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Orange Blooded [2152]
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All-In [47929]
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yes! we are a FULLY INCLUSIVE CHURCH!!***
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May 1, 2024, 3:10 PM
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CU Guru [1022]
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I'm intrigued that there are councils and votes to decide what God supposedly
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May 1, 2024, 4:57 PM
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wants.
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Orange Blooded [2152]
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Screws fall out all the time. The world is an imperfect place...
May 1, 2024, 5:22 PM
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We're human. We don't know everything there is to know about God. We don't even know everything there is to know about ourselves.
People vote because people have different views on some topics.
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CU Guru [1022]
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Re: Screws fall out all the time. The world is an imperfect place...
May 1, 2024, 6:57 PM
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>We're human.
I'm aware. I think that's all this is.
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Orange Blooded [2152]
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So, where's the intrigue coming from?***
May 1, 2024, 7:46 PM
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CU Guru [1022]
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Re: So, where's the intrigue coming from?***
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May 1, 2024, 8:17 PM
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That you guys seem to think that it's a higher power when it's clearly just men deciding what the rules are.
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Orange Blooded [2152]
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So, you don't think God exists and others on this board do...
May 1, 2024, 9:41 PM
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I guess that intrigues you. You're free to be "intrigued".
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CU Guru [1022]
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Re: So, you don't think God exists and others on this board do...
May 1, 2024, 9:48 PM
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welcome to what's known as a "forum"
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Orange Blooded [2152]
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And welcome to a planet where people vote.***
May 1, 2024, 9:49 PM
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CU Guru [1022]
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Re: And welcome to a planet where people vote.***
May 1, 2024, 9:54 PM
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yes, people, indeed
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Orange Blooded [2152]
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At least today, it didn't "blow your mind"...
May 1, 2024, 10:05 PM
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You crack me up with your drama.
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CU Guru [1022]
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Re: At least today, it didn't "blow your mind"...
May 1, 2024, 10:19 PM
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You consider this "drama"?
lmao
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Orange Blooded [2152]
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It's your whole act on this board....
May 1, 2024, 10:24 PM
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You tend to act as if belief in God is the craziest thing you can imagine. I see it on multiple threads. It's as if you were dropped on this planet yesterday and found out some people believe in a higher being, and it's nuts or something.
Now, I can't tell if you're really this intrigued or mind-blown. But if you are....you do you, as the saying goes.
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CU Guru [1022]
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Re: It's your whole act on this board....
May 1, 2024, 10:44 PM
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> Now, I can't tell if you're really this intrigued or mind-blown. But if you are....you do you, as the saying goes.
As far as I can tell, I'm making pretty benign statements on a religion forum, I don't know why you get so bent out of shape about them.
>You tend to act as if belief in God is the craziest thing you can imagine.
Um no... it's the logic you use to get to that belief that I find so interesting. I've said multiple times, I don't think people are nuts or stupid for having religious beliefs, they are just (imo) wrong.
It would be one thing if you laid out a logical case for god, but when you say things like "UMC votes to allow LGBT pastors & weddings" as if god's commands would work like that, it is indeed intriguing to me. If god himself showed up adn said this is how it's going to be, that's a different story, but no, it's always men making some claim on his behalf. How you guys don't realize that is beyond me.
It seems crystal clear that it's men making rules, there doesn't appear to be any evidence that a god is making these rules, scriptures, creeds, or anything else.
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Orange Blooded [2186]
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Re: It's your whole act on this board....
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May 2, 2024, 7:38 AM
[ in reply to It's your whole act on this board.... ] |
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It is kind of funny that these people debate this stuff and never stop to think wait…if there is a higher being who gave us instructions for how to live why is there a debate at all?
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Orange Blooded [2152]
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Well, as I pointed out....
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May 2, 2024, 10:32 AM
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This is an imperfect world. And Humans have a tough time agreeing on anything. My wife and I often disagree on which Waffle House to go to for breakfast. So, the idea that there's debate and disagreement over the meaning of scripture of God's wishes shouldn't be all that surprising.
But we can continue with this faux-shock and surprise stuff that people like Echoes trots out here all the time.
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CU Guru [1022]
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Re: Well, as I pointed out....
May 2, 2024, 12:07 PM
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>This is an imperfect world. And Humans have a tough time agreeing on anything. My wife and I often disagree on which Waffle House to go to for breakfast. So, the idea that there's debate and disagreement over the meaning of scripture of God's wishes shouldn't be all that surprising.
Nobody is surprised that people disagree. It's when those same people, who can't even agree try to tell you what god supposedly wants.
>But we can continue with this faux-shock and surprise stuff that people like Echoes trots out here all the time.
You are the most pedantic person i think i've talked to.
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Orange Blooded [2152]
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Good....
May 2, 2024, 1:22 PM
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You think I'm pedantic. I think you're an act.
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CU Guru [1022]
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Re: Good....
May 2, 2024, 2:04 PM
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No, you just take words like “shocked” literally.
People believe all kind of stuff, you’re beliefs aren’t literally shocking to me.
Ill try to be more direct with you and see if it helps.
Please do explain the “act”. I’m curious. You make claims, i say i don’t believe them, where is the acting?
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Orange Blooded [2152]
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I guess I'll just cut and paste from a previous post....
May 2, 2024, 2:15 PM
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What I said above is what I think of how you conduct yourself on this board. I think it's at least partially an act:
You tend to act as if belief in God is the craziest thing you can imagine. I see it on multiple threads. It's as if you were dropped on this planet yesterday and found out some people believe in a higher being, and it's nuts or something.
Now, I can't tell if you're really this intrigued or mind-blown. But if you are....you do you, as the saying goes.
Now, I do think you're serious in non-belief in God's existence. I think some of the other stuff is an act though, maybe to just try and poke fun at the rest of us. I think you're better on the politics board than on this board.
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CU Guru [1022]
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Re: I guess I'll just cut and paste from a previous post....
May 2, 2024, 2:46 PM
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Nope, this is literally a forum to discuss religion. There is no requirement that you must like my arguments.
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Orange Blooded [2152]
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Nor did I say there was a requirement....
May 2, 2024, 3:12 PM
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You've made criticisms of me. And I've done the same to you. By all means, post what you want. I'm not into censorship. But if I think you're putting on a drama queen act, I will tell you. And there is no requirement for you to like that.
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CU Guru [1022]
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Re: Nor did I say there was a requirement....
May 2, 2024, 6:28 PM
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You’re literally the only one bringing up drama. It’s getting a bit weird. Can we just discuss the forum topic maybe?
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Orange Blooded [2152]
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LOL. OK, give me your take on the UMC on their change of rules on
May 2, 2024, 6:45 PM
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gay pastors & marriage.
I think this will move the denomination to the more liberal side, and a fair # of UMC members will leave. We'll end up with a more homogeneous & smaller group. The UMC historically is a mix of traditionalist, centrist, and progressive churches. But about half of the traditionalist side has left.
I do predict that in about 20-30 years or so, no one will care about this issue all that much. To me, it gets too much attention from hard-right-wingers currently. But that will fade.
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CU Guru [1022]
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Re: LOL. OK, give me your take on the UMC on their change of rules on
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May 2, 2024, 8:10 PM
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To be honest, I totally agree with you. I obviously don't believe there is anything supernatural to it, so I think it's great that it's more inclusive.
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CU Guru [1084]
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Orange Blooded [2152]
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Well yeah....
May 2, 2024, 10:34 AM
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He's been fairly open about that. It's not like you "caught him" in a lie or something.
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CU Guru [1022]
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Oculus Spirit [94309]
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Orange Blooded [2152]
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Or perhaps they are worried about what God wants....
May 3, 2024, 4:48 PM
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but as humans, they might disagree with each other on what he wants. Different groups of people, who both care about God's word deeply, will still not agree on every aspect of how to act out their faith.
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Oculus Spirit [94309]
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I'm sure you've read the apostle Paul's letters to Timothy.***
May 4, 2024, 5:26 AM
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CU Guru [1022]
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Re: I'm sure you've read the apostle Paul's letters to Timothy.***
May 4, 2024, 8:45 AM
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You mean whoever wrote Timothy... scholarly consensus is that they are forged.
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Orange Blooded [2152]
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CU Guru [1022]
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Re: They aren't worried about what God wants.
May 3, 2024, 6:41 PM
[ in reply to They aren't worried about what God wants. ] |
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Seems like a trivially easy thing to clear up if this god actually cared to.
But sure, both of you (humans) will claim that your version is right, while a god just lets you flounder instead of actually guiding you.
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Orange Blooded [2152]
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God has given us what we need....
May 3, 2024, 9:03 PM
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We have life, and a life-sustaining planet. And he sent his son, Jesus, to live as one of us. And through him, I think he's given us what we need.
But we are imperfect, and don't understand everything, and we have free will too. So, disagreements will always be with us on this Earth.
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CU Guru [1022]
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Re: God has given us what we need....
May 4, 2024, 8:43 AM
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>But we are imperfect, and don't understand everything, and we have free will too.
You are conflating some things there. Not understanding something doesn't mean you chose not too, unless you are accusing other denominations of choosing not to understand.
Sometimes the data is simply bad. Also, if something like eternal damnation is on the line, you'd think a loving personal god would clear up the requirements.
>So, disagreements will always be with us on this Earth.
If you can't even understand what's going on here, how the heck do you claim to know what will happen after we're here? That's nonsensical.
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Orange Blooded [2152]
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Re: God has given us what we need....
May 4, 2024, 9:58 AM
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I'm not conflating anything, and you know it. There is free will. There is also lack of understanding. These things are independent of each other, and both can impact our views on how to live & worship on this Earth.
It's in the normal order of things that humans argue & disagree when trying to interpret scripture & discern God's will.
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All-TigerNet [11291]
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Good for us Methodists!
May 1, 2024, 5:01 PM
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And F them hatin-a$$ Baptists!
j/k bout that last part Lord. But you lol’d didn’t you?
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110%er [9101]
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Re: UMC votes to allow LGBT pastors & weddings....
May 1, 2024, 7:47 PM
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deception
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Orange Blooded [2152]
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What's the deception?....
May 1, 2024, 7:48 PM
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There was a vote. They changed a few rules.
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110%er [9101]
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Re: What's the deception?....
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May 2, 2024, 8:26 AM
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deceived and dont even know it, classic definition
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CU Guru [1022]
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ironic***
May 2, 2024, 8:42 AM
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Orange Blooded [2152]
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Legend [17973]
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Re: UMC votes to allow LGBT pastors & weddings....
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May 1, 2024, 9:01 PM
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Not that scripture matters, but, there is this:
For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine, but according to their own desires, because they have itching ears, they will heap up for themselves teachers; 4 and they will turn their ears away from the truth, and be turned aside to fables. 5 But you be watchful in all things, endure afflictions, do the work of an evangelist, fulfill your ministry.
The New King James Version (2 Ti 4:3–5). (1982). Thomas Nelson.
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Orange Blooded [2152]
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I don't know this for sure....
May 1, 2024, 10:07 PM
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But you might be surprised at who that scripture could apply to in today's world.
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Legend [17973]
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I would be very surprised...
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May 2, 2024, 7:44 AM
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to learn the measure for the moral/immoral issues in the world changed since the One who sin is measured by never changes. God does not evolve over time because folks - communities or individuals - feel that He should learn to accept the way things are.
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Orange Blooded [2152]
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I think there's a group of "Christians" in the US....
May 2, 2024, 10:28 AM
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that struts around like peacocks. They might want to heed the scripture you quoted, although it might be a different group than what you're thinking.
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Hall of Famer [24454]
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Re: I think there's a group of "Christians" in the US....
May 2, 2024, 7:34 PM
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There are definitely a lot of "Christians"
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CU Guru [1022]
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Re: I think there's a group of "Christians" in the US....
May 2, 2024, 8:11 PM
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>There are definitely a lot of "Christians"
This is exactly where there are so many denominations haha
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Hall of Famer [24454]
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Re: I think there's a group of "Christians" in the US....
May 2, 2024, 8:38 PM
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I'm not in any of them
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CU Guru [1022]
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Re: I think there's a group of "Christians" in the US....
May 2, 2024, 9:41 PM
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You just distinguished yourself from "Christians". That's the point. It's the same thing all the other sects do. Of course, your specific version of your specific religion is the correct one, that's what everyone thinks.
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Hall of Famer [24454]
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Re: I think there's a group of "Christians" in the US....
May 2, 2024, 10:18 PM
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I'm not even sure if I would be considered "Christian", at this point. I have been born of the spirit of God, as I was drawn by the Holy Spirit and saw the light that is Christ. Whatever that is.
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CU Guru [1022]
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Re: I think there's a group of "Christians" in the US....
May 3, 2024, 6:43 AM
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What did it look like?
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Hall of Famer [24454]
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Re: I think there's a group of "Christians" in the US....
May 3, 2024, 7:45 AM
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It was a light that opened my mind, and it allowed me to see myself more clearly.
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CU Guru [1022]
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Re: I think there's a group of "Christians" in the US....
May 3, 2024, 6:39 PM
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Ah so you didn't literally see anything?
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Hall of Famer [24454]
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Re: I think there's a group of "Christians" in the US....
May 3, 2024, 7:34 PM
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The sight was given by the light. That's what light does.
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CU Guru [1022]
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Re: I think there's a group of "Christians" in the US....
May 3, 2024, 8:26 PM
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so you figuratively "saw the light"
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Hall of Famer [24454]
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Re: I think there's a group of "Christians" in the US....
May 3, 2024, 8:59 PM
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No, it wasn't figurative. It was real.
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CU Guru [1022]
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Re: I think there's a group of "Christians" in the US....
May 4, 2024, 8:39 AM
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ok, so that's what I was asking, what did it look like?
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Hall of Famer [24454]
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Re: I think there's a group of "Christians" in the US....
May 4, 2024, 8:56 AM
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In that sense it was like turning the lights on in a room. It changes the way you see things.
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CU Guru [1022]
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Re: UMC votes to allow LGBT pastors & weddings....
May 1, 2024, 10:21 PM
[ in reply to Re: UMC votes to allow LGBT pastors & weddings.... ] |
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"There will be a time where people will disagree with me, don't do that".
That's all that is. OF COURSE they would say that crap.
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Hall of Famer [24454]
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Re: UMC votes to allow LGBT pastors & weddings....
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May 2, 2024, 9:08 AM
[ in reply to Re: UMC votes to allow LGBT pastors & weddings.... ] |
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I think this is more appropriate
They exchanged the truth of God for a lie and offered worship and service to the creature rather than to the Creator, who is blessed forever. Amen. That is why God abandoned them to their shameful passions. Their women exchanged natural intercourse for unnatural practices. Likewise, men gave up natural relations with women and were consumed with passion for one another. Men committed shameful acts with men and received in their own persons the fitting penalty for their perversion. Furthermore, since these people did not see fit to acknowledge God, he abandoned them to their depraved way of thinking and to all types of vile behavior.
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Rom.1.25,Rom.1.26,Rom.1.27,Rom.1.28&version=NCB
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Orange Blooded [2186]
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Re: UMC votes to allow LGBT pastors & weddings....
May 2, 2024, 9:17 AM
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Why would god be so concerned with what a human being does sexually?
Serious question. Don’t give me a stock “biblical” answer.
And don’t say it’s bad for society. I know homosexual couples that live healthy, productive lives and adopt kids who otherwise wouldn’t have a home.
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Hall of Famer [24454]
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Re: UMC votes to allow LGBT pastors & weddings....
May 2, 2024, 9:23 AM
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Not an answer you will accept, but man, wife, children is an earthly representation of the Holy Trinity.
Probably another answer you will not accept, but at its best, the parental influence of Father and Mother is ideal and should not be discounted.
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Orange Blooded [2152]
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I think God blesses all couples that are in committed relationships....
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May 3, 2024, 8:18 AM
[ in reply to Re: UMC votes to allow LGBT pastors & weddings.... ] |
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It's what's in the heart that matters. And when you have two consenting adults, I think God looks well on those relationships.
Alot of the scripture that supposedly prohibits same-sex relationships is really about things like orgies or pedophilia or adulterous lust. That's different than someone in a life-long committed relationship with someone else.
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Orange Blooded [3088]
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Re: I think God blesses all couples that are in committed relationships....
May 5, 2024, 11:01 AM
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Where do you get from scripture that prohibitions on same sex activity was limited as you describe? Has the church in its history every limited scripture to your description?
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Orange Blooded [3088]
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Hall of Famer [24454]
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Orange Blooded [2152]
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I was unaware of that....
May 2, 2024, 10:12 AM
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Point me to that book.
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Hall of Famer [24454]
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Re: I was unaware of that....
May 2, 2024, 10:35 AM
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I believe it's called The Book of Discipline.
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Orange Blooded [2152]
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Actually, we look to the Bible....
May 2, 2024, 10:44 AM
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The Book of Discipline is an expression of our view on a variety of topics.
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110%er [6518]
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Re: UMC votes to allow LGBT pastors & weddings....
May 5, 2024, 11:13 PM
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UMC is apostate.
(In advance. My pastor is not a lard bucket and does not like fried chicken any more than the average southerner.)
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CU Guru [1022]
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Re: UMC votes to allow LGBT pastors & weddings....
May 6, 2024, 6:53 AM
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I’m sure he’s just peachy
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Orange Blooded [2152]
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110%er [6518]
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Re: And I'm sure it's a "he" pastor....
May 11, 2024, 8:27 PM
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You ever read the Biblical qualifications of a Bishop?
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Hall of Famer [22885]
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Romans 1
May 10, 2024, 9:22 AM
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Thinking they were smarter than God, they exchanged the truth for a lie, so God turned them over to their evil desires.
The church is supposed to impact the world. All too often, in America today, we have allowed the world to impact the church.
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Orange Blooded [2152]
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Yes, there's alot of that in the US....
May 10, 2024, 10:39 AM
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I'm not sure if you and I are talking about the same groups of Christians though.
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