a way to make it so that everyone gets a shot at it(paraphrasing) had to have been said from a "analyst point of view". As a Buckeye fan, I am pretty sure he is okay with OSU having far and away superior talent in the Big 10! Agree? Disagree?
Nick Saban wakes up and can "trip on a 5 star recruit" on his way to breakfast it seems. Kids go to Nick because they want to go to the NFL. At least, that is how it started out before he got rolling good. Now, it's just a "ego thing with having an Alabama offer and playing for Nick Saban"! There is also the whole, "want to play for a championship thing"!
Shocked - because it is coming from Herbstreit. Especially because what was his solutions to making this happen? Does anybody know how to make the good players go to a school that "HAS DONE NOTHING TO MAKE YOU THINK THEY WILL COMPETE"? I see it H.S. all the time. Schools get accused of recruiting - but they don't have to. Parents/players do what they have to in order to attend that winning school. Is it the schools fault these kids make themselves available to them? How do you change that? Do you go: Okay bama you have 4 - 5 stars already nobody else can sign. Clemson you too! Go fill your 4 star quota Dabo! Stop Cring Ryan Day - and find the best 3 stars you can to fill out the roster!
What do you do to "make it more diverse"?
Personally, and of course, I love it how it is. FSU - even with SEC schools out there often would have the best or a top three class. That was the hurdle Clemson had to overcome. Then in 16 ended up beating Alabama with a 5 year composite star rated out of H.S. class "outside the top 10"! I think that team was composite #12. The hard way. Earned it. It took Tajh, CJ, Chad Morris up tempo and relentless pursuit of climbing the mountain to get where Clemson is as I type this. So, I don't care to "make it fair" just yet.
What do you all think about Kirks comments?
Basically, he is referencing Clemson and Alabama fatigue! Ohio State as well - but that is to be expected in my opinion as unlike the ACC no team from the Big 10 other than Ohio State has challenged for a National Title outside of OSU since 1998. The ACC has "current members": VT - 2000, Miami - won it - 2001, Miami - got robbed 2002 but played for it, Florida State won it in 2013 and we all know what our Tigers have been able to do. Unlike the Big 10 - the ACC isn't having to lean on leather helmet days and voted on National Championships and ghost of past accomplishments. Much more recent success from "the teams in the field".
The SEC can say they have a strong field - no doubt! I give them Hades - but you can't deny multiple teams have been able to step up from time to time and challenge the conference heavy weight.

What I would say about expanding the playoff

https://247sports.com/Article/Kirk-Herbstreit-wants-changes-College-Football-Playoff-system-Alabama-Clemson-Ohio-State-157104268/

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Re: Herbstreit Commentary About CFB Playoffs!

[4]
Posted: Dec 18, 2020, 8:14 AM
 

College football's future will be changed into something most schools can't afford--much more sweeping than changing the playoffs--if Congress passes the Booker bill as presented.
https://www.espn.com/college-sports/story/_/id/30533536/congressional-proposal-overhaul-college-sports


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Re: Herbstreit Commentary About CFB Playoffs!

emoji_events [5]
Posted: Dec 18, 2020, 8:34 AM
 

Great! Congressional involvement. That’s going to make it better!

Enjoy our run as one of the top college football teams while you can. This will lead to the serious degradation (if not the eventual destruction) of college football, as we now know it.

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Re: Herbstreit Commentary About CFB Playoffs!

[3]
Posted: Dec 18, 2020, 8:40 AM
 

The do-nothing NCAA asked for their help. If they can't do their jobs, why even have the NCAA?

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--Henry David Thoreau


Re: Herbstreit Commentary About CFB Playoffs!

[2]
Posted: Dec 18, 2020, 9:03 AM
 


Great! Congressional involvement. That’s going to make it better!

Enjoy our run as one of the top college football teams while you can. This will lead to the serious degradation (if not the eventual destruction) of college football, as we now know it.




I have to agree. It's crazy.

Having a coach like Dabo who has more than "football values" about him will help Clemson! People will still want to go to a place where they will be treated fairly and be given an opportunity to "outwork the competition" for a starting job regardless of how many stars you are. If you make plays - you play! It is now and will always be a big part of his legacy here to me. And why Clemson will be in a better position than most with some of the changes that's happening!
Well that and a whole bunch of very young kids now have Clemson as their blue blood!

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Meantime, what about Making It Fair?

[1]
Posted: Dec 18, 2020, 9:22 AM
 

When you talk about expanding the playoffs you have to remember - in normal years you are talking about cities and business having millions of dollars tied up in bowl games!
They apparently must be making money or I can't see them continuing hosting and putting these events on. Cities like Miami, Tampa and Jacksonville much like Charlotte get a huge economic boost from having the fans of those teams come spend some quality times in their hotels and restaurants.
In Charlotte the small conference: CIAA use to generate an annual $55 million in Charlotte. And it's nothing compared to the ACC tournament.

Would you keep it how it is now and maybe add the Chic Fil - A as a semi-final spot? And also the Gator Bowl maybe? If so, I could see that working. When would you do it? When would they be expected to play? Because now you get roughly 4 weeks to prepare. Maybe play the championship games 1st weekend of December. Two weeks later play those Qtr. Finals? Then the semi-finals on Jan. 1?

Something like that would work. You just hope bowl games don't go away as that is the NCAA tournament for football. Each programs one unquestioned "One shining moment" to be somewhat the center of attention. Attention that could lead to better recruits. More interest from boosters and hopefully better facilities. They catapult teams into the next season on high notes and make off season workouts more enthusiastic. They create hope for some programs. Players opting out to get ready for the NFL has hurt them.
As far as the playoffs though being expanded - will it really fix the huge gap in who is getting the best players annually? Those same teams will always still be in the hunt! Just like basketball: Duke, Kentucky, Kansas, Gonzaga, Michigan State and Villanova are all virtual locks! One of these schools will be in the final four or final w/o question. Bookmark this page.
If football has it's favorites what's the difference?

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Re: Herbstreit Commentary About CFB Playoffs!

[2]
Posted: Dec 18, 2020, 9:12 AM
 

What they're suggesting is the failed WOKE movement experiment we've been trying for 50 years... Gotten us nothing but a divided country and more corruption.

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Re: Herbstreit Commentary About CFB Playoffs!

[1]
Posted: Dec 18, 2020, 8:57 AM
 

Wish extremes wasn't the answer to solving some of these issues in some people's minds; when a more simple solution exist.

For example, hearing a kids reasons for transferring(prior to this year one time deal) and being human. If it makes sense and is plausible - stop having a stiff upper lip about it and grant the transfer. I.E. a kid can't just go - I am not playing enough here. Side note: do you want someone on your campus who isn't fully committed and happy?

Knowing many former and current college athletes - the compensation talk rarely came up! A cousin of mine that played at nancy st. was contacted by the Ed O'Bannon group. I don't know that he ever received anything - but if so, it wasn't much.
If we are talking just doing the right thing by a particular player that has "worked hard to put themselves in position to be popular within the framework of the team" then if they can have a speaking engagement because someone wants to listen to a college kid speak - then they should be able to do that. They should get the "fair market value" for a guest speaker! I.E. whatever you would have given someone else you can only give that. Trevor would kill it - but Cade Stewart likely wouldn't. DJU might - but Mike Jones wouldn't. Just like the IRS have your receipts ready.

Something other than just this rigid thing was needed. But, now instead of trying to be more flexible folks are going way overboard with trying to "make it right by athletes"! I get it. I am not blind to how scholarships at some schools aren't renewed if a better higher rated prospect comes. Or how after your eligibility at some schools they treat you like a disease. Or the money generated in certain sports. I get all that - but lawmakers getting involved is a bit much i.m.o. Could have been and should have been handled "in house"!

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I would create a model for college football

[1]
Posted: Dec 18, 2020, 11:03 AM
 

that ensures all teams end the regular season with a 6-6 record. Then, the two teams with the lowest operating budgets meet for the national championship.

I think that would be very fair and inclusive.

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Frankly...he's right !!!!

[4]
Posted: Dec 18, 2020, 8:15 AM
 

That said, is it really up to the CFP Committee to change to rules, or is it up to the other teams across the country that are not Alabama, OcryO State, or Clemson to get better and challenge them for supremacy.

College basketball has a 64 team tournament playoff format, and hundreds of schools play each year in an attempt to make that 64 team field. However, the vast majority of those teams have no realistic hope of making it to the National Championship. The teams that really do have a realistic chance to play for a national championship are limited to a select few.

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= 8 team playoff***

[1]
Posted: Dec 18, 2020, 8:16 AM
 



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null


Kirk is SURE who is gonna win -go back to last weeks gameday

[4]
Posted: Dec 18, 2020, 8:17 AM
 

and see WHO they picked as the winner of the


LSU - Gators game . ..

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null


Re: = 6 team playoff***


Posted: Dec 18, 2020, 4:43 PM
 

After Covid (please, God)....5 Conference champs,1 at large...Ranked by Committee...1,2 get a bye. Then re-rank the winners to 1-4 ..2,3 and NCG...Not perfect, but as fair as it is now...My 2 pennies worth...which has been mentioned until all Germans are accounted for...

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Dominant Streaks In Sports

[3]
Posted: Dec 18, 2020, 8:20 AM
 

The Connecticut womens basketball teams.
Tiger Woods at the height of his success.
Jimmy Johnson.
Floyd Mayweather.
The New England Patriots with Bellichik and Brady was winning SB what every other year?
College Basketball - unless Gonzaga or Clemson does it this year - will be one of the usual suspects.
In local sports - any H.S. football team coached by Tommy Knotts!
Federer
Serena Williams

***I am likely missing some others*** but you get the point. How bad is it to the sport of college football to have dominant teams in your opinion?

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Re: Dominant Streaks In Sports

[1]
Posted: Dec 18, 2020, 9:05 AM
 

Point taken.

As soon as you put politics into sports, it's done for. Stupid proposal and stupid on NCAA pres to be even asking Congress for oversight.

No problem with institutions being responsible for players safety but absolutely against players getting compensated for their name or whatever.

Not opposed to increased stipend for all atheletes. They're getting a full ride as it is. But paying one more than the other is b.s. and no way to ever manage it... Just screw it up and destroy it.

Also not opposed to going to 8 team playoff and eliminate an ooc game with d2 teams during reg season. Make that game a non counting pre season scrimmage game where a citadel would get paid...

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Re: Projected 8 team playoff

[1]
Posted: Dec 18, 2020, 9:10 AM
 

Based on current rankings

1. Alabama vs 8. UGA
3. Clemson vs 6. Iowa St

2. ND vs 7. Florida
4. Ohio St vs 5. Texas A&M

Bama vs Clemson
ND vs OSU

Clemson vs ND

After CCGs

1. Alabama vs 8. Cincinnati
3. Ohio St vs 6. Iowa St

2. Clemson vs 7. UGA
4.  ND vs 5. Texas A&M

Bama vs OSU
Clemson vs ND

Bama vs Clemson

A&M and Iowa St may be interchangeable

3 SEC teams, 1 G5, 2 "ACC"

The problem is adding a 16th game. Could make it an 11 game reg season with no FCS games but that kills FCS. If you eliminate 1 reg season game you could have a 16 game playoff by eliminating Conf Champ Games and have 10 Div winners and 6 at large ( Coastal and Cinn would get in) plus UGA. Ok, Ind, UNC maybe. Play 1st round at higher seed then 2nd round the next week at Conf Champ type sites. With the additional games and probably more interest than the CCGs may be able to revenue share with FCS.


Message was edited by: djones73®


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Having Georgia and Florida in the top 10 is an absolute joke***

[2]
Posted: Dec 18, 2020, 9:12 AM
 



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Off the cuff I agree, BUT

[1]
Posted: Dec 18, 2020, 10:32 AM
 

Who the heck else you gonna put in there? After the top 3 or 4 teams, the rest are unmitigated garbage.

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To be sure but...

[1]
Posted: Dec 18, 2020, 11:12 AM
 

how can you justify only dropping Florida one spot in the poll on the heels of a really bad loss to 3-win LSU team...as a 24 point favorite no less?

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Re: Having Georgia and Florida in the top 10 is an absolute joke***


Posted: Dec 18, 2020, 11:02 AM
 

I agree. I assumed the committee would move Cinn up and UGA and Fl down.

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Re: Projected 8 team playoff


Posted: Dec 18, 2020, 4:46 PM
 

I like the 6 team better...8 gets top heavy...

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Re: Herbstreit Commentary About CFB Playoffs!


Posted: Dec 18, 2020, 8:53 AM
 

I agree with Kirk in that it needs to be expanded. Just how many and how...well, I'm not gonna think about that.

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In my opinion, the absolute most should be

[2]
Posted: Dec 18, 2020, 9:25 AM
 

no more than 8 teams. I really think 4 is the best number. There has clearly been a drop outside the top 2 teams. No #3 team in the final four has won the CFP. It has been the #1 or #2 team dominating as the CFP Champion.

A better solution is 6 teams, with the #1 &2 seeds getting a bye, and the winners of the two games with the #3-#6 teams become the official CFP Final Four.

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Re: In my opinion, the absolute most should be

[1]
Posted: Dec 18, 2020, 9:40 AM
 


no more than 8 teams. I really think 4 is the best number. There has clearly been a drop outside the top 2 teams. No #3 team in the final four has won the CFP. It has been the #1 or #2 team dominating as the CFP Champion.

A better solution is 6 teams, with the #1 &2 seeds getting a bye, and the winners of the two games with the #3-#6 teams become the official CFP Final Four.




I like this option personally!

Only issue I see is if a school and fan base like O Cry O State gets one of the play in games. They would claim the extra game caused some back up player to twist his pinky and they got all banged up and now have to face a rested #1 or #2 team. After a few seasons, someone would listen and expand it to 8 anyway. That way everyone has an opportunity to get key players banged up in pursuit of a championship. Injuries are a part of the game we would tell the buck nuts.
Then there is the "well they had extra preparation time thing that will surely happen"!
It's more of a throwback to the old BCS the idea of having teams with a bye week.

As things are now - I would love this format as I believe Clemson would most years be #1 or #2 and get a bye.

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Re: In my opinion, the absolute most should be

[1]
Posted: Dec 18, 2020, 10:51 AM
 

DAMB HillRockTiger! So, after I made my comment (and while I was out on my morning walk with my dog in the woods); I come back to see you are not only on a roll - and killing it - you are making a lot of solid points. Kudos to you my friend!

I would be okay with Spartacus and Stolen Valor aka Da Nang #### Blumenthall’s congressional commission if they would make you the Commissioner.

(Unfortunately, you probably don’t have the ‘political connections’ to be considered... I mean, I could be wrong; however you sound much too intelligent, practical, and honest to be a politician or part of the swamp)

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Re: In my opinion, the absolute most should be

[1]
Posted: Dec 18, 2020, 11:24 AM
 

I agree with the 6 team playoff expansion if anything. That covers your 5 major conference champions and leaves 1 spot open for a non conference champion or a deserving team from a smaller conference. Having said that, the drop off between top 2-3 teams and the rest if the field has been dramatic every year, and I doubt the NC results would have changed by expanding the current 4 team playoff.

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Re: Herbstreit Commentary About CFB Playoffs!

[3]
Posted: Dec 18, 2020, 9:18 AM
 

I'll keep this short.

The easiest way to expand the CFB playoff is to give an automatic bid to conference champions. It's the simplest way to expand without adding more games to the season which is WOULD be a detriment to the student-athletes.

Expand it to 8 teams. Five automatic P-5 bids, plus three at-large.

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Re: Herbstreit Commentary About CFB Playoffs!

[1]
Posted: Dec 18, 2020, 9:46 AM
 

For the remaining three, would you put a requirement for a G-5 to be included?

I'm of the thought that if there is no G-5 requirement (and then we can have the big debate about which G-5), then the CFP should just be for P5. Let the G-5 create their own.

I personally like having a requirement to include at least one G-5.

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Re: Herbstreit Commentary About CFB Playoffs!

[1]
Posted: Dec 18, 2020, 11:10 AM
 

If you go 16 and no Conf CG you take out the rematchs before the playoffs. Committee could move teams up or down 1 seed to avoid rematches where possible at least in the first round. Also has 6 at large so more chance for G5 teams and you could easily guarantee 1 spot out of 16 W/O a lot of down side. 1 of 8 is harder to justify.

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Re: Herbstreit Commentary About CFB Playoffs!

[1]
Posted: Dec 18, 2020, 11:32 AM
 

That's a real good question.

I like the option of including a G-5 team, just not as a requirement.

I don't like the word "requirement" because it'll turn into an entitlement in years when the G-5 doesn't have a top 8 team. I suspect it would be often.

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Great Discussion! Appreciate all the opinions!

[1]
Posted: Dec 18, 2020, 12:05 PM
 

Good discussion! It's always good to know you aren't alone in certain thought processes!

You just hope some of the changes that are out there don't change the landscape to the point college football is unrecognizable.

What a shame that would be to future generations! As football isn't just simply a game in many places; it's what you build entire parts of the year around. It's what you build schedules around for entire families and communities. My 1st college game was where first learned of quick heartbreaks! Saw this girl that looked like an angel. We talked before the game she went back to her section and "I never saw her again"! Yeah, kids, I am older there was no cell phones or even pagers.
The point being - stories like that(many/most with much happier outcomes than mine) are all a part of college football as much as the game. The Band! The Cheerleaders! Everything that goes into the pageantry of it - is what is in jeopardy!

I am going to enjoy it while it last and pray they don't mess it up!

Go Tigers!

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Re: Great Discussion! Appreciate all the opinions!


Posted: Dec 18, 2020, 1:10 PM
 

Here here! Well said.

There's nothing wrong with tweaking the CFP model, it was designed with flexibility in mind. The AP era brought us the BCS, and the BCS brought us the CFP. Each was an improvement over the prior system.

That being said, I agree with you that college football is so more than just a sport. Women's tennis is a sport. College Football part of our culture and DNA as Clemson alumni, fans, and southerners. It's about all of the things you mentioned. Unfortunately, there are people who could care less about college football and would seek to destroy it precisely because they despise the culture it represents (wolves in sheep's clothing). Those people should be knee-capped at the door and never be allowed in the conversation.

If the powers that be are serious about making the CFB better for everyone, they need to look no further than Dabo Swinney and Nick Saban. Get those two guys in a room and ask their opinions about all the relevant issues. I bet you come away with a winning formula. Just my 2cents.

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Re: Herbstreit Commentary About CFB Playoffs!


Posted: Dec 18, 2020, 10:59 AM
 

I totally agree Reckless. Your proposal is the best and most logical option I’ve seen in all the plans proposed to date. You would think that as it addresses ALL P5s and gives opportunity to the ‘non’ P5s, as well.

Guess it makes too much sense to be adopted.

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If that is truly a problem - the only way to keep more teams


Posted: Dec 18, 2020, 9:35 AM
 

"interested" in the season is to expand the playoff.

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I think it is true what he said about Alabama recruiting

[2]
Posted: Dec 18, 2020, 9:48 AM
 

under Nick Saban. It is now to the point where some kids want to go there just to check off the box saying they were coached in college by Saban, knowing that is a leg up on getting to the NFL.

So, per the logic tree, when Saban finally hangs it up, Clemson recruiting will immediately get better, because the next most consistent program to Alabama is....US!

It also means, per the logic tree, that Dabo will have a huge decision to make, for real. Does he abandon all that he has built in Clemson, South Carolina, to go back to Alabama when mama comes calling? Just so he can be next in line and be constantly compared to St. Nick? I honestly don't think he will turn his back on Clemson, and his legacy here, just to be another in the lineage of Alabama coaches. Because, no matter how much success he might have, that's all he would be, just the next cog in the machine. At Clemson, he designed, built, and runs the machine. It has his name on it, and nobody elses.

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